Underground facilites? Telltale signs?

I have heard it discussed often that there are various underground facilities in Utah. Below are listed examples:

www.fortunecity.com...

www.anomalies-unlimited.com...


I have seen telltale signs, at least according to others. I am just interested in what the minds of ATS would consider telltale signs and just how to know when you are on the trail of an underground facility.

When I hear what I consider to be "telltale" signs, I often picture Huge vents on the surface for "breathers" or oxygen systems, Sunken in earth from collapse of inherent terrain, and excavation piles all around. Am I correct in looking for these kinds of anamolies? And if not, I am sure there are other signs I should be looking for as well.

I know many believe the whole scenario of underground bases is ludicrous. However I trust the people and friends I am getting leads from. And , freinds and aquintances who have said things to me seem to be on the cutting edge of any and all conspiracies here locally. What stinks is they can usually back up their claims. Which brings me to the point.

I have been told to avoid certain areas. Of course these areas gain the most attention from me. I have been told to avoid anything that in any least way can be tied to the whole "reptilian" agenda. Wow, don't even get me started on this because I don't know what to believe and where people get some of what I believe are "CRAZY" ideas in their heads. But, if it will improve my safety I am willing to at least superficially believe in things I am to avoid. Still, the whole "Reptillian" thing is hard to swallow. Not to mention it is very hard to actually find someone who claims to have seen one.

What's worse, is the people who do claim to have seen them usually claim they see them in different stages from human-to-reptillian transformation, and that jagged pill gets even harder to swallow.

Anyway back to the topic: I have come across areas where I have to ask myself; Could this be a sign of underground activity? I want to know other people's opinions on what are and aren't determining factors for undergound activity?

Below are pictures I promised to submit for another post of an area like the ones in question above. This area has surface signs, Sunken in earth from collapse of inherent terrain, and excavation piles all around. Not to mention other anomalies. Am I correct in looking for these kinds of anomalies? And if not, I am sure there are other signs I should be looking for as well.

Pictures:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Any input on what else to look for? And, Is there ANY proof that ANY underground base has EVER existed?

Any input on what else to look for? And, Is there ANY proof that ANY underground base has EVER existed?

I'm wondering if people looking for these type of things are wasting their time?

Namely ME

Well, I can tell you one thing, your website has it's facts wrong. Whoever put thissite up doesn't know much about Groom Lake. Here's what he sais:

: Stealth and cloaking Aircraft research & development
"'Dreamland (Data Repository Establishment and Maintenance Land)
Elmint (Electromagnetic Intelligence), Biological weapons research and genetic manipulation/warfare storage, Cold Empire, EVA, Program HIS (Hybrid Intelligence System),BW/CW; IRIS (Infrared Intruder Systems), BI-PASS, REP-TILES, back engineering of captured space craft propulsion systems, holding area of all alien materials and bodies/prisoners,

Here's what ALL is Wrong with this statement:

1. Dreamland is a Call Sign. It doesn't stand for Anything
   
2. They don't test Bioweapons at Groom Lake
   
3. They Also don't study genetics
   
4. The base doesn't have any ET's
   
5. They do Not study Genetic Warfare at Groom Lake
   
6. they don't keep alien bodies/prisoners at Area 51 (that's only in Hollywood
   

These are the obvious ones. Try another site!

Tim

Here's what ALL is Wrong with this statement:

1. Dreamland is a Call Sign. It doesn't stand for Anything
   
2. They don't test Bioweapons at Groom Lake
   
3. They Also don't study genetics
   
4. The base doesn't have any ET's
   
5. They do Not study Genetic Warfare at Groom Lake
   
6. they don't keep alien bodies/prisoners at Area 51 (that's only in Hollywood
   

These are the obvious ones. Try another site!

Tim

For a top secret facility, you seem to know an awful lot about what is and isn't going on there. If these ones are 'obvious', I suppose you have proof to back these things up?

I'm not saying these things are going on at Groom Lake, but I fail to see how you could know they're not.

I ran the Groom Lake Research Project for ATS a few years back. While many things about Grrom Lake are Top Secret, not everything is. You have to go beyond the internet to sources like Books, Freedom of Information Act requestes, The DET 3 security manual, ect.

For information on the name "Dreamland" look up permanent Call sign for ground stations. (you may have to go though several sources to find it)

Groom Lake's Primary User is DET 3 of the Air Force Flight Test Center (AFFTC). The AFFTC tests and develops aircraft technology. Their Primary base is at Edwards Air Force Base, California. The base is technically an extention of Flight Dynamics division of the Air Force Materials Command Headquatered at Wright-Patterson AFB.

Tim

Originally posted by theutahbigfoothunter

Any input on what else to look for? And, Is there ANY proof that ANY underground base has EVER existed?

I think that it's very possible for there to be numerous underground bases. In Wiltshire in the UK there's an entire underground town with 60 miles of roads - if an entire town can be built underground then it's definitely plausible that there ARE underground bases throughout the world.

It's just finding the evidence for them that's the tricky part!!

UBH, there are a few underground bases out there. NORAD comes to mind. But I think you are probably thinking more like Dulce and such. We have the technology to build them and have for quite some time. Underground bases are nothing new, though most are built into the side of a mountain or cliff.

So Killswitch, you say NORAD comes to mind? Do you have any information on any of the underground facilities in the area? The reason I ask is because I drove by a project recently where developers are building an underground facility of some sort to the North east of a huge entrance in the side of a mountain on the way out to Tooele. It was like an underground air bubble type tennis court dome. For those that know what those look like. It's use is unknown by me. The construction of the facility is almost done and I will try my best to get pictures of it if possible. I'm sure I can. I just sometimes get a little freaked out putting my nose into business where others think it doesn't belong. I'm not sure who is doing the construction. It could be Praxair or even Kennecott copper which is also in near proximity but it is very immense looking and I thought it a little interesting that it is being built underground. When I drove by on a side road, workers were actually laying turf over it with desert plants already growing in the dirt as if to cover it up, or at the very least make it look like nothing was there. Maybe to detract from an environmental impact study? Needless to say I had no business parking there and gawking, so I moved on. But that's a whole other story. But killswitch I would like to hear more about th facilities if any you are aware of.

even bob lazar said that there are no UFOs at Groom Lake. A friend who worked in the AF who has been to Groom Lake swears that it's just tightly controlled security for black projects. not alien back engineering projects.

if they were to do stuff like that wouldn't it bee simpler to put that all on some isolated island. patrol constantly to make sure no boats or subs come a knocking and the added cloud layer from the ocean winds could help conceal a lot of stuff frequently. so why not just do that stuff there or in the arctics somewhere. not at a place where people can walk to it. I know it's hot desert but thats not as big a deterent as it used to be.

In Australia, according to reports and occasional online discussions, the underground facilities are served by railways.

There are claims of isolated, insignificant buildings surrounded by chainlink fences. These are apparently located in rural areas and built to look like maintenance facilities for telephone and other ordinary services. People claim to have broken-in, only to discover they contain sophisticated devices and false-floors which conceal sophisticated communications rooms, tunnels etc. beneath. Others claim that when they approached the vicinity, helicopters suddenly emerged 'from nowhere'.

A middle-aged businessman and his adult son claimed online a few years ago that while they were driving between Sydney and Canberra, they stopped to relieve themselves. They had just crossed a modern bridge spanning a gorge. The son scrambled down a bushy slope. When he hadn't reappeared after several minutes, his father called out to him. The son didn't respond, so the father, slightly alarmed and aware of the danger of snakes, scrambled down in search of him, calling as he went.

After some minutes, he heard his son respond with 'Come look at this!'

The father joined his son at a large steel trapdoor which was set into the side of the incline. The trapdoor was open. The pair looked inside the dark cavern. A steel ladder led downwards. The two men, after ensuring the trapdoor was securely locked in the 'open' position, climbed down the ladder. There were several levels with steel platforms at the intervals.

When they reached the bottom, they discovered a railway track. The track gauge was narrower than that used Statewide for above-ground rail. The track ran in both directions.

They followed the tracks for some considerable distance. Lights set into the tunnel roof or walls, flicked on automatically as they approached them.

The father said he suddenly felt distinctly uneasy and suggested they make their way hurriedly to the surface, which they did. They made their way immediately to their vehicle and sped away. The father said it was several hours before his anxiety lessened.

The reasons he gave for his anxiety were:
* the trapdoor, ladders, tracks, tunnels, lighting, etc. were all clearly recent and well maintained.
* the track guage differed from any other he'd seen
* the entire facility had obviously cost a huge amount of money, yet as far as he was aware, it had never been made known to the general public
* the area was remote but well-served by above-ground rail. He could think of no reason to explain this underground system
* he instinctively felt afraid

and most importantly, from his point of view --- someone had left the trapdoor in the 'open' position. There was very little debris on the tunnel floor or the tracks. This indicated the trapdoor was usually closed, which it would have been in any case, to prevent people from entering it and to prevent animals from falling into it. Only when half a kilometre approx. along the tracks with his son, did his father suddenly realise that whoever had left the trapdoor open (possibly maintenance personnel) may still be nearby and may return to either lock the door -- or discover himself and his son exploring the facility. The father confessed that for some reason, he became suddenly deathly afraid of the latter possibility.

This story appeared on a site run by gruops dedicated to subterranean exploration.

Other posts detailed highly secret subterranean complexes beneath the Australian capitol (Canberra) and Melbourne. An entry was supposedly discovered in one of Melbourne's parks, after a murdered girl was allegedly discovered. The murder was not reported by the media. People spoke of lights appearning in the park on some nights, which appeared to be shining up out of the ground. Those who attempted to locate the source of the lights (which they believed must be coming from sub-ground tunnels, caverns, etc.) were warned away by far more than usually beligerent 'personnel', who demanded ID and 'asked a lot of questions'. Shortly afterwards, 'maintenance staff' cordoned-off the area in question. An online informant claimed large-diameter hose-type things projected from the ground. The strange 'ground staff' responded to enquiries with ' Could I see your ID?' and other authoritative demands and questions. The area remained cordoned off for considerable time after which security personnel moved-along those who tried to sneak around to find the myseterious 'entrance' and source of the still-unexplained lights.

The subterranean explorer groups claimed that in the cliffs to the north of Woolongong (south of Sydney) they discovered cavernous 'entries' with direct sea-access. They claimed these were approx. five storeys tall and deep inside they were serviced by a massive complex of ramps, stairs, ante-chambers, etc. --- clearly a major engineering undertaking at considerable cost. All they were able to discover on plans etc. (which were obtained via various methods) was that the facility was declared a 'stormwater' drainage system. The group found this official claim ludicrous, as the area supposedly 'drained' via this multi-million dollar complex, was virtually uninhabited. The group speculated the facility was highly favourable to submarines, the occupants further provided for by the access direct from sea to facility to above-ground highways.

Stories abound about alleged subterranean 'US secret bases' within the vast, uninhabited Australian outback. These are alleged to be seven levels deep, according to 'informers' who claim to have worked on the bases' construction. Some of these 'secret US bases' are reputed to provide open-sea-access via subterranean waterways.

And there are an equally large number of reports of 'secret US/Alien bases' within the remote Australian outback. Various groups have attempted to get close enough to photograph what they claim are 'aliens' and 'alien craft' who live alongside US personnel at the bases. They claim that helicopters and high-powered vehicles warn off any who come remotely near the bases.

Information is of course difficult to obtain, because the US long ago established bases in Australia and not even the Australian government is privy to information relating to US activity. Most Prime Ministers have accepted the US 'hands off' rule. The one Prime Minister (Gough Whitlam) who demanded transparency from the US regarding its installations etc. was swiftly kicked out of office. Since then, all Prime Ministers have behaved as if the US presence within Australia is not happening.

some links to those stories would be awsome. I could read stuff like that last thread all day. or at least intend to if i can get some good links.

Sounds like someone is up to something shady in australia. Makes you wonder what goes on down in those tunnels.

Hi Bassplyr: I agree. I found them fascinating too.

I had the sites saved, but it was about four hard-drives ago. Forgot about those sites until I saw this thread.

Four am here at the moment and I have to log off, but if I can remember, I'll try to find the sites again tomorrow night and if I can, I'll post them

In the meantime, you could run some searches about 'Australian underground facilities' or 'Australian secret/mysterious/underground/subterranean bases', "US secret bases in Australia' etc. Good luck

This is interesting

I've herd before that there is a lot of infrastructure under DisneyLand.

Each person entering goes through biorhythm identification systems, metal detectors, and uses an identification card in conjunction with an alphanumeric password. This portion of the building is more than adequate for any disaster, including nuclear fallout. There are ample emergency supplies for the executives and senior staffers. Special meeting rooms are located here, for supersecret meetings and planning. There is even an emergency-only helicopter stored here that can rise up through a secret hatch.

Skim through this and you will find some very interesting points - espacally at the bottom of the page.

BASSPLYR: wracked my memory and ran some searches. Remembered that one of the sites I used to visit was 'Cave Clan'. But when I found it a few minutes ago, discovered it is now all squeaky-clean and affiliated with standard cavers' sites worldwide. I browsed the site a bit, hoping to find a link to the 'real' info, but unless I missed it, have to accept that for reasons known to themselves, the site owners are now strictly 'legit'. Shame, they used to have photos of the Woolongong 'drainage system' facility, plus dozens of other photo-sets of odd places and discoveries, as well as a very interesting forum, which is where (if memory serves) I read about the man and his son and the underground rail facility. Everyone caves-in to the internet police sooner or later, but it's ironic that fear-nothing cavers would cave in.

Anyway, did find the following. It's achival, but at least might give you a feel for the situation (re: US presence and alleged reasons for, etc.) in Australia: members.iimetro.com.au...

I'll run some more searches tomorrow if I have a chance. In the meantime, you could see what you find by running the search: 'secret underground bases australia'

Saddened to find internet is so heavily policed these days. Already we can say, 'Back in the good old days, you could say/find anything on the net'. You don't realize how it's changed until you try finding something that used to be there only a year or so ago.

Hey thanks Dock6! I'll go check out those links right away. Good looking out.

been underground at Disneyland once with a school teacher to get some other kids out of the disneyland jail for shoplifting plush toys on a school field trip there. the jail cells were painted with disney characters on the walls. strange. my dads also spent extensive time underground at disney land when filming commercials.

hospitals also have a maze of underground tunnels and a morgue and everrything, huge compute bank arrrays, auto clave stations. Can easily get lost if your new there. I used to volenteer at St. Josephs medical center in Burbank and the tunnels down there will get you lost if you aren't familiar with them and they aren't even that large.

so if this is what walt disney and hospitals can do. imagine what a govt. could do. we already know that N.Koreas entire military is well built into underground bunkers and facilities. they have these for the military just to evade our air campaigns which they wisely recognised many years ago would get obliterated by the US. why do you think we were flaunting nuclear bunker busters. to let them know that they were and will never be safe from us if we choose for them not to be.

Originally posted by BASSPLYR
we already know that N.Koreas entire military is well built into underground bunkers and facilities.

You're Exaggerating BASSPLYR! Yes the N. Koreans have many underground facilities for sheltering strategic targets. But claiming that their Entire Military is undergroud- Now that's a huge load of BS!

There is no such thing as a standing military that doesn't have some surface facilities. The cost of what your proposing is not only practically imposssible, but would cost in the Hundreds of TRILLIONS of Dollars, even for a very small country to attempt.

Some military facilities can NOT be bulit Completely underground, no matter how you do it:

- Air Feilds
- Sea Ports
- Radar Stations
- Bombing and gunnery ranges

If your going to play a buff, don't make it so obvious!

Tim

what.....OK not all of their military is underground. obviously a plane can't take off or even fly in a cave. and radar does no good when it's underground if your interested with whats in the air. however. NKorea did try to put as much of their military that they can into underground facilities. Most of N Korea is mountanous. they take advantage of that and put lots of stuff into the side of the mountains. bunkers, underground. not all of it. but their goal is to get all of it secured that way. they have a great fear of our air power. they know that without the initial stand off ability to wait out the first volley of US air bombing and keep their equipment intact they will ahve no chance to fight a normal traditional war. maybe they are looking into the tactics that insurgencies use. but they initally prepared and are still geared towoard traditional war.

also. N koreans don't eat. the govt. spends all of their money in their military. They are sorta nuts like that. also virtual slave labor is cheap so it's not that big a deal for them to start tunneleing into the side of mountains to store their stuff.

The underground facilites are vast from a few recent websites I have looked at. This seemed to be the most amazing:

www.spacewar.com...

The scariest part is : "Most of America's allied forces and navy ships can be targeted by the North's new missiles," said Kim Myung-Jin of the Korea Institute for Defense Analyses in Seoul.
(as said in the article)

Hey Tim

I was wondering if it were possible to get a copy of this report/research project that you did on Groom awhile back. I'm quite interested, and I want to know what is true so far and what is pure fiction. Also, you mentioned something about Groom Lake's Primary User being DET 3 of the Air Force Flight Test Center.

I live about 50 miles south of Edwards Air Force Base in California, and I've seen some strange things go on at night, things I can't really explain that I've see in the night sky. Do you know much about this base?

Originally posted by cagarcia15
Hey Tim

I was wondering if it were possible to get a copy of this report/research project that you did on Groom awhile back.

No problem! A copy of the Groom Lake Research Project's DATA Summery Report is Here While the data was well researched, we did make one error that shows up in the report: The report CLAIMS the B-2 was tested at Groom Lake, when in fact it was NOT! My mentor and good friend Shadowhawk found the error after the fact.

I'm quite interested, and I want to know what is true so far and what is pure fiction. Also, you mentioned something about Groom Lake's Primary User being DET 3 of the Air Force Flight Test Center.

That is correct. As a matter of fact the base commander for Groom Lake is also the officer who serves as the commander of DET 3. In fact at home I have an old Air Force units catolog that lists each Air Force unit and it's assign base from the commands and Air Forces down to individual squadrons. Air Force Flight Test Center Det 3 is listed as the primary tenet unit for Groom Lake.


I live about 50 miles south of Edwards Air Force Base in California, and I've seen some strange things go on at night, things I can't really explain that I've see in the night sky. Do you know much about this base?

I know a little about Edwards AFB. For starters, Edwards Air Force Base is the Air Force's primary Air Force Flight Test Center. This is where most aircraft (including the B-2) were flight tested. This base is also the home of the NASA X-Plane program, and the Air Force Test Pilot School.

For much better information on the testing at Edwards AFB, I would recommend contacting Shadowhawk via U2U. X-Planes and Flight Research are a speciality of his. I go to him when I have questions.

Tim