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I Was Thinking About The VT Shootings (Thread Topics)

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posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 01:36 AM
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Originally posted by spacedoubt
But, What about the reverse scanario?
How would you protect yourself, if you were one of the potential victims.
How to avoid being the "fish in a barrel"? A fish without a gun.


But in order to do that you need a detailed idea of what the killer will do and so it is difficult to implement such a thread without details of what could happen.

Anyway, such details of what happened are likely to soon be on Wikipedia, Columbine was really detailed last I looked, as was (as it is similar to this theme) Beslan.

Originally posted by anxietydisorder
Just a reminder of some ATS history.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

We've had a member on our boards that went on a school shooting rampage.


BTW that is stated on wikipedia that he posted here, probably not exactly the ideal publicity this forum needs.

[edit on 18-4-2007 by apex]




posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 02:35 AM
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I would personally like to hear some peoples Ideas on what migh "play out." not for entertainment, but if i was a possible victim in a situation like this, i would like to know what you sick bastards have in mind. that i way i can prepare


is honesty no longer a virtue... lets be good sports here, ehh

[edit on 18-4-2007 by tom goose]



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 06:20 AM
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Westpoint, I applaud you on your foresight to 'test the waters' before actually posting something that some members may find unsuitable.



Although I don't agree with a play by play on how to carry out a school massacre, I do see how it could be somewhat beneficial to a person trapped in that situation. Knowing what the gunman(s) next move might be.

As someone mentioned, It would be more advantageous for a play by play on how to survive a school massacre.

As it would be impossible to predict each scenario, a few helpful 'survival' tips could save a life someday.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 06:48 AM
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I think the issue here is "propriety." Appropriate behavior. If you want to avoid being misunderstood, pose your hypothetical in a different context such as prevention. Under that conditional umbrella, you could and would be placing an absolute caveate on the true intent of what you're doing.

I've been asked to take part in certain discussions on a variety of sites and chatboards which I have turned down for just this reason. Free speech is free speech, but it does come with one price. Consequences. Please forgive me if this seems a little simple, but I have some experience in this area.

Some people have criticized my work because they think it's a how-to. Try getting THAT monkey off your back, and you'll see what I mean. Context matters. Even with all the why's and wherefore's in place, you're still going to run in to some people who derive "something else" from your discussion that you didn't even think of.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 07:15 AM
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it's been revealed that the shooter {Cho = aka 'The Question Mark'}
at VT also wrote & developed 'stories' in the creative writing class he attended,
which others say were 'grotesque'

imho, what your proposing might be interpeted by some members/lurkers
as in the same category, 'grotesque'...no matter what window-dressing is used to justify the exercise.

there's a very fine line, as other posters have suggested
~proceed at your own risk~



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 10:31 AM
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If it weren't so soon after the event I think you'd not have much problem at all, as long as you weren't making a manual on how to do it or anything like that.

They should allow concealed weapons on campuses. There was a bill proposing that here in Jan. 2006 (I live an hour from VT) and it was denied. I doubt 32 people would've been killed if concealed firearms were allowed on campus.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 10:39 AM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
how hypothetically one could/would orchestrate a similar event according to their ideas and means...


Kids who might shoot up your school have the following characteristics:

1) They're a loner, usually spending their time keeping themselves to themselves.

If you see a kid who's a bit of a loner, make sure you're his best mate, because next thing you know he could be shooting up your school. He won't kill you if you're his only friend though. Think!

2) Kids who buy handguns and plenty of ammo.

Just keep an eye out yeah?!



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 02:34 PM
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Originally posted by shaunybaby
Kids who might shoot up your school have the following characteristics:

1) They're a loner, usually spending their time keeping themselves to themselves.
2) Kids who buy handguns and plenty of ammo.

Just keep an eye out yeah?!


You forgot the worst case scenario of your school being shot up, religious fundamentalists.

So Westpoint23, will you be making a thread on this?



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 02:41 PM
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I want to make the thread but as others have said there could be consequences... Frankly I have not given as much thought to "defensive" scenarios as I have to ones about being on the attack, just my nature. Anyway, one member posted "signs" to look for, I think that is somewhat dangerous, you cannot categorize everyone like that. Would this be a bad time to mention that I have owned a gun for several months now?


[edit on 18-4-2007 by WestPoint23]



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 02:46 PM
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Maybe if you posted it in RATS, it would be better than access to everyone. In fact , if there is ever something that if I were thinking of posting in RATS, this would be it.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 03:04 PM
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1. The Amigos are probably going to have to weigh in on this, the subject is way too much of a hot potato for anyone short of them to make a judgment call on.

2. If anything, I'd recommend putting it in RATS where one has to be a member in good standing, and have an idea what ATS is about, before they could see it.

3. I'd treat the subject matter itself as if it were a DHS Red Cell Program operation, where you're basically brainstorming ways in which the worst-case scenarios could play out in order to organize an effective response against them.

4. I'd also ask yourself what you hope to accomplish with such a thread. Would you be sending this to school districts as a response guide? An excercise in mental drubbing? A way to get out of doing homework, etc...

Anyway, I re-iterate #1... I wouldn't do anything on this till the Amigos weigh in.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 03:42 PM
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I can't think of a worse idea. Let's say y'all toss ideas and scenarios around and some kid later uses what he's learned on the site. You will have to live with thought that your idea resulted in one, two maybe 30 deaths. Then there's the possibility that the site will suffer as a result. The press we'd get as a result of our educating the killer in better ways to kill could shut down the site.

Any individual who posted in the thread could probably be held liable in the inevitable lawsuits, as would the site, the owners and possibly the staff.


it's moronic, immoral and downright dumb and, to be totally honest, Westpoint, posting that you want to put out a "plan" and posting that you have owned a gun for a few months now, is a sure way to get yourself on a watch list. Let's say, for arguments sake, that the folks investigating this case find out the the killer visited this site. (remember Weisse mentioned above). They peruse the site, looking for clues and see your post, your admission to interest in the planning and methods one would use and your admission to having recently purchased a gun and suddenly, these investigators are keeping an eye on you, with the hopes of stopping another maniac before it's too late.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by Crakeur
I can't think of a worse idea. Let's say y'all toss ideas and scenarios around and some kid later uses what he's learned on the site. You will have to live with thought that your idea resulted in one, two maybe 30 deaths. Then there's the possibility that the site will suffer as a result. The press we'd get as a result of our educating the killer in better ways to kill could shut down the site.
But if we did it from the other perspective, rather than the attacking idea, would that still come under this sort of category?


it's moronic, immoral and downright dumb and, to be totally honest, Westpoint, posting that you want to put out a "plan" and posting that you have owned a gun for a few months now, is a sure way to get yourself on a watch list.


in a similar way that it is moronic and dumb to loudly shout HI to a person named Jack on a plane?



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 04:25 PM
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apex, I think any discussion about techniques and methods would be unwise. You post ideas on how to hide, defend yourself or escape from such a scene and you are posting things the killer might do first and then you are giving a potential maniac the things to look for should he decide to go forward with his plan.

what if you discussed how to survive, methods for hiding etc and then wespoint goes on a rampage and you read in the papers how he knew the kids doing..... were doing it because it was discussed on ATS.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 04:34 PM
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I see where you are coming from on this issue, and I can tend to agree, but there is an equal chance that the attacker in such a situation would have thought it through themselves and thought up what victims would potentially do.

Anyway, with this sort of thing I think counter coordinated attacks like a terrorist attack would be more useful, as a massacre like VT is likely to be more random, with luck of where the attacker goes being a more contributing factor in survival than what people think of doing. Also how to escape from a filled hall with armed terrorists could be easier to predict, as a strategy would be worked out by the terrorists on how to ensure as much destruction as possible.

With one attacker survival would be much easier I think.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 04:54 PM
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Originally posted by apex

With one attacker survival would be much easier I think.


I don't know about that. one crazy individual is far less predictable than a group of well educated (in the aread of terror), single minded folks who have spent a long time plotting and planning for every contingency.


have you learned nothing from the slasher films of your youth? the only means of survival is to be a virgin, female preferred and you must not imbibe alcohol or partake in any illegal activities. then, and only then, can you manage to escape.



posted on Apr, 18 2007 @ 05:07 PM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
I do not think thought and question should be restricted...

This thought and this question should be.


-closed-





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