a woman joining the masons....??

Originally posted by LILITH_S
I am not rude, I am just realist. She underlined she is a girl many times, she is maybe too young too realize what is it about. Or she might regret her decision later. Secondly, no woman can be a Mason and this is a fact. I think this girl is looking for her identity and it is very human to point her the right place she will find it : not in the Freemasonry, but in herself. I would also like to ask her if she considered the negative aspects of the Freemasonry and the horrible experiences some of its members had. This girl has simply to grow up before joining any society especially one of this type. Why don't you point this to her? Or you are just looking for blind sheeps to follow you ? !!! My words cannot be rude as long as they are reasonable

ERrr.. please space your sentences every once in a while. Thanks.

she is maybe too young too realize what is it about.

As one of the youngest Free Masons in Ohio history, and else where.. I will take that as a personal insult. While I am not one to brag ... oh hell.. I am one of the most arrogant bastards you'll come across.. I am damn smart.. I by far over exceed in just about everything I do, including Masonry, writing and research. I have passed those who are elders to me many times before in many areas when they have doubted me in my youth, I have showed them that age brings experience, but so does vigilant observation and making all efforts to secure knowledge in all forms whenever available. To say one being young makes them
1. inferior to you
2. less of a being to you
3. below your intellectual standards
because you think you are something high and mighty, but my friend, I already look down on you. Your just like the many thousands and millions that walk this world, they think that because they told them selves they are something, or maybe mommy told them they where special.. that they are indeed. In reality it is simply being self absorbed and failing to see themselves as they are, mundane, ordinary, the average norm and egotistical thinking themselves above all the others who likewise think they are better then every one else.. searching for diminutive imperfections instead of looking at their own major social shortcomings.

In short.. it is best not to think your better then any one else that you do not truly know, that by expressing your malcontent for your surroundings, especially on the internet where every word can be scrutinized, you throw your self on the boards openly, for scrutiny, examination, to be read like a book essentially.

And while you may not think your comments where rude, they where, and not just rude, but unjust in that you do not even know the person you blatantly attacked for no reason.. what brothers me even more then all of that, it would appear you joined just to lend your insightful views on CK23... tell me, did feeding your ego off of someone else’s expense get you off well enough?

And I know you will not agree with a word I say, you did nothing wrong, you did not say one thing offensive..

And you want to be a Mason ?! You are not even able to copy/paste

Because this ^^ is how polite, courteous and civil people respond to another individual SIMPLY ASKING FOR HELP which, I find incredibly ironic, is the main principle of Freemasonry, in which you basically just spat on. Congrats.

My words cannot be rude as long as they are reasonable

You know, by apparent admission through personal ignorance, just about as much as any other "internet scholar"..

It is not in your right to tell someone where they need to look for what they desire..

It is not in your right to tell someone what they should believe.

It is not in your right to assume your knowledge is better placed on someone else, in an attempt to indirectly suppress the free will we all have to do, choose and act as we wish.

Why do we not point out that maybe Masonry is not for her?

We point that out to everyone, it was pointed out to me. If she wishes to strive forward and become a co-Mason, even though I nor the majority believe women should be Masons, IT IS NOT IN OUR RIGHT to tell ANYONE what to do, especially in regards to personal, spiritual endeavors.

Surly someone of age would know such basic principles no? Ah yes, ignorance is fluid in all ages and walks of life.

So after all efforts, money and time spent within years, they still prefer to leave than to stay in it. I am wondering, what have these people learned and we don't know yet ?!

Members leave all the time, in fact most leave whether people realize it or not.. they come for the degree, they go buy their fancy ring, they might come to the first two meetings and fade away.. they are already a Mason, why commit to actually partake in it if you get the recognition..

I don't know what they call these people elsewhere around the country, around here they are called "ring Masons" ..

As for the "testimony" there are plenty of threads already explaining, do a little research into it.. to think that someone joining is making them vulnerable to having their sense of individuality taken away is absurd.

Please, simply take time to re-read your own words, and understand your own experiences do not mean you have the right to judge, or attack another member.

-Rock


[edit on 4/23/2007 by Rockpuck]

Is it whole for me ? Isn't it better to do your homeworks kid ? You are wasting your time writing something I wouldn't even read, dear. 20 year old student won't teach me lessons. Heal your frustrations somewhere else

Right, ignorance is a hard wall to breach.

Il keep it simple since I am unsure of your ability to read.

Watch your mouth or it will be the mods that take care of you.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Right, ignorance is a hard wall to breach.

Il keep it simple since I am unsure of your ability to read.

Watch your mouth or it will be the mods that take care of you.

Are you menacing me maybe? Can you read my language like I am reading yours ? Or can you speak it ? Maybe you should see a psychiatrist

Am I menacing you?

What the heck is that even supposed to mean?

Can I speak your language as well as you speak English?

That depends really..

Do you speak Latin? If so, yes.

Do you speak Irish Gaelic? If so, yes.

Do you speak French? If so, yes.

You kinda seem Baltic, and or Slavic in nature. Russian maybe? I don't know, where are you from.. maybe I can, but maybe not. English is a widely spoken language.. speaking English at any level is not as impressive to me then other languages as it is standard in the business world. Most countries teach it.

[edit on 4/24/2007 by Rockpuck]

It is funny you are using this forum as arena to expose your knowledge and skills. "Menacing" is a very clear term, if you are speaking French, it is even easier to understand it. No need to speak to us about your language skills, diplomas, aptitudes etc. I speak more languages than you and I have much higher educational level than you, so it is logic I am not fascinated with what you say. But I am not going to tell you about it, I am not feeding my self-confidence on the Web - like you do (and you seem to be so desperate with your achievements).
Yes, I am Russian. Mais si tu veux, on parle Français, c'est mieux comme ça

Look, I'm not a mod, but I am stepping in here.
This conflagration hast to end.
This is not the topic of this thread, and it is starting to get out of hand.

Please allow CK23 to continue her line of questioning without personal attacks of her character.
If insulting her means that much to you Lilith_S, than feel free to do it via u2u.
By pursuing this line of behavior, all you are really doing is going into a library and screaming at the top of your lungs.
Rockpuck, please...don't allow yourself to be flustered by someone who is obviously baiting you.

Lilith_S, there is no problem with you criticizing CK23, but here on ATS, we hold ourselves to a higher standard and your attacks are quite rude.

Please let's not allow this thread to become a war of attrition, govern yourselves accordingly.

My opinion.

Exactly, this is not an appropriate place to dispute.


@wu kung : It's OK, you are right , this has to stop. Otherwise, I am not enjoying insulting people.

@Rockpuck : *edit*

Mod Note: You Have a U2U- Click Here.




[edit on 24-4-2007 by LILITH_S]

[edit on 26-4-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

[edit on 28-4-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

I do not believe it appropriate to discuss in another language on ATS boards them selves, however if you wish to discuss in French we can take it to U2U - the mods have to be able to read the words you type, otherwise you could be saying all kinds of things and the mods wouldn't know.

However, I will respond in English.

You still rant on about age. "knowledge" does not come with age. And no offense, taking principle lessons from you..... and of course, you should know, we all know, "wisdom" does not come with age either. Experience is the only thing that comes with age. And maybe arthritis.

Kitty, I would like to apologize that your thread was derailed by both my self and Lilith here. Please, carry on with any questions you may have. Perhaps we can help you find a co-Masonic lodge closer to where you live?

PS. How did I know you where Russian.... weird.

[edit on 4/24/2007 by Rockpuck]

Originally posted by LILITH_S
It is funny you are using this forum as arena to expose your knowledge and skills. "Menacing" is a very clear term, if you are speaking French, it is even easier to understand it. No need to speak to us about your language skills, diplomas, aptitudes etc. I speak more languages than you and I have much higher educational level than you, so it is logic I am not fascinated with what you say. But I am not going to tell you about it, I am not feeding my self-confidence on the Web - like you do (and you seem to be so desperate with your achievements).
Yes, I am Russian. Mais si tu veux, on parle Français, c'est mieux comme ça

Lilith S

You might be shocked by both the age and educational level of some of the members of ATS. This forum is not the place for rudeness, regardless of your opinion of the correctness of your view. To demean someone for an honest quest for knowledge or in expressing a desire to follow a given path, is just wrong.

Regardless of educational degrees obtained, and I’m fairly sure that I can match you degree for degree, no one has the right to degrade another person. Language skills do not denote education, only training. Degrees do not denote knowledge only schooling.


[edit on 24-4-2007 by Masonic Student]

Originally posted by Rockpuck
You still rant on about age. "knowledge" does not come with age. And no offense, taking principle lessons from you.....

and of course, you should know, we all know, "wisdom" does not come with age either. Experience is the only thing that comes with age. And maybe arthritis.

OK. Knowledge does not come with age - true. It comes at any age. Experience sometimes comes with age and wisdom always comes with experience. This is my point of view. As far as my personality is concerned, you don't know me at all. But if you claim that you are one of the youngest masons, I will tell you that I am one of the youngest PhD's - this cannot be achieved without principles, determination and hard work.
I won't discuss on this subject again, this thread is opened to help someone, not to support our fights. Sorry for any inconvenience

P.S. I am not Russian , just Slavic

[edit on 24-4-2007 by LILITH_S]

Mod Note: Trim Those Quotes - Please Review this link

[edit on 26-4-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

Originally posted by Masonic Student
Regardless of educational degrees obtained, and I’m fairly sure that I can match you degree for degree, no one has the right to degrade another person. Language skills do not denote education, only training. Degrees do not denote knowledge only schooling.

You are perfectly right. Thanks. I have no intention to degrade anybody (anymore)

Mod Note: Trim Those Quotes - Please Review this link

[edit on 26-4-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

Lilith S

Welcome, I hope to read more of your post in the future.



Kitty,
Co-masonry
is a link that I hope will let you find a co-masonry lodge closer to your home.


[edit on 24-4-2007 by Masonic Student]

lilith s, again, i thank you for the information. the whole point of these threads is to gain info, and that can only be good.

are there any Freemasons who have had any negative experiences that they would be willing to share ?

Reading your posts, I have got an impression that you are simply seeking to belong in order to feel stronger, more secure or more powerful. This is without a doubt your principal motivation. It is true that joining a community could give you the precious feeling of being powerful and protected..

there are good and bad sides to everything, and obviously i want to learn as much as i can, i received my application 6 months ago and still have not sent it in. if i was just wanting to 'join any old group just to feel powerful', then i would have joined already.

there is no way for anyone to really 'know' someone else via these posts on-line, all i can do is tell you (all), that i am putting myself out there openly and honestly, and hopefully i ask the right questions and do so without disrespecting anyone.
ck23

everyone.. i am sorry things got out of hand.. obviously there are some very strong feelings about my question on if a woman can join a Lodge.

the link you have posted for Co-Masonry, is the one i have used. it is the group that i have already been in contact with since last year.

are there any positive or negative views re: that website ??

ck23


[edit on 26-4-2007 by curiouskitty23]

CK23, if you wish to learn more and have questions that need answering, I started this thread for that very reason.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Feel free to come and ask.
Read through the previous posts, you might find some very interesting information there.

-WK

Originally posted by curiouskitty23
everyone.. i am sorry things got out of hand.. obviously there are some very strong feelings about my question on if a woman can join a Lodge.

the link you have posted for Co-Masonry, is the one i have used. it is the group that i have already been in contact with since last year.

are there any positive or negative views re: that website ??

ck23


[edit on 26-4-2007 by curiouskitty23]

From the looks of it, it honestly looks like a very well run, well regulated and well obedient organization. If Masonry is for you, and you are looking for support from a Mason, I support you 110% in your endeveur..

If you find what your searching, you will know you have found it, and that is all there is to it.. the acceptance and opinions of others are then irrelevant.

I hope you find a lodge near you so that you do not have to travel to far. Keep us up to date on how it goes for you, or if you decide on something else. You have friends here .

Also, if you have any other questions, go to the thread that brother Wu Kung posted.. it is an excellent resource center for information regarding Masonry on all levels to be asked, evaluated and responded to equally and honestly.. no lies, no bs. Ask your question and someone will get your answer.