Billy Meier UFO Contact Hoax: Discussion, page 78


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ATS Members have flagged this thread 18 times


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 05:48 PM by easynow
Already covered.


You got that right !

Forced perspective is a fact and many examples have already been shown.

www.examiner.com...

www.examiner.com...

no further PROOF has been presented from Meier or anyone defending this story that shows what we are seeing are NOT photos that are forced perspective.

biased money making documentary's don't count.

extraordinary claims require extraordinary PROOF. the burden lies upon the one making the claim to prove it ...not the opposite.



Lock all the Meier threads except one and move it to the Grey area where it belongs.




















[edit on 22-4-2009 by easynow]


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 05:53 PM by Indigo_Child
reply to post by easynow



LOL, that is not a forced perspective. That is a badly photoshopped cut-out of Meier's head and Wedding cake UFO onto the IIG image plundering Meier's trashcans

Nobody has yet been able to show that Meier's photos use a forced perspective. I already examined one in the deleted thread and described the significant differences.

Until that is not forthcoming, no matter how many times you say it, it won't make it true.

Show don't tell.

[edit on 22-4-2009 by Indigo_Child]



reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 05:58 PM by Malcram
reply to post by Soloist



Lets take one point at a time and keep things coherent.

The Dino pics. I responded to that on the last page. First, can we directly link them to Meier - did he definitely take them and second, did he definitely present them as real evidence of his claimed trip? Can this be proven?

I think this is important in view of some claims that fake Meier photos were introduced in order to "contaminate" the evidence and discredit Meier. If so, they have succeeded remarkably! So can you answer my questions and the others on the last page regarding the Dino and other pics you are highlighting?

[edit on 22-4-2009 by Malcram]


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 05:59 PM by easynow
reply to post by Indigo_Child



Nobody has yet been able to show that Meier's photos use a forced perspective


see this is the problem

it is not up to us to prove it's forced perspective

it's up to the advocates to PROVE that it is not !

so far ...you or anyone else hasn't proved it so this case will remain a HOAX until you do


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 06:04 PM by Indigo_Child
reply to post by DaMod



The bottom image is photoshopped, you do know that right?


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 06:09 PM by Malcram
reply to post by easynow



Not so, it doesn't work that way.

Until you prove that it is definitely forced perspective - or other methods of hoaxing - then your definite claim, that is IS forced perspective, and therefore a hoax, is illegitimate - it is a belief touted as "fact".

Let me post a little from an article that can be found by clicking the links in my signature that is relevant here:

"Since the true skeptic does not assert a claim, he has no burden to prove anything.. But if a critic asserts that there is evidence for disproof, that he has a negative hypothesis...he is making a claim and therefore also has to bear a burden of proof.

Critics who assert negative claims...often act as though they have no burden of proof placed on them at all, though such a stance would be appropriate only for the agnostic or true skeptic. A result of this is that many critics seem to feel it is only necessary to present a case for their counter-claims based upon plausibility rather than empirical evidence... Showing evidence is unconvincing is not grounds for completely dismissing it. If a critic asserts that the result was due to artifact X, that critic then has the burden of proof to demonstrate that artifact X can and probably did produce such results under such circumstances....Alas, most critics seem happy to sit in their armchairs producing post hoc counter-explanations. Whichever side ends up with the true story, science best progresses through laboratory investigations."


[edit on 22-4-2009 by Malcram]


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 06:15 PM by Malcram
reply to post by Aspie



The proof of the claim that they have been faked is more relevant than the pictures.

Where is the proof



reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 06:16 PM by DaMod
reply to post by Indigo_Child



Are the trash can lids photoshopped??? i don't think they are sorry.


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 06:21 PM by Malcram
reply to post by Soloist



I take it that is a 'No" then, to my question.

I think we can reasonably link Meier to a good deal of his evidence. My question is can the same be done with these particular photographs? it's not an unreasonable question.

If you know someone claims to have taken photographs of UFO etc, and that people were also intent of discrediting him and you heard that they had even introduced fake evidence passing it off as the work of this person, would you not think it important to try to distinguish between what was actually his evidence and possibly fake evidence introduced to discredit him?

[edit on 22-4-2009 by Malcram]


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 06:24 PM by Aspie
Originally posted by Malcram
reply to
post by Aspie



The proof of the claim that they have been faked is more relevant than the pictures.

Where is the proof


Listen to the episode of the Paracast where Horn makes his second appearance. You will get a full explanation there


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 06:26 PM by Indigo_Child
Damod,

The trash can lid in the third image is photoshopped. In the original the man is holding a normal trash can lid.


reply to
post by Soloist



Yes we can link Billy Meier directly to the pictures and videos, because we can see him taking them and the investigation documentary shows him taking the investigators to all the locations where he took his shots, giving them his original film and negatives, as well sound recording and metal samples.

However, there is no link shown that the Dinosaur pics and other pics taken on trips. Do you have any published material where Meier claims ownership of these pics? I am only familiar of one publication, the original Lee Elders one published in 1983 which was personally verified by Meier. Are these pics present in that book?

[edit on 22-4-2009 by Indigo_Child]


reply posted on 22-4-2009 @ 10:53 PM by Soloist
Originally posted by EffEcTiVe_UniT
touche indigo touche.

The fact that the mods closed down the thread after derek admitted that he didnt fully investigate the case is obvious.

The fact that the people who believe the meier evidence is true is brutally attacked without a penalty or warning at all from mods.

The fact that meier evidence supporters cannot even go to an offensive side without being called a cultist or personally attacking and labeled abuse.

This is relevant because this would explain to what ATS is doing to discredit and artificially degrading this topic and the strong offensive attacks that we constantly are under attack from. Yet nothing is done.

Why ATS are you stepping aside from all this. You enforce your rules on meier supporters but yet you let us recieve personal attacks...


Wow, did you nail yourself up on that cross all by yourself? This is a discussion forum, you seem to be perceiving those who would appear to be much more knowledgeable about the hoax as attacking you instead of listening and absorbing what they have to say. There's a reason for it, it's not just a witch hunt for poor Bill and his "evidence supporters".

Hoaxes are frowned upon, and should be. You should ask yourself do you really care about ufology, or just not admitting being wrong, even if it's painfully obvious? I don't see how anyone can possibly have both in this instance.


Read through this whole thread, it's long, but notice the "Meier evidence supporters" reactions to the truth about this hoax, every time they hit a wall they add a twist and expect more and more until it gets to an impossible burden of proof, when in reality, it would seem, they don't care about the truth, only being right.
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