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Topic started on 11-4-2007 @ 10:33 AM by Chicagofreedomfighter
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3 generals spurn war ‘czar’ post
Bush seeks overseer for Iraq, Afghanistan
Read it, I am speechless.
www.msnbc.msn.com...
I don’t know what’s more frightening the fact that this is real, or how nonchalant its being reported because lets face it Don-imus is way more
*SNIP* important.
Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.
[edit on 11/4/2007 by Mirthful Me]
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reply posted on 11-4-2007 @ 01:40 PM by DCFusion
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Great find! Can't believe I missed it. I think this is extremely indicative of the pitiful situation in Iraq and Afghanistan and the opinions people
have of they way Bush is handling things. If the Bush Admin. has asked three people and each one said no, that says an awful lot.
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reply posted on 11-4-2007 @ 11:47 PM by iori_komei
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And here I thought we were supposed to hate anything to do with the
former Soviet Union, now he wants a war czar. 
On a more serious note, can he actually appoint one, I suspect that he
can without violating anything, but still it seems odd.
I wonder how long it will take him to find someone, or more likely, how
long before he gets so impatient that he can't get anyone that he has a
fit and basically says screw it and drops the idea.
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 01:02 AM by Rockpuck
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Haha Iori..
I do wonder why we keep naming our offices "czar" .. slightly unusual given the meaning of the word?
Anyways. OP offered typical over reaction. OMG the country is ruined a war czar!
The czar apparently would be a high commander over both theaters.. then report back to the pentagon..
There are only 2 commanding generals, one over Iraq and the other over Afghanistan, I cannot imagine communication is that hard.. now they need to
report to a middle man? Bureaucracy, growing to help the growing bureaucracy.
And to say this is the new American Dictatorship, this should actually solidify the fact that this administration is to weak to do something so grand.
He has NO backing from the military.. the three top picks said hell no! One guy said all he would do is develop an ulcer and leave anyways.
Gotta love a general with humor.
They all know Bush cannot run a war, and that this is a PR stunt with no actual meaning.
So calm down there OP, the world is safe for another day! .... or is it! 
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 08:13 AM by aecreate
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He screwed up wars in two countries,
now he wants somone else to deal
with them, except, NO ONE WANTS TO!
I guess "The Decider" has reached
the height of his incompetence if
he has to find someone to do
his job as Commander-in-Chief.
Ain't that the truth
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 08:23 AM by marg6043
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Bush can not even run his own personal finances . . . he is ruining our nation, now it got us into a never ending conflict in the middle east for oil
. . . now he wants to shift the mess he got us in the middle east to retired military generals.
I am glad that the three prospect have the intelligence to decline because they know that the mess can not be fix.
But we have also McCain a presidential candidate that said that Iraq must be won I tell you this politicians on agenda can not differentiate
their head from their butts.
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 10:37 AM by CX
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I would'nt get all excited about this, the UK has had a drugs czar for ages. Not that it's made a blind bit of difference! 
UK drugs czar
Look up any definition and it clearly states that it's a word used by western countries for ages.
Dictionary Library > Words > Dictionary czar (zär, tsär)
n.
also tsar or tzar (zär, tsär) A male monarch or emperor, especially one of the emperors who ruled Russia until the revolution of 1917.
A person having great power; an autocrat: “the square-jawed, ruddy complacency of Jack Farrell, the czar of the Fifteenth Street police station”
(Ernest Hemingway).
Informal. An appointed official having special powers to regulate or supervise an activity: a racetrack czar; an energy czar.
[Russian tsar', from Old Russian tsĭsarĭ, emperor, king, from Old Church Slavonic tsěsarĭ, from Gothic kaisar, from Greek, from Latin Caesar,
emperor. See caesar.]
Metaphorical uses
Like many lofty titles, e.g. Mogul, Tsar or Czar has been used as a metaphor for positions of high authority, in English since 1866 (referring to U.S.
President Andrew Johnson), with a connotation of dictatorial powers and style, fitting since "Autocrat" was an official title of the Russian Emperor
(informally referred to as 'the Czar').
This use is not limited to statesmen, e.g. 'drug czar' for the head of the Drug Enforcement Administration, the U.S. agency against illegal
narcotics, or "terrorism czar" for a Presidential advisor on terrorism policy.
CX.
[edit on 12/4/07 by CX]
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 11:13 AM by DenyAllKnowledge
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I noticed on CX's source that the original Shah was missing.
For example Xerxes title was xšāyaθiya xšāyaθiyānām (Achaemenid/Old Persian)
šāhān šāh (Parthia+Sassanian/Middle Persian)
shāhanshāh (Parsi/Farsi/Modern Persian)
Literally: King of Kings
The Russian Tsars adopted the title from the Persian word (Stalin, a native Georgian and a Tsar in all but title, had a fascination with the ancient
Shahs of persia which is discussed in more detail in the book "Stalin: Court of the Red Tsar")
So in a weird way, and probably completely unknown to himself, Bush is infact making a link to Persia and therefore Iran. His Arch-Enemies!!
There was a program on Radio4 the other day about the proliferation of Tsars here in the UK, a Respect Tsar, Crime Tsar, Mental Health Tsar, the list
is endless and tiresome.
It basically seems that Bush is trying to get someone to take the responsibility for his mess and take the eventual downfall. Must be the most
unappealing position in the government!
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 11:40 AM by drogo
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the use of czar has entered the language as use for an entity in total cotroll (sometimes only imagioned). so the usage of "czar" in this story is
not some froidian slip but just normal modern use of the word.
the story however is interesting i hadn't heard about it yet. so bush is looking for someone to use as a scapegoat for his failing little war.
someone he can point to and say "it's your fault". i don't think i'd want that possition either.
the real question is what the heck can be done to try to fix this massive mistake? can't realy leave or all hell will break loose, staying is going
to prove costly. dammed if you do dammed if you don't.  staying is getting good soldiers killed but to leave would prety much cause a civil war.
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 12:14 PM by deltaboy
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Then I guess we been living under dictatorship for decades if we start assuming the word czar is meaning dictator automatically. We got a drug czar,
economic czar, an intelligence czar, and now a war czar.
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 12:49 PM by marg6043
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Who is going to agree to becoming a WAR CZAR?
Anybody that cares about their reputation and with political future will stay away from a position like that. . .
Because as bad as things are going in the middle east and with no end in the future it will be the WAR CZAR reputation in line.
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 03:12 PM by Orwells Ghost
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Perhaps this is an "intelligent" move on Bushes part as he realizes he needs a unified command to coordinate these disparate forces for their pincer
assault on Iran!
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reply posted on 12-4-2007 @ 10:01 PM by iraqvet68
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Doesn't make sense from a military standpoint, maybe to share air assets or shuffle funding around. Otherwise just another layer of B.S. piled on.
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reply posted on 13-4-2007 @ 04:14 AM by Inannamute
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 Originally posted by DenyAllKnowledge
The Russian Tsars adopted the title from the Persian word (Stalin, a native Georgian and a Tsar in all but title, had a fascination with the ancient
Shahs of persia which is discussed in more detail in the book "Stalin: Court of the Red Tsar")
Can you cite sources for your understanding of the etymology here? As far as I've always been aware (and a quick check online confirmed this) all the
varieties of the word used actually are descended from the person, Caesar - since after the first Caesar and his son, the title came to mean the Roman
Emperor, and from there it was adopted by other languages and races.
I'm not sure where the Shah you mentioned fits in, but the Caesar etymology makes more sense, especially considering the pronunciation and common
spellings of the word - indicating something closer to a two syllable rather than single syllable sound.
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reply posted on 14-4-2007 @ 08:50 PM by coolieno99
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This is nothing new. Bush cannot think for himself. He has to hired someone to do the thinking for him.
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reply posted on 14-4-2007 @ 08:57 PM by dgtempe
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A nation of warriors that requires a Czar to really intimidate the pants out of our earth neighbors.
And we are going to let it happen. Yep. Drug Lords and War Czars. I guess War on terror and Homeland security is not enough because to the paranoid
the message has to be stronger. CZAR.
Somebody shoot me. Please. 
**I remember when i used to be laughed at when i mentioned things like this coming down the pike....Well, here it is and not many are laughing
anymore.
I never knew how prophetic my words would be.  
[edit on 14-4-2007 by dgtempe]
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reply posted on 14-4-2007 @ 09:28 PM by Sauron
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I am sure the boy king will find someone to take the heat for him,
Why no one wants to be Bush's war czar.
By Fred Kaplan
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Fifth, everyone (except maybe the appointed czar) understands all this from the outset—understands that the whole enterprise is a PR stunt to make
the president look like he's trying to do something and to absolve him from blame after it's clear that even the wise outsider couldn't work
miracles.
www.slate.com...
[edit on 14/4/2007 by Sauron]
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reply posted on 15-4-2007 @ 07:29 PM by Luxifero
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God must be slapping himself continuously for appointing this man to his Presidency.
The Slate article states it perfectly by directing readers in the end to internalize the idiocy of this plan to create a war czar when our
self-appointed war president is the only cogent figure to make productive and positive change in Iran and Afghanistan.
Luxifero
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