Why i think the TR-3B Astra Locust does not exist and never did

There are rumor all around the internet about the TR-3B as an explanation for all the triangular craft sighting.
It's all the same, on every website the same info about it, nothing new or different everywhere the same...

so let's have a look at it



The triangular shape of this plane has 3 well placed hydrogene/oxygene engines.
Now, somewhere in the middle, it's got a "Magnet Field Disruptor" MFD, this is a ring transporting plasma preassurized 250,000 atmospheres in 150° Kelvin.
The result of that is a 89% mass reduction ( some sites say it's not actually anti-g some do, artists impression )

Now imagine to powering a frisby with rotorblades...the effect is the same. This craft would be uncontrollable.

So the first thing BULL# at this is the fact that sightings of triangular craft are blamed on this craft, there are numorous reasons why "they" aren't "this" .

1. thing, the Belgium triangle, which looks pretty much alike TR3B,
this is the most TR3B guessed case, well the Triangle did ascend 1000 meters in a finger snip and it broke several target locks from the fighter planes chasing it.
There is still air resistance in the theory of the TR3B, this would simply not be possible ( not to mention the g-effect )

2. How the hell would a top secret information like this i mean look at the amount of info, it's all very specific, how would this reach the internets and appear all the same on every site you seek for TR3B ?

3. The military would never let them fly, where these triangles are reportedly doing, in some cases they're low/slow flying even near highways.

...etc

All that doesn't match

Well my theory is, the TR3B was CREATED by those who use to cover it all up, to let the people blame their sightings on Top Secret military stuff.

I want your opinions




[edit on 29-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

[edit on 29-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

[edit on 29-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

Hello,

I like the thread idea you have here but it has been covered lots so be prepared for many referenced to them. I have a few questions for you and your knowledge of the alleged craft.

1.What do you think the sightings are?

2.Other than internet, what's your understanding of aircreft technology?

I will wait to post more after I get your respones to these questions. Your above mentioned reasons as to why it cannot be possible/military are very incorrect, you are comparing totally different technologies using past understandings of physics. What used to be impossible is not very practical and applicable.

Peace, Mondo

Originally posted by Mondogiwa
Hello,

I like the thread idea you have here but it has been covered lots so be prepared for many referenced to them. I have a few questions for you and your knowledge of the alleged craft.

1.What do you think the sightings are?

2.Other than internet, what's your understanding of aircreft technology?

I will wait to post more after I get your respones to these questions. Your above mentioned reasons as to why it cannot be possible/military are very incorrect, you are comparing totally different technologies using past understandings of physics. What used to be impossible is not very practical and applicable.

Peace, Mondo

"incorrect" so if you know better about the effects of a MFD for example, teach me.
Also precisize on what is that much incorrect.
However my english is not that good to precisely describe all my thoughts however.

1.What do you think the sightings are?

I believe these triangles are of completely different technology, probably not of this earth. ( come on it's quite obvious )
You should go read some reports about them, their manouvers bahavour etc. only then you can make yourself a picture of the sightingis in context with this.

2.Other than internet, what's your understanding of aircreft technology?

Quite ok in the "classified" information.

you are comparing totally different technologies using past understandings of physics.

You must be a joker.

Tell me something about TR-3B you know more than me.
[edit on 29-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

[edit on 29-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

[edit on 29-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

Paul,

First, where are you from, your English is fine.

Next, the possibility of the TR3B's existence is up in the air, but the technology that is suggested makes it possible (at least in theory). There are technologies that exist today that render airflow and airflow disturbance obsolete, in effect they make air disturbance not a factor.

I have been privy to some suggested technologies (none are ever said to exist on paper and application), and they take what we commonly know as airfows and turn them on their ears.

I worked for the U.S. Navy as part of the F18 program and have also talked with emmbers of other branches that will completely agree with me that these technologies are possible and probable. Some of these friends of mine are even here on ATS and cruise the aircraft forums as I do.

Can I prove this, no! In time will we all know of these projects, probably! Believe me Paul, the craft and propulsion systems that are out there or at least being tested, are beyond most people's wildest dreams. The Triangle sightings that people see have many possibilities, and I cannot really comment on what other people say they have see, as I have not seen them myself.

Maybe there are other technologies from other worlds at play here......BUT...I would bet almost anything in the world on the fact that they are just our own projects at work and test. Just my thoughts and opinion and I choose to not argue over it with you. If you want to throw opinions around, great..I love to debate and share thoughts. however, I wish no opinion pushing either way, nor disrespect at all. So, I apologize if you feel that I was harsh, not my intention at all. We are all entitled to our own opinions and the facts that we have to back them up, right!

Peace to you sir, Mondo

Ive followed the Belgium triangle case for some time, its one of my favorite UFO cases of all time. Im not sure anything about its movement make it clearly of Alien origin. In my opinion it would highly suggest being a remotely operated aircraft.

We are already building them and in theory atleast they can be designed to take G forces that would kill a human.

First of all, yeah Mondogiwa i'd like to discuss this here :-) ( last time i tried in a sci-fi forum it failed lol ) and i hoped you would answer my question as you said my statements above were incorrect.

Well to make this clear, i believe USA have stolen UFO technology from the NAZIS aswell as from the probably Roswell incident ( if it was not their own flightdisc ) , they're also in contact with other species so my guesses.

But the triangles is maybe a bigger thing than you might think.

Not only that they do insane maneuvres that they simply have to be gravitationless. Witnesses always say "floating" but never "flying" to note this.

I do not dismiss the possibility, that the USA would own them, but i am pretty sure their source is not from us, although Triangles sightings were likely not there before 1980 if i'm not totally wrong.

If you look often in the Aliens forum on ATS, there was a thread with a perfect edged triangle on the mars surface, a shape that would not be natural, probably a craft.

Also important to UFO classification is the behavour.
While discs often be extremely fast passing the skies in high altitudes, triangles seem to be extreme slow flying aswell as sometimes low flying, well not always of course but that's the reason they're more often reported.
Now that's the exact oposite the military would do, no doubt on that, i mean they got A51, they would have enogh space there to test everything, why would it be Belgium or an area near a highway?

What interests me, i have never heard of a triangle being built at A51, what i heard being built there were discs and a diamond-like shaped spyplane, the ex-worker described it an insect shape.

There's plently any information about Triangles being built under government secrecy, but this very information about the craft, now where is it from, who told it first?
It's all very suspicous to me, unlike of other theories.


[edit on 30-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
I do not dismiss the possibility, that the USA would own them, but i am pretty sure their source is not from us, although Triangles sightings were likely not there before 1980 if i'm not totally wrong.

A very interesting theory and one shared by alot of people.

The one thing that often makes me doubt if certain UFO sightings are secret Soviet or US aircraft is sometimes where they are sighted. If the Belgium triangle was a US or Russian black aircraft what was it doing in Belgium airspace and over populated areas no less?

Both those countries have very remote and very secure locations on their own soil to test such aircraft to their hearts content.

95% of them are not ours i have no doubt about that, aswell as i have no doubt that the Belgium one was not ours.


I was speculating if the government or military made the theory themselves, to calm the people down and give them a slight explanation of what they saw and how "normal" it actually is for a top secret airplane etc.
or how the hell do we got that much accurized information about a top-secret vehicle out there?


And did you ever ask yourself why Black Triangles are actually black?
The answer is easy, they don't get illuminated/reflected by anything, i came to the thought because researches found out that quickly that the ligts beneath the objects never illuminated the surface of the triangle, neither was there ever a sun reflection seen on the surface.


[edit on 30-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

[edit on 30-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

It wouldn't surprise me if the TR-3B was a UAV. I personally don't buy the oxygen/hydrogen propulsion claim. More likely that its nuclear powered(see nerva), combine that with plasma technology that cancels out airflow(it effectively flies in a vacuum). Combined with the MFD(gravity nullification not anti-gravity)and you've got one mean *explitive*.

one of the things i didn't buy either.

Yeah an engine that runs on rocket propellent. some people will believe anything. Honestly I don't think the TR-3B is an alien craft(don't really believe any of them are). I know it looks incredibly advanced, but when going over technology that was researched, and then suddenly cancelled makes me suspicious of our true technological capabilities.

[edit on 31-3-2007 by danwild6]

Originally posted by danwild6
It wouldn't surprise me if the TR-3B was a UAV. I personally don't buy the oxygen/hydrogen propulsion claim. More likely that its nuclear powered(see nerva), combine that with plasma technology that cancels out airflow(it effectively flies in a vacuum). Combined with the MFD(gravity nullification not anti-gravity)and you've got one mean *explitive*.

This is closer to the truth in my opinion and based on what I have seen working in the UAV area. No proof, but the technology, as i stated before is there.

Peace, Mondo

Technology that is obvious too high to be done just by us, just look at the enormous amount of reports, which damn military would fly them there???
How could a craft of us simply do turns like that??? Why would the USA not have fighters of that kind then?
IT ALL SIMPLY DOESN'T MATCH.
Though some people just avoid the possibility of it being ET which is plain stupid.
"Some people will believe just anything" that's the point, many people will not even ask themselves how this damn thing works in theory, but it's obvious it lacks.


Danwild6, what do you think is the origin of flying discs?

[edit on 31-3-2007 by Paul the seeker]

Paul,

Do you just jump to the conclusion that alieans are involved when you can't understand the technology?? It seems you just restate the same point over and over again. You can't really explain how a cell phone does what it does but you don't think aliens made them...or do you?

By stating that since the technology is just obviously too far advanced for us to have made you are making the same mistake as you claim others make by saying they are ours. The point is that you have no, and I mean no proof whatsoever other than your thoughts and ideas that make sense to YOU! This is the same thing that everybody does, no matter what their stance is on the subject. There's no way to know for sure...it just has to be a logical deductive approach based on your personal experience and/or knowledge base. For me, it's all based on governement military projects with the U.S. Navy that I get my thoughts and ideas and information from. I have seen with my very own eyes some technologies under study that are mind blowing and I still am not sure that I really understand them so it's just beyond me....but, I totally and completely believe that we have the capability and knowledge to create otherwordly technologies. That is not to say that they are all our own but I am convinced beyond any shadow of a doubt that what most people have seen is our own technologies. It does not have to fit into your box or mine!

Peace to you sir, end of posts on subject for me.

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
Technology that is obvious too high to be done just by us, just look at the enormous amount of reports, which damn military would fly them there???

Well given the trillion dollars that has disappeared from the DOD over the past decades, I have no doubt that the black world is suitably financed for such innovations.

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
How could a craft of us simply do turns like that??? Why would the USA not have fighters of that kind then?

Why not? What assumptions are you making? The combination of nuclear propulsion with autonomous control, and plasma technology alone would be enough to make "modern fighters" completely obsolete. All of the above mentioned technologies are well researched. To say nothing of gravity nullification.

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
Though some people just avoid the possibility of it being ET which is plain stupid.
"Some people will believe just anything" that's the point, many people will not even ask themselves how this damn thing works in theory, but it's obvious it lacks.

Well I never said it wasn't a possibilty; however, I find that given the evidence, there is just as much chance that these are terrestrial craft(more so imo)as there is that they are of extraterrestrial origin.

I believe you will find that a great many people are wondering how these things work(I'm one of them). But that doesn't mean we will necessarily come to the same conclusion.

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
Danwild6, what do you think is the origin of flying discs?

Most(if not all)ufo sightings are either natural phenomena(unexplained included), misidentified aircraft, or classified government craft. The vast majority of the sightings fall into the first two categories.

Why do I believe that? Well I guess the main reason is, when Kenneth Arnold reported his sighting to the media. He stated that he saw "craft reminiscent of two half cresents stuck together and flying like saucers skipping across water" of course there are variations of this statement. Arnold can be seen here holding an artists conception of what he saw.





I've always thought that its awfully nice of the aliens to design there starships based on our perception of what hey should look like.

Originally posted by Mondogiwa
Paul,

Do you just jump to the conclusion that alieans are involved when you can't understand the technology?? It seems you just restate the same point over and over again. You can't really explain how a cell phone does what it does but you don't think aliens made them...or do you?

By stating that since the technology is just obviously too far advanced for us to have made you are making the same mistake as you claim others make by saying they are ours. The point is that you have no, and I mean no proof whatsoever other than your thoughts and ideas that make sense to YOU! This is the same thing that everybody does, no matter what their stance is on the subject. There's no way to know for sure...it just has to be a logical deductive approach based on your personal experience and/or knowledge base. For me, it's all based on governement military projects with the U.S. Navy that I get my thoughts and ideas and information from. I have seen with my very own eyes some technologies under study that are mind blowing and I still am not sure that I really understand them so it's just beyond me....but, I totally and completely believe that we have the capability and knowledge to create otherwordly technologies. That is not to say that they are all our own but I am convinced beyond any shadow of a doubt that what most people have seen is our own technologies. It does not have to fit into your box or mine!

Peace to you sir, end of posts on subject for me.

I know what you mean but you're totally wrong about it.
I see it from the realistic side, which concludes it is more likely being related to alien technology. I've read incidents about triangles enough to know their flight behavour, flight location .. all that doesn't match. You didn't lose a word to my arguments you just seem to bash that this theory is so real working, that's not discussion.
Now tell me what, do you even hold the possibility yourself it could be not of us?

Originally posted by danwild6

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
Technology that is obvious too high to be done just by us, just look at the enormous amount of reports, which damn military would fly them there???

Well given the trillion dollars that has disappeared from the DOD over the past decades, I have no doubt that the black world is suitably financed for such innovations.

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
How could a craft of us simply do turns like that??? Why would the USA not have fighters of that kind then?

Why not? What assumptions are you making? The combination of nuclear propulsion with autonomous control, and plasma technology alone would be enough to make "modern fighters" completely obsolete. All of the above mentioned technologies are well researched. To say nothing of gravity nullification.

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
Though some people just avoid the possibility of it being ET which is plain stupid.
"Some people will believe just anything" that's the point, many people will not even ask themselves how this damn thing works in theory, but it's obvious it lacks.

Well I never said it wasn't a possibilty; however, I find that given the evidence, there is just as much chance that these are terrestrial craft(more so imo)as there is that they are of extraterrestrial origin.

I believe you will find that a great many people are wondering how these things work(I'm one of them). But that doesn't mean we will necessarily come to the same conclusion.

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
Danwild6, what do you think is the origin of flying discs?

Most(if not all)ufo sightings are either natural phenomena(unexplained included), misidentified aircraft, or classified government craft. The vast majority of the sightings fall into the first two categories.

Why do I believe that? Well I guess the main reason is, when Kenneth Arnold reported his sighting to the media. He stated that he saw "craft reminiscent of two half cresents stuck together and flying like saucers skipping across water" of course there are variations of this statement. Arnold can be seen here holding an artists conception of what he saw.

I've always thought that its awfully nice of the aliens to design there starships based on our perception of what hey should look like.

i guess reaing some more reports of UFO would change your mind also :/
And i wonder how you can even guess what the percentage of misidentified classified objects natural phenomenon etc. is.

Is your beileve about that just based uppon this one person Kenneth Arnold ?



[edit on 1-4-2007 by Paul the seeker]

[edit on 1-4-2007 by Paul the seeker]

[edit on 1-4-2007 by Paul the seeker]

Paul, you aren't from belgium or holland by chance? (seemed so to me for some reason)

I'd have to agree the belgian ufo cases are some of the best candidates out there. not in the least because the official research is public, done by a civilian agency in cooperation with the belgian air force. (SOBEPS)
But I also regard all this as phenomena untill conclusively proven what all these things are. Speculation is fine and all but it can go awry.

If you are belgian and live there you should be able to request the research.
I phoned once but got a french speaking belgian on the phone and my french is almost non existing.


I do not understand quite how you find aliens more realistic then technological advances of our own?
You do know the new fighters now are technology of 15 - 20 years ago. they might have had just 1 or 2 testbeds back then but large scale use and public existence is 15 - 25 years after the innovations. So imagine what we might have 20 years from now. and now imagine somewhere in a hanger are 2 or so testbeds for this technology... explains some stuff without even getting technical.

Another thing is.
Why would a far more advanced alien species be interested in a little planet with a species on it that can barely get of the ground? (from their point of view)
I have a good reason as I dabble in the alternate history/religion scene but aside from that any reason at all? we think far more of ourselves then we should. we're barely crawling out of our shell and we act like we know everything. so again why would they care?

And I'd prefer to see a more professional scientific mindset and less emotion.

you're frowning on some people here and that's not really the smartest thing to do in this place. several people can be called real veterans of this field and have looked at every theory inside and out.

also I don't think it's very scientific to just try and enforce your theory in the manner you have.

The alien thing is just fine. like I said I'm from a scene which has a good reason for at least one alien species to be curious about us.
But your argument of how well everything fits in your alien point of view that's saying nothing.
When you assume it's aliens, incomprehensably far ahead of us, anything... really anything can be 'explained'.

[edit on 1-4-2007 by David2012]

[edit on 1-4-2007 by David2012]

Originally posted by Paul the seeker
i guess reaing some more reports of UFO would change your mind also :/
And i wonder how you can even guess what the percentage of misidentified classified objects natural phenomenon etc. is.

Is your beileve about that just based uppon this one person Kenneth Arnold ?

I can guess because it some logical given peoples willingness too see what they want too see(or what they believe they saw). And my belief is based upon an analytical view of the UFO phenomena.

Example one- Kenneth Arnold's sighting: He reports crescent shaped craft which were misreported as saucer shaped. Since then the great majority of sightings have been of round saucer like objects. The half crescent I don't believe has been seen since.

Example two- Roswell Incident: An incident that was reported to the public by the military and then denied by the military. I find it hard to believe that the military would accidentally(as has been suggested)devulge the capture of a "flying disk".

Originally posted by David2012
Paul, you aren't from belgium or holland by chance? (seemed so to me for some reason)

I'd have to agree the belgian ufo cases are some of the best candidates out there. not in the least because the official research is public, done by a civilian agency in cooperation with the belgian air force. (SOBEPS)
But I also regard all this as phenomena untill conclusively proven what all these things are. Speculation is fine and all but it can go awry.

If you are belgian and live there you should be able to request the research.
I phoned once but got a french speaking belgian on the phone and my french is almost non existing.


I do not understand quite how you find aliens more realistic then technological advances of our own?
You do know the new fighters now are technology of 15 - 20 years ago. they might have had just 1 or 2 testbeds back then but large scale use and public existence is 15 - 25 years after the innovations. So imagine what we might have 20 years from now. and now imagine somewhere in a hanger are 2 or so testbeds for this technology... explains some stuff without even getting technical.

Another thing is.
Why would a far more advanced alien species be interested in a little planet with a species on it that can barely get of the ground? (from their point of view)
I have a good reason as I dabble in the alternate history/religion scene but aside from that any reason at all? we think far more of ourselves then we should. we're barely crawling out of our shell and we act like we know everything. so again why would they care?

And I'd prefer to see a more professional scientific mindset and less emotion.

you're frowning on some people here and that's not really the smartest thing to do in this place. several people can be called real veterans of this field and have looked at every theory inside and out.

also I don't think it's very scientific to just try and enforce your theory in the manner you have.

The alien thing is just fine. like I said I'm from a scene which has a good reason for at least one alien species to be curious about us.
But your argument of how well everything fits in your alien point of view that's saying nothing.
When you assume it's aliens, incomprehensably far ahead of us, anything... really anything can be 'explained'.

[edit on 1-4-2007 by David2012]

[edit on 1-4-2007 by David2012]

Part1:

Why should i repeat myself now 5 times why i think it is not the military controlling these crafts?
Why do people just come here at first not reading half the thread and think they know better?

but ok i'll tell once again why i think NOT ALL of them are of us or atleast alien (call it "foreign" if you like it more) technology involved.

1. Triangle Incident locations : simply not any government would let their experimental crafts or stealth crafts cruise where triangles are reported.
They're flying low like 500 meters and on extreme low speeds and then just vanish. I don't know if you heard the reports of A51 workers, they reported of having built a craft in diamond shape, to go at mach9... this was never reported to be sighted, also no A51 worker i remember spoke any word about a "TR-3B" or triangle.
The fact there was never reported anything officially about any technology like this the chance for this to be atleast military or top secret if it's not controlled by aliens raises up to 90%
And now before you say things like " it's more likely a technology of us" bash this argument OK???

2. All the theories about the technology involved especially the MFD sound nice but seriously, have you ever read any UFO reports? OK, but more than 3?
Triangle reports go back to the 80s and earlier, now don't tell me they had nuclear powered gravityless and unrealisitc seeming manouvarible triangles at that time. well not unless foreigners were involved.


One word at the end here,
isn't "deny-ignorance" a liked word in these forums