Are we doomed to failure

Are we as a life form doomed to failure, will we ever get off this planet, will we ever evolve. As far as history goes we have had at least 2 thousand years of war, famine and pestilence, is that it, is that mans sole contribution to the universe.

Is the best we can expect a nuke/chemical/bio war waged by the many for the benefit of the few. Or do we wait for the earth to be cleanesed by mother nature, is that all we really deserve.

I'm sad to say there are times when I think that it is what we need, that we are just savages wearing a thin veil of civility.

what you should ask yourself then, is has there been versions of this civilisation before our known history. i.e before modern history, was there a civilisation that was destroyed before. many belief that this has played out many times.

the supposed illuminati believe that life is in cycles, so make of that what you will.

Originally posted by magicmushroom
Or do we wait for the earth to be cleanesed by mother nature, is that all we really deserve.

I'm sad to say there are times when I think that it is what we need, that we are just savages wearing a thin veil of civility.

I tend to agree wholeheartedly with you on this. Many,many times I have felt that humanity needs a good old fashioned ass kicking by good ol' Mother Earth. It's the least she could do,eh? After all, we have been such good caretakers of her.


I really am not sure that we will ever colonize space. I think that if we ever do it will not be for many centuries after you and I have come and went. It's not something that I deem likely to happen in the nexy 50-100 years, not at all. By that time, there may not even be a need for humanity to journey to some distant star.

I think that eventually there will be a large percentage of the population that is decimated off of the earth. When it happens it will be labeled a "tragedy" by most but it will cause the human race to realize that it doesn't have dominion over all things like it so arrogantly seems to believe. It will lead man to live more in harmony with that which God has provided him.

Things are not as bleak as many would have one to believe. There is a rhym and reason to all things.




[edit on 25-3-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Andy, Yes I have had several lifes already.

Speaker, Yes I agree, there are times when we seem to behave like a bunch of spoilt brats who need a good dam slapping every once in a while.

And again to the other life forms that share the planet with us we must appear as a pandemic disease that kills all in its path.

will we ever get off this planet

Why are you in such a hurry to jump ship....
Like a monkey trying to escape its own tail

You are quick to assume the world's problems are at their very core external.
I can assure you what you are trying to escape is not in its purest essense evil external forces but infact negative internal ones.

I believe mankind is going thru the cosmic equivelant of the terrible two's. We want what we want when we want it. If we don't get it we throw a hissy fit and go into a rage.

We will eventually grow out of it though. Three year olds are far more curious and understanding of the things around them. We're almost there.

Of course, we are animals. Products of the ever ruthless, competitive Mother Nature.

If we ever leave this planet and find other lifeforms that have NOT had our legacy, and live in peace and harmony, well, we will kick their wimpy alien butts.

Starship Troopers, man!
Badasses of the Universe!

I'm not looking forward to receive the ass-kickage just because 1% on the top decides everything.

Yes; There is a way out of it. Change the World.

And everyone will reply... "But no! WE CANNOT CHANGE THIS WORLD! ITS IMPOSSIBLE! YOU WILL WASTE SO MUCH TIME WHICH COULD BE SPENT ON EDUCATION, CARREER, MONEY, CONSUMER-GOODS etc."

ORLY?!

Well the only way is to change our world. As sad it is.

There is no "escape" to other planets, or waiting for some photonic Belt to do the Job.

This is where we are. It's the only thing we can change/do.

Hmmm... and... what change are you envisioning?

As I said, Humanity is the product of a rather ruthless evolutionary process.
We have aggression, competitiveness, possessiveness built in. And not because of some Evil Weakness in the species, but because they are essential traits needed to survive.

And unless you plan of distributing Happy Drugs or insist upon compulsory lobotomies, then any plan to change the world is gonna have to deal with the basic nature of humanity.

Utopia need to take into account the fact that not all humans are Nice and Co-operative.

Originally posted by emjoi
Hmmm... and... what change are you envisioning?

As I said, Humanity is the product of a rather ruthless evolutionary process.
We have aggression, competitiveness, possessiveness built in. And not because of some Evil Weakness in the species, but because they are essential traits needed to survive.

And unless you plan of distributing Happy Drugs or insist upon compulsory lobotomies, then any plan to change the world is gonna have to deal with the basic nature of humanity.

Utopia need to take into account the fact that not all humans are Nice and Co-operative.

C'mon mate. Gimme a break with the Darwinian Mass-Media concept of "Evolution" or Human Behavior.

The majority of humans living in rather Matriarchal societies are Nonviolent.
There are even completely matriarchal societies where things like violence or murder is completely unknown.

The Humans haven't always been a War-Mongering species. Or at least a species lead to wars by the few on the top.

In fact the natural Human only kills for Food. Like Hunting for instance. Any exceeding form of agression or killing is plain sadistic behavior resulting from manipulation, patriarchal societies or sickness in an Unreal world.

You can't talk about natural evolutionary processes when our species is being manipulated and supressed.

The changes which need to be done are simple:

Regain the sovereign of the people.
True Education.
True Information.
Independent Media = Only Media.
Fight ignorance.

Free yourself from our current social "beliefs" to fight for a larger goal.

Even if it takes a little sacrifice.

osram you got it right....

Regain the sovereign of the people.
And.... how? Don't get me wrong, not knocking you, just trying to turn an abstract idea into something practical.

True Education.
Who's truth? Replace one set of propaganda and prejudices with another?

True Information.
Once again, who's Truth?

Independent Media = Only Media.
And, how do you keep it Independent? People have opinions, people will try and influence? This is a real battle being currently fought. Balancing Govt regulation with market freedom. Who is to decide that person A may speak, but person B cannot? I agree, but it's not an easy thing to do.

Fight ignorance.
Hey, I'm all for widening the horizons of the population... showing them ways of other cultures, other ways of thinking and doing things. Encouraging people to be flexible and accepting. Cool.
Just accept that it wont work with alot of people. It takes alot for some to not be closed and tribal.

I know that many people try to convince others of "conspiracy practics". (Not theories) What a horrible unword to be honest. And it's hard to convince people which are way too prejudiced and involved in society themselves.

I guess the attempt has to be fighting our enemy with their own weapons.

If they use Symbolism and Subconscious Manipulation to keep the majority quiet, the people should do the same to propagate the truth:

There isn't only Prejudices and Subjective opinions. Although the current situation might make us believe there is only that kind of information, the truth is:

There is only one truth. There are not 5 truths, or 5 parallel Realities. There is only one.
Sure, it will always be described in an incomplete way. Every subjective interpretation or description done with language, words or images is not an actual event taking place. After all we have our limits.

To answer your question: Truth would be to publish something as close to the truth as possible, and not doing the opposite. To publish the opposite of facts to pursue private/corporate goals. (Lies)

For instance; I had a chance appearing of a mate who sprayed on walls in our school times. I recently met him by coincidence on the street and he naturally was very happy to see me even if i didnt call him for a year. He is the type of guy who's always looking for friends, and he doesn't even realize if someone doesn't really like him.

My idea was to convince him of Conspiracy in first place.
As a second step it would be needed to manipulate him, to start a new movement, a subculture precisely.

To do such an "experiment" I would need to pretend friendship, trust.. etc. and use Forbidden rhetorics to get him where i want him to be. And to make him do what i want him to do.

So the goal would be to create a growing, autonomous subculture - Some kind of a "Sprayer-Crew". Which follows a larger philosophy and doesn't simply Tag their unreadable Names on Walls anymore.

They would Tag stuff like the Illuminati Triangle with "War on Terra" below. Or internet Adresses combined with catchy/provocating phrases or symbols.

I know it sounds a bit "basic". Using Walls to give out a message in the "REAL" world, not on the web.

But often the most simple ideas are the most genius or efficient ones.

Concluding I also have to say that in such an "experiment" almost every tactic of the powerful few would be involved;

Manipulation, Propaganda and staying invisible. Because of not participating actively in those Actions.
Apart from that Autonomous Projects or Subcultures are the only way to change something. They can go on and grow even if the Leader or inventor is gone.

I know it sounds really wierd, and I'm not the type of guy to use forbidden rhetorics. But after all it is for a bigger, benevolent goal.

Just an Idea/Example.

Whether we are doomed or not, we will one day have to restart the cycle. Nature is cyclical. everything, at its base, is energy which moves in waves. it is all cyclical.

will we fail? well, the funny thing about failure is that you have to define success first before you can define failure (ie, "not success").

Some would say we have already failed, or that our failure is in our nature (greed, lust). Who knows. Perhaps we are on a cyclical ascension. perhaps we are here only for specific reasons, such as developmental steps. This could be the realm of this stage of development. Your thoughts on this would depend on your thoughts on spirituality, i suppose.

Who knows if we will fail. We are a people that fancies itself as great guardians, and perserverence incarnate. We don't portray ourselves as failures, generally. Even when faced with overwhelming odds, our stories usually have a "pull it out in the end" mentality behind their creation. As if they were penned by raging egomaniacs, carbon copying their prose from one plotline to the next on some mission of literary manifest destiny.

It is unnerving to think that we would fail to provide our own salvation. Perhaps this is what we need. Perhaps the act of disillusionment is not a bad thing at all, as living within an illusory existence is definitely the greater of any two evils. "Ignorance is bliss" must have been penned by a person with a "sheeple" mentality.

We are not doomed by fate. We choose our death the same daywe chose money and planetary destruction instead of being the care takers we where meant to be.

In the words of Padre Pio, "What is life, but a pilgrimage?"

Earth has a bloody competitive history, but we also has a history of compassion and selflessness.

Don't despair, we were born for the cosmos. Here we are.

Hey magicmushroom, you seem to be asking some serious stuff. As far evolving I suggested somewhere here today, perhaps we're put here/or genetically built to live a very limited life span, that we NOT evolve too fast through learning as say if the average human life span was 200-300 years.

Dallas

If we were to evolve, we would no longer be "we." There would be two species; human and the evolved species. Would these two species be able to coexist or would they fight each other.

I doubt humans would allow this evolution to a superior species. It would be much like the x-men comics, The fear of a superior race would cause humans to fear it and would fight to supress the evolution.

Thanks for the replies thus far. I sometimes think that as we progress somehow we seem to go backwards, that in a sense technology dumbs us down rather than making us smarter.

Also does not history show that the more highly advanced a civilisation is the easier it can go down the pan.

If we were to evolve, we would no longer be "we." There would be two species; human and the evolved species. Would these two species be able to coexist or would they fight each other.

I can follow the stream of logic that lead you to make that statement.....
But i dont necessarily agree with it.... 100% anyway (I'm not an oracle, only my humble thoughts here....)

Are you familiar with occult theories on things like group minds and oversouls ECT ECT....

(forgive me if my terminology is not exact or correct at times...im trying to convey ideas i have read about but i dont always remember the exact terminology they used but only the ideasETc... so i hope you can follow me...)

But basically many occult writers ETC believe in a system where by not only is your individual soul an entity but also that groups and subdivisions of individuals/entities who have shared characteristics have souls also.....group souls if you will.....
And that these are no less valid then your actual self......
And that that is the way the world works....I.E> that for example in the relm or demension of spirit that it is somehow possible to interface with say for example the soul of the planet... a race...., an animal speicies, or the whole of humanity.....
And that if you were to communicate with this entity it would appear as a seperate individual....oddly enough...
And through some quirk of the nature of spirit that you can also communicate with anything you care to name.....i.E
in fact any in-animate object....
I.E like some of those meditation you see in books where they ask you to "become" a rock or a speck of dust or what ever...... and "feel" what it is like ETC.......
That it is possible somehow to interface with the spiritual essense of "inanimate" things (I.E. your car for example) and that by some quirk of the spiritual nature of the universe that in this process this communication process somehow imbues that object with a personality.....?


I know it sounds weird...... and i have never had a conversation with a rock.... and im not saying that the personality you would experience is inately part of the object ????? perhaps a quirk of the process itself?

Any way i digress......
other possible examples of physical evidence of this sceme for example could be "the 100th monkey syndrome" if you have heard of this......
This is a legitimate scientifically observed mystery......
The way that when a certain critical mass is achieved by members of a species that information can be passed (even to issolated pockets of this same species).....
Which hint at this all encompassing spiritual connection ETC through all things ....
THE FORCE BROTHER...............
SO anyway what im trying to say.....
Is that when part of the population evolves into "X men" if you will...
That when a certain critical mass is reached... that all of a sudden a cascade would occur and the entire population would start to transform......
This is due to the fact that although we appear as seperate individuals that on various spiritual dimensions we share the same over soul.......
we are connected.,.,.... through spirit....