Free Masons: Why Men Need Societies Like Free Masonry: An Essay.

Dock6,

Out of all of that, I still don't see where you stated where this deep-seated hatred comes from. You just went off on a diatribe, proving to me at least how similar you are to the very people you claim to despise. You claim to stand tall for morals, and yet will slam another group simply for existing. This doesn't help your case at all. In fact, it hurts it, because now I have to try to decide if you're any better than those you claim to dislike. Your views lead me to a no vote. You just suggest that all men that join the Masons do so out of a deep-seated desire to feel complete, when that's not the case at all.

If I were going to join, I'd be looking for one thing, and one thing only to start; knowledge. Now that's not to say that there's anything secret to be had there in the way of knowledge of our history, but I cannot, in good conscience discount it. I'm a greedy person when it comes to knowledge not publicly handed down. That stuff that's hidden from sight is the most enticing stuff around, because it's the only remaining knowledge that has yet to be fully assimilated into our society. But that's just my views on it. For example, the Catholic Church has huge stores of texts which they won't release to the general public because they claim that they are heretical. Well, why not release them, and let us be the judges of that one?

Anyway, all of this quasi-evidence that you purport to us is baseless. There are no known cases, that I can recall in my studies anyway, where anything like that which you've suggested has happened. I've been wrong before, and I'm sure I will be again, but I don't believe I am on this one. Show me some hard proof here, and maybe I'll rethink my stand, unless I can prove you wrong.

Proof brother, that's what it's all about here. Well that, and denying ignorance.

Respectfully,
TheBorg

Borg

Dock6 will struggle to find evidence because there is none. According to her, I am a low-level drone slavishly doing my Master's bidding. Now when I stack that (let generously call it a) hypothesis against the reality of my 14 years in freemasonry and time as Master myself, it doesn't quite add up.

Originally posted by Matyas
I am a little bit better today than when I did that other post

Certainly a group such as these Masons are that have earned so much criticism and vengeful ire must be onto something really hot.

In every civilization stretching all the way back to the dim past societies were formed and maintained that kept the fires. They called them the priesthood.

Now thanks to Dock6 and her ilk I have been inspired to join. Thank you Dock6, Derek, and all the others who have helped to give direction and meaning to my life. I owe you all a great deal!

I love this post..

Indeed if we are but a bunch of nobodies, has beens, once was.. we sure do generate a huge amount of interest.. a huge amount of fear even!

The success of Dan Brown and authors like him, including the many hundreds who did books just on his books trying to figure out Masonry.. shows there is still a lasting interest in the unknown in this society..

The "recruitment" that dock6 speaks of is no more then telling people who already want to join, how to join.

WOA! I think were getting too deep. In my opinion the bottom line for having lodges(wether masons, moose, elks,or any other), Is to have a chance to get out of the house. And be idealistic. And I dont see anything wrong with any of it. As if you cared.

Why not cut to the core of this?

The central tenet of masonry demands that members support their fellow masons, even if it requires committing perjury. There can be no debating this: it's public knowledge.

Yet in above posts, the self-claimed masons here and their sycophants have been at pains to paint masonry as 'ethical', 'honourable', upright.

So on one one hand we have the biblical instruction: ' Thou shalt not bear false witness' (bearing false witness being an apt description of perjury).

On the other we have masonic edict demanding members commit perjury to get other masons off the hook. If masons do not agree to this from the get-go, they cannot become masons.

The two instructions are incompatible. Either you ARE prepared to lie/commit perjury (which is not and never will be 'ethical' or 'honourable') or you will NOT commit perjury/bear false witness even if it means a fellow mason will be sentenced to death row.

So which are you: a mason or an honest individual?

Clearly, you cannot be both: you cannot serve two masters at once.

Originally posted by Dock6


Why not cut to the core of this?

Yes, lets do that.

The central tenet of masonry demands that members support their fellow masons, even if it requires committing perjury. There can be no debating this: it's public knowledge.

So if something is public knowledge it cannot therefore be up for debate? How crazy is that? Your statement above is false and I can prove it.

Yet in above posts, the self-claimed masons here and their sycophants have been at pains to paint masonry as 'ethical', 'honourable', upright.

Correct. There is no conflict as your original premise is false.

So on one one hand we have the biblical instruction: ' Thou shalt not bear false witness' (bearing false witness being an apt description of perjury).

On the other we have masonic edict demanding members commit perjury to get other masons off the hook. If masons do not agree to this from the get-go, they cannot become masons.

This is entirely false. Please attempt to point me in the direct of this 'edict'.

The two instructions are incompatible. Either you ARE prepared to lie/commit perjury (which is not and never will be 'ethical' or 'honourable') or you will NOT commit perjury/bear false witness even if it means a fellow mason will be sentenced to death row.

So which are you: a mason or an honest individual?

Clearly, you cannot be both: you cannot serve two masters at once.

Quite right. So because the first alternative is untrue, therefore one CAN be an honest individual and a mason.

This all hinges on your belief that freemasonry instructs masons to lie for each other, even commit perjury. Would you agree that if that argument is proven false, then your whole 'hypothesis' is void?

Originally posted by Dock6
The central tenet of masonry demands that members support their fellow masons

Actually the central tenets of Masonry are Friendship, Morality and Brotherly Love. Apparently you don't know much about Freemasonry which makes me wonder why you're posting about it. Simple research would have turned THIS up.

even if it requires committing perjury. There can be no debating this: it's public knowledge.

Horse hockey!!!!. The Charge of the FIRST degree of Masonry says "In the State you are to be a quiet and peaceful citizen, true to your government and just to the laws of the country in which you reside." (This, by the way can be found in ANY Masonic Monitor which ANYONE in the world can purchase...so you should have known that...and I suspect you did, but would prefer to post vicious lies instead. That seems to be the m.o. of "scholars" like you)

Perjury is illegal in case you hadn't heard, so how can a Mason swear to commit perjury when he's charged by the very institution he's joining to OBEY the laws of his country? Hmmm???? Do you honest-to-God think people like George Washington, Harry S. Truman, and other Masons would swear to commit perjury? Use your brain, mmm-k?.

On the other we have masonic edict demanding members commit perjury to get other masons off the hook. If masons do not agree to this from the get-go, they cannot become masons.

That's a lie. Plain and simple, but it's the kind that's become so prevalent on this board. Congratulations, you've come up with nothing new.

The two instructions are incompatible. Either you ARE prepared to lie/commit perjury

Nope. No truth to that at all.

or you will NOT commit perjury/bear false witness even if it means a fellow mason will be sentenced to death row.

If a Mason witnesses a crime a Mason has committed it's his duty AS A MASON, who is true to the laws of his country (see above), to report it....NOT cover it up. To claim otherwise is a lie, plain and simple and unworthy of further comment.

So which are you: a mason or an honest individual?

Obviously if you're a TRUE Mason...you're both.

Clearly, you cannot be both: you cannot serve two masters at once.

Clearly you have no clue what you're talking about.

You really shouldn't be posting about Freemasonry. It's obviously beyond the realm of your comprehension.

I can hardly wait for your next post of "brilliant scholarship" (read: "B.S.") or whatever else you or those like you happen to dream up.


[edit on 25-3-2007 by Appak]

RE: "Playing fun" Rituals

Dock6 alluded or outright stated that one of the purposes of the Masons were to play some childish game or ritual. I would say that this statement comes from a childish mind.

The rituals are meant to impart, in a dramatic fashion the importance of morality, ethics, or whatever other virtue upon the person undergoing the ritual. It is meant to have a lasting effect.

It would be easy enough to say, "Be ethical, live morally, be generous to those in need.", but again, the purpose of the ritual is to do more than that; to have a lasting impact upon the person regarding the virtue or virtues in question.

The rituals are secret because knowing what happens beforehand would diminish or eliminate the hoped impact upon the person.

Originally posted by Appak

Originally posted by Dock6
The central tenet of masonry demands that members support their fellow masons

Clearly you have no clue what you're talking about.

You really shouldn't be posting about Freemasonry. It's obviously beyond the realm of your comprehension.

I can hardly wait for your next post of "brilliant scholarship" (read: "B.S.") or whatever else you or those like you happen to dream up.

[edit on 25-3-2007 by Appak]

All this playing to the gallery !

The grandstanding (that means old-fashioned 'showing off')

The desperate need to impress other low-level masons.

Very recently, I read an article entitled: Are Masons mentally unstable? The article suggested a certain type of male is attracted to Masonry. Men suffering arrested-development, for example -- wannabe actors (those desperate for an audience) entranced by ritual & fantasy --- men who harbor deep feelings of inadequacy, etc.

Discovering the article was serendipitous, because early in this thread, I'd suggested the very same thing, based on mere casual observation.

It's disturbing to read the responses from what are clearly low-level Masons in this and other threads and forums, for what becomes clear is that Masonry has become perilously debased.

It makes perfect sense that so many religious, legal and law-enforcement agencies are taking a harsh stand against masons at this particular time.

I suspect it's the masonic heirarchy themselves who initiated this culling of rank and file masons. They would be sickened and dismayed by the 'calibre' of response from those purporting to act as the Voice of Masonry in this thread alone.

Have any of you bothered even to read Pike's exhortations regarding the standard expected of even low-level masons? Clearly not.

Dock,

How about citing some sources? You know; put up or shut up? Thus far, nothing you've described bears any relationship to Masonry. Either you're making this up out of whole cloth or you have a 'source' a la freemasonrywatch et al.

Originally posted by Dock6
I suspect it's the masonic heirarchy themselves who initiated this culling of rank and file masons. They would be sickened and dismayed by the 'calibre' of response from those purporting to act as the Voice of Masonry in this thread alone.

If you think there's a such thing as "low-level" Masons there's no use in trying to educate you. You're educated beyond your ability to understand.

Too bad for you.

Have any of you bothered even to read Pike's exhortations regarding the standard expected of even low-level masons? Clearly not.

Personally I've read everything of Pike's that is in print and a couple of books that are NOT in print, but are in the archives of the Supreme Council. Pike's writings were his own opinion (he says so quite plainly several times) and nothing more. I can write my opinions of Freemasonry and what it teaches. Doesn't make it "official" (but again, this has been said tons of times on this site...) [sigh]

What you don't know, because you have no way to know is that Pike's lecture for the 33rd Degree makes it clear that there are no low-level Masons (despite what you "googled" up on some anti-Masonic web-site)

He even makes it clear that those who have attained the 33rd & Last Degree of the Scottish Rite are actually the servants of Freemasonry, because Freemasonry is a servant to the world. He says that we are to serve the Fraternity and the Community as a whole (which, by the way, includes serving the Church of one's choice). Pike says this SEVERAL TIMES in no uncertain terms in in his version of the Ritual of the 33rd Degree. (I point that out specifically because EVERY jurisdiction around the world has it's own version of the rituals...there's not just one).

All that being said, Pike was the presiding officer of the Scottish Rite of the Southern Jurisdiction of the U.S.A. and had no authority beyond the Scottish Rite (Southern Jurisdiction). In fact, in the Northern Jurisdiction, U.S.A. and other Supreme Councils around the world, most Scottish Rite Masons don't have a clue who Pike was...nor do they care what he wrote.

Pike's not a very good source to spread ignorance and hatred.

Oh well....wasted enough of my time.

By the way, Dock6 PLEASE, I implore of you...learn how to use the "quote" function. It's not hard and makes your posts easier to follow.

In fact, it's just good manners.

[edit on 25-3-2007 by Appak]

Originally posted by Trinityman
This all hinges on your belief that freemasonry instructs masons to lie for each other, even commit perjury. Would you agree that if that argument is proven false, then your whole 'hypothesis' is void?

Ooops Dock6, looks like you missed this question. Care to reply?

Here is what I don't get right..

I am a Master Mason.. Appak, Trinityman as well as many others.. Appak is actually a 33rd degree Mason..

Yet we are all ignorant.. even though there are past masters on this board, Appak being a 33rd which according to most now makes him an elite world controller or alien communicator I don't know what the latest claims are..

But anyways, we are all ignorant because we are "lowly" Masons...... but yet someone like you Dock6 know the goingons of the "elite" Masons ... but you have not even reached the status of lowly Mason yet? How do you come across such information that even me as ignorant as I am yet within the organization cannot know?

I will make a bet....

YouTube?

Dock6:

No... I'm not part of a disinfo campaign, but I feel compelled to respond out of sheer curiosity:

Obviously you've got an axe to grind here, but "dewy-eyed"? C'mon... What is so damn wrong with blokes meeting together in the interests of charity and personal development?

I applaud your flowery (albeit insulting) use of language, but you're not going to convince anyone with a modicum of objectivity with mere insults.

Hit us with the facts.

What is it that spurs on this aggression, that provokes such ire within you? Is it some bad experience from your past?

I question your own values if you are so disgusted by the concepts of fellowship and brotherly love. Are you that jaded?

[edit on 26-3-2007 by Roark]

Roark,

That's exactly what I've been trying to get at since I saw this thread pop up. I'm just surprised that he's been able to keep going on this long with no citable sources. I say that if he can't provide anything substantial, that I'm going to just give up on this rant of his, and just account it to a lack of education.

TheBorg

Now, (to those impatient, boyish posters above) it would help if you'd try to remember that masonry is your obsession ... not mine.
I pop in from time to time. In the meantime --- as I see has occurred -- you are free to chat amongst yourselves in confusion and excitement: will Dock return for another serving of your brilliant wit? Will Dock provide you yet another opportunity to demonstrate your slavish loyalty to masonry before the entire world?

As it happens, I happened upon a droll site earlier today, which illustrated the mason-prescribed blueprints re: online 'debate' with those who question the agenda of masons. And I noted that at least three of those have been employed by masons in this thread: 'the concern', 'the personal attack' and 'diversion'.

For those masons amongst you who have NOT been properly tutored in 'how to disarm opponents of masonry', I'll try to return shortly to post the link. That way, you'll be able to save it or even print it out for future use.



[edit on 26-3-2007 by Dock6]

Grand Lodge Masonry

Progress becomes easier for the candidate after he passes the first three degrees, or the "Blue Lodge." There are no examinations to learn, and he can take whole blocks of degrees at one time. In fact, one brother in the Church related to me that he took all the degrees from the fourth through to the thirty-second in four days.

In the case of the brother above, he and a group of Master Masons received the fourth through the fourteenth degree the first day after arriving in the city in which the Grand Lodge was located. After a night of fun and revelry (and very little sleep), they went through the conferring of the "Chapter of Rose Croix," which is the fifteenth through the eighteenth degrees for the Scottish rite (Southern Jurisdiction). After another night similar to the first, he received the Council of Kadosh, or the nineteenth through the thirtieth degrees.

Finally, on the fourth day, he received the "Consistory," or the thirty-first and the thirty-second degrees. The fact that they received little sleep at night seemed to be planned on the part of the officials, perhaps for the purpose of dulling the candidate's senses during the rituals. A clear head would seem inappropriate for receipt of these "honorable mysteries." The brother related that he had a hard time even remaining awake.

After a man has reached the thirty-second degree, he can, if he chooses, become a Shriner.

The Shrine, then, is a side order of the thirty-second degree. There remains only one degree higher than the thirty-second: that is the thirty-third or "Inspector General," which is honorary. It can only be conferred for some act of benevolence, endeavor, or esteem far and above the line of duty. It is usually conferred on presidents and kings and certain other dignitaries.

Fourth through to thirty-second degrees in FOUR days !

Gee, some people take longer than that just to wash their car !

Originally posted by Dock6


Fourth through to thirty-second degrees in FOUR days !

Gee, some people take longer than that just to wash their car !

That's nothing new. The Scottish Rite degrees have always been conferred in that manner. Pike himself received all the degrees from the 4th to the 32nd in about 10 minutes, by proclamation.

It was never meant to be a long, drawn-out process.

MASONIC MORALS

Master Masons promise not to cheat, defraud, or do violence to a Master Mason. They promise not to commit adultery with the wife of a Master Mason or seduce his sister, daughter, or other female relative. These promises only apply to fellow Master Masons.

They do not protect non-Masons, Entered Apprentices, or Fellow Crafts and their families.

Masons are required to tell lies and even perjure themselves to protect other Masons. They are also required to obey even orders which they know to be immoral:

"You must conceal all the crimes of your brother Masons, except murder and treason, and these only at your own option, and should you be summoned as a witness against a brother Mason be always sure to shield him. Prevaricate [falsify], don't tell the whole truth in his case, keep his secrets, forget the most important points. It may be perjury to do this, it is true, but you're keeping your obligations, and remember if you live up to your obligation strictly, you'll be free from sin." (Edmond Ronayne, "Masonic Handbook," page 183)

"Right or wrong his very existence as a Mason hangs upon obedience to the powers immediately set above him. The one unpardonable crime in a Mason is contumacy [insubordination] or disobedience." (Robert Morris, "Webb's Monitor of Freemasonry," page 169)

[edit on 26-3-2007 by Dock6]

And again:

If a Mason is a defendant in court, Masonic partiality extends to the witness stand. In the Masonic Hand Book we read:

“You must conceal all the crimes of your brother Masons, except murder and treason, and these only at your own option, and should you be summoned as a witness against a brother Mason, be always sure to shield him. Prevaricate, don’t tell the whole truth in this case, keep his secrets, forget the most important points. It may be perjury to do this, it is true, but you’re keeping your obligations, and remember if you live up to your obligations strictly, you’ll be free from sin.”

So what are these 'obligations'?

Worshipful Master: “What makes you a Mason?”

Senior Warden: “My Obligation.”
(- question and answer, The Entered Apprentice Degree Ritual)

So there it is.

For most of us, it is God who determines if and when we become 'free from sin'. Millions believe and trust that Christ died to 'free them from sin'.

But Masons apparently are instructed they will be freed from sin if they uphold their oath to LIE, to commit perjury and pervert the course of justice in the interests of their fellow-masons.

Now why would any man with a functioning brain tolerate such threat and blackmail from a bunch of apron-wearing, ring-tapping cult members?

And here it becomes dark, DARK, dark.

They accept it because they have no choice anymore: they have sworn to uphold the masonic OATHS they took, during which they agreed that if they FAIL to uphold these oaths, they will submit to having their tongue and eyes and entrails ripped from their living bodies by their fellow masons.

And it gets darker.

They swear on the BIBLE that they will uphold these sacriligious masonic oaths to LIE, PERJURE and PERVERT justice and morality on behalf of other masons. Any masons. Murderers. Pedophiles. Thieves. Embezzlers. Pornographers. Drug dealers.

Yet at the commencement of this thread, there was attempt to persuade us that masons are altruistic, community-serving nice-guys.

Nice? In addition to readily agreeing to lie, pervert and corrupt -- masons EXCLUDE 'cripples', 'women', 'the mentally challenged', 'eunuchs' (in today's parlance this undoubtedly includes homosexuals, transexuals, transgender etc.), 'jews', 'athiests' and a raft of others who fail to meet 'masonic high standards' ('high standards' such as jumping at the chance to lie, blaspheme, cheat, cover-up, perjure themselves, etc.)

Males must be 21 before they're eligible to join the masons.

Why is that, if the masons are merely a 'religiously oriented' organisation?

Did Christ reject those who were not yet 21? I think I remember his warning his enemies that they should not prevent the 'little children' from going to him.

Even in the Old Testament, I don't remember God rejecting any who were under the age of 21.

And have YOU ever read or heard of Christ rejecting: 'cripples', 'women', 'the mentally challenged', 'jews', etc. ?

Yet the same masonic temples who promote themselves as family centred will not accept so many members of 'families'.

Instead, they insist initiates be a minimum of 21 years of age. LEGAL age.

Because when a male is 21 years or over, any CONTRACT or OATH he undertakes is BINDING.

He may not REALISE that, because while he is SWEARING 'obedience' and AGREEING to have his entrails torn out should he betray the OATHS he's being required to swear (on the Holy Bible, no less), he is being DISTRACTED by the fact he is having his pants leg and other items of his clothing torn away and being thrust into a simulation of death in a masonic basement.

Sure, he might return home and think to himself:

' Oh well, that wasn't so bad. Just some crazy ritual to please a bunch of old guys. I got involved in worse in the Scouts and when I was in college and the Marines. Wow. What a charade ! All that mumbo-jumbo. Do those old guys really believe all that stuff? Pillars and crazy murals and chanting and stuff. --- Oh well. I'm 'in' now: I'm a mason ! Now I can sit back and just wait for all the contracts and deals to come through. Just in time, too. If I hadn't told the bank manager I'd been accepted by the masons, he'd have foreclosed by now. Whew. Thank goodness I've got all that pressure off my back. Now it's Easy Street time, with all my good mason buddies to carry me through. This time next year, I could be raking in the dough. And next time I get stopped by that cop, I'll make sure my mason buddies teach him a lesson he'll never forget. He'll be eating out of my hand from now on -- or else ! '

A few years later, when that same man is instructed by his 'mason buddies' to lie in court or to assist in the systematic destruction of someone who's done him no harm -- he might be tempted to resign from the masons.

But he's told: ' Think again, son. I'd hate to hear you were picked up with drugs/child sex slave/stolen goods in your car. It happens you know. You just can't be too careful. Innocent men go down all the time. But as long as you're a mason, you're ok --- right? Right? Yeah. That's right. Well, be seeing you at the lodge next week son. Take care, ya hear'.

Join (the masons) in haste: repent at leisure.

And that's just with regard to your physical body and welfare. Which is nothing really: it's just stuff that decays, stops then rots.

But the soul and eternal life --- well, that's a different story.

And swearing on the Holy Bible to honour and obey mortal men above all others? Doesn't leave much room for God or Christ, does it?

You expect Christ to defend you when the chips are down?

Did you defend HIM when you joined the masons?

Just asking.