Moderators Are Not Above The Terms & Conditions

It's not uncommon to see suggestions in some posts that ATS/BTS/AP moderators enjoy some sort of special privilege because they're mods and can therefore get away with things that other members cannot.

I wish to lay this notion to rest, because it's not true.

All members of the staff, including moderators, super moderators and administrators, have agreed -- like every other member by virtue of our participation here -- to honor the AboveTopSecret.com Terms And Conditions Of Use.

NO ONE is exempt from the T&C. :shk:

If at any time you should see any staff member behave in a manner contrary to the terms & conditions, please let us know immediately by submitting a Complaint/Suggestion.

We take all such reports very seriously and will not tolerate misconduct on the part of any staff member.

I know it's easy on a conspiracy site to assume that moderators can get away with being abusive because they're mods, but actually the opposite is true.

Where we might cut a little slack for regular members (I mean hey, we're only human ), moderators are expected to adhere to the highest ethical standards, and abuse of any staff position is grounds for immediate dismissal.

All members of the staff are solemnly pledged to serve the membership.

If any of us should give you the slightest impression otherwise, we want to hear about it.

Anything less would be unacceptable.

Thank you for your understanding and support.

I have seen a few posts where members have accused Mods of having preferential treatment just because they hold that position. And yes, members with a proven track record with the boards have been given some grace that a noobie troll would not receive.

But hell, that's what a community is all about.
The Mods on ATS are all members that have worked their way up the ranks, and they've proven themselves as people that have a dedication to the betterment of our community.

And really, getting the flashy Mod cape doesn't make them into perfect beings.
Most of them are still human, well, except for the ones that have always been Reptilian or Nordic.


ATS has the best Mods on the web...

Originally posted by Majic
NO ONE is exempt from the T&C.

That is such a great sentence. Not only does it define our commitment to ATS, but it teaches people that the proper spelling of noone is actually no one.

That's like two lessons in one.

We Aim Two Please

Originally posted by ZeddicusZulZorander
That's like two lessons in one.

Nothing but the best for our members.

Believe it.

While I see why there is a need for this, I feel this need only stems from a small population of members who were engaged in a heated debate with a passionate staff member. Not all staff members are willing to "duke it out" on the boards as others. We all know who they are, and I think we all respect them for it. But in the rare instance where another member receives a warn from a staff member, who was not involved, they tend to point the finger at the staff member who was involved and scream differential treatment. The staff are there for a reason. Not because we "like" them, but because they know how to behave.

I remember an older thread where a member, who was an old staff member, berated current staff for how they behaved. It was quite evident at this point that his or her "demotion" stemmed from the inability to control him or herself and resulted in him or herself losing their position on the staff. Hence, this individual was certainly not above the law.

It seems, to me, that what makes our staff so great, also makes their job so tough. They always deal with issues behind closed doors. We, as members, do not have to read this drama every day on the discussion board, and we can get on with our day to day business. But at the same time, it appears that most members feel the "Gestapo" is out on the power trip.

When I signed up for ATS in 2005, I met several staff members very quickly. Approachable, open-minded, respectful, and always willing to go the extra mile. Even for a new member, who was only one of the few hundred that had signed up that day. This left a lasting impression on me personally, and it had me logging back in time and time again.

I've always said, this is more than a discussion board. It is my opinion that we have a site housing the highest of quality posts, submitted by a top notch membership, and kept in line by the best damn staff that anyone could ask for.

Respect begets respect. I think that sums up this community quite nicely.

Above Top Secret, you've made me a better person. Since signing up, I've always asked more questions, looked deeper, and questioned the status quo.

For that, I thank you.




[edit on 14-3-2007 by chissler]

Now let me get this straight...

Do I have to PAY the MODS to abuse me, or is this a free service...

OOPPPPSSS

Wrong site..

**sorry**

Semper

Hmm.

I had a whole post written out, but thought better of it, as nothing can come from it at this point in time. Let me just say however, that no matter how many times a mod professes this exact sentiment, it only makes me throw up in my mouth a little.

My point is this: It doesn't matter if the mods abide by the rules, when the rules are open to interpretation by said mod. Must have been some signing statements on the TOS when they were enacted.

Not to mention the attitudes of certain mods on this board are, quite frankly, utterly disgusting, and really reflect poorly on the entire site. While I do still lurk around, ATS has left a bad taste in my mouth, and all for nothing.

Respectfully,

Unit

reply to post by Unit541


Wow Unit, you really take this internet stuff seriously. I remember a mod that was on my ass about quoting, one liners, etc when I first got here and he just made me a better netizen.

Btw seekerof, if you're reading this, thanks and I miss you.

Unit, if ATS is leaving such a bad taste in your mouth maybe you should limit your exposure for the sake of your gorge.



[edit on 16-10-2007 by intrepid]

They may not get special rules or conditions,but they certainly do break the rules and conditions a lot.I'll leave it at that since people will certainly be able to come up with their own examples of this exact thing.

Originally posted by Project_Silo
They may not get special rules or conditions,but they certainly do break the rules and conditions a lot.I'll leave it at that since people will certainly be able to come up with their own examples of this exact thing.

No, don't leave it at that. Please present examples of this if you don't mind. Personally i don't care to be slandered.

Checks And Balances

Originally posted by Project_Silo
They may not get special rules or conditions,but they certainly do break the rules and conditions a lot.

Then please, let's see some more complaints.

It's easy enough to generalize like this, but if a mod is misbehaving, generalities won't help us solve any problems.

A Complaint About Complaints

While we're on the subject, *I* have a complaint: most of the complaints I see directed at mods are not supported by the terms & conditions. :shk:

Moving a thread or editing profanity from a post is not a violation. Mods are expected to do things like that.

Likewise, a mod disagreeing with you on some topic isn't wrong either, because mods are allowed to have opinions too.

However, if a mod is being abusive or taking action against any member that is not clearly supported by the T&C, now we're talking!

So by all means don't hesitate to complain when you see mods breaking the rules, but please, make sure they're breaking the rules first.

reply to post by intrepid


Quoting the entire post above you?

Quotation Narc

Originally posted by enjoies05
Quoting the entire post above you?

Busted!

Oops! Now I'M busted! Gahhhh!

I think we can all understand how mod #1 might have a different take on an issue than mod #2. Hopefully that doesn't happen much because I suspect most users of this board want to see fairness, i.e.: equal treatment in given circumstances. If a one-liner post costs you points and then you see a one-liner nonsense post by a mod, the trust level goes down. I happen to think SOME one-liner posts are pithy and ought to be allowed. Indeed, I think they often are for that reason. But I'll give you an example of a situation where I feel there was unequal treatment. It's way too late to find the exact posts, but....

I posted on a thread that our friend Bocephus claims to have several implants from aliens and that he says everyone has at least one. This is a true statement. Bocephus I'm sure would agree. I wasn't judging Bocephus at all, just stating matter of fact what he said, which was relevant to the thread. I couldn't believe the reply I got from someone who called me names, suggested I was a member of the NWO and abusing others (Like my avatar is real? Is yours?) and suggested very heatedly that I should be banned and prevented from posting. She used lots of 'flame' emoticons to illustrate her point. Why? I didn't say anything wrong. I didn't criticize anyone. The whole attack was totally unjustified. I complained and asked, "What should I do?" (You know what I WANTED to do, but I was attempting to restrain myself.) The powers wrote back suggesting I do nothing. Just let it go. It was obvious I was right in context. Etc. Well, I did as suggested and ignored it. Did this person receive any warning? Nope. Did she lose 500 points? Nope. Had I said anything like she did I feel certain I would have been hammered, warned, and possibly banned. It was that bad. But she got off scott free. I've seen 500 point deductions for WAY less than that post.

That's an example of uneven moderation. It's different than IGNORED moderation when a mod wasn't paying attention to a thread. All the evidence was there. Now when you have a court appearance for, let's say, and anger management issue, beating up someone, or whatever, I think you'd be quite justifiably angry of the guy ahead of you with the same issue exactly had his case dismissed, and you got a year of prison time. That's unequal treatment under the law, and it's something you guys should think about.

Point Two: The demeanor of mods.

There's a thread with two sides. People are yammering back and forth. They have been for months. It gets a little heated, as it soemtimes does, but is likely to simmer down on its own, as it has before. Let's say it's a typical Greer thread. You know how those go. No mods have been following it. Then suddenly here comes a Moderator who is NOT LISTED as a moderator of the given forum, but appears to be just a roving deputy, shows up with an intimidating avatar as big as a house, mean looking, and says in 20 point bold type: THIS STOPS NOW!! with similar threats about the coming warnings if everyone doesn't just roll over and assume the position. I've seen this happen when someone made a mild joke in a thread that was supposed to be ON TOPIC! PERIOD!

Wow. Forgive me for not being impressed. Moderators, I think, need to meditate a bit on the word "moderate." What does 'moderate' mean? Can you possibly moderate in a moderate fashion? Can you possibly say something like, "Look, guys and gals. This is getting out of hand. I'm afraid if there is any more name calling, it's going to involve sanctions on the guilty parties. This is your fair warning. No more, please. Be nice. Thanks."

Now that's a polite way to moderate. In my experience Springer usually uses this approach. Some moderators use the: THIS STOPS NOW OR THE BUTTS GET KICKED!!!! approach along with the monster fist in the air gigantic 40 storey tall avatar. That's not polite. It's not nice. It's being a bully. Those who moderate in this fashion need to stop doing it. Yelling at people is what you DON'T want people to do. Why do you think doing it yourself is justified? Lead by example, if you will, by being moderate yourself. And by the way, where is our normal moderator? You're not on the list. In fact, you're acting like a roving mercenary soldier of fortune intimidating anyone you please.

The point is that I don't think you treat your users very well. They are second class citizens subject to sanctions and, on occasion, pushed around as per above. The users are providing 'user-generated-content,' giving ATS those page views and advertising revenue that will make it profitable and pay off that venture capital funding.

Now, what I think the moderator crowd needs to do is get together and brain storm these issues and come up with a 'Moderator Code of Ethics' that says how moderators ought to moderate. You are the guys in the midst of this, so you just go ahead and do that as you see fit. Post it. And your users will be more happy.

Thank you for considering.

Originally posted by schuyler
Now, what I think the moderator crowd needs to do is get together and brain storm these issues and come up with a 'Moderator Code of Ethics' that says how moderators ought to moderate. You are the guys in the midst of this, so you just go ahead and do that as you see fit. Post it. And your users will be more happy.

Thank you for considering.

We actually already have this. Not that anyone other than moderators would know and yes we ARE held to a stricter standard than anyone else on the site. We HAVE to justify what we do. The problem as I see it is that there are some members that would interpret mod actions, this happens ALL of the time. Do you know what goes on behind the scenes? No, but there's still staff derision as they don't see what is "unseen". I see a BB&Q thread here to explain this.

As to things like one liners, yes, sometimes we have no choice like, "Let's keep on topic folks." Yes, that's a 1 liner but it is community management. Not like we're forming an opinion. Just keeping it clean for YOU guys. Your thanks for this is noted.

Originally posted by Project_Silo
They may not get special rules or conditions,but they certainly do break the rules and conditions a lot.I'll leave it at that since people will certainly be able to come up with their own examples of this exact thing.

I think you are asking the Mods to not have opinions if you think they are overstepping their boundaries. They are human too, well most of them are, gotta watch out for those two shapeshifters. They haven't as far as I have seen, violated the T&C's like some here seem to claim. They get paid FAR too much for them to violate the T&C's, but they are allowed to have opinions.

I must say this is one of the "cleanest' sites I have come across in the bantering of various topics that people feel very strongly about one way or the other. Most other places such as this on the internet are festering sores compared to this.

reply to post by Majic


LOL..I have complained many times and I get zero respnse.

In fact a while ago I posted about the women hanging herself with ehr handcuffs.Moderater FredT removed it TWO TIMES.Saying it's neither a conspiracy or breaking news.It was both,I was first to post it..

Two whole days later someone else posted it and no one removed it...odd huh?

Well FredT told me he couldn't tell me anymore about the sittuation and I should send a u2u about it to Mirthfullme ...3 u2us later I get no response and still to this day 0 respnse..

BTW that thread has around 15 or 16 pages....Sigh ...This is just one example.

Not to mention Intrepid compairing my suggestion of making a whole seperate forum for people who use halucinegens for spiritual reasons only,such as Shamans ETC.He compaired it to pedophelia.HA..

It's also very very funny since you guys just bought adds on Coast to Coast,yet they have these people on there ALL the time promoting and or talking about these exact drugs and experiences..

Sigh...... I can keep going if you would like.

Originally posted by Majic
It's not uncommon to see suggestions in some posts that ATS/BTS/AP moderators enjoy some sort of special privilege because they're mods and can therefore get away with things that other members cannot.

I wish to lay this notion to rest, because it's not true.

All members of the staff, including moderators, super moderators and administrators, have agreed -- like every other member by virtue of our participation here -- to honor the AboveTopSecret.com Terms And Conditions Of Use.

NO ONE is exempt from the T&C. :shk:

Does that include thread titles that use profanity?

www.belowtopsecret.com...

some rank-and-file ATS-ers have been banned for that . . . .

(Edit to add: the first post on thread was in JULY)

[edit on 16-10-2007 by dr_strangecraft]

Originally posted by dr_strangecraft


Does that include thread titles that use profanity?

www.belowtopsecret.com...

some rank-and-file ATS-ers have been banned for that . . . .

Interesting that you brought that up Dr. Over 2 years ago, before this member was made a staff member. Do you have a point? Seems we missed one. Again, what's your point?

Well, there's no way for me (or other ATS-ers) to know who became a mod when.

All any of us can judge by is, what we see. All I saw, was a thread, and then it "says" the OP is a moderator. again, just going by what I see.

That is my point.

There's plenty of "muscle" applied by mods, when they see a post they don't like. And it's always a huge issue if a regular ATS-er asks questions.

Just look at the tone you're taking with me.