I don't get this Chemtrail business!!!

I've seen loads of threads on ATS regarding chemtrails and seeing as a lot of the guys talking about it seem to be fairly intelligent im confused as to what they are getting at!

When i look into the sky and see a contrail behind a plane, i know that it is just water vapour from the heat of the engines at high altitude.. so why do so many people think the plane is spraying chemicals into the sky???

as for the trails starting and stopping, isnt this just when the plane travels through warmer air and the water in the air isnt condensed?

Please tell me about chemtrails!...

Heres what I understand about contrails and chemtrails. If im wrong please correct me. The vapor or contrails should disapate to the point of not being visable to the eye in 3-4 minutes. Chemtrails can act in many different manners depending on many factors(weather, specific chemical,altitude). I witness on a regular basis(I live in San Jose, Ca.) trails that stay cohesive up to a half hour. During summer of 2005, I was entering Las Vegas by car from the west(mid day, clear sky, very hot) and saw a perfect (nice job pilots!) 9 square grid of trails that was many miles (10-15) wide that lasted 25-35 minutes. As to what chemical and why, I only have my ideas. Perhaps a calming agent (mixed with bright lights and you get a zombie. Anyone else notice this about people in Vegas?) or something that will cause a "agresive" effect (used during a heat wave could bring interesting results) or maybe the chemtrails can be used in combination with other devices such as H.A.A.R.P. for a more effective goal. I believe area weather is a huge factor. A wind swept area, such as San Francisco, might not be condusive for chemtrails but a stagnet area such as Las Vegas would be ideal.

Originally posted by projectionist
Heres what I understand about contrails and chemtrails. If im wrong please correct me. The vapor or contrails should disapate to the point of not being visable to the eye in 3-4 minutes.

OK.

Regular contrails can and do persist for much more than a matter of minutes.

See below for a picture of B-17 bombers during WWII. The contrail spanning the frame is clearly spreading and persisting, not dissipating within minutes.

The aircraft are carrying bomb loads for the long flight to Germany, not spray equipment or chemicals. So you know they're leaving regular contrails.



[edit on 3/15/2007 by eaglewingz]

Thanks guys, not as many replies as i would have liked though. does anyone have any pics of what does not look like a regular contrail? I live under a flight path and on a clear calm day, some contrails can last almost an hour before they totally disperse.

Thanks eaglwingz however im not sure if your trying to correct me or back me up.

Originally posted by fiftyfifty
Thanks guys, not as many replies as i would have liked though. does anyone have any pics of what does not look like a regular contrail? I live under a flight path and on a clear calm day, some contrails can last almost an hour before they totally disperse.

As an amateur meteorologist and weather photographer living under one of the busiest air routes in the world (as, indeed, do most Britons) and one who spends more time looking at the sky than the ground, I've never seen any contrail that didn't look like a normal contrail. I've also yet to see any photographs of anything that doesn't look to me like normal contrails or natural high level clouds.

Part of the problem is that chemtrails - if they exist - will only be visible when the atmospheric conditions are right for the creation of persistent contrails anyway.

50-50

I know very little about chemtrails, but have read a little about them.
If you're interested, here are some websites and other links which I have found previously, when I was reading up about them:


Aerosol Crimes & Cover Up - a website largely devoted to Chemtrails

The Other Reality - Chemtrail Aerosol Crimes cloudbuster - a Google video

Coming Clean - From an airline mechanic, describing secret tanks & pipes in commercial aircraft

Google search on Chemtrails +Britain (which I have intended looking at in more detail if & when I get a chance.


Hope these are some help in "telling you about chemtrails".

Originally posted by fiftyfifty
does anyone have any pics of what does not look like a regular contrail?

The first site I listed above has lots of pics, including some comparison pics.

ive seen many videos from atomic bomb testing that show the sky gridded with smoke trails setup to study the wind and blast patterns post explosion. maybe contrails are just beefed up to stay visible for as long as possible while atmospheric conditions are being analyzed either for weather or much more sinister activities.

Originally posted by Fjtruth

Originally posted by fiftyfifty
does anyone have any pics of what does not look like a regular contrail?

The first site I listed above has lots of pics, including some comparison pics.

Cliff Carnicom, like most chemtrail conspiracists, refuses to accept the existence of persistent contrails (the same phenomena climatalogists have been studying for years with regards causes of global warming) - relying on him would be like relying on a palaeontology site whose author doesn't believe in dinosaurs

I can't find any pictures on his site which wouldn't look out of place in a meteorology text book portraying persistent contrails and the many different varieties of cirrus clouds.

Y, alot o proof. It takes guts to now what your talkin about... get it straight.

First, I currently have no view on whether Chemtrails or persistent contrails exist, but I do find the story in Coming Clean spooky. That's what sparked my interest in this subject in the first place.

Originally posted by Essan
Cliff Carnicom, like most chemtrail conspiracists, refuses to accept the existence of persistent contrails (the same phenomena climatalogists have been studying for years with regards causes of global warming)

Irrespective of what you believe to be the cause of the persistent trails in the pictures, Cliff Carnicom's site
Aerosol Crimes & Cover Up does provide comparison pictures of 'regular' (non-persistent) contrails and persistent trails which he believes to be chemtrails (which is what I understand 50-50 to have asked for), so it's still a useful reference site.

I don't want to put words into your mouth, but you seem to be implying that persistent contrails must exist because global warming exists?
But does it therefore follow that IF global warming does not exist (an issue on which I am currently neutral), then persistent contrails may not exist, and hence chemtrails may exist?

Originally posted by Essan
relying on him would be like relying on a palaeontology site whose author doesn't believe in dinosaurs

Are you implying that those who reject global warming are akin to someone not believing in dinosaurs?

thanks guys. fjtruth, cheers for the links but im not sure about the validity of the airline mechanic and none of the pics point to anything unusual. The pic where the contrails look like a grid are common in busy airspace. I noticed as i was looking at them this morning above my house, there were 6 airliners in view, all travelling in the same direction but at slightly different altitudes and some further ahead than others. Some of the trails disappeared after a few seconds while some, one in particular streaked across all of the visible sky. Another two airliners crossed the paths shortly after at a 90deg angle.

I don't think there was anything suspicious about this as all of the planes were tavelling in the usual directions that they normally fly in. (I believe the ones heading east were heading for East midlands airport and the ones flying north were heading towards manchester).

Ok, s now i have come accross this.. not sure what to make of it but there is a lot of info there... Weather Wars

Originally posted by fiftyfifty
Ok, s now i have come accross this.. not sure what to make of it but there is a lot of info there... Weather Wars

From the guy who thinks Katrina was created by the Yazuka in retaliation for Hiroshima, and that odd shaped clouds are proof of weather manipulation (hope he never sees one shaped like an elephant!!!)

Originally posted by Fjtruth

I don't want to put words into your mouth, but you seem to be implying that persistent contrails must exist because global warming exists?

No, but as air traffic has rocketed in the past 2 decades, so there has been an increase in persistent contrails which in turn cause the earth to warm by reflecting outgoing radiation back down - you may find this interesting:

www.worldclimatereport.com...



Are you implying that those who reject global warming are akin to someone not believing in dinosaurs?

No, only those who don't beleive in persistent contrails

Originally posted by fiftyfifty
The pic where the contrails look like a grid are common in busy airspace.

Doesn't necessarily mean they aren't chemtrails.

Originally posted by fiftyfifty
I don't think there was anything suspicious about this as all of the planes were tavelling in the usual directions that they normally fly in.

But if chemtrails were emitted by regular commercial airlines, isn't that what you'd expect?

(As I said before, I'm agnostic on this - but here I'm playing devil's advocate.)

I suppose you have got a point but this is one conspiracy i totally don't buy in to. as discussed in the other threads, way to many people would have to be in on it plus 100 million other reasons lol. I may be wrong but thats how i stand on the matter.

... I just don't see easyjet, ryanair, bmibaby having anything to do with chemtrails they are all the budget airlines over where i live.

overcast days the airports around me (JFK and LGA) divert their flight paths for different approaches. this could be a reason for some people seeing aircraft that seem "out of place" or not on their usual course.

Cirrus clouds (the high thin whispy clouds) are premonitory of rain. Why? It's because cirrus clouds are made of moist air (low pressure), which is moving in, above dry clear high pressure down below. Cirrus clouds are the first step. They creep in above the high pressure down below. Eventually, and usually fairly soon -within a day-, the low pressure manages to move out all of the high pressure down below and it rains. So when you see those thin whispy clouds moving in, watch out because even though the weather has been great, things are going to change fairly soon.

Jets fly way up high where the cirrus clouds are. If you see a jet go by with a really short contrail, then you know that high pressure goes all the way up and the great weather (dry sunny) is going to continue. If you see a jet go by and its contrail stretches across the sky, it means moist air is now creeping in over the top of the high pressure front. The heat from the jet engines is making cirrus clouds in the moist air which is creeping in over the top of the high pressure down below, and although the weather has been great (clear, dry, sunny) soon the low pressure will move the high pressure out and it will begin to rain.

Cirrus clouds and long jet contrails are both premonitory of rain.

There. Now you don't need the weatherman.