Steven Greers latest conference

Originally posted by millerman


See, it's things like this that make me wonder, you SAY you've been doing the research, you SAY you've been following his work closely, reading his books and going over his online material - and yet you don't seem to be aware of even the most basic facts of his life and his work!

Have you even read "Hidden Truth"? You SAY you have, and yet here I am having to re-explain all the same things that he ALREADY explains in the book!

Millerman, I don't believe the guy that you are talking to in this post has read the book either. I missed the point where he had asserted that he had read the book or done 'research'.

Calling Mercury gay was a clear joke, he uses that in the book, it's actually androgenous, he also uses it one another one of his video lectures besides the one from the conference. Even if it is a bad joke, it's not enough to discredit Dr. Greer.

I appreciate you hanging in there with this guy, what I like about these posts is that people can read your arguments, you are getting the truth out there.

One thing that I think all the participants on this post can agree on, is that none of us can be at rest until disclosure happens.

Until then, make some noise and get it out there. This thing does not solely rest on Dr Greer's shoulders ya know.

We can all sit back and ask what Dr Greer has done but what have YOU done?

Have you written Dennis Kucinich yet? Dr Greer asked us to in the Expo video. Did you know Kucinich recently announced his campaign for the Presidency?

Have you written any of the Presidential nominees?

What's that you say? You don't know who they are? You don't know how to write a letter?

I've taken care of all that for you:

www.abovetopsecret.com...'

What have you done for disclosure lately?

I totally agree with C3Hamby on this.

First thing we should do is what can we do, even with limited resources.
The very least you can do, it Talk about it around you. Bring friends home and show them the National press club video, the witnesses, send them links. Do a show at your local community Room, or at the library...etc...

Another note here: One great way to relax the atmosphere, when the subject is strange or upsetting in the case of the Blackops...is using humor. It works great, and helps keeping the sanity That's my 2 cents anyway.

Originally posted by tock
I totally agree with C3Hamby on this.

Another note here: One great way to relax the atmosphere, when the subject is strange or upsetting in the case of the Blackops...is using humor. It works great, and helps keeping the sanity

That's my 2 cents anyway.

Thanks Tock!

I second that motion on levity. Good grief what's the anger about??



Sometimes I think the ETs are checking out the discussion on this board and they say, 'Nope, they aren't ready yet....

Originally posted by kroms33

Originally posted by millerman

Okay good but have you researched what exactly it is that CSETI does? They do things like going to places where there are waves of UFO sightings occuring, and they proactively make contact with the crafts. And Greer has allegedly been doing this for at least 15 years. That is why I said he is THE expert....

Of course I know what CSETI does - why do you think I am so angry at Greer for going that route?

You mean a route that works? Why would you get angry at him for that?

Or are you saying that their CE-5 protocol doesn't work?

Now, *I* don't know that for a FACT yet, but I understand the concept, and I'm trying to explain where Dr. Greer is coming from so that people can understand it. According to him, the ETs already know this, already have all the technology that makes use of that principle (the technology for travelling through "Hyperspace" or "Sub-space" uses it), and they're just waiting for us to sort of "wake up" and get it.

Right, but these radical claims he makes - they sell lots of tickets and books, no?

Well, I have no problem with him trying to sell some books and make some $$$, since he gave up his career in medicine to do this, and he has done all this without any real funding to speak of.... in fact, I think people should give SEAS a lot MORE $$$, because maybe then they'd be able to finally produce a workable device themselves....

And - since there is a cover up in place - why would the ETs wait for us to wake up and 'get it' if we theoretically already have it?

Well, I meant the earth as a whole. They are waiting for us to not only develop the technology, but also to evolve spiritually into a peaceful civilization.

(And no I don't know that for a FACT and I can't PROVE it.... but it is the hypothesis that makes the most sense to me, after the research that I have done)

Well, 'contact' HAS been established. Greer and CSETI have been doing it for 15 years (or so they claim since I haven't been to a training)

Here is where I have to swing the gavel and pound it down with a loud resounding "thud"

AGAIN presenting yourself as an authority figure, this time as some sort of "Supreme Judge of Truth and Fact".... well you're not MY judge, and you're definitely not Greer's judge!

You have unobstructed evidence that Greer and CSETI has had contact with aliens? Then you state that 'so they claim'. Don't you want to know this is all for real - or don't you want to find out that you are being 'had' ?

No, as I said, I have not personally been to a CSETI training, I'll give you that.

And yes I want to know that this is all for real, but I personally am satisfied with footage I have seen in Jose Escamilla's film, and other footage. I am satisfied that UFOs do exist and that they have ETs in them.

I am also personally satisfied that Greer isn't making all this CSETI stuff up, after having researched his work extensively. Indeed he comes across as a person of great integrity and credibility. And as he says in the NPC conference video - he is a state licensed medical practitioner, and he would lose his license to practice medicine if he were found to be perpetrating a hoax on the public!

Now maybe someone from CSETI or someone that has been out to one of these contact events could speak up and talk about some of the things they've witnessed, but I really don't see the point - they would immediately get ridiculed and dismissed as a nut. "Oh yeah, you saw a real spacecraft, you saw a real ET, they showed you their Remote Viewing helmets - you're insane!!! PROOF PROOF PROOF, PROOF PROOF PROOF......"

I personally am content to wait and see how this thing with the major G8 country plays out - for if that does happen, it'll solve that whole problem, definitively.....

But what do you do when the proof exists, you KNOW it exists, but it is very heavily guarded by the powers-that-be in the secret government and there's a complete mainstream media blackout on it? Do you just sit and wait for something to change.... or do you go ahead and start trying to educate people anyway?

you keep your mouth shut until you have the facts to back you claims so the government can't take that away from you and call you a nut job

Gee, exactly what the shadow government would WANT you to do.... well thank God Greer decided to take a different path!

(Have you read Hidden Truth Forbidden Knowledge BTW? He explains all these exact same things in that book.............)

As for his book - I read part of it, but never finished it... why? I got disappointed in the direction it was taking.

LMFAO!!!

Well there you go! You claim to be a legitimate researcher - but you didn't even bother to READ THE WHOLE BOOK where he EXPLAINS HIS ENTIRE STANCE in detail! Where he goes into great detail about the shadow government and all these hidden technologies!

You want to be a good thorough legitimate researcher? Go read the whole book!

Originally posted by c3hamby

One thing that I think all the participants on this post can agree on, is that none of us can be at rest until disclosure happens.

Until then, make some noise and get it out there. This thing does not solely rest on Dr Greer's shoulders ya know.

We can all sit back and ask what Dr Greer has done but what have YOU done?

Have you written Dennis Kucinich yet? Dr Greer asked us to in the Expo video. Did you know Kucinich recently announced his campaign for the Presidency?

Have you written any of the Presidential nominees?

Excellent point c3hamby! Simply knowing the truth isn't enough, we have to spread it around....

I think targeting US Presidents or Presidential candidates may be a bit of a waste of time, as they'll end up in the same sort of spot that Clinton was in, where he wanted to do something but was afraid for his life.... or God forbid they'll end up like JFK and James Forrestal....

Instead I think what is needed is a massive public outcry for the release of these hidden technologies, to the point where people are talking about it on TV and radio, out in the streets etc....

Guys like Dr. Greer and Paul Hellyer have paved the way for this, now we need to carry it forward and help them make it happen....

I think we should do a million person peace march meditation and C5 event on Washington DC.

Something like that to mobilize a lot of people....

A LOT of people....

Think about it...how to make it happen....

c3hamby:

Yes something like that would certainly work!

My concern for you is that if you live in the US and you start trying to organize something like that, you might get labelled a dissident or terrorist and get dragged off to a prison camp or worse.....

Are you familiar with
America: Freedom to Fascism and Aaron Russo?

As I was watching his videos, I wondered if he was familiar with TDP and Dr. Greer's stuff.... perhaps he could help with this?

Originally posted by millerman


NO GOVERNMENT has met with Greer? And you know that.... how?

Again, what is it you think he's been doing for the past 15 years?

I think you are arguing for the sense of 'arguing' I know what he has been doing - but what governments have welcomed him? WHAT government officials have talked with him about disclosing this? What powerful leader in the world has sat down with Greer and said "OK" - or even looked HIS direction? NONE.
Stop trying to misrepresent what I am typing - unless perhaps you can't comprehend it.

He has met with MANY people in various governments, militaries, intelligence communities..... and you would know that if you had really done the research. I mean, how else do you think he found all these 400+ MILITARY AND GOVERNMENT witnesses?

this is NOTHING new - or haven't you read what I have typed in this forum?

Well, if you had read the book, you would know that he did try to reach President Clinton, but Clinton was too afraid of the rogue group to do anything.... Bush? Yeah right, quite obviously on the NWO/warmongering side....

I know that he 'tried' to reach Clinton - but nothing HAPPENED... so the above is a pointless argument and is baseless.

See the infighting this Greer guy has caused amongst the research community? It just furthers my point that he is a dupe.

Let's see, maybe not the prime minister of Canada but the Honorable Paul Hellyer, former Canadian Minister of Defense, has stepped forward and he is now demanding the release of these technologies....

WHY ARE YOU THROWING ME IN A CATEGORY I DON'T BELONG?
I never said UFOs do not exist: I SAID I was angry at Greer for taking a spiritual route with this - making US - EVERYONE INVOLVED with this look like 'tin foil hat wearing IDIOTS' - and that is exactly what they DO think of us because of Greer.

Some users are actually U2Uing me about you people - and wondering why you take this guy's word so seriously. Here is ONE Example:
"Its interesting how we are now relagated to the DEBUNKER group, when If anyone bothers to read the first couple of pages of the thread, clearly we spoke of support for the project but dismay at the spiritual content now presented in the contact proposition."

And Greer is now talking about a G8 country planning a major open contact event with him.... but oh no, NO GOVERNMENT has met with him........ ;-)

Are you seriously using this as a factually based argument? Please.
Show me / tell me - I want to know: do you know what G-8 country Greer is meeting with? What country is that? I really want to know.

Seeing IS believing... talk is cheap... oh, unless you spend $100 to see a guru whom disrupts the credibility of ufology.

[qoute]
Well, the problem is, you quite clearly have NOT read Greer's latest book, "Hidden Truth....", because here I am having to re-explain to you all the same things that he already explains in that book....


I read part of it - I was unimpressed. I won't contribute money to what I consider a attempt to disrupt breakthroughs and truth - people have to know he is a fraud.

And if you are claiming to be some prominent UFO researcher - then who are you?

I never claimed to be prominent - not at all - it seems all you are trying to do is to bait me into an argument over semantics. I HAVE stated that I have researched UFOs ON and OFF for more years then Greer has - why would that give anyone FAME status? I am not famous by any means - and I am sure as hell a lot poorer then Greer is.

Again making authoritative statements and claiming to speak for all of Ufology and for the general public.... let's let people decide for themselves if he is credible or if he has discredited anyone!

FINE - PEOPLE: SPEAK UP - TELL THESE PEOPLE WHAT YOU THINK OF GREER.

We need to get past this whole "PROOF PROOF PROOF, SHOW ME THE PROOF" argument. The entire point of all this, is that there are some very wealthy and powerful cartels that have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo of fossil fuels, and they are ACTIVELY WITHHOLDING the proof!

see - only when it suits your argumentative needs.
All hail the mighty Greer - whatever you say master - whatever you tell us.
That is scary. "Beware of False Prophets" - I am not even religious - but I think that part of the bible really needs to be held close to everyones heart.
That statement goes beyond religious comprehension... it basically tells you: don't believe everyone you hear.

So if someone told you they had been to the moon and ate cheese and drank beer with the aliens - you would just believe them...

Why else do you think these inventors keep popping up, have been popping up for at least 100 years, but keep getting utterly squashed? (research Nikola Tesla, Hans Coler, and a boatload of others)

WHAT?
Who is disagreeing with you? I am not sure you understand where this conversation originated from: it originated from ME and OTHERS being unhappy with Greer turning UFO's/ETs into a RELIGION.
You seem to be losing site of your argumentation and are trying to convince a person that believes in conspiracies and UFOs/ET's - that they exist - um its kind of pointless - because I believe... I just don't believe Greer... I really wish others would chime in on this - I am fending off way to many people - when I know for a fact that others out there believe the same as I do.
I am sure there are HUNDREDS of researchers that would easily dismantle Greers intentions - I don't understand why so many people stand up and defend this false UFO Messiah.
Its kind of weird...
Look deep at what they have done - and LOOK deep at the divide they have caused... and don't blame the researchers who don't believe Greer - we are doing this scientifically - not mystically.

Don't you people DARE label us in the Debunker Category as it seems like the direction is going - YOUR the ones following Greer without question... which is very... very strange in itself.

Originally posted by c3hamby

We can all sit back and ask what Dr Greer has done but what have YOU done?

Have you written Dennis Kucinich yet? Dr Greer asked us to in the Expo video. Did you know Kucinich recently announced his campaign for the Presidency?

Have you written any of the Presidential nominees?

What's that you say? You don't know who they are? You don't know how to write a letter?

I've taken care of all that for you:

www.abovetopsecret.com...'

What have you done for disclosure lately?

I have done all of the above and then some - i have written UFO organizations, representatives, government officials, current presidency - all to no avail.

What you guys are failing to realize is that WE are ALL on the SAME TEAM.
We just don't believe Greer... and that he discredited tons of people.

Originally posted by millerman

No, as I said, I have not personally been to a CSETI training, I'll give you that.

And yes I want to know that this is all for real, but I personally am satisfied with footage I have seen in Jose Escamilla's film, and other footage. I am satisfied that UFOs do exist and that they have ETs in them.

OK - FOR THE LAST TIME - I don't think you UNDERSTAND this conversation. You are acting as if I am a skeptic and don't believe in UFOs or ETs - where did that come from? Find it, find where I say UFOs and ETs don't exist?
Stop acting LIKE I am against UFOs and ET's and all that crap... THIS IS what I was talking about - and IT worked.
THE BEST WAY TO CONTROL A PEOPLE IS TO KEEP THEM SPLIT/SEGREGATED.
You believe in the shadow government right? Well - I see you believe highly in them too... especially Greer.
Disinformationalist of the Century.

I am also personally satisfied that Greer isn't making all this CSETI stuff up, after having researched his work extensively. Indeed he comes across as a person of great integrity and credibility. And as he says in the NPC conference video - he is a state licensed medical practitioner, and he would lose his license to practice medicine if he were found to be perpetrating a hoax on the public!

His spiritual beliefs and what not have no bearing on his statements about hoaxes. I think the 450+ researchers are/were sincere - I thing Greer started out sincere - but lost it when either:

1) he was told by someone to shut up
2) he was told by the government to make his own religion
3) he had always had a secret agenda
4) he is perhaps out to discredit UFOs/ETs

or even all of the above... who knows.

Now maybe someone from CSETI or someone that has been out to one of these contact events could speak up and talk about some of the things they've witnessed, but I really don't see the point - they would immediately get ridiculed and dismissed as a nut. "Oh yeah, you saw a real spacecraft, you saw a real ET, they showed you their Remote Viewing helmets - you're insane!!! PROOF PROOF PROOF, PROOF PROOF PROOF......"

I don't think you know what you are ... talking about?
You act as if I am a skeptic... are you not reading what I am typing? Why don't you start over and read everything that I typed from the beginning.
Stop trying to push that I am a skeptic because I don't believe in this false Messiah of yours... your getting rude and a bit out of hand.

But what do you do when the proof exists, you KNOW it exists, but it is very heavily guarded by the powers-that-be in the secret government and there's a complete mainstream media blackout on it? Do you just sit and wait for something to change.... or do you go ahead and start trying to educate people anyway?

you keep your mouth shut until you have the facts to back you claims so the government can't take that away from you and call you a nut job

Gee, exactly what the shadow government would WANT you to do.... well thank God Greer decided to take a different path!

LMFAO!!!

Well there you go! You claim to be a legitimate researcher - but you didn't even bother to READ THE WHOLE BOOK where he EXPLAINS HIS ENTIRE STANCE in detail! Where he goes into great detail about the shadow government and all these hidden technologies!

You want to be a good thorough legitimate researcher? Go read the whole book!

Um, oh boy - you got me?? LOL

But all my statements - as all of yours - are JUST OPINION.
Right? OR can you even see where I am coming from?

I find his new age stuff veering a bit too far away from the "nuts & bolts" of the UFO experience, while its all good talking about the meta verse it aint gonna convince anyone unless solid evidence is provided. Also you may write him off, but what about the 100's(?) of ex military witness's he's amassed as part of the disclosure drive..are they all liars? I dont think so, even if just 1 of them is telling a real story then its certainly good what he's doin..I just wish he would'nt sour it with some of the things he's talkin about now..

Originally posted by kroms33

Originally posted by millerman

NO GOVERNMENT has met with Greer? And you know that.... how?

Again, what is it you think he's been doing for the past 15 years?

I think you are arguing for the sense of 'arguing'

No, I am coming to the defense of someone who I believe to be a very important public figure, someone who FINALLY stood up to the shadow government or "Murder Inc" as he calls them, who nearly got killed God knows how many times in the process, who showed AMAZING courage and leadership, and helped pave the way for these earth-saving technologies to FINALLY be disclosed and used for peaceful purposes, after 100 years of needlessly consuming fossil fuels and ruining our biosphere.... not to mention at least 100 years of absolutely senseless war, oppression and poverty....

Coming to his defense because I see him being called a nut, a kook, a dupe, a fraud, a 'tin foil hat wearing IDIOT', a 'False Prophet', a 'UFO Messiah'.... because I see him not merely being discussed and debated, but being ATTACKED AND RIDICULED....

I know what he has been doing - but what governments have welcomed him? WHAT government officials have talked with him about disclosing this? What powerful leader in the world has sat down with Greer and said "OK" - or even looked HIS direction? NONE.

And you know that - how? If he hasn't been meeting with governments and leaders for the past 15 years - then where did the army of 400+ whistleblowers come from? How did the Disclosure Project National Press Club Conference happen?

See the infighting this Greer guy has caused amongst the research community? It just furthers my point that he is a dupe.

More namecalling?

And BTW I'm not "fighting" with you, I'm discussing. As far as I can tell, YOU are the only one getting angry and resorting to namecalling....

Why does this make you so angry? So Greer talks about God, he talks about praying or meditating, he talks about higher states of cosmic consciousness.... he is essentially talking about a unification of science and spirituality. WHY is that something to get ANGRY about?

It should be a cause of CELEBRATION!!!

YES!!!!! Science and spirituality are unified, because all matter and energy and life and consciousness are unified and One! And there are actually proof-of-principle technologies that PROVE that! That is GOOD NEWS!

FINALLY we can get rid of the false dichotomy between science and spirituality, the dichotomy that has not only caused tonnes of bickering and arguing, but HUNDREDS OF YEARS OF SENSELESS WAR AND DEATH in the various wars between Christians and Muslims and Jews....

Some users are actually U2Uing me about you people - and wondering why you take this guy's word so seriously.

Well hey, guys, don't talk about me behind my back, come right out here in the open and talk to me! I can handle it! You don't see me getting angry or calling anyone names....

"Its interesting how we are now relagated to the DEBUNKER group, when If anyone bothers to read the first couple of pages of the thread, clearly we spoke of support for the project but dismay at the spiritual content now presented in the contact proposition."

Well, maybe I'm treating you like a DEBUNKER because you're resorting to namecalling, ridicule, accusations (calling Greer a fraud), presenting yourself as an Authority figure (the Judge Of Truth), claiming to speak for many more people than just yourself..... essentially ALL THE CLASSIC TACTICS OF DEBUNKERS....

Face the truth - you ARE attacking, ridiculing and trying to debunk Greer. Why? Why should we be so angry at this man, who has done so much GOOD? Who PAVED THE WAY for the disclosure of the hidden technologies that the world so desperately needs?

And Greer is now talking about a G8 country planning a major open contact event with him.... but oh no, NO GOVERNMENT has met with him........ ;-)

Are you seriously using this as a factually based argument? Please.
Show me / tell me - I want to know: do you know what G-8 country Greer is meeting with? What country is that? I really want to know.

Of course it's not a factually based argument - because the event hasn't happened yet! He is being understandably cautious about how much information he gives out, because he's talking about an event which would change the entire world!

All we can do is be patient and see what happens - and if nothing happens, call me an idiot. But I personally am betting that it will happen, because Greer has come through for us before, and I see no reason not to trust his word.....

Well, the problem is, you quite clearly have NOT read Greer's latest book, "Hidden Truth....", because here I am having to re-explain to you all the same things that he already explains in that book....

I read part of it - I was unimpressed. I won't contribute money to what I consider a attempt to disrupt breakthroughs and truth - people have to know he is a fraud.

So on the one hand you're in here going "Where's the proof? PROOF PROOF PROOF, PROOF PROOF PROOF", and on the other hand, you refuse to even read the entire book where he explains everything? Like all the parts about the shadow government that's WITHHOLDING ALL THE PROOF? The same shadow government that former US President Eisenhower spoke about, JFK spoke about, Senator Daniel Inouye and former Canadian Minister of Defense Paul Hellyer and many many others have spoken about.....?

You are essentially keeping yourself in ignorance about the contents of his book, because you read the first part and you got angry because he started talking about spiritual concepts?



[edit on 15-3-2007 by millerman]

We need to get past this whole "PROOF PROOF PROOF, SHOW ME THE PROOF" argument. The entire point of all this, is that there are some very wealthy and powerful cartels that have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo of fossil fuels, and they are ACTIVELY WITHHOLDING the proof!

see - only when it suits your argumentative needs.
All hail the mighty Greer - whatever you say master - whatever you tell us.

Nope.

As I have said, it's not just Greer that speaks of the shadow government, it's Eisenhower, JFK, Senator Inouye, Paul Hellyer, MANY of the Disclosure Project witnesses.... oh and not to mention Aaron Russo and his Freedom to Fascism movie where he walks you through the whole process of discovering who these people are and how they control us....

You seem to be losing site of your argumentation and are trying to convince a person that believes in conspiracies and UFOs/ET's - that they exist - um its kind of pointless - because I believe... I just don't believe Greer... I really wish others would chime in on this - I am fending off way to many people - when I know for a fact that others out there believe the same as I do.

Well maybe you're now needing to "fend off people", because you started ATTACKING Greer, ridiculing him, calling him names, accusing him of being a fraud etc.....? Attacking this man who has done so much good?

Don't you people DARE label us in the Debunker Category

Threats now?

YOUR the ones following Greer without question... which is very... very strange in itself.

Nope, not just Greer but him and MANY others and a LARGE body of evidence, all pointing to the existence of a shadow government that's not only sitting on these technologies, but actively preventing them from coming out and being used for peaceful purposes.....

Stop trying to push that I am a skeptic because I don't believe in this false Messiah of yours... your getting rude and a bit out of hand.

How am I being rude when I haven't resorted to any personal attacks, namecalling or threats?

YOU were the one taking on a menacing tone with

Don't you people DARE label us in the Debunker Category

What are you so angry about?

Originally posted by millerman

NO GOVERNMENT has met with Greer? And you know that.... how?

Again, what is it you think he's been doing for the past 15 years?

I know it, because if he met with an actual government (thousands of people that make the wheels go round and round - supposedly to do it's citizenries bidding - in a democratic country - then there would have been a massive scale conference with these thousands of individuals). I nor anyone else have heard of any of this taking place...
Now, if your talking about world leaders, representing their government - or a part of their government: Perhaps - but the man himself (Greer), has never stated he has met anyone - so under a logical assumption we can conclude that he hasn't. Do I have proof he hasn't - no, but I shouldn't be the one who has to prove anything - since he is the one making the various claims - why shouldn't he have to back it up?

Coming to his defense because I see him being called a nut, a kook, a dupe, a fraud, a 'tin foil hat wearing IDIOT', a 'False Prophet', a 'UFO Messiah'.... because I see him not merely being discussed and debated, but being ATTACKED AND RIDICULED....

You are not understanding my point of view. (god, I am running low on the 6500 characters to type LOL). I will give you that I have issued a bit of 'name calling' but, believe me it was done in a constructive way that meant no offense to you or anyone else. I can see now that this is basically a religious issue.

And you know that - how? If he hasn't been meeting with governments and leaders for the past 15 years - then where did the army of 400+ whistleblowers come from? How did the Disclosure Project National Press Club Conference happen?

I have watched it - numerous times, and perhaps that is why I am so disappointed in him... I am just calling on people to not take everything they hear as factually based information. You yourself noted that this is a 'spiritual' quest of Greer, have you ever questioned religion in general?
If so, then you should understand my points.

kroms33:
See the infighting this Greer guy has caused amongst the research community? It just furthers my point that he is a dupe.

More namecalling?

Dupe: a person who unquestioningly or unwittingly serves a cause or another person: a dupe of the opponents.
–verb (used with object)
3. to make a dupe of; deceive; delude; trick.

If he is a disinformationalist - then, he is what he is. Don't go pulling some type of psychological guilt trip - it wont work here.

Why does this make you so angry? So Greer talks about God, he talks about praying or meditating, he talks about higher states of cosmic consciousness.... he is essentially talking about a unification of science and spirituality. WHY is that something to get ANGRY about?

It should be a cause of CELEBRATION!!!

You haven't read a word I have typed have you? I am not angry - just mystified that this is happening. How do you know this wasn't planned to split the community apart?

FINALLY we can get rid of the false dichotomy between science and spirituality, the dichotomy that has not only caused tonnes of bickering and arguing, but HUNDREDS OF YEARS OF SENSELESS WAR AND DEATH in the various wars between Christians and Muslims and Jews....

I think you are going to have a harder time convincing THEM (the major religions) then you are me... good luck in that effort.

Yes, that would be nice in a utopia - but humanity, the greater humanity is not ready for any type of debate upon the grounds stated by you or Greer.
This is a 'religion' to you, and that is why you are taking this almost personally. It is understandable, as any religion on earth would feel the same exact way if I was telling them their leaders were corrupt.

I am not getting angry - I am just using objectifying comments for rebuttal. If you are taking offense to it, then I apologize - there is no offense intended - just calling things the way I (and others) see them.

Well, maybe I'm treating you like a DEBUNKER because you're resorting to namecalling, ridicule, accusations (calling Greer a fraud), presenting yourself as an Authority figure (the Judge Of Truth), claiming to speak for many more people than just yourself..... essentially ALL THE CLASSIC TACTICS OF DEBUNKERS....

No, maybe you are calling me - and others debunkers because you have taken offense and feel it is a direct assault on your religious/spiritual beliefs.

Face the truth - you ARE attacking, ridiculing and trying to debunk Greer. Why? Why should we be so angry at this man, who has done so much GOOD? Who PAVED THE WAY for the disclosure of the hidden technologies that the world so desperately needs?

Again, you haven't read anything that I stated - thus you repeat yourself.
ONE LAST TIME:
I am not attacking him: My stance - repeated for the record stands as "He should have kept spirituality out of the matrix of his quest because NOW no acting scientific minds or government will take him seriously."
And weather you like it or not - that is a fact.

Of course it's not a factually based argument - because the event hasn't happened yet! He is being understandably cautious about how much information he gives out, because he's talking about an event which would change the entire world!

what is the time frame then?
and what has Greer come through before on??


Please - if your just skimming my posts - I think you should read them more carefully - because a lot of the questions you are asking me - or repeating are already answered.

Originally posted by c3hamby
I think we should do a million person peace march meditation and C5 event on Washington DC.

Something like that to mobilize a lot of people....

A LOT of people....

Think about it...how to make it happen....

I have mailed Greer - CSETI and a bunch of UFO organizations to get the people organized in one form or another - nothing; they site funding problems...

Perhaps that is so - but with all the books and dvd sales and even conferences - where is all this money going? Certainly not for the betterment of humanity

That is what I am all about - getting the message out there and getting people to come together - but I dare you to try to mail these various groups about getting everyone under one battle flag to take down the 'conspiracy' - they - for some reason wont let it happen.

Originally posted by kroms33

Originally posted by millerman

NO GOVERNMENT has met with Greer? And you know that.... how?

Again, what is it you think he's been doing for the past 15 years?

I know it, because if he met with an actual government (thousands of people that make the wheels go round and round - supposedly to do it's citizenries bidding - in a democratic country - then there would have been a massive scale conference with these thousands of individuals). I nor anyone else have heard of any of this taking place...

Of course not! Because there are elements in the shadow government that actively keep such things sanitized out of the mainstream media - and here again, you would know that if you had read all of the book, and done all the relevant research on the shadow government.... like for example the FOIA government document at disclosureproject.org that talks about CIA involvement in sanitizing the newsmedia....

Also, meeting with actually the ENTIRE government of a country all at once, thousands of people - that's absurd! That never happens anyway! Such things are handled with much smaller committees and councils etc...

Coming to his defense because I see him being called a nut, a kook, a dupe, a fraud, a 'tin foil hat wearing IDIOT', a 'False Prophet', a 'UFO Messiah'.... because I see him not merely being discussed and debated, but being ATTACKED AND RIDICULED....

You are not understanding my point of view. (god, I am running low on the 6500 characters to type LOL). I will give you that I have issued a bit of 'name calling' but, believe me it was done in a constructive way that meant no offense to you or anyone else.

LMAO!

'Constructive' name-calling? Calling him a kook and a fraud and a False Prophet, but in a GOOD way? ROFL......

I can see now that this is basically a religious issue.

Well, I'd prefer the term spiritual, as to me 'religious' invokes thought of Christians, Muslims, Jews etc, and we're not really dealing with that level.

But yes, it IS a spiritual issue, and I have been trying to explain why.

Say you're one of the real hardcore atheistic scientific types, and you have a series of UFO/ET encounters, and say you can suspend disbelief for a minute and assume Greer is telling the truth....

And what you find in all these ET encounters is that ALL the ETs are these really peaceful and spiritual beings, who communicate with you using ONLY telepathy, and they're sitting there in the UFO jacked in to the craft with these Remote Viewing helmets, and they even let you put one on and BAM - you can instantly see anything, any place in the whole universe you want....

You'd freak right out, right? As an atheist who doesn't BELIEVE in things like telepathy, who doesn't BELIEVE in the interconnectedness of all things.... you would have NO way of processing that reality! The cognitive dissonance would drive you right bonkers!

It IS absolutely a spiritual issue - because it is IMPOSSIBLE to even make sense of the ET reality without an understanding of the nexus where science and spirituality meet, the nexus where all matter and energy and consciousness are One...

And that is why the ETs don't even bother trying to deal with people that don't have that prerequisite "cosmic consciousness" - because if they try to approach people like that, they get SHOT AT!

(Assuming Greer is telling the truth, of course!)

Now, do I know these things for a fact yet? No. I am only trying to explain where Greer is coming from, and why he introduces spirituality into things that, to you, should be approached in a strictly scientific way.

To HIM, because of the experiences HE has had.... it is impossible to take the spirituality out of the equation, because it is an inherent part of that whole reality.

I am not attacking him: My stance - repeated for the record stands as "He should have kept spirituality out of the matrix of his quest because NOW no acting scientific minds or government will take him seriously."
And weather you like it or not - that is a fact.

Says YOU. But when you listen to all his radio interviews and stuff like that, it sure sounds like people are taking him seriously, and of course if this major imminent contact event does take place, that'll be the proof in the pudding....

Of course it's not a factually based argument - because the event hasn't happened yet! He is being understandably cautious about how much information he gives out, because he's talking about an event which would change the entire world!

what is the time frame then?

Well how am I supposed to know the time frame? He didn't say! All he said was it was "imminent" - that could mean days, weeks, months.... hopefully no more than a year.... As I said, be patient, and wait and see....

and what has Greer come through before on??

Sigh.

The NPC media conference. The army of military/intelligence/corporate whistleblowers coming forward, with a whole tonne of documentation and A/V evidence.

Now has he produced an ET carcass, or a working ET craft, or a working zero-point energy device?

No - because such things, the absolute smoking gun proof, are HEAVILY HEAVILY GUARDED by the shadow government.

Which you would understand, if you had done all the research. Like reading his whole book.


[edit on 15-3-2007 by millerman]

Originally posted by kroms33

Originally posted by c3hamby
I think we should do a million person peace march meditation and C5 event on Washington DC.

Something like that to mobilize a lot of people....

A LOT of people....

Think about it...how to make it happen....

I have mailed Greer - CSETI and a bunch of UFO organizations to get the people organized in one form or another - nothing; they site funding problems...

Perhaps that is so - but with all the books and dvd sales and even conferences - where is all this money going? Certainly not for the betterment of humanity

That is what I am all about - getting the message out there and getting people to come together - but I dare you to try to mail these various groups about getting everyone under one battle flag to take down the 'conspiracy' - they - for some reason wont let it happen.

You certainly have a quality of debunker, but finance and running a business like Steven has, doesn't seem to be your thing If it was, you would know what is involved behind it .

Lets just run a few numbers:
How much does 5 days trip to a big european town you think?
How much if you are bringing one employe and 2 witnesses with you?
Now, what if you repeat that process few times in a year?
How much does gearing yourself up for field work cost?
Did you check the price of the magnetic field detectors?
And half million candle light spots?
And Infrared gear?

Now, maybe with that you will shut you up regarding the finances behind an NON profit organisations....

[edit on 15-3-2007 by tock]

millerman, I love you. I love how you write and you really are making a good point. And on top of that, I find you entertaining
Keep it up

Thank you tock, are you male or female? ;-)

Hey there

Just a little quote:

“The tiny particles which form the vast universe are not tiny at all. Neither is the universe vast. These are notions of the mind, which is like a knife, always chipping away at the Tao, trying to render it graspable and manageable. But that which is beyond form is ungraspable, and that which is beyond knowing is unmanageable. There is, however, this consolation: She who lets go of the knife will find the Tao at her fingertips.”

- The Unkown Teachings of Lao Tzu.