Harsh Reality of Iraq. ** warning image may disturb

Edit: forget it Marge beat me to it.

Regardless of your POV, if you did serve over there you should know we still appreciate your service.

[edit on 3/9/2007 by Hal9000]

Originally posted by marg6043

Originally posted by stumason

It was bloody well peaceful before the "Coalition" showed up. Granted, Saddam was an utter git and thousands died over a 35 year period, but prior to `91 it was the most prosperous, westernised country in the ME and would have made a great ally.

Now, after 2003, it's a cesspit. Well done.

Sometimes stumason I feel like an old record player going over and over historical facts of the time when our own elected officials used to sleep in the same bed with Saddam . . .

And then make him an enemy when greed and oil grab was to good to resists . . .

You can tell how well the government geared propaganda has work on our fellow Americans . . .

Pity.

Because you've proven time and again your ignorance in Middle East history? I would be tired to.

Throw pictures and bandy words like "peace, love. .. cant we all just get along" Yup. Realistic.

COnnected I check out your links
Tell me, is this what you wanted Saddam to turn over?....

U.S. military photos of the alleged lab showed a bare concrete-walled room scattered with stacks of plastic containers, coiled tubing, hoses and a stand holding a large metal device that looked like a distillery. Black rubber boots lay among the gear

YOu wanted Saddam to turn over all of his 'stacks of plastic containers'?
All of Iraqs 'coiled tubing'? Hoses?

Seriously man, I hope you came to ATS to learn.

Er he .. did have chemical weapons, biological as well.... we gave them to him.. so he did have them somewhere.

Why don't you put a link to the source you got that information from.

Let's please debate the topic and not each other.

Mod Note: Please Stay on Topic

Mod Edit: Please Review the Following Link: Courtesy Is Mandatory

Gotcha Iraqi Chemical Stash
We gave him some chem agents that degrade over time.
He had no Bio agents that I am aware of, and no Nukes whatsoever.

By the way, its not my link, its the best link that Connected gave from his search.
I honestly cant believe there are people that still think Saddam had WMD.


[edit on 9-3-2007 by 11Bravo]

On the overall it is not our troops and coalition forces who are causing the death and destruction in Iraq.

I am not going to upload pictures of people who were beaten, or killed, or maimed, because i don't like to upload those pictures...like some have done to try to use as political tools...

But if you want to see some pictures of what Saddam and his regime was doing to people in Iraq, the following link will show you some pictures if you scroll down...

Warning, Graphic pictures!!.... If you have a faint heart do not click on that link.
mypetjawa.mu.nu...

why is this man smiling?? He has over 400,000 reason not to smile.

when the Iraq soccer team lost they were tortured. The government did this because they didn't score enough goals...Yeah, Iraq was a lovely place before the war.

America will have troops in Iraq for YEARS...why do i say this. America has
60,000 Navy and Marine Corps personnel in Japan. Japans Defense Force has 239,430 men.

Here is the list of bases of American solders in Germany now en.wikipedia.org...

Big boy Countries have big boy responsibilities...

But Muadib, in all honesty, did 100 or more Iraqi civillians blow up daily on the streets when Saddam was in power?
It seems obvious that the death toll pre-invasion was perhaps a few hundred a year, now it is more like a few hundred a week.
You're smart, you do the math, more Iraqis have died since we removed Saddam, then Saddam himself killed while we supported him.

So connected I am to trust Google then and how do you call it?

research?

Hum, give me some juicy links, and trust me we will digest them very fast.

Here is another link with pictures of what Saddam did to the Kurds who are now living in relative peace in northern Iraq, and have been thanking the coalition for getting rid of Saddam, which of course you won't hear on the news.

Warning, very graphic pictures!!!

www.kdp.pp.se...

Never mind either that in Bagdagh there are about 5-7 million people, which is where most of the violence occurs, while in the North and south there are the rest of the 20-22 million Iraqis.

The north and south were the regions that Saddam's regime were systematically going to murder people there, and there were at least 60,000 people in Baghdag who were directly murdered by Saddam's regime.

That's without counting the over 500,000 Iraqi children under the age of 5 who died because the world agreed to put sanctions in Iraq, the same sanctions which Russia, China, France and Germany among others wanted to keep in place, because they were getting rich while selling illegal arms to Saddam in exchange for oil, instead of deposing Saddam's regime.

[edit on 9-3-2007 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by DCP

Big boy Countries have big boy responsibilities...

Sadly I think you are right.
I just wish we were a Big Man Country instead.

Big boys want everything their way, they expect respect but never give it, and they kick sand in other boys faces.
Big men on the other hand are kind, humble, willing to work with others to find a solution, and often give respect where none is warrented.

Agit8dChop: Nice post. Well said.
Just like to add that some people out here agree with you.

FYI : A good read on war can be found at:
( www.WarIsARacket.com... )
The article was written by two-time Congressional Medal Of Honor
recepient : Major General Smedley D. Butler (USMC)
Kind of ironic isn't it?

Rockpuck : People do die in wars. Question: Who profits?
Do the people who die have anything to do with policy, or profit?

Mr. Bush is making his tour of Latin America. They are protesting like
crazy against him, and America.

Xphiles/Rockpuck when are you 2 spineless amoeba's going to admit that America's actions in Iraq have opened the flood gates of mass slaughter. To keep on bangin out that so tired excuse of oh they were doing it to each other before we got there is pathetic, what and the US is making it better, oh its all those insurgents that are wuppin our ass all the time causing the problems.

America was told that this would be the outcome of an invasion but you still went ahead with your agenda anyway. You started this mess so at least have the gonnads to say its your fault instead of blaming everyone else you can think of.

Your lack of compassion for your fellow mans suffering is a disgrace

I guess you missed this post: please review this link now

[edit on 9-3-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

Yeah at least it was bodies to be found to show how evil it was under Saddam no in the outrageous quantities that the propaganda wants to bring, still no prof and no even a fraction of it found. . .

Now with the liberation is not longer bodies but rather people has to scrape their death from the walls and streets and guess who they are.

I got it!!!!! they are all militants and insurgents.

You know the comparison of Saddam evil deeds and the death toll in Iraq right now is something that only people still defending the invasion of that country can bring themselves to justify.

Incredible, death is death Saddam was a killer. . . but what should we call the death now in Iraq?

Casualties, terrorist [depending which side you support], sectarian violence and is all Iraqis fault for not been more agreeable after the liberation



[edit on 9-3-2007 by marg6043]

Originally posted by 11Bravo
But Muadib, in all honesty, did 100 or more Iraqi civillians blow up daily on the streets when Saddam was in power?
It seems obvious that the death toll pre-invasion was perhaps a few hundred a year, now it is more like a few hundred a week.
You're smart, you do the math, more Iraqis have died since we removed Saddam, then Saddam himself killed while we supported him.

Actually Saddam's regime is responsible for tens of thousands of deaths in one or two day campaigns. Remember the mass graves, those that were found, which contained thousands of people?....

The 1983 attack against Kurdish citizens belonging to the Barzani tribe, 8,000 of whom were rounded up by the regime in northern Iraq and executed in deserts at great distances from their homes.
The 1988 Anfal campaign, during which as many as 182,000 people disappeared. Most of the men were separated from their families and were executed in deserts in the west and southwest of Iraq. The remains of some of their wives and children have also been found in mass graves.
Chemical attacks against Kurdish villages from 1986 to 1988, including the Halabja attack, when the Iraqi Air Force dropped sarin, VX and tabun chemical agents on the civilian population, killing 5,000 people immediately and causing long-term medical problems, related deaths, and birth defects among the progeny of thousands more.
The 1991 massacre of Iraqi Shi’a Muslims after the Shi’a uprising at the end of the Gulf war, in which tens of thousands of soldiers and civilians in such regions as Basra and Al-Hillah were killed.
The 1991 Kurdish massacre, which targeted civilians and soldiers who fought for autonomy in northern Iraq after the Gulf war.

Warning some pictures of mass graves found in Iraq are i=seen in the following link.
www.state.gov...

More graphic pictures of mass graves, these pictures are newer.
www.usaid.gov...

Death in the overall is bad, nomatter if is one child, or hundreds, but not even trying to stop more deaths is worse...

[edit on 9-3-2007 by Muaddib]

More pictures of Iraqis murdered by Saddam's regime. This site has 74 pages of pictures, each page has 4-5 pictures.

Warning, very graphic images!!!

www.9neesan.com...

Aw. Tragic. Let me get a tissue. Maybe the ignorant fools shouldn't blow each other up. I don't understand how people sympathize with murderers .. or are so damn clueless they blame America for Sunnis murdering Shia.. you think thats new man?

1)Dude, if we hadn't gone in there, they wouldn't be blowing themselves up.
2)I wouldn't go around trying to give people that disagree on the war, "history lessons" since anyone that studied history would have known invading Iraq would create caos.
3)We are screwed because we can't win the war and we can't leave Iraq. Leaving Iraq would most likely result in a regional war. This war in Iraq is never going to end only get worse and there is no getting out of it. Welcome to middle eastern pollitics.

Originally posted by 11Bravo
But Muadib, in all honesty, did 100 or more Iraqi civillians blow up daily on the streets when Saddam was in power?
It seems obvious that the death toll pre-invasion was perhaps a few hundred a year, now it is more like a few hundred a week.
You're smart, you do the math, more Iraqis have died since we removed Saddam, then Saddam himself killed while we supported him.

LOL

This is what I mean.. THINK ..

Why didn't Sunnis blow them selves up in the streets when Saddam was in power........ maybe because SUNNIS WHERE THE ONES IN POWER KILLING PEOPLE IN TORTURE CHAMBERS!!!!!

You either don't want to see the issue as a broad issue with alot of history, or you use it for pure political gain. Sadly 75% of Americans are so ignorant what ever CNN tells them they listen to. (And I watch CNN every night, not Fox..)

Originally posted by magicmushroom
Xphiles/Rockpuck when are you 2 spineless amoeba's going to admit that America's actions in Iraq have opened the flood gates of mass slaughter.

Your lack of compassion for your fellow mans suffering is a disgrace

look, to keep perspective here, these are geo-political games going on here.

the only thing that was not known in the beginning, was how hard iran syria and others would resist the occupation.

its sad, but, its true.
the people up in there ivory towers are playing a big chess game. they dont care what happens in the middle.

you think america isnt neck deep in bad stuff, your foolin yourself.
you think everbody else isnt neck-deep in it too, you again are foolin yourself.

its a sick game, but, if you dont play you get subjugated.