Is The Reason For All The Evil In The World Just People Taking Things Too Seriously?

Look at every world crisis and war and conflict going on in the world right now or that have ever taken place, and ask yourself, if it weren't have been prevented if the people involved had only taken things a little less seriously?

Or a lot more, just enough for them to stop hurting each other in a manner that induces harmful reactions from the other side. I mean, If people don't care about provocation and focus just on doing what they want to do the world WILL be a better place, right?
That is ,if all the uneducated and the mentally twisted or aggressively proned do it. All of them.
The intellectuals and\or people who already conform with the "not taking things seriously" mandate could be allowed to remain as they are because they're not doing all the trouble anyway.

If people don't do it by themselvs, should it be forced upon them, like a massive brain washing and\or physical modifications?

If they do that (And maybe ban religion too)
Will wars end?

If it's done than potentially no one would ever get annoyed by anything or anyone ever again.
Look at that scenario and think
What should people take seriously, if anything? What should they allow themselves to be offended by, if anything? To what degree can personal morality be allowed to influence our reactions and actions toward to others?

Are there any up-sides for allowing masses of uneducated people to take things seriously? (Both in short- and long-time perspectives).

Are there any up-sides for allowing masses of uneducated people to take things seriously? (Both in short- and long-time perspectives).

short term-take some things seriously,like fixing the kitchen sink,so you could remember what to do the next time the sink is broken

long term-with bigger responsibilities in the future you have to take things serious,like paying the bills,but you got to make some room for fun or some kind of enjoyment.

Its kinda like a balance IMO:
SERIOUSfun---not ok
seriousFUN-----not ok
SERIOUSFUN-------ok
seriousfun----------ok

In my view people take things seriously for a better result out of something or someone.
I wouldn't do it too much on someone,THAT can really cause conflicts.
Although I think people take things seriously on something they don't understand or want to understand.
I remember a quote thats something like this

People fear what they don't understand.

To me misunderstandings,& maybe ignorance as well,are some of the reasons for the evil in this world.It makes me wonder if theses evil actions came from evil intentions or something else.

Well, I didn't really mean "taking things seriously" in the sense that people take fixing the kitchen sink or paying bills seriously, That's something that people have to do if they decide in a advance that they want things like running water in the kitchen or whatever it is the get billed for.
So, it's not so much a matter of having a serious opinion about it. It's more a matter of selfish will, which also causes unfortunate events like white collar crimes, however serious opinions and beliefs not based on logic or reason tend to cause more destruction when masses of people try to "convince" non-believers or just act upon those opinions in a way which violets the laws of the community.

And why is seriousFUN not ok? It sounds great! Never have a non-physical care and have as much fun as possible. Isn't that the point of a lot of these beliefs?

By "people taking things seriously" I referred to when people form opinions (or agree with existing ones) that:

A. Address issues they don't know about
B. Address issues that don't affect them in person
(And the intention behind don't matter really mater as much as the nature of the opinion.)

And then act upon those opinions. This, more often than not, leads to useless results and damage to property and people.

Should we works towards eliminating the ability to have serious opinions by potentially harmful people?
Will it be like doing a small evil for a greater good?

[edit on 25-2-2007 by HAL the bot]

Originally posted by HAL the bot
Is The Reason For All The Evil In The World Just People Taking Things Too Seriously?

No, it's boredom.

Originally posted by Astyanax
No, it's boredom.

Ok, If you think of the mind as a vessel, boredom is when the vessel is empty.
A person in this state can't cause much harm (just as he can't cause much good).

It's only when the vessel is filled with poison that the person becomes dangerous.

Good point, except for the fact that boredom is an inseparable part of life just as anything "filling the vessel" is part of life.

There can be no full without empty, and you wouldn't want never being filled by something (good, desirably), would you?

Serious opinions, however, are a conscious choice, which can be avoided, and if that is in fact "the poison" than shouldn't it be addressed? Somehow?

this is a serious proposition

i just need to know one thing, HAL. how would you define EVIL in the world?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
i just need to know one thing, HAL. how would you define EVIL in the world?

"Causing ruin, injury, or pain; harmful"

If something is important enough to some people, they'll kill for it.

Maybe we're all like that. A mother may kill to protect her children. A starving shipwreck survivor may kill his fellow-survivor for food, as in the Conrad story Falk. It's like every man having his price; everybody has something they'll kill for, or some set of circumstances that will cause them to commit murder.

At bottom this is a question of values. Is human life (another's, not your own) the thing you value the most, is there something you value more?

If there's something you value more (take more seriously) than life, then you'll kill for it.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with this, by the way. The problem lies with what things people value, and where they place them on their personal scale of values.

Killing in the name of a god or a political philosophy or a principle is bloody stupid. I think this is what you mean by 'taking things too seriously'.

Killing to keep oneself alive, or out of trouble, or even simply for loot is understandable and makes perfect sense.

That is, as long as you don't value human life very much.

Needless to say, I do.

If the leaders of different countrys, religions or whatever want to go to war with each other - I think they should be made to fight it out themselves in a public arena with no outside interference and no weapons. Just person to person.

i bet they wouldn't be so keen then. I mean can you imagine any politician risking themselves any harm (except maybe John Prescott)

Somethings NEED to be taken seriously, and unforunately through other peoples 'issues' result in death
IE WW2.

But, I thought.. .after the war to end all wars, and the rise of technologuy, foreign trade and alliances the killing would of stopped by now.

in the 90's we had a relative calm where people genuinly focused on prosperity and cultural gains... it wasnt until the 2000's ++ that we delved into another dark period of man....

doesnt matter who started it, it takes 1 man to pull back from the brink and request dialouge, to restart peace.

on both sides, it seems these men are shot, or kept from being involved.

Originally posted by HAL the bot
Look at every world crisis and war and conflict going on in the world right now or that have ever taken place, and ask yourself, if it weren't have been prevented if the people involved had only taken things a little less seriously?

Or a lot more, just enough for them to stop hurting each other in a manner that induces harmful reactions from the other side. I mean, If people don't care about provocation and focus just on doing what they want to do the world WILL be a better place, right?
That is ,if all the uneducated and the mentally twisted or aggressively proned do it. All of them.
The intellectuals and\or people who already conform with the "not taking things seriously" mandate could be allowed to remain as they are because they're not doing all the trouble anyway.

If people don't do it by themselvs, should it be forced upon them, like a massive brain washing and\or physical modifications?

If they do that (And maybe ban religion too)
Will wars end?

If it's done than potentially no one would ever get annoyed by anything or anyone ever again.
Look at that scenario and think
What should people take seriously, if anything? What should they allow themselves to be offended by, if anything? To what degree can personal morality be allowed to influence our reactions and actions toward to others?

Are there any up-sides for allowing masses of uneducated people to take things seriously? (Both in short- and long-time perspectives).

The main reason for all evil in the world is people are becoming tired with the way our world has become and its like a boiling kettle eventually it has to blow. Our younger generation has nothing good to look forward to and my generation (30 now) doesn't have much to look forward to either.

Take a look around the world tell me one thing about this planet I should be proud of???

War, Destroying The planet, Corporate nations not helping the poor countries and making sure they stay poor, the constant threat of being attacked by terrorists, government conspiracies, the divorce rate in north america, having me and my wife work 10-12 hours a day only to break even every month.

I could go on and on forever but I'm sure you get the point. This is the reason why the evil is coming out in full force because humans are sick and tired of what humanity has become. AND its much easier to do the wrong thing because being an honest citizen takes a lot of work, trust me. To boot the middle class (myself) is paying the wages of the poor and filling the pockets of the rich.

I'm surprised it took this long for the world to get like this.

[edit on 1-3-2007 by leafer]

[edit on 1-3-2007 by leafer]

Originally posted by leafer
Our younger generation has nothing good to look forward to and my generation (30 now) doesn't have much to look forward to either.

Could you explain what previous generations had to look forward to that the present generation does not? I'd be very interested in your reply to this, since I, for one, can't think of anything good they had that we don't have.

What would you like to have to look forward to?

Take a look around the world tell me one thing about this planet I should be proud of???

Here are a few things I'm proud of:

1. The continually improving lives of the majority of the world's population as measured by generally agreed quality-of-life indicators. The people of the world live longer and healthier lives nowadays, with ever better access to education, health care and public utilities.

2. Fewer and fewer people living in absolute poverty every year.

3. The rate of human population increase continues to decline.

4. So does the number of people are dying in international wars and civil conflicts, decade by decade.

5. The Cold War is over. The bad guys lost.

6. Racism, prejudice and hatemongering no longer get a free ride. Folk who peddle such stock are increasingly marginalized and reviled.

7. The world is richer than ever before and that, in spite of increasing inequality, the rich and the poor are both getting richer.

8. Everybody in the world is safer, and no-one in the world really needs to be isolated any more, thanks to communications technology.

9. The world's problems, from climate change to AIDS epidemics to financing the retirement of aging rich-world workers, are increasingly well recognized and identified and genuine efforts are being made, by a variety of interested parties, to solve them.

10. Increasing numbers of people live under democratic governments and the rule of law, and that their lives are increasingly secure.

Some of these facts may be news to you. Nevertheless, they are facts. You'll find the evidence in the annual reports by the United Nations, UNICEF, the World Bank and other international bodies, the more respectable of the world's charities and magazines such as The Economist. People who rely on the mass media for their information are rarely aware of these things, because the media prefers to play up the negative side of things -- good news is boring.

I could go on and on forever but I'm sure you get the point.

I do, but cheer up: you're wrong. The world looks bad to you because that's your way of looking at things. Other people are more sanguine. I, for one, while fully aware of all the suffering, violence, injustice, exploitation and despair that bedevil mankind, nevertheless see the world as beautiful, fascinating and, in its own way, perfect. But it took me a long time, lots of thought and a great deal of experience to get like this and I don't expect others to achieve the same thing very easily. Good luck.

Could you explain what previous generations had to look forward to that the present generation does not?

Well, whatever they wanted I guess.
I mean religious people looked forward to going to heaven, but now they constantly told through the media and other institutions that create public-opinion that they're all dumb fanatics for believing that, and that they're beliefs are worthless. They take they're beliefs very seriously, so they get all pissed off because of it and go out and do damage because of this offense, which they perceive as personal for some reason. That's just one example of the situation today in the world where ironically because people have better lives they take very meaningless things seriously and go out and do damage to society.

The situation of the world right now is in fact really better for many then what it was in the past, but because less people have to worry about surviving or resisting they're oppressor (a dictator or colonial country), they have more time to take opinions voiced in the media (which has become far more pervasive than it used to be) seriously and be offended by them to such a degree that they feel the very fabric of they're lives in danger.

That needs to be solved somehow before a critical mass of such people forms and becomes a movement, because those things tend to drive themselves to cause more damage than any of they're members really wants to cause.

Of course, thats far from being the whole story but that's what I can think up with at the moment.




[edit on 2-3-2007 by HAL the bot]

People taking NEEDS too seriously is the reason for evil.

We all feel the needs, but when you take them too seriously, it becomes greed.

It seems that you are answering your own question.

Originally posted by HAL the bot
Religious people looked forward to going to heaven, but now they're constantly told through the media and other institutions that create public opinion that they're all dumb fanatics...

This suggests that you see manipulation of public opinion through the media as part of the problem.

Ironically because people have better lives they take very meaningless things seriously and go out and do damage to society.

And this suggests that the rest of the explanation is that 'the Devil finds work for idle hands'.

In fact, you make it explicit here:

The less people have to worry about surviving or resisting, they have more time to take opinions voiced in the media (which has become far more pervasive than it used to be) seriously and be offended by them to such a degree that they feel the very fabric of they're lives in danger.

Personally, I believe the deeper reason why there is so much 'evil' in the world has to do with human drives that are part of our instinctive nature and are not very easily repressed or even managed. These are what lie at the root of the causes you suggest. But dealing with them is not as simple as suppressing free speech.

That needs to be solved somehow before a critical mass of such people forms... to cause more damage.

I'm not at all sure that this is a problem that needs to be solved, even if it can. One way to solve it might be to control the media so that it doesn't spread dangerous messages. The trouble is, you attack the basic human right to free speech when you go down that road.

Instead, we might try to persuade the media to behave more responsibly. This is already done to a great extent: every country in the world has regulatory bodies and standards that determine what the media can and cannot say. But in a democracy you can only regulate the media so much; and besides, would you want to? Over-regulation doesn't just destroy the creativity and relevance of a free media, it also makes it easier for governments and special interests to control what is broadcast or published.

Of course, we could make people a bit busier, or less comfortable, so as to give them something real to worry about. Again, this is already done. Capitalist societies keep their citizens busy by making them work for a living and encouraging them to compete to earn more money and acquire symbols of status. This has reached a point in some countries (like America) where it cannot reasonably go any further: many people already regard themselves as desperately overworked and stressed out. Even so, there is still any number of Americans with spare time to get serious about irrelevant issues and create all sorts of social ructions.

But think again: would you really want things any different? Those people troubling the even tenor of society are the agents of social change, of growth and development and improvement. It is precisely people's dissatisfaction with the way things are that drives progress. Of course it causes inequalities and conflicts along the way, but that's nothing new to mankind -- nothing we can't handle.

***

Not convinced? Perhaps you feel that change can still be achieved harmoniously, if only people wouldn't get so murderously worked up over things like politics and religion.

In that case, perhaps the best thing to do would be to give them other things to get worked up about instead.

Let's dream up some conspiracies to keep them occupied. What about a few scare-stories about scaly aliens taking over the government of the world while rings of international financiers manipulate its economy to their profit through the US Federal Reserve and other central banks, keeping the people forever enslaved in debt? We can tell them the dastards will stick at nothing to achieve their beastly ends: they hire Islamic fanatics to fly passenger jets into skyscrapers artfully pre-loaded with explosives, keep the population across swathes of the American Midwest drugged and biddable with 'chemtrails', control the weather and play with our DNA. These aliens are coming and going all the time, and sometimes they kidnap people for use as guinea-pigs in vile experiments...

What do you think? Could we sell them a bill of goods like that?

Nah, no chance. Too far-fetched.

[edit on 5-3-2007 by Astyanax]

Originally posted by Astyanax

What would you like to have to look forward to?

1) In todays world its all about cutbacks and working people (IN North America that is) until they are bled to the bone and cutbacks and layoffs. No respect from companies anymore
2)Both parents now have to work just to keep their nose above water.
3)The lack of respect the younger generation has towards their elders.
4)The TV is now our main focus of society and our children's babysitter
5) People didn't have to change careers as many times as they do today.

I could keep going on but the list would be endless.

Originally posted by leafer

Originally posted by Astyanax
What would you like to have to look forward to?

1) In todays world its all about cutbacks and working people (IN North America that is) until they are bled to the bone and cutbacks and layoffs. No respect from companies anymore
2)Both parents now have to work just to keep their nose above water.
3)The lack of respect the younger generation has towards their elders.
4)The TV is now our main focus of society and our children's babysitter
5) People didn't have to change careers as many times as they do today.

You haven't really answered my question, have you? Perhaps you mean:

1. A job for life without layoffs or cutbacks.
2. The immediate retirement of either your wife or yourself, without financial loss to our household.
3. More respect from people younger than yourself.
4. A world in which people (and especially your babysitter) watch less TV.

Well, I guess that also answers another of my questions: what people long ago had to look forward to that we don't have today. You're right -- for some -- actually, a favoured few -- the answers to that were:

1. A job for life with little prospect of being laid off (though pay and benefit cuts were quite common).
2. Wifey waiting at the door every evening to greet hubby as he comes home from work, with dinner in the oven and frilly panties under her apron.
3. Respectful treatment from young people who knew their manners and did not speak unless spoken to.
4. Evening after evening after evening with no TV at all.

It sounds like hell to me: the stifling, convention-bound, hypocritical, sexist, child-oppressing, undermediated, underinformed hell of pre-Sixties middle-class society in industrialized countries. We have come a long way in terms of social evolution since then; would you then put the clock back, give up all the progress we have made, just so you can enjoy the (completely illusory) security and certainties of life as a wage-slave for the military-industrial complex? Is that your idea of a better life?

I urge you to broaden your perspective. Learn a bit more about the world that surrounds you and how it really functions. Learn to accept it as it is, instead of constantly pining for an unattainable yesterday. Find a way to fit in and profit from the way things are. Your current attitude is deeply unhelpful to you; adopt one that will help you get more out of life. Make an investment in personal growth and suddenly the world will begin to seem a much nicer place.

As long as you keep thinking of yourself as a loser, you'll be one.

Originally posted by Astyanax

As long as you keep thinking of yourself as a loser, you'll be one.

Thanks for that post and no I don't think nor feel that I am a loser LOL. Anyways trying leaving the U.S once and a while and you'll see in countries in Europe especially (Italy, France, to name a few since I've actually lived in both places, 1 year in each) that they are light years ahead of us without working us to the bone. Work weeks are shorter MUCH more vacation time, WOMEN get 2 YEARS maternity leave not the crappy 6-8 months your used to, 4 hours at lunch time off to spend EACH DAY with your family to eat,etc, AN EXTRA CHECK at christmas time each year which translated from italian means the 13th check.

In many countries in Europe its a family first attitude and companies don't expect you to sacrifice family for your job because they understand that a happier person is a more productive person. The west has trouble understanding that concept.

THE divorce rate in Italy is 12% and in the U.S its 35-40%. WHY do you think that is? Maybe more time throughout the day to actually spend with your other, WOW what a novel idea. Also to address your point about THE WOMAN staying home why can't the man stay home why can't he cook dinner etc. It's funny how you automatically assumed I was talking about women. Also why can't both man and woman work Part-time hours and still be able to provide for their families. OH ITS NOT POSSIBLE LOL. PLEASE thats what "they " want you to think.

Try living (not vacationing) in another country instead of hearing on CNN that your the best country. You wouldn't believe your eyes on how real countries are progressing and moving forward THE WAY we should be as a society. Take a look in your own backyard and see how many ghettos you have in the U.S it's pitiful. Each state pretty much has a ghetto which even north of you is non existent and if you ask most people they just shrug it off like that's the way things are LOL. You don't even even have a health care plan for god's sake, lol.

The problem is the U.S is making sure their countries system is being implemented into every country like Iraq when even their way of living isn't that great. You mentioned the cold war is over well is the U.S not to blame in being part of it's cause??



Here is a nice article from the U.S about your poverty rates:

www.msnbc.msn.com...

Poverty rate at 12.7 percent, 4th straight rise

Overall, there were 37 million people living in poverty, up 1.1 million people from 2003.

Great job Real progressive.

Here is a nice little list of THE REAL PROBLEM WITH THIS WORLD:

The U.S bombing list:
Korea and China 1950-53 (Korean War)
Guatemala 1954
Indonesia 1958
Cuba 1959-1961
Guatemala 1960
Congo 1964
Laos 1964-73
Vietnam 1961-73
Cambodia 1969-70
Guatemala 1967-69
Grenada 1983
Lebanon 1983, 1984 (both Lebanese and Syrian targets)
Libya 1986
El Salvador 1980s
Nicaragua 1980s
Iran 1987
Panama 1989
Iraq 1991 (Persian Gulf War)
Kuwait 1991
Somalia 1993
Bosnia 1994, 1995
Sudan 1998
Afghanistan 1998
Yugoslavia 1999
Yemen 2002
Iraq 1991-2003 (US/UK on regular basis)
Iraq 2003-05
Afghanistan 2001-05

AND OH LOOK can it be possible that iran is next? LOL. Let me guess it's because other countries are jealous of your lifestyle and democracy right?? How come other countries who are democratic aren't being bombed and bombing countries themselves???



[edit on 7-3-2007 by leafer]

[edit on 7-3-2007 by leafer]

Originally posted by leafer
Anyways try leaving the U.S once and a while and you'll see...

Try living (not vacationing) in another country instead of hearing on CNN that your the best country...

I'm not American. I am a citizen of a small, poor Asian country. I have never been to the United States of America in my life. I was educated in my own country and in the United Kingdom, which is a country in Europe. I lived in the UK for many years as a child and young man. I have not lived on the European continent per se but I work together with Europeans nearly all the time, particularly Germans and French. I am fully aware of the different kinds of society that exist in different European countries, and the type of social provision enjoyed by the citizens of those countries.

People like myself -- internationally educated, internationally mobile professionals originating from poor countries -- form probably the most cosmopolitan group on the planet. We well informed on world affairs and particularly on the affairs of countries in the rich world and Asia. We know all about social safety nets in Western Europe and the lack of them in the United States.

We also, from our perspective of relative disadvantage and the need to work twice as hard as any North American or European to achieve half the remuneration or career advancement, have little patience with complaints from the coddled bourgeoisie of the West.

Originally posted by Astyanax

Originally posted by leafer
Anyways try leaving the U.S once and a while and you'll see...

Try living (not vacationing) in another country instead of hearing on CNN that your the best country...

I'm not American. I am a citizen of a small, poor Asian country. I have never been to the United States of America in my life. I was educated in my own country and in the United Kingdom, which is a country in Europe. I lived in the UK for many years as a child and young man. I have not lived on the European continent per se but I work together with Europeans nearly all the time, particularly Germans and French. I am fully aware of the different kinds of society that exist in different European countries, and the type of social provision enjoyed by the citizens of those countries.

People like myself -- internationally educated, internationally mobile professionals originating from poor countries -- form probably the most cosmopolitan group on the planet. We well informed on world affairs and particularly on the affairs of countries in the rich world and Asia. We know all about social safety nets in Western Europe and the lack of them in the United States.

We also, from our perspective of relative disadvantage and the need to work twice as hard as any North American or European to achieve half the remuneration or career advancement, have little patience with complaints from the coddled bourgeoisie of the West.

Well my earlier post eluded to (IN NORTH AMERICA) so why answer the question if your not north american??

Originally posted by Astyanax
We also, from our perspective of relative disadvantage and the need to work twice as hard as any North American or European to achieve half the remuneration or career advancement, have little patience with complaints from the coddled bourgeoisie of the West.

And your proud of the fact that you need to work twice as hard?? LOL. Of course your using of the word coddled obviously means you have a chip on your shoulder. Thats okay though its understandable. It's funny though how you PROUD of the fact our world is like that in your earlier posts that we even have poor/slavery type classes in the world.

People like myself -- internationally educated, internationally mobile professionals originating from poor countries -- form probably the most cosmopolitan group on the planet.

Stop making comments like these when you know very little about where I've been and where I have received my education.

Also a little heads up on your praise of the U.K. They have had their hands in just as many world issues as the U.S has. Nothing to be proud of at all.

[edit on 7-3-2007 by leafer]