Real Talk about White Privilege

Originally posted by Deus_Brandon

I am sorry that you don't knwo what to think about this cat. And I am sorry that since I was not even born untill 1983 that I don't know and PRIMARILY don't give a FLYIN _ _ _ _ about anything that that went on before I was borned into this world.

You are one ignorant little puppy deus and what is really sad is that you are proud of it.

Grover, I think what deus brandon is saying is that we understand the there WAS white privilege but not now we have not had any white privileges or at least I know I haven't.

AND what I am saying is that wealthy or not whites still are the ruling class in this country and as such are privileged.

Originally posted by grover
AND what I am saying is that wealthy or not whites still are the ruling class in this country and as such are privileged.

HOW? how are we so privileged?explain oh the same lady looked at you wrong at that store to?

[Originally posted by truthceeca
Enough about my RL experience, which y'all have PLENTY to say about. I'd like to see if y'all have as much to say about this. This is a previous post, but don't worry, I'll be back with more examples such as this.

Waa waa waa! Stop cryin' will ya? It makes me sick. What does your daddy think of you? He must be very disappointed. Poor poor truthceeca, up against White Privilege. He can't even get a sandwich at the deli without the woman in front of him being a racist tart.

Grow up and stop your whining. Be a man and take control of your life, for chrissakes.

Originally posted by grover
AND what I am saying is that wealthy or not whites still are the ruling class in this country and as such are privileged.

Yeah? And? So what? What's your point?

Speaking of "white privilege" why was the Duke "rape" constantly on the news but I'll bet no one has heard about Christopher Newsom and Channon Christian. Carjacked,Christopher Newsom was raped, had his his penis cut off, set on fire,then shot. Channon Christian, was beaten and gang-raped in many ways for four days.Then her breasts were cut off and drain cleaner poured down her throat,and then murdered. Five suspects, Lemaricus Davidson, 25, faces a total of 46 charges. Davidson was indicted on 16 counts of Felony Murder growing out of rape, robbery kidnapping and theft of Channon Christian and Chris Newsom, 2 counts premeditated murder of Christian and Newsom, 2 counts especially aggravated robberies from Christian and Newsom, 4 counts especially aggravated kidnapping of Christian and Newsom, 20 counts aggravated rape of Christian and Newsom, and 2 counts of theft from Christian and Newsom.

Letalvis Cobbins, 24, faces a total of 46 charges. Cobbins was indicted on 16 counts of Felony Murder growing out of rape, robbery kidnapping and theft of Channon Christian and Chris Newsom, 2 counts premeditated murder of Christian and Newsom, 2 counts especially aggravated robberies from Christian and Newsom, 4 counts especially aggravated kidnapping of Christian and Newsom, 20 counts aggravated rape of Christian and Newsom, and 2 counts of theft from Christian and Newsom.

George Thomas, 24, faces a total of 46 charges. Thomas was indicted on 16 counts of Felony Murder growing out of rape, robbery kidnapping and theft of Channon Christian and Chris Newsom, 2 counts premeditated murder of Christian and Newsom, 2 counts especially aggravated robberies from Christian and Newsom, 4 counts especially aggravated kidnapping of Christian and Newsom, 20 counts aggravated rape of Christian and Newsom, and 2 counts of theft from Christian and Newsom.

Just last night, police in Lebanon, Kentucky, arrested 18-year-old Vanessa Coleman. She faces 40 Tennessee state charges. Coleman was indicted on 12 counts Felony Murder growing out of rape, robbery kidnapping and theft of Channon Christian and Chris Newsom, 1 count Premeditated Murder of Christian only, 1 count Especially Aggravated Robbery of Newsom only, 4 counts especially aggravated kidnapping of Christian and Newsom, 20 counts of aggravated rape of Christian and Newsom and 2 Counts of theft from Christian and Newsom.

Eric Boyd, 24, also arrested in connection with the fatal carjacking, only faces federal charges as an accessory after the fact. He was not indicted by Knox county grand jury. The double standard is unbelievable. You will have to dig deep on this one the MSM has buried it.

Why now that its been proven that the girl lied, that no one wants to cover the "Duke rape trial".

The sick he did all those things will die painfully in prison, or in the chair or whatever they have in Kentucky. There's no privilage in that. PS That kind of stuff rarely makes the news. Sure you find cases of this and that dealing with rape and murder, but there are so many that they can't all be covered. Personally I usually change the channel when something like that comes up because it just too sickening to amagine what one human can do to another.

I've experienced these things ENOUGH times from members of a certain demographic to know what she was thinking. I wouldn't expect you to understand, though...

Truth as you have admitted to KNOWING what she was thinking, the whole discussion from this point on is moot. Please enlighten us all as you are the one with the super human mind reading abilities. You are right I do not understand as I do not posess the power of reading minds as you do.

Truth for the third time I will ask you why you care so much about what other people think of you; especially people you don't even know.

[edit on 7/3/2007 by shooterbrody]

Originally posted by truthseeka
I've experienced these things ENOUGH times from members of a certain demographic to know what she was thinking.

Are you saying that people from any particular demographic think alike?

Because if that's what you're saying, then people who have repeated experiences with black men (or any other demographic) can accurately tell what you're thinking and judge your behavior based on their experiences with other black men, right?

Do you realize how that sounds?

So if a woman has been raped twice in her life and both times the man was black, would you say that she has experienced that ENOUGH times from members of that "certain demographic" to know what black men are thinking when they look at her?

Yep. I expected as much.

To keep hearing babbling about my RL experience, yet not a THING about the laws I cited. I already know why that is; no one can (with a straight face, anyway) argue that the Naturalization Act of 1790 or the Dred Scott decision, for example, are NOT examples of how white privilege has shaped the US.

Ah, well. Keep jabbering about my story. As you do I present Dr. Jensen's follow-up to the 1st article of his I cited.

More Thoughts On...White Privilege

Here, he provides some examples of feedback he got for the initial essay.

But probably the most important response I got was from non-white folks, predominantly African-Americans, who said something like this: "Of course there is white privilege. I've been pointing it out to my white friends and co-workers for years. Isn't funny that almost no one listens to me, but everyone takes notice when a white guy says it."

One HUNDRED! I believe I said something like this a few pages back. Maybe this will give the detractors of that comment (that the people who can't see white privilege are primarily white) a bit of evidence.

One thing he does, which I thought was quite interesting, is this:

Right now, I want to use that privilege to acknowledge the many non-white people who took the time to tell me about the enduring realities of racism in the United States. And, I want to talk to the white people who I think misread my essay and misunderstand what's at stake.

He's referring to the non-whites who spoke about being ignored when they spoke of WP. He realizes that what they said is true; white people are FAR more likely to listen to him speak of WP than to a non-white person.

The interesting thing is his decision to use his voice, amplified by WP, to speak on behalf of the non-whites who often are not heard.

He breaks down the responses from whites into 4 groups. I'll cite the 2 that are most relevant to this thread first, as these are the ones I have seen here.

1. White privilege doesn't exist because affirmative action has made being white a disadvantage. The simple response: Extremely limited attempts to combat racism, such as affirmative action, do virtually nothing to erase the white privilege built over 500 years that pervades our society. As a friend of mine says, the only real disadvantage to being white is that it so often prevents people from understanding racial issues.

Well said, Dr. Jensen. This ridiculous argument was posed a number of times in this thread. How a few decades of AA equate to 500 years of WP is FAR beyond me... His friend's comment also speaks volumes.

3. White privilege exists, and that's generally been a good thing because white Europeans have civilized the world. Along the way some bad things may have happened, and we should take care to be nice to non-whites to make up for that. Response: These folks often argued the curiously contradictory position that (1) non-whites and their cultures are not inferior, but (2) white/European culture is superior. As for the civilizing effect of Europe, we might consider five centuries of inhuman, brutal colonialism and World Wars I and II, and then ask what "civilized" means.

Well said, Dr. Jensen. Now, I'll post the other 2 groups, one of which, IMO, is thought about, but not put to words in this thread.

2. White privilege exists, but it can't be changed because it is natural for any group to favor its own, and besides, the worst manifestations of racism are over. Response: This approach makes human choices appear outside of human control, which is a dodge to avoid moral and political responsibility for the injustice we continue to live with.

4. White privilege exists because whites are inherently superior, and I am a weakling and a traitor for suggesting otherwise. Response: The Klan isn't dead.

He then comments on the common thread within the responses; that he is guilty. He has this to say about feeling guilty:

And I don't feel guilty. Guilt is appropriate when one has wronged another, when one has something to feel guilty about. In my life I have felt guilty for racist or sexist things I have said or done, even when they were done unconsciously. But that is guilt I felt because of specific acts, not for the color of my skin.

So, I cannot, and indeed should not, feel either guilty or proud about being white, because it is a state of being I have no control over. However, as a member of a society--and especially as a privileged member of society--I have an obligation not simply to enjoy that privilege that comes with being white but to study and understand it, and work toward a more just world in which such unearned privilege is eliminated.

He's knockin em out of the park now. Here's the last excerpt from the article:

What matters is what we decide to do with the privilege. For me, that means speaking, knowing that I speak with a certain unearned privilege that gives me advantages I cannot justify. It also means learning to listen before I speak, and realizing that I am probably not as smart as I sometimes like to think I am.

It means listening when an elderly black man who sees the original article tacked up on the bulletin board outside my office while on a campus tour stops to chat. This man, who has lived with more kinds of racism than I can imagine through more decades than I have been alive, says to me, "White privilege, yes, good to keep an eye on that, son. Keep yourself honest. But don't forget to pay attention to the folks who live without the privilege."

This is quite interesting to me. Dr. Jensen chooses to use his WP to try to combat WP. In a way, I guess it's like Dante from Devil May Cry 3 using his demon powers to fight demons. And before we get babbling about this last sentence, I'm NOT saying white people are demons; I'm referencing this game because I've been playing it alot recently, and it's a good analogy here.

I'm SURE we'll have more yakking about this analogy, though...:shk:

Originally posted by truthseeka
Yep. I expected as much.

To keep hearing babbling about my RL experience, yet not a THING about the laws I cited. I already know why that is; no one can (with a straight face, anyway) argue that the Naturalization Act of 1790 or the Dred Scott decision, for example, are NOT examples of how white privilege has shaped the US.

Well, when you continue to contradict yourself, how can we not point it out? You ridicule one race for a behaviour you, by your own admission, participate in. We literally have to go out of our own way to ignore the discrepancies in your posts.

You bash BH for this "babbling" of your RL activities and criticize for not acknowledging other aspects of your posts. Yet you do the exact same thing when you ignore everything that she has said. I see a valid point and I was looking for a rebuttal on it. I can not help but notice that you completely ducked what she had to say.

Do these rules not apply to you?


[edit on 7-3-2007 by chissler]

Why not post another example of white privilege?

scholar.google.com...:7df8A28IY4MJ:www.povertyactionlab.org/research/papers/bertrand_mullainathan. pdf+

Here's the abstract:

We perform a field experiment to measure racial discrimination in the labor market. We respond with fictitious resumes to help-wanted ads in Boston and Chicago newspapers. To manipulate perception of race, each resume is randomly assigned either a very African American sounding name or a very White sounding name. The results show significant discrimination against African-American names: White names receive 50 percent more callbacks for interviews. We also find that race affects the benefits of a
better resume. For White names, a higher quality resume elicits 30 percent more callbacks whereas for African Americans, it elicits a far smaller increase. Applicants living in better neighborhoods receive more callbacks but, interestingly, this effect does not differ by race. The amount of discrimination is uniform across occupations and industries. Federal contractors and employers who list “Equal Opportunity Employer” in their ad discriminate as much as other employers. We find little evidence that our results are driven by employers inferring something other than race, such as social class, from the names. These results suggest that racial discrimination is still a prominent feature of the labor market.

Note that this study was conducted in 2003, the same year that the other study I mentioned a few pages back was conducted. White privilege is quite obviously shown here. Names such as Brad and Kristen received MUCH higher call back rates than names such as Rasheed and Aisha.

But, I'm sure THIS is not more evidence of WP...NOT!

Well, I am sorry to say this, but I would hire a john smith before I hired a taniqua laqifah shaniqua jackson( MAD TV) simply for the fact because, well Im trying not to be cruel about this, they are less likely to be ignorant people produced by afirmative action and lax negro colleges.

Sorry, I didnt mean to sound harsh, but its reality. I dont take anyone who had 2 first names or multiple names combined into one seriously. example: tyshawn, etc.





[edit on 7-3-2007 by XphilesPhan]

Originally posted by XphilesPhan
Well, I am sorry to say this, but I would hire a john smith before I hired a taniqua laqifah shaniqua jackson(

MAD TV) simply for the fact because, well Im trying not to be cruel about this, they are less likely to be ignorant people produced by afirmative action and lax negro colleges.

Sorry, I didnt mean to sound harsh, but its reality. I dont take anyone who had 2 first names or multiple names combined into one seriously. example: tyshawn, etc. [edit on 7-3-2007 by XphilesPhan]

Sure you're sorry to say it.

THANKS for proving my point, though. A person with a white name has the privilege of not being thought of as...I just GOTTA put your words here, "ignorant people produced by afirmative action and lax negro colleges."

Wow.:shk: You have NO idea how profound your post is.

Originally posted by grover

Originally posted by Deus_Brandon

I am sorry that you don't knwo what to think about this cat. And I am sorry that since I was not even born untill 1983 that I don't know and PRIMARILY don't give a FLYIN _ _ _ _ about anything that that went on before I was borned into this world.

You are one ignorant little puppy deus and what is really sad is that you are proud of it.

Grover...I know it's tempting, but try not to waste your time on this guy. His ignorance IS sad, seeing as he and I are the same age. You know, we were "borned" in the same year.

Anyway, let me ask you something, seeing that you're old school. Why do you think most of the white posters on this thread have a hard time dealing with white privilege? Hell, you lived in the south during the last days of Jim Crow/segregation, so I KNOW you're familiar with white privilege. Do you think it's the age gap for some here? As for those your age, is it not growing up in the south?

What do you think?

I can't speak for the older members here, nor for the younger ones either but I can speak about what I have observed.

I just spent 3 years studying graphic arts at a local community college as a second career and I saw a lot, and I do mean a lot of self absorbed children there just like deus for whom, if something didn't immediately affect them, then it wasn't real and if something did affect them, especially adversely, generally they reacted with indignant outrage. If they weren't interested in a subject they could talk while the teacher tried to teach around them or if THEY weren't (or their art) subject of conservation, then they were bored and barely tolerated it until the subject of conservation turned to them. Half the time I felt like they should have all been given through spankings and sent to their rooms, but to be fair there were a lot of good kids too but per usual, the brats stuck out.

I am speaking not about white privilege per say but in general. I was in a class with one specific kid though, who should have known better, he had been around, in the Marines etc but he was completely blind to the fact of how well he had it made, and since he was struggling, it was all someone else's fault, affirmative action, grade preference for minority students etc. when in reality the only thing holding him back was he was simply a dumb f, and not smart enough to know it. I know, I tutored him in English and later psychology and he had a hard time comprehending basic principles much less any thing complicated. AND since he disliked studying he blamed racial preference on the fact that the little Hindi girl who could barely speak English was getting A's and he was getting D's at best. She studied hard, he didn't.

Generally speaking I think that some men (white and also black) see minority's coming over her and busting their asses to get ahead, and blame it on preferences. Sometimes its true and sometimes it isn't. Each case is different. We have become soft and expect a lot more than our parents did, and when we see someone achieving, blame some other factor than hard work for helping them get ahead and fail to accept that often it is just plain stupidity (or bad credit or none or any other factor) holding us back.

I have lived in a black household and I have seen discrimination first hand and I grew up white in the south and remember jim crow... somethings have changed and some haven't. I do know this though, if you and I walk into an upscale shop, dressed identically, I will be waited on first. I would put money down on it and win because I have seen it time and again. You, a black man might be totally above board, and I might be a shoplifter, but the guards will follow you around while I make off with the store. THAT is white privilege.



[edit on 7-3-2007 by grover]

[edit on 7-3-2007 by grover]

You must be special EDUCATION .. To think that White's are the ruling class in this country ... As you are way wrong ... As OPRAH is the leading DONATOR to the WORLD and she is a BLACK FEMALE if you haven't noticed ... What about Michael Jordan ... He is followed everywhere ... What about Obama running for president ... You are TRULY oblivious to the world around you ... WAKE THE _ _ _ _ UP !!!!

Originally posted by grover
AND what I am saying is that wealthy or not whites still are the ruling class in this country and as such are privileged.

Originally posted by truthseeka
Sure you're sorry to say it.

THANKS for proving my point, though. A person with a white name has the privilege of not being thought of as...I just GOTTA put your words here, "ignorant people produced by afirmative action and lax negro colleges."

Wow.:shk: You have NO idea how profound your post is.

Well, I shouldnt of put it that way. But you are right. Employers will probably set such a resume to the side.

It is a really #ty deal though. I mean, sometime you dont feel like you have a home here in the USA and you cant really go back to africa either. I have seen the way they treat black americans over there, its like they blame them for their ancestors being captured and brought over here. Or maybe they are envious, hell I dont know. But I think that blacks use names like this to try to preserve some shred of their culture.

OK OK ... WOOOOHOOOOOOOOO NOW WE ARE GETTING SOME WHERE ... Yes White people helped shape america into what it is TODAY ... But NO ... There are not any White Priviledges ... Built into the system although we should have done that ... And if ever there is a time machine I will go back and take care of that ... MYSELF !!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHHA