Atheist: see Psalm 14:1

Psalm 14:1

The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.

it's been a while since i've read a bible all the way through, and when i do read it these days i tend to skip over the psalms

so, when speakeroftruth brought this specific chapter up in another thread, i was somewhat surprised by it

well, it reminded me of a video i had found on youtube a little while back that i'd like to show you all

Atheist

and i'd just like to point out that i belive that Psalm 14:1 is ludicrous, bigoted, and ignorant
would anyone like to convince me otherwise?

[edit on 2/18/07 by madnessinmysoul]

Why should I care what you believe? Better yet, why should you care what I believe? I notice that you, an atheist, seems to hang around theological discussions on ATS/BTS quite a bit. Why is that? are you so insecure in your beliefs that you feel the need to belittle others? I dont understand you.

your an atheist, fine. Do you need to announce that every 5 mintues?

Do I believe in God, and his son Jesus Christ, and the holy spirit? Absolutely.

Do I think your evil? No.

Do I think your a fool? No.

Why?

"judge not, lest you be judged."

nuff said.




[edit on 18-2-2007 by XphilesPhan]

Originally posted by XphilesPhan

Do I believe in God, and his son Jesus Christ, and the holy spirit? Absolutely.

Do I think your evil? No.

Do I think your a fool? No.


[edit on 18-2-2007 by XphilesPhan]

B/c you don't follow the scripture (you're not technically "Christian"). It clearly says in some places that ahteists are both fools and evil.

Atheism is just as much of a prosetylizing religion as any other, as evinced by thoughts and threads like this.

I certainly don't pretend to have all the answers nor the monopoly on virtue, as I think most other people of faith would also agree. But I do believe in a higher power, God, and wish to learn more about him however I can.

Atheists, in the strictist terms, have totally excluded the very possibility of any being higher than themselves, a very narcissistic view to my way of thinking. Yet they go even further by degrading anyone that doesn't share their myopic view.

Under the mantle of their so-called science, they find answers for everything that excludes any possibility of a higher power existing. But real science delving into quantum mechanics, string theory, and beyond show that our universe is far more complicated than we could have ever imagined.

The simple answer is we don't know, and I find the people who cling to what they think as pure science as it is currently known (which is always in flux) just as radical as the people who cling to faith.

[edit on 2/18/2007 by djohnsto77]

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
would anyone like to convince me otherwise?

You don't want to be convinced, you've made that clear, yet you still try to goad others into arguments.

Statements like the one above are clearly only intended to pick fights with others. I guess everyone needs a hobby, but being so antagonistic makes you less credible in my eyes.

I think we are entitled to our beliefs and I have defended both Christians and Atheists alike here at ATS. What I won't defend is ignorant bullying from either side.

Originally posted by XphilesPhan
I notice that you, an atheist, seems to hang around theological discussions on ATS/BTS quite a bit. Why is that?

I have been wondering the same XphilesPhan. Thanks for saying it.

Consider this madness: You know how irritating it is when a Christian shoves their beliefs down your throat and insist that you change and think as they do? Well, I am officially putting you in the same category.

I think the best way to eliminate this type of behavior is to stop responding to any thread you create.

Excuse me, if I may say something, umm I'm the child here so just give me a moment to gather my thoughts..... Okay gathered.

What that particular Bible verse states, at least from my immediate understanding is that people who don't believe in god, "atheists", are " bad people that won't benefit any body at all, including themselves. Now, if I may, I'm going to use Mr.Bill Gates as an example:

"The foundation's '( Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation]' grants have provided funds for college scholarships for under-represented minorities, AIDS prevention, diseases prevalent in third world countries, and other causes. In 2000, the Gates Foundation endowed the University of Cambridge with $210 million for the Gates Cambridge Scholarships. The Foundation has also pledged over $7 billion to its various causes, including $1 billion to the United Negro College Fund. According to a 2004 Forbes magazine article, Gates gave away over $29 billion to charities from 2000 onwards. These donations are usually cited as sparking a substantial change in attitudes towards philanthropy among the very rich, with philanthropy becoming the norm.[50]"


Now according to my interpretation of that bible verse, all of what the Gates have done isn't good. [ Not to be confused with being abominal, but it's still the same that they aren't good.] Why? Because he is the 'fool that hath saith in his heart that "there is no god" '. Now, Mahatmas Ghandi, a very great man, and if I'm not mistaken was a Hindu, can and have done good works according to the bible because he did believe in at least a god. He may still be going to hell, because he didn't accept Jesus Christ as his personal savior, but that's beside the point.

So, the question is, is the acts that people like Mr.Gates have commited, not to be considered good, and just bad? Giving away scholarships, working towards Aids prevention, working towards other disease prevention in third world countries, donating over 29 billion dollars to various charities all working towards a good cause.

Also, I think it very necessary to say that just because someone has, in yopur opinion negatively expressed themselves, it still does some good to try to understand what they have presented to you. Believe it or not, just like it's your duty to proselytize, and let me make it very clear to you that it is just that: a duty, if you're going to call yourself a Christsian... they're going to be stubborn in their faith just as you would in your faith. All of the people here want to do, is help you see that maybe you shouldn't just accept things as they are, without trying to understand them.( -So hard for me to put this into words right now.) And if by chance you happen to question your 'religon', then just have faith.

I won't be praying for you, but I still care about you.

The Psalms do not apply to Christianity. Their author, King David, was not a Christian.

LEVITICUS does not apply to Christianity.

THE LAWS OF MOSES do not apply to Christianity.

The New Testament applies to Christianity.

The most important part of the Jewish Tanakh that applies to Christianity is the ten commandments, as well as the story of creation, the flood, sodom & gomorrah, and thats about it, save a few bits here and there.

Don't get the religions twisted.

[edit on 2/18/2007 by runetang]

Originally posted by djohnsto77
1) But real science delving into quantum mechanics, string theory, and beyond show that our universe is far more complicated than we could have ever imagined.
[edit on 2/18/2007 by djohnsto77]

1) Stop there. It shows that our Universe is complicated, yes, but not so complicated we can't imagine it; after all, someone had to have imagined those theories.

No science we have points torwards any evidence of God and most science we do have points negatively torwards the existence of God. (Earth can't be 6,000 years old, Evolution over creationism, Noah's ark didn't happen, free will doesn't exist,

Originally posted by djohnsto77
Atheism is just as much of a prosetylizing religion as any other, as evinced by thoughts and threads like this.

actually, this thread is to see how people interpret this particular point in scripture...

Atheists, in the strictist terms, have totally excluded the very possibility of any being higher than themselves, a very narcissistic view to my way of thinking. Yet they go even further by degrading anyone that doesn't share their myopic view.

no, actually, most atheists would completely acknowledge the existence of god if given sufficient evidence

you actually perpetuated several myths about atheists with that statement

Under the mantle of their so-called science, they find answers for everything that excludes any possibility of a higher power existing. But real science delving into quantum mechanics, string theory, and beyond show that our universe is far more complicated than we could have ever imagined.

so the universe is more complex...
i don't see how this implies a divine being

"so-called science" needs to exclude things that cannot be tested, like a deity

The simple answer is we don't know, and I find the people who cling to what they think as pure science as it is currently known (which is always in flux) just as radical as the people who cling to faith.

so clinging to the products of reason = clinging to faith...

Originally posted by wellwhatnow
You don't want to be convinced, you've made that clear, yet you still try to goad others into arguments.

no, i do
i want to see alternative interpretations of that line

Statements like the one above are clearly only intended to pick fights with others. I guess everyone needs a hobby, but being so antagonistic makes you less credible in my eyes.

well, thanks for the name calling
but requesting one or more alternative interpretations is in no way an antagonistic statement

Originally posted by XphilesPhan
I notice that you, an atheist, seems to hang around theological discussions on ATS/BTS quite a bit. Why is that?

i do it because it is stimulating stuff to discuss

Consider this madness: You know how irritating it is when a Christian shoves their beliefs down your throat and insist that you change and think as they do? Well, I am officially putting you in the same category.

i'm pointing out a single part of the bible because it seems to be a bit off...
so i'm shoving my beliefs down your throat?
i don't get that

if anything, i'm calling for christians to not see atheists as that particular part of psalms sees them, not calling people to be atheists

believe what you want
it's all your choice

I think the best way to eliminate this type of behavior is to stop responding to any thread you create.

ok, here i'm going to see how the average christian keeps away from the common bigotry towards atheists
have fun ignoring me

Well, the bible was wrong on this one, evidently. Lets face it, for a start it's been translated multiple times, and the psalms were written even longer ago than the new testament. It may have been true then, but it isn't now.

Originally posted by RedDragon
No science we have points torwards any evidence of God and most science we do have points negatively torwards the existence of God. (Earth can't be 6,000 years old, Evolution over creationism, Noah's ark didn't happen, free will doesn't exist,

Madness, You. Are. Annoying.:shk:

Originally posted by thehumbleone
Madness, You. Are. Annoying.:shk:

and you're calling me names

anyway
babloyi, i would just need any sort of test that can be reproduced with the same results that would conclusively show the existence of ANY deity (monotheistic abrahmic god, thor, zeus, fsm, osiris, amateratsu, quetzelzoatl, etc)

key word there is reproduced with the same results

and the original cause argument doesn't work out for theists because they give you a false answer
a being that doesn't fit into causuality
and many have argued against casuality, it isn't set in stone that it is 100%

[edit on 2/18/07 by madnessinmysoul]

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.

...


and i'd just like to point out that i belive that Psalm 14:1 is ludicrous, bigoted, and ignorant
would anyone like to convince me otherwise?

Yes, I would, but as you have made plainly obvious, you have said in your heart there is no God. Not in your mind, not through the evidence, but in your heart. You have made your stand. So you work against God, work to convince people to abandon their religion and accept yours, and call those who refuse to worship at the alter of madness bigots, ignorant and ludicrous.

So would I like to convince you otherwise, help to open your eyes to God, or maybe even to your own prejudices and faith that you claim not to have? Absolutely. However, I remember when I was where you are now, and know there is no logical argument that can be made that will take off your blinders. Instead, I can only pray for your understanding, and pray I will.

You know what's truly amazing about Psalm 14:1? Though in God's eyes those who say there is no God in their hearts are fools, incapable of any good work, are corrupt, and have done abominable works, God still loves you! I, as a man, find that so difficult to wrap my head around at times. Looking at myself, I see corruption, hypocrisy, foolishness, and, like a dog goes back to his vomit, so I repeat my folly, yet God so loves me in spite of myself that He, knowing me full well, sent His only Son to die in my place, because He wanted to spend eternity with me, a wretched sinner! And not just me, but every one of us. He gave us the ultimate Valentine 2000 years ago on Calvary, and all He asks in return is that we love Him with all of our hearts. That's it! Just love Him.

It truly is amazing, my friend, and I will pray that the veil covering your eyes be torn and you be able to see His love for you.

Originally posted by junglejake
Yes, I would, but as you have made plainly obvious, you have said in your heart there is no God. Not in your mind, not through the evidence, but in your heart.

incorrect
i have said that, since there is no evidence to prove the existence of god, i have come to the logical conclusion that said being does not convice

You have made your stand. So you work against God, work to convince people to abandon their religion and accept yours, and call those who refuse to worship at the alter of madness bigots, ignorant and ludicrous.

no, again i disagree
i do not follow a religion
i do not attempt to convert, i may ask people to look at their own beliefs, the universe, etc more closely, but i never tell them to accept my position
and i never call people bigots, ignorant, and lucdicrous for the simple fact that they disagree with me

It truly is amazing, my friend, and I will pray that the veil covering your eyes be torn and you be able to see His love for you.

well, here's how you can convert me
prove the existence of a deity
then prove that it is the deity of your religion

there is no veil over my eyes
there's just no evidence for them to see

and JJ, i've completely disproven that atheists are as described in Psalm 14:1, haven't i?

[edit on 2/18/07 by madnessinmysoul]

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
well, here's how you can convert me
prove the existence of a deity
then prove that it is the deity of your religion

If only I could...

there is no veil over my eyes
there's just no evidence for them to see

So you've convinced yourself...

Originally posted by junglejake
So you've convinced yourself...

well, i haven't seen it

so, jj, do you have any testable reproducable evidence for the exitence of ANY deity?

None that you would accept based on the evidence, no. We've had these conversations on many occasion. You've misconstrued or misunderstood (I don't claim to know your mind) points, or, in other cases, ignored points and gone on to other questions or changed the criteria for your questions. Quite simply, I don't see how I could possibly convince you of anything. All I can hope is that God will open your eyes, and that you will not resist when He does.

Were we discussing math, I could try to prove 2 + 2 = 4 to you by showing you two straws in one hand, two straws in the other hand, and combine them to have 4 straws in both hands, and still you would be unconvinced. So no, I cannot prove to your satisfaction that God exists, because in your mind, He does not and you refuse to see any evidence that He does. 2+2=3, and no amount of evidence will state otherwise because in your mind the evidence is false, even when it stares you in the face.

jj, math is improvable because it is purely abstract product of our mind that ends up having practical applications, so that little comparison fails

unless of course, you're implying that your deity is merely an abstract creation of the mind of religious people

JJ, dude, why are you wasting your time?

Please stop for all our sakes.