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Originally posted by ULTIMA1
But what about the EMT and firemen that have come foreward and stated that they were told to leave the area that the building was being pulled and then heard a countdown over the radio.
Originally posted by coughymachine
Can anyone explain the blue flame that bursts from the window that is furthest right with 1:15 of the video remaining?
Originally posted by ULTIMA1
Originally posted by CameronFox
Ultima? come on now! Your a pretty smart guy. But Geesh! to even THINK that CD experts could look at a 47 story skyscraper burning out of control and say...."ok lets all run into this burning building... plant EXPLOSIVES...and detonate in under 2 hours????" Dude... your reaching here. Remember the last two hours all the firemen were doing was pretty much standing around watching it burn. Of the hundreds of firefighters..not one ever mentioned seeing a crew of people running into the building with explosives.
Sorry... not one of your better posts.
Well for 1 if you rememebr from the report from the EPA recovering the fuel states that thier was probly no fires on the ground floor because other wise they would have recovered all the fuel.
Second all personel including firemen were moved back beyond a safety zone around building 7.
Third as stated several times and backed up by fire department, no steel buiding has collapsed due to fire and or structural damage.
Originally posted by nick7261
Originally posted by T Trubballshoota
CTers are proposing that unknown individuals were clever enough to sneak in huge quantities of explosives under peoples noses, plan to have aircraft crashed into buildings at different locations and all the rest of the ingenious stuff...]
The government is proposing that a small group of extremists planned and financed the simultaneous hijackings of 4 commercial airliners over a several year period, all without going noticed by any U.S. intelligence operations which were specifically looking for terrorists who might be planning just such an attack.
The government is proposing that these terrorist would sneak around the country, attend flight training schools, receive large amount of cash wired to them through international banks, right under the noses of the billion dollar intelligence organizations who were LOOKING for them.
The government's 9/11 Commisioners are also proposing that they were simply mistaken when they first denied that the officers from Able Danger ever wanted to talk to them, and that the information they were going to provide wasn't relevant to the 9/11 Commission investigation anyway.
The government is proposing that the NIST after 5 years, and after being 2 1/2 years behind schedule, still can't figure out why WTC7 collapsed the way it did.
But you can believe bin Laden and a rag-tag group of untrained arabs that never planned or carried out any thing even remotely similar to this COULD have pulled this off?
Let me make sure I understand this...
The CIA and the Dept. of Defense, with billion dollar budgets and thousands of professionally trained and experienced operatives could NOT pull off 9/11, but 20 or so untrained, inexperienced, arabs, with little or no support organization an minimal funding, COULD pull off 9/11?
Do you really think this makes any sense?
Originally posted by aecreate
BUILDINGS JUST DON'T FALL LIKE THAT.
Seriously, what is so hard to grasp?
Originally posted by GwionX
ALL of these ordinary people with their "gubment" training, ya know, the ones that went to the same elementry schools as us, had the same girlfriends as us, liked the same movies as us, loved the same country as us, suddenly decided to MURDER us so thier bosses could make a buck?
All of this done with immaculate precision, without one, NOT ONE of them spilling the beans? What kind of Borg-like world do YOU live in?
America's best minds are NOT working for the Gubment for $45k-55K a year. Hell, even America's own private enterprise knows it: Why do you think they sell the gubment $500 hammers and get away with it? It ain't because they are the most effecient bunch around.
WAKE-UP!! You will someday..I just wish it was now.
Steel beams in standard fire tests reach a state of deflections and runaway well below temperatures achieved in real fires. In a composite steel frame structure these beams are designed to support the composite deck slab. It is therefore quite understandable that they are fire protected to avoid runaway failures. The fire at Broadgate showed that this didn't actually happen in a real structure. Subsequently, six full-scale fire tests on a real composite frame structure at Cardington showed that despite large deflections of structural members affected by fire, runaway type failures did not occur in real frame structures when subjected to realistic fires in a variety of compartments.
This project was the first major effort to understand this behaviour using computational models of the Cardington fire tests. A full explanation of the mechanics that are responsible for the robust behaviour of unprotected composite frames in fire has been achieved and will be presented in detail in this report. Reaching this new understanding has been a laborious process, and numerous blind alleys had to be investigated along the way, however obvious the answer may now seem to the researchers involved in this project. It is possible that the conclusions will not seem obvious to others who have not been directly involved, however considerable effort has gone in to presenting the results of the project to provide as much detail as possible. Approximately 40 supplementary reports and over 10 technical papers have been written and appear as an appendix to this report. This amount of work has ensured that the conclusions presented have been verified by a number of independent approaches. Mutually reinforcing arguments were developed from the results of different computational models, application of fundamental mechanics and the analysis of test data. It is therefore with a great deal of confidence that these findings have been presented for close scrutiny by the profession. Once this new understanding of structural behaviour in fire is widely disseminated, discussed and understood, the way will be clear for completing all the other tasks which are necessary for full exploitation of the knowledge gained. This will lead to safer, more economic and rational design of steel frame structures for fire resistance.
Originally posted by nick7261
Originally posted by GwionX
Are you just more comfortable thinking that evil only exists in darker skinned people who worship a different God than you do?
Somebody murdered 3,000 people on 9/11. That's clear. So you think al-Qaeda committed these murders by convincing 19 young men to kill themselves, just so the rest of al-Qaeda could get bombed out of Afghanistan? Do you honestly believe that these al-Qaeda murderers are so evil, so delusion, and so stupid, but yet clever enough to pull off 9/11?
And what exactly did they pull off? So they murdered 3000 Americans and knocked down a couple of buildings. What did al-Qaeda gain from this?
On the other hand, the founding members of PNAC who left PNAC and their jobs as corporate executives, what did they gain from 9/11?
Unfortunately, I live in a world where our government can even consider events like Project Northwoods, complete with its real or fake victims.
By the way, how many U.S. troops have been sent to die in Iraq? Who sent them there? Am I better off now than I was before these troops died? I know Halliburton and Exxon execs and stockholders are.
America's best minds are NOT working for the Gubment for $45k-55K a year.
My cousin just got hired out of college at about $100k a year to work for a top defense contractor. See, the government doesn't hire thes best minds. The government hires the companies that hire the best minds. It is my understanding that she can't even say 1 word about what she does because she signed a non-disclosure agreement that makes spilling the beans a federal, criminal offense.
I'm afraid I'm not the one who is in the media induced, believe-whatever-they-tell-me trance.
Originally posted by something smells
Maybe I am being selective in my observations, though.
Why can't fire EVER fail steel in a controlled lab environment, where the heat is intentionally cranked up?
Firefighters' efforts were also hampered by malfunctioning water pumps and the lack of fire extinguishers inside the building as fire laws are not strictly enforced in Venezuela.
Originally posted by talisman
It wasn't just the fact it fell, it fell straight down into its foundational footprint.
[edit on 18-2-2007 by talisman]
Originally posted by purplecoral
what do you mean its baseless and means nothing? comes out of his mouth... you may be right but, making it look like he hasn't committed insurance fraud seems quite logical, since everything is being covered up. why run away with his millions when he can make many more from rebuilding, and being the good guy? ALSO... consider this... since it was built, the world trade centre had only had ONE owner, Port Authority.... just seems a little coincidental that it happened to change hands that very summer, and look at the timelines mentioned earlier.... this is obviously just my opinion, and i think we are free to question this, when its there for all to see. are you suggesting that was a puppet of larry silverstein?