US Poised For Attack On Iran!! Has The Final Count Down Begun?

Originally posted by OBE1

Originally posted by Peyres

I fail to see how people in Tehran will perish if the West knocks out nuclear facilities that aren't even in Tehran.

Hello Peyres...If you are referring to my segway to the video, 'Those we want to kill', I agree that I should have been more careful with my wording. Perhaps 'Those we would kill' would have been more appropriate. My apologies.

I'm not claiming that there will be an attack, and I sincerely hope there isn't. However if an attack did occur, then defense suppression would be a primary element. I'm not privy to the locations of fixed Iranian missile defence systems, but I am aware that the Russians began shipping the new Tor-M1 mobile systems to Tehran this past November. How many will be deployed close to population centers? I can't say with any certainty...but I am confident that we'll attempt to take them out...where ever they are...collateral damage or not.

An attack that would effectively set Iran's nuclear intentions back five years, would involve hundreds and hundreds of sorties across an estimated five to eight days...it's not just about the core nuclear facilities which are spread across the country, but radar facilities, munitions depots, command & control centers, and approximately 10 air bases. R&D and production facilities for Iran’s medium-range ballistic missile programme would also be priority targets, as well as the locations where the actual mobile missiles are deployed...and this is really a partial list of critical assets.

Targets specifically located in and around Tehran proper would include; the Tehran Research Reactor, the radioisotope production facility, a range of nuclear-related laboratories and the Kalaye Electric Company. I believe I already mentioned university laboratories and their related technology centres in a previous post.

Still, not everyone in Iran resides in the capitol...and I haven't even mentioned the possibility of radioactive material being lofted into the air...and the resulting contamination.

I would be surprised if wide scale collateral damage isn't inevitable. I remember Lebanon this past summer...and I still haven't forgotten Shock & Awe.

Peace &
Good Fortune
OBE1

Depleted Uranium

[edit on 19-2-2007 by OBE1]

Yes I agree, unfortunately Iran is bound to use its civilian population centres as a Shield. It has been done in Iraq, done in Kosovo etc, and to be honest it is sickening, and it is another indication of how under-hand the current Iranian reigeme is. It will match their efforts in Iraq. Demonise the West by using sacrificial civilians to do

You look at Western cities in comparison, there are next to no millitary targets. London is getting rid of all but 2 bases. Northwood HQ (which is where the Iraq war is run) and RAF Northolt (they cart the queen and government officials across the globe). Whilst they could be considered high value targets by both terrorists or an attacking force, they are located in the less densley populated suburbs.

There is a risk of Radioactive material contamination. But I'm pretty sure I had read that the fact that alot of the facilities are underground will minimize this severely. But also the nature of the bombs that will used.

In the case of the Israeli/Lebanon conflict, Hezbollah were firing rockets from civilian centres. Whilst I do think the Israeli reaction was grossly disproportionate. Hezbollah had free and unrestricted access to Lebanese infrastructure to launch rocket attacks on civilians.

Baghdad was also packed full of military targets, nearly every strategic target (including government personnel) was located either within the city boundaries or on the outskirts. Remember Sadamn also attempted to use kidnapped Western civilians to shield particular facilities in the first gulf war.

Originally posted by malganis
You make a good point LudaChris, that a superpower has responsibilities but isn't always going to be able to please everyone.

Ok a lot of people think that China will be a new superpower within this century or even this half of the century. Do you think that they will be involved in world issues as much as USA is? e.g. leading invasions in search of WMDs/terrorists, giving as much foreign aid, etc.

Well, China rising as a superpower isnt necessarily a bad thing for the US. It would take a big burden off of the US as far as responsibility for policing the world and alot of blame off of the US for certain events gone wrong, because people will start looking to China to take care of some things. I mean when disaster strikes anywhere in the world now, the US military is dispatched to deliver aid, provide security to a degree(other nations participate here as well), and help rebuild. If China rises to this status, it will have to carry an increased portion of the burden in these situations. Nations wont be able to turn around and ask why the US hasnt given more aid, they will have to ask the same of China.

Originally posted by Peyres

Yes I agree, unfortunately Iran is bound to use its civilian population centres as a Shield. It has been done in Iraq, done in Kosovo etc, and to be honest it is sickening, and it is another indication of how under-hand the current Iranian reigeme is. It will match their efforts in Iraq. Demonise the West by using sacrificial civilians to do

You look at Western cities in comparison, there are next to no millitary targets. London is getting rid of all but 2 bases. Northwood HQ (which is where the Iraq war is run) and RAF Northolt (they cart the queen and government officials across the globe). Whilst they could be considered high value targets by both terrorists or an attacking force, they are located in the less densley populated suburbs.

Greetings Peyres

Perhaps you just need to look a little farther west. I formerly resided in a heavily populated coastal area of California...a handfull of miles from two 'critical' nuclear reactors. I currently live relatively close to the Los Alamos National Laboratory. This is a massive facility, completely surrounded by the town of Los Alamos, adjacent to the small city of White Rock NM, and within close proximity to the state capitol; Santa Fe. Then there's Sandia National Laboratory's Kirtland AFB facility. It's located adjacent to the Albuquerque Airport, on the southern edge of the city of Albuquerque...population: approximately 500,000...and this is only one state.

Any contention that the Tehran Research Reactor, and related facilities were constructed in Tehran to intentionally endanger the civilian populace, or to enable using them as some sort of strategic 'shield' in the event some heavy handed rogue nation decided to launch a 'preemptive' air strike, is a bit far-fetched...maybe? Research facilities often exist in, or near major population centers as a matter of convenience. The Iranian population is far from being a pack of crazed Middle Easterners living in mud huts...willing to be used as cannon fodder.

Regarding the issue of Hezbollah rockets being fired from inside civilian homes...I never read anything that verified these claims by the IDF. In fact, some counter-claims point to the folly of attempting to fire a Katyusha from inside someones kitchen due to back-blast.

Hezbollah did fire thousands of unguided rockets into civilian areas, and some that fell on Haifa were documented to have been armed with ball bearings.

On the Israeli side of the ledger, this was clearly a case of lopsided aggression, and they have subsequently come forth on their use of cluster bombs in civilian centers. 'Human Rights Watch' documented violations on both sides, but they were massively weighted on the side of Israel.

In war, neither side remains clean...best to avoid the issue all together in my opinion.

Peace &
Good Fortune
OBE1

Isn’t it surprising that only the U.S. and Israel, and a few minor allies have the ‘authority’ to possess nuclear warheads? The biggest stockpiles are in the U.S. and Israel, with neither allowing the International Atomic Inspection group, to inspect their major sites either in the U.S. or at any military sites in Europe or in the Far East or the Middle East and Israel in Dimona. Of course, the U.S. does not dare push China on this issue because China has its stockpile as well as Russia—but we never hear of these countries being a “threat”. Why?

America’s transgressions in the world will utterly destroy their reputation as a world moral leader, as a country to be believed to foster democracy and freedom.

They will be a laughing stock, not only to foreign powers, but also to their own people who have the good sense to see the absurdity of their posture vs their rhetoric of “freedom and democracy.” Can one forget Agent Orange and the cancers it caused in the Vietnamese or the deforestation of Viet Nam and the vast destruction of its rice fields—all in the name of “democracy and freedom”—for who?

This madness of the present administration will paint America darkly for decades and perhaps centuries to come if ordinary Americans themselves don’t stop this…

NOW!!

The Clock's Ticking: More Battle Indicators!!

After Iran's seizure of 15 British navy personnel ominous signs that war is nearing, give an indication that this could be the new "Gulf of Tonkin" Bush and Blair have long yearned for to justify air strikes on Iran.

Then...

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. Navy on Tuesday said it had no information to substantiate a market rumor that Iran had fired at a U.S. naval vessel in the Gulf.
"Navy has nothing to substantiate that report right now," a Navy official said. "At this juncture, there is no validity to it."

"We have no information at this time that indicates any incident taking place," said White House National Security Council spokesman Gordon Johndroe.

That's what the Navy says. Probably Iran DID fire a warning salvo. One more step closer to war!

Simulated Attacks

The U.S. Navy on Tuesday began its largest demonstration of force in the Persian Gulf since the 2003 invasion of Iraq, led by a pair of aircraft carriers and backed by warplanes flying simulated attack maneuvers off the coast of Iran.

The maneuvers bring together two strike groups of U.S. warships and more than 100 U.S. warplanes to conduct simulated air warfare in the crowded Gulf shipping lanes.
AP

But as I mentioned earlier, D-Day will be anytime AFTER the so called 'surge' in troops to Iraq has been completed. And that's already under way!

Top up your tanks guys. Oil will shoot up to $100 a barrel sooner than you think! So keep those extra barrels in your garage, full to the brim. You're going to need them!

Sorry guys...

All ready a post on this

here...

Are we hours away from war with Iran??

Thanks,

NeoN HaZe.

Originally posted by Neon Haze
Sorry guys...

All ready a post on this

here...

Are we hours away from war with Iran??

Thanks,

NeoN HaZe.

Thanks to you too, Neon!!

This is a continuation of my thread dated 17 feb 2007, "Has The Final Countdown Begun"?

Your thread is dated 24th March, more than a month later!! Anyway, in my thread, I've laid stress on the military aspects of the 'impending' showdown.

Cheers!!



[edit on 28-3-2007 by mikesingh]

Originally posted by mikesingh
Thanks to you too, Neon!!

This is a continuation of my thread dated 17 feb 2007, "Has The Final Countdown Begun"?

Your thread is dated 24th March, more than a month later!! Anyway, in my thread, I've laid stress on the military aspects of the 'impending' showdown.

Cheers!!

Ahh I see I didn't notice this was a thread started a month ago pertaining to potentiality of an attack.

I though it was related specifically at the recent events.

My apologies.

All the best,

NeoN.

But as I mentioned earlier, D-Day will be anytime AFTER the so called 'surge' in troops to Iraq has been completed. And that's already under way!

Top up your tanks guys. Oil will shoot up to $100 a barrel sooner than you think! So keep those extra barrels in your garage, full to the brim. You're going to need them!

Indeed. I mentioned something similar about oil prices in another thread a minute ago. Take a look at how GM, Ford, and Chrysler have been fairing in previous times of 3 dollar per gallon gas. Notice that Toyota will soon be the #1 auto maker b/c the big "2.5" continue to put their best only into the full size SUVs and Trucks. If we attack Iran, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see 4, maybe 5, dollar per barrel oil. Aside from Iran halting sales, who knows what Iran's ally, Venezuela would do? What if they both switched to the Euro for trading?

We need to invest more in alternative sources. MANY of our issues would be solved.

Originally posted by mikesingh
Isn’t it surprising that only the U.S. and Israel, and a few minor allies have the ‘authority’ to possess nuclear warheads? The biggest stockpiles are in the U.S. and Israel, with neither allowing the International Atomic Inspection group, to inspect their major sites either in the U.S. or at any military sites in Europe or in the Far East or the Middle East and Israel in Dimona. Of course, the U.S. does not dare push China on this issue because China has its stockpile as well as Russia—but we never hear of these countries being a “threat”. Why?

America’s transgressions in the world will utterly destroy their reputation as a world moral leader, as a country to be believed to foster democracy and freedom.

They will be a laughing stock, not only to foreign powers, but also to their own people who have the good sense to see the absurdity of their posture vs their rhetoric of “freedom and democracy.” Can one forget Agent Orange and the cancers it caused in the Vietnamese or the deforestation of Viet Nam and the vast destruction of its rice fields—all in the name of “democracy and freedom”—for who?

This madness of the present administration will paint America darkly for decades and perhaps centuries to come if ordinary Americans themselves don’t stop this…

Most of those other countries that dont possess nuclear weapons gave up the right to develop or obtain them when they signed the NPT. They voluntarily signed those documents which prohibit such activity. Is that a bad thing? The US and Russia have the largest stockpiles in the world, and have been continuously reduced over the past few decades with the START and SALT treaties. Maybe there will come a day when a nuclear detterrent becomes uneccessary, but I doubt it. How many wars between nuclear states do you think have been prevented due to that detterrent?

Maybe right on the second point, but history may look differently upon those "transgressions" depending on the outcome in the future.

Agent Orange related cancer is a big problem for those who still survive thier exposure to the chemical. It was meant to kill dense brush and foilage the VC and NVA used to hide in, but ended up killing some of our own. It certainly is a travesty the govt allowed our soldiers to be exposed to AO.

Once again, depending on how events unfold and are resolved in the future, your statement may be wrong. The victor writes history, right or wrong.

Originally posted by el_madmaster
Aside from Iran halting sales, who knows what Iran's ally, Venezuela would do? What if they both switched to the Euro for trading?

That's already happening!!

Venezuelan leader Hugo Chavez is directing a growing share of the country's oil profits into euros as the dollar and crude prices fall.

The dollar, down 9.5 percent against the euro this year, may face more pressure in 2007 because Venezuela and oil producers from the United Arab Emirates to Indonesia plan to funnel more money into the single European currency.

More...

I see the dollar crashing in the not to distant future as more and more countries convert to the Euro for trading. Bad scene! The markets would take a huge tumble with bears ruling the roost at the stock markets.

NOW is the time to sell!!

Cheers!

Of course the US is going to attack Iran! Of course that is why oil prices are going down, because if they attack Iran oil will go up to 175 or more!! The people controlling oil really don't want to completely stop the American consumer with an even bigger price spike when the attack drives oil up a certain percentage. They are artificially deflating the price of oil to send it right back up where it used to be. Also the American economy if on the verge of collapse. The only ace America has left is their massive military might. The only way to forgive our debts and keep the elite in power in America is to completely put the world into chaos and either beat them into submission or to save them from some other foe(ie The Russian's and/or the Chinese). Its all about the American elite keeping the cow in the barn instead of having to give it away. Simultaneously I think the Russians and Chinese want what the Americans have. Isn't that how its been throughout the centuries. One tribe wants what the other has and goes over and attacks the other tribe. How we are so similar to our forefathers when we profess to be so different.

Russia pulled back in Georgia because the timing is all wrong. I think they have something else in mind. They want all of their allies to strike many targets around the world at once. Why? Because the US couldn't effectively coordinate all the attacks at once.The US was trying to goad Russia into attacking on their own. The old divide and conquer philosophy. Yes the Russians had to answer because the Georgians were attacking allies, and could have put them at a slightly larger disadvantage when everything goes down.. The US is planning this Iran thing right in the middle of the Olympics so the Chinese can't respond. The Russians pulled back and dug in because they would stand a better chance in the upcoming possible WWIII thing touched off by Iran if they are just on the edge of takeover and can just wait until their allies can respond. I would be like any one of us attacking a football team. Even if we were Chuck Norris himself we'd get our ass kicked.
The US fleet isn't completely "on station" yet off Iran so we have at least the long or maybe until the end of the Olympics before WWIII starts.
It's so sad I don't have the money to finish building my shelter.

Originally posted by carolina1737
Of course the US is going to attack Iran! Of course that is why oil prices are going down, because if they attack Iran oil will go up to 175 or more!! The people controlling oil really don't want to completely stop the American consumer with an even bigger price spike when the attack drives oil up a certain percentage. They are artificially deflating the price of oil to send it right back up where it used to be. (

Good post carolina! I didn't think of this! A conspiracy of sorts. But I really wonder if the price of oil has been artificially deflated for an 'impending' holocaust. It most likely is due to other reasons, including the strengthening of the dollar and the falling demand for oil especially in the US.

Yes, the market is being controlled by "market forces" you are so right. The oil interests probably send a lot of the money back into the market to speculate it back up to a level which makes them more money. Yes demand is falling, but we sell a huge amount of fuels to Europe so demand numbers for US fuel products is off by a bit. Also there is the scandal about those companies selling fuel to Europe being subsidized by the us taxpayer by mixing in green fuel products and getting a tax credit. The US citizen is being washed and the government is so crooked with oil money they won't do anything about the ongoing theft of taxpayer money from the public. I really just think they know that if a war with Iran comes and all hell breaks loose.....the price of oil will go up so much the average US citizen would have to pay 9-10 a gallon and that would put the price of going to work not worth going to work for most. Not to mention the average consumer could not afford to go out and do business. So these interests upon hearing through the grapevine an attack was coming realized that if the prices were kept so high the entire oil economy on which they live would come crashing to a halt. So why not take a month or two of reduced profits, get the price down a little then get it jacked right back up to where it was(With an attack on Iran)...maybe a little more...and still be able to rob the people on a daily basis. The alternative would be the end of their power(nobody buying their products) if that price shot up to the point where none could afford to travel. But again they don't have total control over the market, but a large enough amount of control to get what they need out of it. The US interests just took their pressure out of the upward price spiral. ...that doesn't mean there aren't others still trying to serve their interests, but it gets harder when the market takes on a new dynamic where others(Russia, Venezuela, etc) may being trying to produce that "economy stop" on the US through hiher prices. Us interests just want to milk as much out of the US as they can and not stop the milk flowing...the others(Russia, Venezuala, China*ally, etc) just want to do as much damage as they can and fill their coffers as much as they can in order to start that wwIII thing. Because we surly won't be buying oil from them after that happens....

Oh, i also think that the strengthening dollar has more to do with a scared European Zone. If Russia is on the warpath America suddenly becomes exactly what they need. I'm sure that has a lot to do with the strengthening dollar. I mean NATO might be able to put up some sort of fight, but they let their military establishment waste away(Just look at France for an example). Russia just stored up their stuff and waited. The Europeans know its coming, you can't keep something this big secret, they just don't want to scare the public..The primary competitor for the top currency spot is the Euro, and they just decided not to "be so hard on the American" if they were going to need our help.. Honestly what market dynamic has changed to justify the rise of the dollar...fundamentally there isn't one....especially since American interst rates have been held down and European ones are going up. The reverse dollar value SHOULD be true!! If the US dollar were to actually rise through true market forces the US would need to raise interest rates, and Bush won't let them because that means more oil dollars for oil with the dollar being worth less.