Big Moon

This is going to sound like a stupid question, but i'm going to ask it anyway.

Why is it that on some photos i see of the moon, it looks massive. I did look up about this and found out its mainly to do with perception :

moon explained


but what i still dont get, is why i never see it big. I am on the outskirts of London....is it that it is just not possible to see a "big" moon from here?
These photos are amazing....i want to see it so much in real life, but all i ever see is a small moon, even when its rising

i found a photo...this is what i mean, why do i never see the moon looking like this:




[edit on 15-2-2007 by geek101]

did you not see the moon recently? (the last full moon i think) it was huge at about 5.30pm & orange, from Oxford. Ive wondered the same thing, I presumed it was to do with it having an elliptical orbit (although i dont know that it does)]


EDIT: I really do not believe that article you posted, that picture you posted clearly refutes his idea that the moon is really always the same size. I cannot be just an illusion

[edit on 15-2-2007 by Frakkerface]

I saw the full moon, but no, it wasnt big. Is it something to do with the fact that i cant see very far across the horizon....houses get in my way.
I would loved to have seen that....its amazing.
It does seem strange the illusion thing, but perception is a weird thing. Go here:

how perception of size is skewed

and do the "click on the man" thing....very weird

Originally posted by geek101
I saw the full moon, but no, it wasnt big. Is it something to do with the fact that i cant see very far across the horizon....houses get in my way.
I would loved to have seen that....its amazing.
It does seem strange the illusion thing, but perception is a weird thing. Go here:

how perception of size is skewed

and do the "click on the man" thing....very weird

Frakker is right, in the UK last full moon it was huge! It is weird how perception changes.

I do know what you mean though, you see pictures or footage from certain movies and the moon appears twice the size of even the last full moon we had.

Originally posted by John NadaFrakker is right, in the UK last full moon it was huge!

i think it is definitely the case then, of houses blocking the full horizon view for me...cos all i ever see (and i look every night) is the regular small one. I'm going to go somewhere flat next full moon...i wanna see one

yeah i did the man test thing on that site, it is a good example of the irregularity of perception. But look at the picture you posted, you cant say that that is the same size as it is when its high in the sky.

I still dont get why it would be an illusion, or even how it could be. What would cause such an illusion? Wouldnt a camera expose the illusion somehow, or at least lessen it?

This should shed some light on the phrase "Moon Illusion", you might also want to do a search on the term "Oculomotor Micropsia"

Moon Illusion

but I don't believe thats what you are getting at.

The photo you gave a link to is an excellent example of a question my brother asked me. I'm not skilled enough in photography and not articulate enough to convey the correct terms, but this is how I see it.

Its not the moon that appears large, its the people.

If you were to look at that view without the aid of a zoom lens, the relative sizes of the subjects would be the same, you just accept it as the norm because you are not framing that specific area.

It could also have someting to do with the moon being anywhere between 382500 km and 360000 km from the photographer and the people being only, lets say 200 metres away. If you were to join those people on the hillside you would see no visble change in the size of the moon however those people on the hillside will now be fullsized.

Hope this helps, I'm sure someone will explain it better than me......

Also, light bends...take that into factor. Sometimes the color will change and size will change due to the way gases bend the light. It will appear bigger, but it's really not.

Ive seen it once! In a car driving down the motorway, is it the M5 that cuts right down the middle of the UK, or M1... cant remember. It was bound to happen sooner or later, that particular stretch of motorway gives a lovely perspective, nice parallel lines and a flat view.

The moon was HUGE, quite eerie and breathtaking, I would love to see it like that again.

The photo in the original post is definitely taken through a powerful telephoto lens (and maybe even cropped). But as other posts said, perception has a lot to do with it also.

Also, If you tried to photograph what you thought of as a giant moon on the horizon using a normal lens (or even the 3X to 4X zoom on standard digital cameras) the moon will look much more tiny in the photo than you expected.

Thanks for the replies you guys.
Koka...thanks for that explanation..it seems you and Soylent Green believe it is to do with camera usage.
But that doesnt explain people like FrakkerFace, Dae and John Nada who say they have SEEN this with their own eyes.
AlphaAnuOmega.....how would light bending affect the size? I dont know anything about this stuff.

And Frakkerface, if you dont believe its an illusion, what DO you think causes it?

Again, thanks for the replies. Tried looking out for the moon last night, couldnt even see it at all

Where those big pictures were probably taken was at a place on earth were it was actually closer, or at least it wasn't obstructed by all the buildings and lights of a large city like London.

Plus not all camera's are created equal. The lens have alot to do with the photograph.

Just an opinon.

[edit on 16-2-2007 by Royal76]

Originally posted by geek101
Koka...thanks for that explanation..it seems you and Soylent Green believe it is to do with camera usage.
But that doesnt explain people like FrakkerFace, Dae and John Nada who say they have SEEN this with their own eyes.

Np geek101, I believe my explanation regarding the specific photo you gave to be accurate. It matters not that it was a "Big Moon" night.

However, I do understand your question regarding the "Big Moon" itself as I have also witnessed this first hand, and it looked amazing.

The link I gave you goes some way to explaining possible theories into the phenomena, but I have searched to no avail for an overall explanation that people agree on.

Why does the moon look so big now?

When I witnessed it, I assumed it was down to atmospehrics and the low angle it was at, but apparently that is not what causes it. I find myself swaying toward the ellipitical orbit, as mentioned by Frakkerface, but if scientists can't work it out I'm not sure we will.

The Moon at Perigee and Apogee

One thing we can be sure of is that it happens........sorry......

[edit on 16-2-2007 by Koka]

Originally posted by geek101
Thanks for the replies you guys.
Koka...thanks for that explanation..it seems you and Soylent Green believe it is to do with camera usage.
But that doesnt explain people like FrakkerFace, Dae and John Nada who say they have SEEN this with their own eyes.
AlphaAnuOmega.....how would light bending affect the size? I dont know anything about this stuff.

And Frakkerface, if you dont believe its an illusion, what DO you think causes it?

Again, thanks for the replies. Tried looking out for the moon last night, couldnt even see it at all

There are many reasons for the moon to look bigger. My original response regarding telephoto lenses was directed at your original post, and was correct relative to that photo. Here is a summary of the reasons for a "Big Moon".

-As I said, the photo in your original post was definitely photgraphed through a powerful telephoto lens.

-As noted by Koka in the post above, the Moon at perigee (the closest point of it's orbit relaive to earth) is 13% bigger than the Moon at apogee (closest point of its orbit), so it will look slightly larger sometimes.

-When a Big Moon looks large on the horizon to the naked eye, it is mostly due to an optical illusion involving our brain perceiving the Moon against a close or distant foreground.

Here's an experiment you can do to prove the last explanation. The next time the moon looks "Big" (BTW, the next full moon is March 4th), get a ruler, hold it at arm's length, then measure the diameter on the Moon. Be as precise as possible (measure to the millimeter or 1/16th inch or something like that). If the Moon is full or approximately full, it will be rising probably an hour or two after sunset (the moon rises approx. 1 hr. later every night). Wait about 4 hours or until the moon is straight overhead. It will look much smaller than it did peviously. Now take your ruler at arm's length and measure again. Make sure you're holding the ruler at precisely the same length from your eye (be as precise as possible). You'll be surprised to see that the Moon is exactly the same size as it was earlier.

Whether the Moon is in apogee or perigee is irrelevant to the above experiment, since the orbital distance does not perceptively change over the length of time of the experiment.

Here's another link that describes some of the reasons for the "Apparent Big Moon"
www.perseus.gr...

I hope this helps...happy skywatching!

[edit on 17-2-2007 by Soylent Green Is People]

Originally posted by Soylent Green Is People

Here's an experiment you can do to prove the last explanation. The next time the moon looks "Big" (BTW, the next full moon is March 4th), get a ruler, hold it at arm's length, then measure the diameter on the Moon. Be as precise as possible (measure to the millimeter or 1/16th inch or something like that). If the Moon is full or approximately full, it will be rising probably an hour or two after sunset (the moon rises approx. 1 hr. later every night). Wait about 4 hours or until the moon is straight overhead. It will look much smaller than it did peviously. Now take your ruler at arm's length and measure again. Make sure you're holding the ruler at precisely the same length from your eye (be as precise as possible). You'll be surprised to see that the Moon is exactly the same size as it was earlier.
I hope this helps...happy skywatching!

thank you so much....you and Koka have explained things really well. And as for this experiment....next full moon, i shall be out there, somwhere, ruler in hand.