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Are the writers of fiction-fantasy onto something?

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posted on Dec, 17 2003 @ 07:04 PM
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Having read various fantasy/science fiction/ horror books, I have started to believe that the artists and creative writers all share a common element.

I am taken back by the works of H P Lovecraft, his vividness and total emotional effect. Although his works are fiction, something seems to be hiding behind those words, almost like a "fictional history".

Todd McFarlane's "Spawn" comic book, with elements of religion and occult. The war between heaven and hell, with earth caught in the middle.

(Don't recall name) write of Babylon 5. The Ancient Ones, the shadows, etcetera. Religious tones, with an alien twist.

There are a few others, but my mind is wandering a bit. Anyway, there are numerous other authors who have touched upon the same cords, but I cannot recall right now. I'll edit this later if need be.

Now my question is two-fold. Do you, dear reader, feel the same, that there are writers out there who are in touch with something "more" than just good writing skills, something more along the lines of being "touched"? Or am I just reading too much into this?




posted on Dec, 17 2003 @ 07:09 PM
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Funny you bring this up, a local movie reviewer in my city just say the Rings' trilogy ending and said that is the exact reason these films are so well received. Because on deep subconscious levels they reflect reality, a reality that some see, some fear and some want to ignore or cannot see.



posted on Dec, 17 2003 @ 07:26 PM
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I'm embarking on writing a Fantazy Epic, and I have many parallels to the real world. This is how I make the story work. I see how deception, politics, racism, betrayal, love etc.. work in this world than incorporate it into my novel.
This is why I love ATS so much, I get many ideas from the subjects and issues we discuss here.



posted on Dec, 17 2003 @ 07:43 PM
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Those are the words I was looking for, but my mind was foggy!

These authors, somehow, have tapped into the subconscous, or perhaps a collective memory. There are just some works that'll make you stand back and make you feel uncomfortable, as if you KNOW, somewhere in the back of your mind...

Granted, there are other really good writers out there, who write along the same lines, but their works are missing that one thing that sets off alarms and signals in the mind.

*heh* I'd like to defend the comic SPAWN real quickly... there is something about it... don't know what... but the whole conflict with the spirituality issues, brings such overwhelming thoughts (?) memories (?) that are quickly covered with fog. Probably the only one who thinks so, but... if anyone hasn't read these, I highly recommend them!



posted on Dec, 17 2003 @ 08:53 PM
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i happened upon a comic book documentry on TLC a few days ago and it gave me some insight to writers of fantasy in general and I learned that writers of these genres look for something in the world/current events that capture our imagination. you can have talent in making stories up but you can always weave real world elements to make them all the more better



posted on Dec, 18 2003 @ 02:59 PM
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An excellent theory on this kind of thing is presented in the movie Unbreakable (Bruce Willis and Samuel L. Jackson; M. Night Shyamalan).

The basic idea (for those of you who have never seen it) is that all mythology, past and present is based on actual events, with comics being the new mythology. Events portrayed may be exaggerated or slightly skewed as they are fictionalized, but they are based in fact to some degree.

I recommend the movie and I'm very much a believer in the idea, as well.

That comic book documentary was also very good, as well. I knew a great deal about the history of comics beforehand, but there were a few things I learned from it.

I've also read Spawn, although not for a long time now, and yes, it is a good read, as the storyline delves into the grey areas between good and evil that are shown in various religions and spirituality.



posted on Dec, 18 2003 @ 03:35 PM
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I don't think we can forget the famous Robert E. Howard, creator of Cona, King Kull, and Soloman Cane.

He wrote an entire history fro the Conan world; from the rise and fall of Atlantis, to the rise of the Hyborian Age after the great cataclysm, and the decline of the Hyborian Age, the ethnic groups that formed from them, and how the world was one continent during the time of Conan, to be finally rendered asunder, to form the world now as we know it.

He used many familiar names: Stygia, Kush, Corinthia, Asgard, Vendhya(India), Khitai(China), Nordheim(Norway and Sweden), the Picts, and so on. He was absolutley brilliant.

But, as is with most writers, he suffered from alcoholism and depression( ever notice how Steven Kings books have gone to crap after he quit drinking), which ended in his suicide at the age of 33.



posted on Dec, 19 2003 @ 09:34 AM
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(sigh)

Guys, start going to some science fiction conventions, eh? Talk to the writers. I've been doing this for the past 25 years and have met (briefly) Asimov, Clarke, Terry Pratchett, Robert Silverberg, Mercedes Lackey, Gordon Dickson, and a whole huge list of the top scifi and fantasy writers and have met comic book authors at San Diego Comicon (a *HUGE* con.) I even crossed paths with Todd McFarlaine.

They make this stuff up. They don't believe it. They aren't "channeling" anything. There's no "secret knowledge."

In fact, some of them (Robert Jordan, among others, and James Gurney (Dinotopia) and Marion Zimmer Bradley) have to keep timelines and extensive notes because if they don't inconsistances creep into their works and their fans write them and nag them about it.

Start going to cons, eh? It's a good education in just how creative writers and artists can get when they're making stuff up.



posted on Dec, 20 2003 @ 06:08 PM
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Soothsayer

They just might be... Look how Dan Simmons depicted the future of the catholic empire in "Hyperion".

Can't you see some similarities?



posted on Dec, 22 2003 @ 05:01 PM
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I personally like the idea of the shared subconscious collective memory. Even if the authors are using their own creative juices, even if they don't believe in the things they write, I feel that deep down, they are expressing something everyone already knows.

An artist will work on something that is familiar to them... a writer will write what s/he knows.

I am not saying that all writers/artists are "connected" to something deep within our pasts. I am just merely suggesting that those creative people, because they are artists, are more open... more "willing" to see things that normal people cannot, or will not, see.

It is in that reasoning that I had proposed this topic... these people are not worshipping Urizen, or bringing forth Shadows from the Outer Rim... they are merely telling a story, their story, which they did in fact "make up" on their own. But then, too, they are also writing about things, about creatures and beings, that have happened many lives ago; they, as artists, are more receptive, more "intuned" to the hidden things within our subconscious.

For future reference... I too, have been at the San Diego events (even had sex atop the convention center). I have also met Todd McFarlane (have is autograph framed next to the Spawn toy line along my wall). I have also turned down working for Marvel comics 10 years ago. I understand the creative processes needed to develope characters and storylines... I also know in my works (both text and drawing) I am drawing from something deeper.



posted on Dec, 22 2003 @ 05:14 PM
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I always thought H.P. Lovecraft was on to something when he wrote about the Great Old Ones and gods from beyond the stars. Maybe he had some knowledge about the existance of these "creatures". Things that are so far beyond humans that we would have no chance of understanding them.

Oh, and J. Michael Stracynski, the creator of Babylon 5, based the Shadows on Lovecraft's Old Ones. They both sleep in ancient cyclpoean cites in far off places. Like the old ones, the shadows aren't really evil, they're just so above us we're like ants to them...and pawns.



posted on Jun, 8 2004 @ 06:42 AM
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Originally posted by Flinx
I always thought H.P. Lovecraft was on to something when he wrote about the Great Old Ones and gods from beyond the stars. Maybe he had some knowledge about the existance of these "creatures". Things that are so far beyond humans that we would have no chance of understanding them.


Aye, there is a belief that Lovecraft was describing something real which is, if not widespread, then certainly not an entirely marginal part of his fandom. It derives from the fact that his fiction largely came to him from his twisted dreams (he once expressed a fear of what he might dream if he were to take opium, given that his dreams were already so vivid), and describes entities which make their presence felt through the dream world.

As a result of this belief, Lovecraft's creations are often used in magical rituals. To what effect, I can not say, as my magical practice is very limited, and I am wary of attempting to invoke the Old Ones at this early stage (though in truth, there is a hint of this in my choice of user names).

For more information, see this link.Mythos Magic



posted on Jun, 8 2004 @ 06:48 AM
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I think most of the fantasy writers are more on something than onto something.

Except for Lewis Carroll. It is evident in his body of work that he was straight-laced, and never built any psychedelic references in anywhere in his conservative and conformist worlds.




posted on Jun, 8 2004 @ 07:17 AM
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I think the story of "John Titor" has the potential to be a great work of fiction. Spread across seventy turbulent Earth years, it could be an epic....unless it comes true...!!



posted on Jun, 8 2004 @ 07:31 AM
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Attend a local (or not so local) science fiction convention and TALK to these people.


...Sheesh.


Worldcon (this year it's also Noreastcon):
worldcon.org...
Japanese conventions
www.mmjp.or.jp...
Northwest US conventions
www.sfnorthwest.org...
North central US and Canada
www.visi.com...
Locus Magazine's international convention list
www.locusmag.com...

[edit on 8-6-2004 by Byrd]



posted on Jun, 8 2004 @ 07:33 AM
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Just to add to Flinx's post, yes Lovecraft was onto something more then just writing horrow. Some reports say that the writer was killed because he was getting close to the truth. I know I read this somewhere. I believe that it goes onto say that some secret society (The Illuminati?) killed him to keep quiet. Anyone know anything more?



posted on Jun, 8 2004 @ 12:43 PM
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hello everyone,

I think all the writers share the same thing: They all want to "share" or tell something in their writings.

Writing is a form of art. In art, the artist is "obliged" to show something, either good or bad. Not everyone understands it, but the ones who does, they will get the idea. The idea is always from the real world.



posted on Jun, 8 2004 @ 02:23 PM
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I been coming up with this story for awhile now myself - (don't know what form it'll be in such as book or RPG video game) and one of the funnest parts of it is creating hidden things in it. One of the main reasons I like reading scifi is that hidden stuff. Like some have said - LOTR has much christian symbolism in it, or so I'm told...





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