I have posted google map info many times, I thought I had in this thread but maybye not, here you go.

Go to Google Maps and type in Eastlake OHIO, I filemed these right on the Shore of Lake Erie in Eastlake

Seriously Defcon... I think most of us can tell the difference of fixed wing aircraft movement and something else. Go debunk somewhere else! I am not trying to be a jerk but after a while it gets annoying..if we are talking about a lady in her 60's then conjecture is fine..but Aircraft is really fairly easy to identiy especially over a lake where sound is AMPLIFIED.


AS

Originally posted by defcon5
So which was it, it was getting closer, or further?

? This is not hard to understand, I filmed object #2 because it was getting closer to me than object #1, THEN it either left at a high rate of speed or dissapeared. Take your pick

Originally posted by A SINCLAIR
Seriously Defcon... I think most of us can tell the difference of fixed wing aircraft movement and something else. Go debunk somewhere else! I am not trying to be a jerk but after a while it gets annoying..if we are talking about a lady in her 60's then conjecture is fine..but Aircraft is really fairly easy to identiy especially over a lake where sound is AMPLIFIED.


AS

Aparently not, as people are still believing that these lights are not normal aircraft landing lights.

Also note, that depending on wind direction, sound can be completely muffled. Those lights could be miles and miles away as well, it's hard to tell at night like that.

Originally posted by AgainstSecrecy

Originally posted by defcon5
Wow…
So now I am a government agent/debunker…
Makes you look like quite uninformed since so many folks on this site know what I do for a living. Perhaps you should look around some, and you can find out the truth too, the truth is out there…

Since you feel you have to defend yourself, you must count yourself in.

People only defend themselfs if they feel they have to...

You know considering I have never made it a big secret on this board what I do for a living now a days, I am wondering at what point that I should consider your very ignorant remarks a personal attack?

Funny how those that debunk UFO’s never seem get support from the board Mods.

I guess that if this continues unabated ill have little choice but to defend myself and make a public fool out of you.

Originally posted by groingrinder
I am not buying the "airplane landing light theory" and here is why. Traffic patterns do not bring airplanes in for miles low over water. Even when planes are only several miles from the airport, they are still thousands of feet up in the air.

But when your dealing with a large body of water your dealing with the curve of the earth. Same way you see the mast on a sailboat for quite awhile before seeing the body of the ship. Considering that those masts are often a hundred feet tall on a large ship, and yet thin, its amazing that the curve is that apparent over even a few miles.

Originally posted by Frozenthought
Go to Google Maps and type in Eastlake OHIO, I filemed these right on the Shore of Lake Erie in Eastlake

No I mean a closer area, like what park, not a whole city.
If you want to include the whole darn city then it will be quite easy to say you were right next to that airport posted earlier, and judging from the location of the landing lights in your video, I an guessing you were fairly close to that airport and just don’t wish to admit that.

Originally posted by defcon5
You know considering I have never made it a big secret on this board what I do for a living now a days, I am wondering at what point that I should consider your very ignorant remarks a personal attack?

Funny how those that debunk UFO’s never seem get support from the board Mods.

I guess that if this continues unabated ill have little choice but to defend myself and make a public fool out of you.

You know my friend...I don't feel the need to participate in flamewars, especially not on ATS. This is not a junkboard, this is a serious and credible board. If you want to troll, then feel free to do that somewhere else. Your postings are getting more and more annoying.

If you feel "personally attacked" by my sarcasm, then I can't help you.

"make a public fool out of you"
I don't consider this as a dangerous thread my friend, but if you feel, that you have to start a flamewar, so be it. I won't participate.

This stuff is offtopic anyway, so BTT

Originally posted by defcon5

Originally posted by groingrinder
I am not buying the "airplane landing light theory" and here is why. Traffic patterns do not bring airplanes in for miles low over water. Even when planes are only several miles from the airport, they are still thousands of feet up in the air.

But when your dealing with a large body of water your dealing with the curve of the earth. Same way you see the mast on a sailboat for quite awhile before seeing the body of the ship. Considering that those masts are often a hundred feet tall on a large ship, and yet thin, its amazing that the curve is that apparent over even a few miles.

You obviously refuse to look up in the sky to observe ACTUAL AIRPORT TRAFFIC!! THE Earth does not curve any differently over a body of water than it does over land. You may bluff somebody younger, or those who casually look up at the sky from time to time. However I have been looking up in the sky for better than 40 years now and I know what airplanes look like under ALL conditions. I also live near a traffic pattern for 3 airports. Go peddle your fairy tales elsewhere. Under no normal conditions will airplanes approach an airport from so low. When airplanes first turn on their landing lights, you can take your fist and hold it out at arms length straight up and down and it will fit comfortably between the airplanes and the horizon. At no point will the plane appear to be anywhere near the surface of the water. Airplanes maintain thousands of feet of altitude right up until they are about a mile away from landing.

Originally posted by AgainstSecrecy
You know my friend...I don't feel the need to participate in flamewars, especially not on ATS. This is not a junkboard, this is a serious and credible board. If you want to troll, then feel free to do that somewhere else. Your postings are getting more and more annoying.

ROFLMAO!!!

Who started calling who names?
Who started posting pictures of secret agents, and guys wearing blind folds??

What happened to the mason guys on here when they used similar tactics of posting pictures of fruitcakes???

So whom, my friend, is the troll around here????

Better look at the mirror and stop looking through the hole in the mirror.

What’s the matter, this thread cannot hold up to serious scrutiny?!?

Oh by the way, now I am a polysomnographer, look that up, it can be your new word for the day…

A lot of folks on here know that, because after attaining enough posts to be considered a serious member, they are in chat at night talking with me…

i want to mention something that i noticed in the video

look at about 1:52-1:53, like right after he switches to the night vision

see that beam of light in the air?

now, i live in a city with an airport, so i can say from first hand experience what that is.

you know those huge, rotating lights they have at airports, that act sort of like lighthouses, that just spin around and around and around, that are like extremely powerful flood lights. I cant explain it very well but I am sure you know what I mean.
yes?

i can confidently say that if that is not an airport in the bottom left hand corner, than their certainly is one nearby. Not saying these are planes, cuz i dont know. I also saw on youtube someone mentioned they might be police lights, hence the flashing and minute color change, which is plausible given that you can make out a hill in the background with the night vision on.

IF this was a plane, AND if this was some runway at a airport that was supposed to land, THEN, why in the world are there no LIGHTS on the RUNWAY??????

IF this was a runway, those lights would be illuminating even if was very faint. ESPECIALLY when the cameraman put on night vision, it would have picked up the flashing lights that lead the craft down or for that matter the AIRPORT lights itself OR even the surrounding structure around it IE: highways, lamp post, surrounding homes,stores or hangars.

Unless this is from an old movie airplane where the guy shuts off the lights (one of my fav. movies by the way) to the runway. Then I stand corrected,

MAYBE,

just maybe this was some kind of drill that day to test pilots skills just in case power shuts down.


This is definitely a strange clip, i just wish it wasn't soo damn dark.

AND for that matter if this was a plane WHERE are the blinking lights that are around the plane. You should be able to see those regardless how foggy it is, you can see those bad boys even when these planes are thousands of feet up in the air, so why not when they are landing??? We have so much damn pollution in the air that some light will reflect. In this video NADA (nothing lol) no haze, no nothing except for the lights we are debating about.

PEOPLE get focused,

Drop this plane BULL**** and think of another idea to debunk this (if it can be).

defcon5: Your post count does not make you a serious researcher. It is the content of your posts that does that.

Because you and others like to chat does not increase the validity of your posts.

[edit on 2-9-2007 by groingrinder]

I too live near major air traffic. Ohare. I have looked up and thought wow that could be a UFO but it's for like 10 seconds and then it becomes clear that it is an airplane. I am here to hopefully gain information and awareness that leads me to the truth. Defcon, I think, is here for other reasons in any case it's time to STFU! QUite honestly do you really think David Serada and Dan Akroyd would bother with footage that could even possibly be mistaken for an airplane? Come on!

AS

Originally posted by groingrinder
You obviously refuse to look up in the sky to observe ACTUAL AIRPORT TRAFFIC!! THE Earth does not curve any differently over a body of water than it does over land.

I used to be a ramp supervisor for an airlines, I looked at the sky more then you have. Yes, the world has a curve to it, and yes, it’s more obvious over the water because you have a view unobstructed by surface features. Aircraft call into flight ops 20 minutes prior to landing, and you CAN go outside after the call and locate their lights under the right conditions, here on the coast.

Originally posted by groingrinder
You may bluff somebody younger, or those who casually look up at the sky from time to time.

Maybe you can bluff someone that knows nothing about aviation and is just a casual aircraft observer.

Originally posted by groingrinder
At no point will the plane appear to be anywhere near the surface of the water.

Perhaps you can explain why after the space shuttle arc’s, it goes down again toward the water…
Maybe its going over the curve of the earth, and its altitude is not apparent to someone over that arc. Maybe you can explain why a ships mast shows up prior to the rest of the ship on the horizon. Maybe you can explain how I can see aircraft coming in from the coast and they appear to be only a few hundred feet off the ground when they are really thousands of feet up...

Well, I guess everyone ignored my first post but that's okay. Here are some more tips about Lake Erie that might also come into play with this discussion.

Lake Erie, just like any big body of water, creates mirages. Lake Erie separates Ohio from Canada and I think the distance is around 50 miles. On some really weird weather days there is a strange mirage that makes people think they can see over to Canada. It looks like land, buildings, trees, the whole deal, but it is not. It is some kind of freaky water effect mirage.

Also when you are out on the lake there are times when it looks like boats off in the horizon are flying. They look like they are hundreds of feet above the water. Again, this is some weird heat and water effect.

The same thing happens with lights. Lights off lake Erie bend and reflect in really strange ways. It is hard to explain but it can be super creepy at nighttime. It almost looks like ghosts or glowing fogs gliding around the Lake.

Airplanes also have strange effect that I cannot explain. Sometimes they look like they are flying low and then when they pass overhead they are actually very high in the sky. The planes often look like cars driving around in the sky. They seem to dip and curve like they are driving on mountain roads. I can't explain why but again, this is some kind of lake / environment effect.

I have spent years on that lake on islands like Put-in-Bay. You can see a lot of really strange things but I never saw anything over the lake that I thought was an actual UFO. I don't know how anyone would consider anything a real UFO though once they have seen all the weird effects that the lake can produce.

There is even a bar called "Mirage On the Water" at the Lake. Not sure if it is still there though. I have not been to Cleveland in a few years.


[edit on 9-2-2007 by zerotime]

Originally posted by lurkinginthedark
you know those huge, rotating lights they have at airports, that act sort of like lighthouses, that just spin around and around and around, that are like extremely powerful flood lights. I cant explain it very well but I am sure you know what I mean.
yes?

Yes, its called a rotating beacon light, they flash two green and one white.

Originally posted by whos_out_there
IF this was a plane, AND if this was some runway at a airport that was supposed to land, THEN, why in the world are there no LIGHTS on the RUNWAY??????

He had it zoomed out of the frame until he switched over to night vision, when it switched so did the zoom level.

Originally posted by whos_out_there
AND for that matter if this was a plane WHERE are the blinking lights that are around the plane.

I have answered this multiple times already, go back and read. Check the pictures I posted.


[edit on 2/9/2007 by defcon5]