Homosexuality and Religion

ok, today there is a huge arguement that homosexuality is against the bible, many try to avoid the subject, but we all know its happening.

my question is: Is it really against the Bible?

I am heterosexual, am an active Roman Catholic Christian, and have no quarels with people being homosexual. The Church's arguement is that if God wanted men to love ment and women to love women he would have made Adam and David or Eve and Elizabeth. But from what i understand the Bible never says Homosexuality is wrong. What it does state is that though shalt love thy neighbor like you love me(God). So is it really that wrong?


I am torn between this arguement because i believe in the Roman Catholic Church but I also believe that w/e floats your boat is yours to keep it floating.


What do all of you believe? I know this is a very sensitive topic, but I want some honest to God opinions.

[edit on 01/14/2007 by CrazyPolak]

I believe you should put down the bible.

What is more trustworthy? Your feelings? or the feelings of 1000's of strange men all mixed into one book?

Ok, i'm definitely not giving up on my religion because i disagree on whether homosexuality is wrong or alright. Religion is way too important to just give it up for a reason like that.

Keep your faith mate. Lose the organization.

can you elaborate on that? I'm not really understanding what u mean.

Originally posted by CrazyPolak
can you elaborate on that? I'm not really understanding what u mean.

I understand his meaning. He seems to feel the same way I do.

I will try and elaborate: Your beliefs and spirituality (in whatever you happen to believe in) is an important and powerful thing in ones life. However, religion and the orginized doctrines/belief systems only hinders ones ability to experience the spiritual world that is around us.

So in short: Keep your faith and drop your limitations.

I hope that helped.

Sure, I'll try my best.

There is nothing written in any religous material IMO, that isn't already in one's self. Reading and researching these religous materials is not bad in itself. They can offer a great guidance in your search. This is what I mean by 'faith'.

It is the dogma that surrounds these books, created by organized men/women, to tell you and me, what is being said. I can read, I'm sure you can read too. We don't need anyone telling us what the words in these books mean. This is what I mean by 'organization'.

A specific example may be something like this:

A young man or woman, growing up in a Protestant household and community, has some questions and some uneasy feelings about things they don't understand. This young man/woman travels to the local Protestant church to ask his/her priest or other high sitting church figure these questions. They get their answers, and all is well, because the 'church' should know the answers to their questions. This person is now fully indoctrinated into the dogma of their specific religion.

I would tell this person to visit the priests of the neighboring Catholic church and ask the same questions. Then move on to the local Synagogue and again ask the same questions. Then hit the local Mosque, the Temple, the Tee-Pee and so fourth. After all this, go sit on a bench on a park, and ponder what they had heard. This person is now fully indoctrinated into the dogma of themselves.

I hope that is clear. If not, I'll try again.

The Bible certainly says Homosexuality is wrong:

20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

This quite nicely sums it up.

There's far more hatred of homosexuality in the Bible though.

ALL that matters is LOVE.

The bible makes this clear and simple over and over. Ignore the snares laid in wait by Moses and Paul for your brethren's accusers (NOT you)...if their heart does not convict then neither does God.
Also: to the pure all things are pure.
Love from a pure heart loves without reservation.

Why does it not say anywhere in the bible AT ALL that a woman with a woman is not allowed? If Eve can do it, why not Adam?

Any love is good lovin', so I took what I could get; yes I took what I could get!

LOVE is the answer
LOVE is all we need
LOVE makes the world go around

And this is the ultimate, paradigm-shattering, truth
that i can and will personally attest to
if not then God or nature strike me dead as I write :

LOVE overcomes death
LOVE is stronger than death
LOVE can and will wake the dead

so...GOD is LOVE
and you believe in GOD
and also believe in LOVE
and LOVE brought GOD back to life
not God.

This was shocking to me.
LOVE is more powerful than even GOD!
LOVE does not EVER die.

And if you are not homosexual, then do not give it another thought.
At all.
Why judge an activity you don't partake in?
Why judge an activity?

God bless you and all those you love!

Women are included at Romans 1:24-27

...for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the women, burned in their lust one toward another...

Naturally we're like the animals. Males mate with females and then the females have offspring. The system of procreation. Homosexuality is against that nature. Notice that the animals don't have the desire to go against that nature. Why are humans different? Because we're made in God's image. There is no sexes in the spirit realm. Notice that the scriptures always say the angels and God are always described as men. There is no female type. So how do you download the mind of spirit creature, with no sexual characteristics, into the body of a fleshly-like animal? Very carefully. Adam and Eve were made with bodily perfection. The fleshly design would not have deviated off course, along with their offspring. The problem is that Adam and Eve chose to leave God by eating of the forbidden fruit and so God allowed the human design to faulter without his intervening. Mankind must have been dealing with the homosexual desire for a long time now, because it was first mentioned during the era of the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. That's about 4000 years ago.

But it is scientifically possible for a woman to have a baby without even having sex. If this happened then the baby would be a girl because the sperm donates the X or Y which is the gender marker gene.

And if men keep harems then what do the other 999 do while the one is entertaining the King? And of course the eunuchs are out-numbered 3 to 1 except in the perfect concubine system.

Originally posted by lostinspace
Notice that the animals don't have the desire to go against that nature. Why are humans different?

This has been proven wrong many times. There are incidents of homosexuality in nature as well. It is obviously a natural phenomenon.

en.wikipedia.org...

[edit on 9-2-2007 by VladTheImpaler]

I believe in 'love the sinner, hate the sin'. What people do behind closed doors is their own business if it is consentual. Do I think it's wrong? Yes, based on my belief in the Bible. Am I going to do anything to stop them from living the lifestyle they want? No.

I only ever met one openly gay person, and I got along with him just fine. I didn't try telling him that he was 'living in sin' or anything, although I did disapprove of his lifestyle. I just tried to accept the guy for what he was.

If homosexual behaviour is evil in the eyes of God, well, it only hurts those practicing it, and not the rest of us, so I say let them if they want. If it isn't evil, then it doesn't hurt anyone at all.

There are some Bibilcal scriptures that say homosexuality is wrong. They typically use the language 'lusting after strange flesh' or 'lying with man as with woman' or something like that, since the word homosexuality did not exist until more recently in English. I'd have to actually not be lazy and look them up to find them specifically, but I have seen them in both the old and new testaments.

CrazyPolak,

You're probably referring to thread about Ted Haggard on ATS in which I and a few others are arguing the "sinfulness" of homosexuality (unless you meant "today" in the broader sense of the time in which we live i.e. 21 century). If that's the case then I suppose there's no real need for me to restate everything I said in that thread. (either way I don't feel like reiterating what I've already said lol)

But I will say this:

The quotes that people are posting in here are known as "The Clobber Passages", they're basically a homophobe's best weapon in denouncing homosexuality as far as the Bible is concerned. However, it becomes quite clear, given a proper understanding of the historic and scriptual context in which these passages were written, that they are not denouncing homosexuality as a whole.

Some passages are denouncing the cult temple prostitutes, as many cults had prostitutes in their temple both as priests and priestess in some instances and as a means to support the temple monetarily. The prostitutes were both male and female and both catered to both male and female clients.

Other passages are denouncing the sexual immorality of the Romans. The passage from Romans one posted mentioned is such a passage. It stated that these people were heterosexual and able to enjoy a straight relationship but turned to homosexuality in their opulent endulgences.

Ex posted a great link which you should all read:

Homosexuality and the Bible


Now, as for the question of whether homosexuality is a sin, you need to go by your heart and what you know to be true from your study of the Bible. You seem smart enough to not need someone to tell you how to feel about something. You need to decide for yourself, based off prayer, meditation, and the reading of scripture, whether or not it is a sin.

Anyone who tries to make God exclusive, who tries to say you can't get into heaven because of something you can't change, is not a Christian in my opinion.

Jesus broke bread with all manner of sinners and unclean people, he was condemned by the religious leaders for it but we follow Jesus, not the Pharisees.

EDIT: for clarity

[edit on 9-2-2007 by Shadowflux]