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By Zeus!

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posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 03:00 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
I have to wonder at where they are getting their rituals from,


I seem to recall that the Olympic torch was lit from a fire from a pagan ceremony this last time (or was it the time before??). One of the times it was lit from a fire there and then there was a relay of the fire from the pagan ceremony .... They actually had women dressed as priestess' and had them around a giant fire at one of the temples somewhere over that way. I'm pretty sure it was Greece since that's where the Olympics originated.

Wonder where they got their ceremonies? They had 'em ... somehow.




posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 03:30 PM
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Originally posted by rocknroll
Exactly. Organized religion is not telling people what they want to hear.
They don't want guilt; but guilt is good it keeps us from being bad.

Wow.


That is way convoluted - especially when compared against the main tenet of mainstream christianity - don't you yourself profess christianity? - the main idea being that a NON GUILTY man died in a horrid way in from of his mother and wife...and if you believe that then you will be GUILTLESS.

Bovine feces. grrrrrr.


Nobody likes to be told they are wrong.

Well, NO, not about something that is both totally subjective and and individual matter which should be off limits from busybodies who have no right to judge.
And that is why YOU are WRONG too.


This is why religious people have a problem with pagans: religious folk feel pagans are spiritually irresponsible. This will always be the view taken by the religious.

Yeah, well that is the main source of the problem - you obviously think that we are all wrong BUT you are justified because YOU are CORRECT.

Well i forfeit my right to be correct just so no one else has to be chipped at. Except the chippers, that is.
I say you are wrong and totally oblivious to how you are perceived by the rest of us.
Oh yeah - I'm totally wrong, too.
That way it's fair..i mean 'just.'



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 04:13 PM
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Annie, I don't waste my time responding to anything fundies say.. They have a right to believe as they wish, but to me, it holds little to no truth.

I let them have their opinion, because that is what they are, and I continue to have mine.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

From what I understand, that is eesentially how pagans view things. They view the gods and goddesses as sort of attributes of a singular God. I don't see anything wrong with that.


not so, i myself am what is termed a norse heathen. the only modern pagan relgions that adhere to what this paragraph says are the wiccans and some hindus who want to be in good with christianity for whatever reason. the vast majority of pagan religions, of which there are litterally hundreds if not a thousand or more, are polytheistic in the truest sense of the word.
not to belittle anyone's belief, but it seems to me a little rediculous and illogical to believe that it is possible for one deity to create itself but for no others to do so. if one god exists then any number of gods should also exist. although whether any exist at all is debatable.
hope a pagan's point of view came in handy



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 07:31 PM
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@ Optimus

Well, whatever the case may be..I think it is your right to believe as you wish. As far as why Hindus are trying to "buddy" up to Christianity, it's,at least from my perspective, simple. Hindus and Muslims have been fighting for centuries... While Christianity doesn't necessarily approve of Hinduism, it's not viewed with the same disdain as it is in Islam.. When the stuff hits the fans between the religions, as it eventually will, I personally think Hindus and Christians both will have conflict with Islam.

Bottom line is, as "unaccepting" as we think Christians are of other faiths, I don't think Christianity comes nearly as close to being "unaccepting" as Islam does. That may be a misunderstanding on my part of the Islamic faith, but that is just my perspective.

[edit on 7-2-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 07:42 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
It's a historical fact that Judaism,Christianity and Islam have persecuted pagans.


Oh sure. I agree with you. But honestly, I didn't see the article as a shout out to Christians to 'get the Pagans'. It just seemed like information to me. Information about the Greek Orthodox not being happy with the upswing in Pagan activity ... something that is important when you want to look at potential modern pagan persecution rising up.


Would not supprise me if it did end up that way, making Christians mad.

The Greek Mythology is far far older then Christianity... Why didn't the Christian god appear to one the most powerful civilizations to ever exist? Or to the Romans who used Greek Mythology? ... Their "peagan" religion is older then Christians, so I hope I do not see Christians telling them they are wrong..



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by Royal76
I don't care, more room in heaven, if you ask me. Of course if you ask my parents I could be joining them in Hell either way.


no kidding.... I think its foolish to worship something like the sun in this day and age. In ancient times people that it was a god, now we know better.

I am not saying they are going to hell, but I will believe in Christ anyday over worshipping an idol or pagan god. Just my personal opinion.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 07:56 PM
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This is why religious people have a problem with pagans: religious folk feel pagans are spiritually irresponsible. This will always be the view taken by the religious.


This is your problem apparently. I doubt you can speak for all religious folk.

IMO (and i'm always right, always) , the view probably taken by most religous folk is as simple as right and wrong. I'm right, your wrong. Nothing about irresponsibility.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 07:57 PM
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Originally posted by Rockpuck


Would not supprise me if it did end up that way, making Christians mad.

The Greek Mythology is far far older then Christianity... Why didn't the Christian god appear to one the most powerful civilizations to ever exist? Or to the Romans who used Greek Mythology? ... Their "peagan" religion is older then Christians, so I hope I do not see Christians telling them they are wrong..


Well, before Christ it was judaism. which dates to roughly 2000 BC, so it may not be neccesarily older.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:00 PM
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I am not saying they are going to hell, but I will believe in Christ anyday over worshipping an idol or pagan god. Just my personal opinion.


Great! So now we know why you chose your faith. Not for what it represents, and/or teaches, but that an unproven life of a mythical character, written in a terribly uncohesive book, is more believable. Sad really.

Maybe you should reevaluate your own faith. Then come and tell us about others.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:02 PM
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So many different religions and pantheons were born from the original Greek beliefs, it isn't even funny.

Of course, there are even a lot of theories stating that Christianity and Old Test. material came from Greek mythos.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:06 PM
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Originally posted by XphilesPhan

Well, before Christ it was judaism. which dates to roughly 2000 BC, so it may not be neccesarily older.


Certainly you are not going to make the claim that Judaism is the world's oldest religion...Certainly not..



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:06 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38


That is way convoluted - especially when compared against the main tenet of mainstream christianity - don't you yourself profess christianity? - the main idea being that a NON GUILTY man died in a horrid way in from of his mother and wife...and if you believe that then you will be GUILTLESS.

Bovine feces. grrrrrr.


ahhh, so you are passing judgment on christianity, and you are somehow justified in this? Have you ever read the bible? Obviously you havent if you are under the impression Jesus had a wife, and dont give me that mary magdelen crap. Thet was never in the scripture and is purely conjecture that has no basis in historical fact. Jesus died in a horrible way so that mankind didnt, once again, incur the wrath of the Lord. It was also a sacrifice on the part of Christ and a gift from God. Because Christ paid the price for ALL sins, no one that follows Christ will ever have to pay for them. The gift was salvation and a path to God paid for by the blood of His only son.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:19 PM
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I was raised in a Greek Orthodox church and my father is Greek, born in Athens. I left the church, it was too hypocritical and offered no reasoning for its 'traditional' [aka closed minded] beliefs.

I support anyones right to worship whatever they want to or not to worship anything at all as long as they aren't disturbing or hurting anyone else in the process. If you honestly need a set of rules to live by on pain of eternal suffering, than you should probably keep believing that for the rest of the worlds safety and well being, but those of us that freely choose to show love without fear of punishment have no need for something like that.

I don't believe that there are many gods, or that numbers need exist wherever 'heaven' and 'god' are, if indeed they are, and I think they are. God might be everyone in one, and neither single nor many. But I do not feel that Christ is anymore a God than you or me, nor that God is a bearded man sitting on a throne in the clouds. Funny, because thats how both Christians and Greek pagans seem to interpret the visual representation of their 'king' gods, so perhaps there is a connection between them.


And if many thousands of near death experiences are anything to go by, we all go to heaven eventually, athiest-pagan-muslim-jew-christian, whatever.

[edit on 7-2-2007 by BallOfPopulation]



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:36 PM
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Originally posted by rocknroll
Organized religion is not telling people what they want to hear.
They don't want guilt; but guilt is good it keeps us from being bad.

You misunderstood me. People want organized religion to tell them it's okay to be homosexual, it's okay to have abortions, it's okay to screw your brains out with whomever you want.


Originally posted by queenannie38
That is way convoluted - especially when compared against the main tenet of mainstream christianity - don't you yourself profess christianity? - the main idea being that a NON GUILTY man died in a horrid way in from of his mother and wife...and if you believe that then you will be GUILTLESS.

LOL!
"His wife"?????? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!
Queenie, as usual you don't make a bit of sense.


Originally posted by queenannie38
....individual matter which should be off limits from busybodies who have no right to judge.....

Your body is His Temple, your spirit is His creation.



Originally posted by queenannie38
Yeah, well that is the main source of the problem - you obviously think that we are all wrong BUT you are justified because YOU are CORRECT.

Yep, this is what makes you a pagan, and me a Christian.


Originally posted by queenannie38
I say you are wrong and totally oblivious to how you are perceived by the rest of us.

Ah, so you are the spokeperson for ATS.



Originally posted by queenannie38
Oh yeah - I'm totally wrong, too.

You don't have to tell me. I know this.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:39 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Annie, I don't waste my time responding to anything fundies say...

Think before you speak. I'm not a fundie. I'm just a plain ol Catholic.
Wanna bash that too?
I believe in God's word, is that a problem?


[edit on 7-2-2007 by rocknroll]



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:49 PM
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Frankly yes. Can you tell me God's word?

Why didn't Jesus write his own testimonies?
Why didn't any of his immediate disciples?
Were they all illiterate?

You believe in MAN's word.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 08:56 PM
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Originally posted by XphilesPhan

Originally posted by Rockpuck


Would not supprise me if it did end up that way, making Christians mad.

The Greek Mythology is far far older then Christianity... Why didn't the Christian god appear to one the most powerful civilizations to ever exist? Or to the Romans who used Greek Mythology? ... Their "peagan" religion is older then Christians, so I hope I do not see Christians telling them they are wrong..


Well, before Christ it was judaism. which dates to roughly 2000 BC, so it may not be neccesarily older.


OK. Fair enough.

Judaism was most likely coppied off of Egyptian Mythology, only converted while under slavery. The actual ate of Jewish emergance is unknown..

Also, relgions by Picts and Celts date back almost 3,000 years, Hinduism back before Judaism, and Nature worship and Animalism tens od thousands before Jews walked the earth.

It should also be noted the God in the old testament, while is the same god, is not the same god buy action, reason, and can hardly be compared, as Islam is the same way, same god.. acts completely different. Why is that? Because Society makes a religion, religion does not make a society.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by nextguyinline
Frankly yes. Can you tell me God's word?

It's called the Bible. Pick it up and read it.


Originally posted by nextguyinline
Why didn't Jesus write his own testimonies?

Obviously he didn't have to.


Originally posted by nextguyinline
Why didn't any of his immediate disciples?

They did, but people like you without faith refuse to believe this.


Originally posted by nextguyinline
Were they all illiterate?

No.


Originally posted by nextguyinline
You believe in MAN's word.

I believe this would better define you, since you doubt the Holy Bible.



posted on Feb, 7 2007 @ 09:45 PM
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Originally posted by XphilesPhanObviously you havent if you are under the impression Jesus had a wife, and dont give me that mary magdelen crap. Thet was never in the scripture and is purely conjecture that has no basis in historical fact


And who wrote 'the scripture'? Jesus? God? Joseph? The Bible (I presume) was written (and constantly revised) by humans. And, like all humans, is flawed. Do you honestly believe that all the information that you read in 'the Scriptures' was written exactly the same as it was 2000+ years ago albeit in another language? No of course not.
The early church omitted information that didn't fit in with their doctrine. Do you think they'd leave hints that Jesus COULD have had a wife and family? No because it would question his divinity and the status of the early church.
Also I wouldn't call the Bible 'historical fact'.


Originally posted by XphilesPhan
. Jesus died in a horrible way so that mankind didnt, once again, incur the wrath of the Lord. It was also a sacrifice on the part of Christ and a gift from God. Because Christ paid the price for ALL sins, no one that follows Christ will ever have to pay for them. The gift was salvation and a path to God paid for by the blood of His only son.

Now this is the confusing part. What about the billions of souls in Ancient Asia, Africa, the Americas and Pacific etc that WEREN'T brought Christianity 'till the Age of Reason or after that? Do they deserve eternal damnation because they didn't know about Christianity?

Anyway in my opinion Greek mythology is one of the most ancient known(and organised) polytheistic religions. The only older one would have been Egyptian mythology.

Also what about the animalistic/spiritual tribal cults? Aren't they the oldest?

[edit on 7-2-2007 by Chaoticar]



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