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Originally posted by Muaddib
The question is, if it is mankind who is to blame for global warming because of the CO2 being released by mankind in the atmosphere and the chemicals released in the oceans, why did the increase in temperatures began deep under the Earth's crust first?
Anybody care to anwser that question?
Originally posted by grover
Your hypothesis sounds good on Muaddib but it would be interesting to run it past a real scientist who actually knows what they are talking about and see what they say.
.............
Originally posted by Astronomer70
Muaddib you are also saying, all-be-it in a round-about way, that the IPCC report is a political report as much as anything else. The IPCC certainly has access to all the data from all the sources you cite, yet they basically just dismiss that data. Why is that?
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Originally posted by Muaddib
Rantings huh?....
RealClimate is a commentary site on climate science by working climate scientists for the interested public and journalists. We aim to provide a quick response to developing stories and provide the context sometimes missing in mainstream commentary. The discussion here is restricted to scientific topics and will not get involved in any political or economic implications of the science. The people
Originally posted by Regenmacher
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So go post a forecast and leave out anthropogenic factors, then we shall see if your all blow or not. I say you have no such courage and you only know how to hindcast.
Originally posted by Muaddib
This coming from the same person who in order to refute evidence uses a website which claims everyone who does not agree with their opinion is just a layperson despite the fact that there are several prominent scientists who can refute these claims?...
Originally posted by Muaddib
This coming from the same person who in order to refute evidence uses a website which claims everyone who does not agree with their opinion is just a layperson despite the fact that there are several prominent scientists who can refute these claims?...
Dr Sami Solanki, the director of the renowned Max Planck Institute for Solar System Research in Gottingen, Germany, who led the research, said: "The Sun has been at its strongest over the past 60 years and may now be affecting global temperatures.
"The Sun is in a changed state. It is brighter than it was a few hundred years ago and this brightening started relatively recently - in the last 100 to 150 years."
Slow variations in the Earth's orbit around the Sun change where and when solar energy is received on Earth. This affects the amount of energy that is reflected and absorbed. These orbital variations are believed to be a factor in initiating the ice ages.
Before the industrial age and extensive use of fossil fuels, the concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere stood at about 280 parts per million, scientists have determined.
Average readings at the 11,141-foot Mauna Loa Observatory, where carbon dioxide density peaks each northern winter, hovered around 379 parts-per-million on Friday, compared with about 376 a year ago.
That year-to-year increase of about 3 parts per million is considerably higher than the average annual increase of 1.8 parts per million over the past decade, and markedly more accelerated than the 1-part-per-million annual increase recorded a half-century ago, when observations were first made here.
Asked to explain the stepped-up rate, climatologists were cautious, saying data needed to be further evaluated. But Asia immediately sprang to mind.
“China is taking off economically and burning a lot of fuel. India, too,” said Pieter Tans, a prominent carbon-cycle expert at NOAA's Boulder lab.
Another leading climatologist, Ralph Keeling, whose father, Charles D. Keeling, developed methods for measuring carbon dioxide, noted that the rate “does fluctuate up and down a bit,” and said it was too early to reach conclusions. But he added: “People are worried about `feedbacks.' We are moving into a warmer world.”
He explained that warming itself releases carbon dioxide from the ocean and soil. By raising the gas's level in the atmosphere, that in turn could increase warming, in a “positive feedback,” said Keeling, of San Diego's Scripps Institution of Oceanography.
The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change projects that, if unchecked, atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations by 2100 will range from 650 to 970 parts per million. As a result, the panel estimates, average global temperature would probably rise by 1.4 to 5.8 degrees Celsius (2.7 and 10.4 degrees Fahrenheit) between 1990 and 2100.
Dr Sami Solanki, the director of the renowned Max Planck Institute for Solar System Research in Gottingen, Germany, who led the research, said: "The Sun has been at its strongest over the past 60 years and may now be affecting global temperatures.
"The Sun is in a changed state. It is brighter than it was a few hundred years ago and this brightening started relatively recently - in the last 100 to 150 years."
Slow variations in the Earth's orbit around the Sun change where and when solar energy is received on Earth. This affects the amount of energy that is reflected and absorbed. These orbital variations are believed to be a factor in initiating the ice ages.
Before the industrial age and extensive use of fossil fuels, the concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere stood at about 280 parts per million, scientists have determined.
Average readings at the 11,141-foot Mauna Loa Observatory, where carbon dioxide density peaks each northern winter, hovered around 379 parts-per-million on Friday, compared with about 376 a year ago.
That year-to-year increase of about 3 parts per million is considerably higher than the average annual increase of 1.8 parts per million over the past decade, and markedly more accelerated than the 1-part-per-million annual increase recorded a half-century ago, when observations were first made here.
Asked to explain the stepped-up rate, climatologists were cautious, saying data needed to be further evaluated. But Asia immediately sprang to mind.
“China is taking off economically and burning a lot of fuel. India, too,” said Pieter Tans, a prominent carbon-cycle expert at NOAA's Boulder lab.
Another leading climatologist, Ralph Keeling, whose father, Charles D. Keeling, developed methods for measuring carbon dioxide, noted that the rate “does fluctuate up and down a bit,” and said it was too early to reach conclusions. But he added: “People are worried about `feedbacks.' We are moving into a warmer world.”
He explained that warming itself releases carbon dioxide from the ocean and soil. By raising the gas's level in the atmosphere, that in turn could increase warming, in a “positive feedback,” said Keeling, of San Diego's Scripps Institution of Oceanography.
The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change projects that, if unchecked, atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations by 2100 will range from 650 to 970 parts per million. As a result, the panel estimates, average global temperature would probably rise by 1.4 to 5.8 degrees Celsius (2.7 and 10.4 degrees Fahrenheit) between 1990 and 2100.
Originally posted by centurion1211
Face it. You're talking about competing theories for what's happening and that no has proved anything yet. I even saw a theory that changes in the cosmic ray flux affects cloud cover and thus global warming/cooling. I saw another one that says without this warming effect, we'd be headed for ther mini-ice age.
Predictive power
The predictive power of a scientific theory refers to its ability to generate testable predictions. Theories with strong predictive power are highly valued, because the predictions can often encourage the falsification of the theory. The concept of predictive power differs from explanatory or descriptive power (where phenomena that are already known are retrospectively explained by a given theory) in that it allows a prospective test of theoretical understanding.
Originally posted by FoxStriker
yes we can stop global warming... we have the technology to do so.
but do we want to use it, the cost in money could be to much, would we give up our life still for it... i really doubt it... would 3rd world countries agree... nope. it would cause mass starvation...
weve hit over population as it is
although it is extremely possible though
Originally posted by LogansRun
But thats just the point, those "prominent" scientists that you call them aren't in the general concensus as the rest of the scientifici community are on the topic.
Originally posted by LogansRun
Just because there are a few scientists that say differently does'nt make them correct. Back when GW was just a forming theory, many scientists (most actually) didn't take it seriously as they couldn't fathom mankind affecting the earth on that scale.
Originally posted by LogansRun
These scientists that you post about have their own theories that may or may not have some basis in fact - the rest of the scientific sommunity happen to disagree with them.
Do you really think there is some mass worldwide conspiracy with all the worlds scientists collaborating with liberals on this to demonize man?? Do you realize how insane that sounds??
Originally posted by Muaddib
Yet many of them come from different camps, different countries and agree that something else must be going on because of what the "real data", and not "proxies", show.
Originally posted by Muaddib
There are more than "just a few scientists who disagree that mankind has not caused global warming. Just because you don't hear it in the news, the newspapers, or even in some internet websites, does not mean they are only a few.
Originally posted by Muaddib
Their data is based on fact....on real measured data, not on "proxies made up of variables which has been proven to be wrong, such as the data from the Hockey Stick Graph.
Originally posted by Regenmacher
................
You don't even know what borehole data represents, where as model simulations all show that it is not possible to explain the anomalous late 20th century warmth without including the contribution from anthropogenic forcing factors.
...............
Unresolved Issues with the Assessment of Multi-Decadal Global Land-Surface Temperature Trends
Roger A. Pielke Sr., University of Colorado, CIRES/ATOC, Boulder, CO, 80309
Christopher A. Davey, Desert Research Institute, 2215 Raggio Parkway, Reno, NV 89512
Dev Niyogi, Souleymane Fall, and Jesse Steinweg-Woods, Purdue University, Department of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences and Department of Agronomy, 915 W. State St., West Lafayette, IN 47907
Ken Hubbard and Xiaomao Lin, School of Natural Resources, University of Nebraska-Lincoln, NE 68583-0997
Ming Cai, Department of Meteorology
Young-Kwon Lim, Center for Ocean-Atmospheric Prediction Studies Florida State University, Tallahassee, FL 32306
Hong Li, Department of Atmospheric and Oceanic Science, University of Maryland, College Park, MD, 20742
John Nielsen-Gammon, Department of Atmospheric Sciences, Texas A&M University College Station, TX 77843-3150
Kevin Gallo, NOAA/NESDIS, Center for Satellite Applications and Research, Camp Springs, MD 20746
Robert Hale, CIRA, Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO 80523
Jim Angel, Illinois State Water Survey, Dept. of Natural Resources
2204 Griffith Drive, Champaign IL 61820-7495
Rezaul Mahmood and Stuart Foster, Dept. of Geography and Geology, Western Kentucky University, Bowling Green, KY 42101
Richard T. McNider, Department of Atmospheric Science University of Alabama in Huntsville, Huntsville, AL 35899
Peter Blanken, Department of Geography and Environmental Studies, University of Colorado, Boulder, CO 80501-0260
Keywords: Air temperature, Global Warming, Climate Change, Surface Temperature, Historical Climate Network, Climate Uncertainty/Index Terms 1600 (Global Change); 1637-Regional Climate Change;
3309-Climatology; 3305-Climate Change and Variability; 3322-Land-Atmosphere Interactions 11/07/06
Abstract
The paper documents various unresolved issues in using surface temperature trends as a metric for assessing global and regional climate change. A series of examples ranging from errors caused by temperature measurements at a monitoring station to the undocumented biases
in the regionally and globally averaged time series are provided. The issues are poorly understood or documented and relate to micrometeorological impacts due to warm bias in nighttime minimum temperatures, poor siting of the instrumentation, effect of winds as well as surface atmospheric water vapor content on temperature trends, the quantification of uncertainties in the homogenization of surface temperature data and the influence of land use/land-cover (LULC) change on surface temperature trends.