Originally posted by REASON

Originally posted by IMMORTAL

Originally posted by elevatedone
I know there are many reasons we do it and some of them are good ones, but I've wondered, when is someone going to come here and kick us around ?

I believe someone already has--the wtc terrorist attacks killed a lot of innocent lives.

Wow !!! u are very observant!! It didn't even occur to me terrorists could be a threat to the USA and its citizen. (sarcasm)

The terrorists want us all dead because of jealousy and if the had nuks or chem / bio Sept 11, 2001, the FOR SURE WOULD HAVE USED IT!!!!!!

terrorist = disease

Pres. Bush = Cure

GOT BLESS PRES. Bush and GOD BLESS the U.S.A.

Sorry for insulting you but you are a patriotic fool.

If these people had nukes and yes some of them do. They wouldn't just nuke for just being jelous as they couldn't care less for you and your modern ways as you become enslaved to your government look at the USA patriot act 1 and 2 and have a real think of who it benefits??

Your government if looking for terrorists on the streets of your country when they should concentrate on the borders to stop terrorists getting into the country in the first place now I am stating this as a fact that I, ME am smarter than YOUR president. Sorry for such a big ego but your president is so stupid he has to have cues and electronic means to talk to your population.

He is pro-war because he know's nothing else, listen to his voice when he is asked a unpredetermined question and listen to him choke on his own voice. You can have your own opinion to president but honestly you must see past the patriotism to see what he really is.

Some people say the President of the USA is the most powerful man in the world. They are soooooo wrong this guy is suposed to be in control of many, many nukes I bet his trgger finger is itching to press the red button.
Why have you not just nuked the middle-east back to the stone age well the fact that saudi-arabia has over a trillion dollors in the banks of america and the bush family is very, very friendly to the middle-east that is until they want something.

All societies decay and fall. They are often rebuilt, but they all fall at one time or another whether by conquest or implosion is the only question. As for the terrorists, they didn't hit us because they were jealous. They have a fundamental religious belief that spurs thier actions. They view us as a country mixed with heathens and christians. They have a mission to convert both. The difference is, Most religions teach convert or go to hell, their religion teaches convert or we will kill you and send you to hell. As for Bush being the cure, wake up and smell the coffee. The president doesn't call the shots anymore. Hasn't for a long long time F.D.R. saw to that. The CFR runs the show. If you don't play their game, you don't get elected. All presidents from F.D.R. since have played the game. Don't blame the leaders, it is our fault. We are the ones who fell asleep and let this happen. But back to the topic at hand. Go check out Jeremiah chapter 4. It may very well be talking about the destruction of America. When you read it, think about this: God calls Israel his people, so who is the daughter of his people?

Originally posted by Hunting Veritas

Originally posted by REASON

Originally posted by IMMORTAL

Originally posted by elevatedone
I know there are many reasons we do it and some of them are good ones, but I've wondered, when is someone going to come here and kick us around ?

I believe someone already has--the wtc terrorist attacks killed a lot of innocent lives.

Wow !!! u are very observant!! It didn't even occur to me terrorists could be a threat to the USA and its citizen. (sarcasm)

The terrorists want us all dead because of jealousy and if the had nuks or chem / bio Sept 11, 2001, the FOR SURE WOULD HAVE USED IT!!!!!!

terrorist = disease

Pres. Bush = Cure

GOT BLESS PRES. Bush and GOD BLESS the U.S.A.

Sorry for insulting you but you are a patriotic fool.

If these people had nukes and yes some of them do. They wouldn't just nuke for just being jelous as they couldn't care less for you and your modern ways as you become enslaved to your government look at the USA patriot act 1 and 2 and have a real think of who it benefits??

Your government if looking for terrorists on the streets of your country when they should concentrate on the borders to stop terrorists getting into the country in the first place now I am stating this as a fact that I, ME am smarter than YOUR president. Sorry for such a big ego but your president is so stupid he has to have cues and electronic means to talk to your population.

He is pro-war because he know's nothing else, listen to his voice when he is asked a unpredetermined question and listen to him choke on his own voice. You can have your own opinion to president but honestly you must see past the patriotism to see what he really is.

Some people say the President of the USA is the most powerful man in the world. They are soooooo wrong this guy is suposed to be in control of many, many nukes I bet his trgger finger is itching to press the red button.
Why have you not just nuked the middle-east back to the stone age well the fact that saudi-arabia has over a trillion dollors in the banks of america and the bush family is very, very friendly to the middle-east that is until they want something.

HV you speak the truth. It is incredible to see the American public being taken in by the events of the past six years. I'm an American and a former member of the US military.
To me it seems surreal and downright Orwellian that the people seem to support and believe what this bunch tells them. The current President Bush is an obvious figurehead that is controlled by a cadre of corporate America.
My children have extrapolated that for themselves and they are 13 and 15 years old.
I'm 45, a combat veteran of 12 years service and I'm here to tell you that the America they sing about in those songs does not exist today.
The nations of the world do not appreciate the role and arrogance we have taken on in the past fifty years. I don't understand how what is obvious to the rest of the world goes somehow unseen by the population of our own country.
The wars of the recent past were not waged for the reasons given by our lip service leaders. They were wars waged for economics and power. The rest of the world is NOT jealous. They are pissed off. Just as you would be pissed off if someone came here and started dictating right and wrong to us.
Do not live under the dillusion that most of the world is for us. We are the power and wealth that is, for this time. If Tahihti held the same power and wealth, the world would be wearing grass skirts just to cuury favor.
Be alert! We need more lerts.

I agree with the guy that wrote the message above me. I'm Canadian and probly a lot more forgiving of what is going on in the states right now than the peoples of other nations that haven't had such a long history of friendship as the USA and Canada. But the rest of the world is not jealous, jealous of what? Canada, most of the EU, Japan, etc., all have similar standards of living and lifestyles to the USA.. if you were to be shown a picture of a large Canadian or German city, you would not be able to tell it from an American counterpart unless you recognized a landmark. We do not envy your role as a military superpower, as there is nobody left to fight... and if there were, the rest of the western powers could take them out quite readily without the USA, providing we could decide on a plan and enact it without too much squabling, which is argueable... hehe. But we are just made a little nervous when the toughest kid on the block is taking swings and making threats to half the people in the room.... makes us wonder when we're next. I think that in this day and age we can find other ways to solve the world's problems... and if you think about it, they really are quite minor ones compared to our capabilities... than the threat of massive organized destructive conflict... I mean, it worked for Ghengis Khan, but I think we can come up with better solutions. That is more or less what the western world is trying to tell America... The rest of the world is saying something more along the lines of 'mind yer own darn business'. Just my take on the situation, glad to hear comments.

Okay, for the rest of the world to understand whats going on in the U.S. here it goes. after 9/11 USA had legitimate reason to enter afghanistan and remove the taliban. Only afghanistan! that was it. Instead bush has taken this as a way to go on a crusade to line his pockets. There should have been no invasion of Iraq.
WMD's aside,which were really never proven and was just speculation, it didn't matter what iraq did, that wasn't the point. The point was that bush was getting less money than he would of liked for oil. Saddam, if he was guilty of anything it was cutting the oil prices by "illegally" selling the oil. All of these 'atrocities' saddam comitted,probably happened, but were trumped up as an excuse for an invasion of iraq to prevent them from selling cheap oil. If we were so concerned about saddam gasing his people this should have been done years ago. it wasn't a concern then just as it isnt now. it was just dirt to make the US seem less aggressive. now that bush controls the taps in iraq, we see the result. a sharp rise in oil prices. The bushs are now making twice as much money for the cost of a few american soldiers who's families will never see the money they are owed and deserve. I am very patriotic but i know what drives bush and it is the same for both parties, money. we have shaken up the world by going from a somewhat peaceful group who stuck to themselves to almost a police state. this is what has everyone so scared.

Ok first to the point on USA falling or being destroyed. I don't think the world today can be compared to the world of old. Things have gone to far USA is to strong we are beyond the point of return. Given the fact that America sits on a thrown of power with its fingers in everything it wont be long before the world is more and more controlled and united than you realize. In a 50 years or so countries will be more of a symbol rather than a reality. In a sense now we (USA) use our power to control things other countries do. In my opinion I don't see the USA falling I see it changing. With the soon to be moon base mining (helium 3) for a new source of energy and gas company's being threatened the world will change into a world of corporations. Fighting over resources and influencing governments even more than they already do.

I think going into Iraq was the right thing for many reasons. Most people don't like change and cant see past the current situation. Its like doing construction on a house. You go in the place looks nice then you destroy everything inside only to rebuild it to be beautiful and more efficient.

One of the many reasons we went into Iraq was the fact that the region itself is dominated by religion. Religion is powerful as you can see it turn men into human bombs without fear. This being a major threat to the U.S. they decided to come up with a plan eliminate and control this new threat. I believe what will happen is Iraq will be somewhat Americanized just like Japan after worldwar II. With MTV and other American influences pushed into the youth it will change the face of the one last radical region in the world. American ideals and way of thinking will be spread into the populous over time. We will use them for there oil they will sell it to us and we will probably be able to control the prices of that oil. In return they will be more of a wealthy country like its neighbor Kuwait. We have done two things by going into Iraq. We have illuminated countless radicals and are changing the way they think. We have also got our fingers into a place that has lots of oil to fuel our economy. If oil prices got to $5 per galleon the USA government would begin to collapse. Those are the main reasons for doing what we did, in my opinion. But don't get me wrong im all for the move we maid. If somebody has to lead the world here and beyond I would rather it be us.

Originally posted by Trustnone
Okay, for the rest of the world to understand whats going on in the U.S. here it goes. after 9/11 USA had legitimate reason to enter afghanistan and remove the taliban. Only afghanistan! that was it. Instead bush has taken this as a way to go on a crusade to line his pockets. There should have been no invasion of Iraq.
WMD's aside,which were really never proven and was just speculation, it didn't matter what iraq did, that wasn't the point. The point was that bush was getting less money than he would of liked for oil. Saddam, if he was guilty of anything it was cutting the oil prices by "illegally" selling the oil. All of these 'atrocities' saddam comitted,probably happened, but were trumped up as an excuse for an invasion of iraq to prevent them from selling cheap oil. If we were so concerned about saddam gasing his people this should have been done years ago. it wasn't a concern then just as it isnt now. it was just dirt to make the US seem less aggressive. now that bush controls the taps in iraq, we see the result. a sharp rise in oil prices. The bushs are now making twice as much money for the cost of a few american soldiers who's families will never see the money they are owed and deserve. I am very patriotic but i know what drives bush and it is the same for both parties, money. we have shaken up the world by going from a somewhat peaceful group who stuck to themselves to almost a police state. this is what has everyone so scared.

Bravo. It really isn't difficult is it? Always follow the money and you'll find the culprit.

The U.S.A. won't fall, it'll just become absorbed, diluted, homogenized, shaped, shifted, and conformed like any other great civilization that grew too big, too powerful, too attached to its own point of view. Don't get me wrong, I love this country. But the writing is on the wall...

.
It happens to Nation states.

It happens to species.

Imagine a time when some different species looks [down] at us with gentle solicitude.
pat us on the head and say "poor dears, can barely think"

So party hard, we're all and everything is terminal.
.

Yes, but no other empire became a Super Power so fast, and has had such an iron grip over the rest of the world. During Rome, there was this place called China, they were probably a super power. Oh yeah, and when Rome fell, the dark ages came...so I guess it was all peachy keen.

Originally posted by REASON
If all empires in history that have rose have eventually fallen.......that is not a good outlook for the USA!


People hate the USA out of jealousy!
When my parents we children and were starving they remember blocks of butter and cheese with labels on them spelling "USA". at the time they didn't know what it meant all they remember the feeling of hunger. Now they have been here in the US for over 30 years and love this country and trully appreciate it for what it is!

Freedom , liberty , and all other things denied to them by communist and corrupt governments.

Too bad so many US citizens take everything we have for granted. If we only knew how lucky we are!


All I know is if the USA falls you can kiss the rest of the world goodbye!!!

(sorry about spelling)

replies appreciated..

[edit on 9-11-2004 by John bull 1]

Wow, no offense but that post was a little ignorant. Your saying that people do not appreciate america, but your parents do appreciate it? But who was president at the time of your parents? Hmmm? Have they been in any wars? Have they spoken to you about the wars they have been in, if they have been in any?

After living in Dallas for the last 6 months I see things differently now back in Europe. Americans as a whole are convinced of their own propaganda. America's world domination will not last forever, someone else will take over at some point. It would be stupid to think otherwise. The British empire was based on trade and therefore we thought that it couldn't fail, but it did.
I don't hate Americans, far from it, but I do think that they are brainwashed. What country is the land of the free? I would say Switzerland or maybe Holland.

USA is not destrpyed. Just some nuts think they are doing it wrong. USA is the dominant nation of the World!

Originally posted by CarlosG
After living in Dallas for the last 6 months I see things differently now back in Europe. Americans as a whole are convinced of their own propaganda. America's world domination will not last forever, someone else will take over at some point. It would be stupid to think otherwise. The British empire was based on trade and therefore we thought that it couldn't fail, but it did.
I don't hate Americans, far from it, but I do think that they are brainwashed. What country is the land of the free? I would say Switzerland or maybe Holland.

Well you're right on the money then, because there's no such thing as European Propaganda...right?

The only US propaganda out there that's corrupt, is the one created by the liberal US media.

No land is truly free. Why is Holland free? Because it's legal to smoke crack and have a multiple hooker gangbang in a school zone?

I'll refer back to the original post of this thread. The US is greatest country on this planet, and there's lot's of jealousy out there.

Love it or leave it.......as you are FREE to do so.

I agree that every country has propaganda, I just think that in the US the citizens are bombarded with it more than any other Country I have lived in. (Worked in UK, Germany & US so far) Especially through the TV. And Holland is not all about drugs and sex -- just that they are the most well known freedoms that the population are able to enjoy.
The US is an impressive country, and the people on the whole are friendly. I am just stating an observation.

Originally posted by CarlosG
I agree that every country has propaganda, I just think that in the US the citizens are bombarded with it more than any other Country I have lived in. (Worked in UK, Germany & US so far) Especially through the TV. And Holland is not all about drugs and sex -- just that they are the most well known freedoms that the population are able to enjoy.
The US is an impressive country, and the people on the whole are friendly. I am just stating an observation.

I ask you a favor.

Give me an example of the propaganda.

Something that you may have been exposed to specifically that made you formulate your opinion.

Originally posted by REASON

Originally posted by Russian

Originally posted by REASON


GOT BLESS PRES. Bush and GOD BLESS the U.S.A.

i agree with this...

but it still doesnt mean USA will NOT fall...

every power falls...

just look at the history...

also USA will soon go away from God...

I 100% agree. The USA is on track on going away from god....look at news and the ACLU!


Division of church and state means that no church officials running the state not being forbidden to use the word god anywhere.

I wonder what your saying now...?

Superpowers are the very thing that tears this planet apart. The pride and support of the US possessing large quantities of nuclear weapons sickens me.
There is no pride in creating a war machine. No pride in possessing the means to kill millions of people. Many people on this board seem deluded.
If you want to preach such unfounded egotistical love for your own nation why dont you read a history book and get your facts right.

One crucial factor that seems to be overlooked as of yet.
The US is a NEW COUNTRY merely hundreds of years old.
Of course its a wealthy prosperous country.
It hasnt weathered anywhere near as much as much of the rest of the world.

As for patriotism...im all for it. but theres a difference between patriotism and nationalism. As for the poster who pretty much spat on europe...you do realise America is the "melting pot" of the world.
I suggest you do your research....unless your relatives are american indian then im afraid you pretty much hypothetically spat on the country you came from.
Ignorance is bliss isnt it?