Who here will pledge...

Who here is willing to pledge not to accept the National ID or True ID. How many american citizens on this site are NOT going to renew their Driver's licence after 2008? Be honest, I don't want to hear from a bunch of "part-time Patriots" who talkl about wanting to be free but won't sacrifice. How many people are TRULY willing to face the hardships that await us if we refuse the new ID? Who here is willing to stand up, and get up off of their knees, and REFUSE to be a slave? Who here can honestly say that they would face legal recourse for refusing to be tagged like cattle?

Only honest answers please, don't even bother saying anything here if you are not willing to sacrifice.

Originally posted by Nicotine1982
Who here is willing to pledge not to accept the National ID or True ID. How many american citizens on this site are NOT going to renew their Driver's licence after 2008? Be honest, I don't want to hear from a bunch of "part-time Patriots" who talkl about wanting to be free but won't sacrifice. How many people are TRULY willing to face the hardships that await us if we refuse the new ID? Who here is willing to stand up, and get up off of their knees, and REFUSE to be a slave? Who here can honestly say that they would face legal recourse for refusing to be tagged like cattle?

Only honest answers please, don't even bother saying anything here if you are not willing to sacrifice.

I for one will not accept the National ID card.

The way the law is written, the ID is voluntary, however, the basis of it being voluntary falls on the shoulders of the states. The law makes it clear that the Secretary of Homeland Security has the final "say so" of whether or not another form of ID would be acceptable, as well as the final "say so" as to where the ID card will be necessary to gain entry. If you do not have this "ID" with you, and are required to show it at any given time, you will not be able to "prove" yourself an American Citizen.

This is America, and I will not be forced into a life of "guilty until proven innocent", under the guise of "be scared of the boogeyman".

Willingly accepting this National ID Card, will be me willingly giving up my freedoms and rights, and as well, me willingly saying goodbye to the basic principles that America was founded on.

No. I will not take it.

Well said.

I can't believe that out of 30 veiws, Infoholics is the only one willing to commit to this.

Originally posted by Infoholic
[The way the law is written, the ID is voluntary, however, the basis of it being voluntary falls on the shoulders of the states. The law makes it clear that the Secretary of Homeland Security has the final "say so" of whether or not another form of ID would be acceptable, as well as the final "say so" as to where the ID card will be necessary to gain entry. If you do not have this "ID" with you, and are required to show it at any given time, you will not be able to "prove" yourself an American Citizen.

I don't know how it can be considered "voluntary" when states like Texas and several others are already making preparations for it. I certainly do not intend to get one.

[edit on 31-1-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

[edit on 31-1-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

I refuse even now to get a drivers license , and I sure as hell am not gonna accept a national id card. Im not gonna fall in line like cattle, Im gonna stray my own way an if that means enduring hardship, pain, suffering, w/e. I can deal with that because I know this isnt all there is to life.

Not much voluntary about it. You're not even allowed a passport if you don't have it.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
I don't know how it can be considered "voluntary" when states like Texas and several others are already making preparations for it.

Through H.R. 1268, it doesn't say the States "must" adopt the ID, it just says the Federal Government will not accept anything less than...

(a) MINIMUM STANDARDS FOR FEDERAL USE.—
(1) IN GENERAL.—Beginning 3 years after the date of the
enactment of this division, a Federal agency may not accept,
for any official purpose, a driver’s license or identification card
issued by a State to any person unless the State is meeting
the requirements of this section.
source

Don't do anything that pertains to the "official purpose" - meaning stay away from the following:

(3) OFFICIAL PURPOSE.—The term ‘‘official purpose’’ includes
but is not limited to accessing Federal facilities, boarding federally
regulated commercial aircraft, entering nuclear power
plants, and any other purposes that the Secretary shall determine.

and...

SEC. 204. GRANTS TO STATES.
(a) IN GENERAL.—The Secretary may make grants to a State
to assist the State in conforming to the minimum standards set
forth in this title.
source

Doesn't say the States must conform, but does say that if the states "do" conform, they will be assisted monetarily.

If you don't want to carry the National ID, that's fine. It just renders you a non-citizen, because you can't prove to the Federal Government employee (checkpoints, banks, federal cemeteries, or wherever they wish to implement this) that you are a citizen as the National ID will be the only viable source to be accepted by the Government.


Either way, speaker... are you going to accept the National ID Card, as Nicotine asked?

[edit on 1/31/2007 by Infoholic]

Originally posted by Infoholic

Either way, speaker... are you going to accept the National ID Card, as Nicotine asked?

[edit on 1/31/2007 by Infoholic]

Speaker said:

I don't know how it can be considered "voluntary" when states like Texas and several others are already making preparations for it. I certainly do not intend to get one.

I renewed my UK passport a few months before the switch to the electronic versions, my fingerprints, DNA, and biometric data aren't on any database as of yet, and they never will by my free consent...I will do all I can to resist this vile systematic cataloguing of British citizens and educate anyone who has an ear to listen and free-will to make the choice to resist...join the resistance here and do your part!



...I am not a number, I am a free man!

Call me slow, but what exactly are we talking about? What will be different about driver's licenses after 2008? I'm a shmo in a suburban town with no access to public transportation; I need a license. I don't have the fortitude to go around unemployed, uninsured, putting holes in random people for food and gas, and squatting out in the forest somewhere.
Mad Max isn't a way of life, it's a movie.

how about this

give me one (or more) true downside to having a national idea

i'll evalute the case against
then i'll make my decision

i will not blindly obey your command to disagree with a policy anymore than i'll blindly obey getting a new ID card without evaluating it

After reading many threads on this site, I feel the need to preface my first opinion with a statement: I am new. I have only recently come across the wonder that is ATS and by no means claim to be knowledgeable in conspiracies, Big Brother or anything else of that nature.

Ahem.

Society breeds a lot of ideas into people, starting at a very early age. We're taught to be suspicious of everything, especially post 9-11. Most people, after stumbling across this thread (I said most people, I admit I'm making a broad generalization) would come to the conclusion that those unwilling to obtain this ID have something to hide.

I don't personally believe this - I would never seek out such an invasive means of identification (and I'm not even from the US).

Perhaps the Big Wigs have no intention of making a more secure nation by implementing the National ID. Perhaps the only intention of this ID method is to expose certain people, who by the definition of today's society, have something to hide.

Perhaps it's merely a way of looking into the lives of those who wish to remain hidden, by seperating them from the sheep, so to speak.

Originally posted by SkepticBeliever
Perhaps it's merely a way of looking into the lives of those who wish to remain hidden, by seperating them from the sheep, so to speak.

With the adoption of the mindset of 'if you're innocent you'll have nothing to worry about', those who take the national compulsory ID will be deemed innocent, whilst those of us who oppose will be eventually rounded up and made to account for why we are behaving in such a suspicious manner

Originally posted by Sunsetspawn
Call me slow, but what exactly are we talking about? What will be different about driver's licenses after 2008? I'm a shmo in a suburban town with no access to public transportation; I need a license. I don't have the fortitude to go around unemployed, uninsured, putting holes in random people for food and gas, and squatting out in the forest somewhere.
Mad Max isn't a way of life, it's a movie.

From what I've been reading, the national id card will have spychip in it that can track your movement.

Originally posted by Jessicamsa
From what I've been reading, the national id card will have spychip in it that can track your movement.

There are two options...either invest in a 'faraday-cage-wallet' to block transponder signals to the RFID chip or involve the card in a 'microwave-oven accident' for about 10seconds at full-power

ive recently heard about the may 1 2008 national id card on one of www.freetalklive.com podcast and i can say that i probably wont be getting one of these. things are getting down to the wire on this whole new world order thing and the revelations mark of the beast (global corporation) and it worries me. im 36 and have a 10 year old son who is my best buddy and would give my life for him. how can i explain this id system to him or my family. i guess that he will have to have an id card as well. i will not be able to buy nor sell without this card. so i need to prepare for this now.
i have always worried about the social security number and the divers license but now that this national id card is coming it just kinda puts everything in perspective.


here is part of the video "from Freedom to Fascism" that sort of explains the national id card.

www.youtube.com...

[edit on 31-1-2007 by Funkydung]

Originally posted by citizen smith

Originally posted by Jessicamsa
From what I've been reading, the national id card will have spychip in it that can track your movement.

There are two options...either invest in a 'faraday-cage-wallet' to block transponder signals to the RFID chip or involve the card in a 'microwave-oven accident' for about 10seconds at full-power

I am not worried either way. You can insert a faraday cage in your existing wallet for less than $1 at a hardware store. The 'new' ID will prove to be useless anyway. Remember when several states adopted the 'absolutely guaranteed forgery proof' driver's license a few years back? It took less than 2 weeks for the fakes to hit the streets. The new counterfeit proof US currency had phonies in circulation before the real ones were completely distributed to the banks.

Any document or ID does not have to be so good as to fool experts at a national laboratory. It only has to be good enough to fool the harried, overworked, and underpaid clerk or gate attendant who glances at it for no more than 2 seconds.

Much ado about nothing.

Ya'll want to live in the woods ? Great, have at it.
I prefer to live in, and offer/accept the services of society.
You want to be a "rebel", you want to be the "cool kid" ?

Have at it. If I catch you stealing my toilet paper, you're going to wish
you had that ID.

Now. If you want to live among civilized people that think having an ID
(gee had the SS cards and driver licenses for what ? 40-50 years?)
will mean the loss of freedom, you are either hiding something, or are so
paranoid, that a proffessional might be in order.

The above is my opinion.
Lex

ignorance: the state or fact of being ignorant : lack of knowledge, education, or awareness.
source

Originally posted by Lexion
Ya'll want to live in the woods ? Great, have at it.
I prefer to live in, and offer/accept the services of society.
You want to be a "rebel", you want to be the "cool kid" ?

Have at it. If I catch you stealing my toilet paper, you're going to wish
you had that ID.

Now. If you want to live among civilized people that think having an ID
(gee had the SS cards and driver licenses for what ? 40-50 years?)
will mean the loss of freedom, you are either hiding something, or are so
paranoid, that a proffessional might be in order.

1st off, Lex... before you return to this thread to debate the logistics of the National ID Card, please read the bill in question.

Here's the link: H.R. 1268 - The "National ID" begins on page 81.


2nd - I hope you make good on that threat when I come to take your toilet paper.

3rd - Have you no concept that your driver's license is 100% unquestionably voluntary? But by not having a drivers license, that doesn't render you a non-citizen of the United States. That just simply means it's illegal for you to drive. If you don't want a license, don't drive. The SS card is a means of registering yourself for income tax purposes, not for personal identification to get into something as meaningless as a federal library.


Your idealism of "you are either hiding something, or are so
paranoid, that a proffessional might be in order" is absurd. A mentality like that deserves no freedom nor liberty, because you obviously do not care for such a thing.

[edit on 1/31/2007 by Infoholic]

As a law abiding veteran of the Army, I have all the freedoms and
liberties that I want.
And, by calling me ignorant.
Sir, you are sadly mistaken.

I stand by my conviction that anyone scared of a national ID has something to hide, or is quite paranoid.

Of course, the above is just my opinion.

Lex

PS By calling me ignorant, you have violated the T & C of ATS.
Have a pleasant day.