I wanted to post this particular topic for a while now, in my own opinion alternate realities may be caused by divergent paths of a single universal frame due to the prababability of certain, perhaps large-scale events. in a similiar way that a tree fans out. By now there are perhaps millions upon millions of these "divergent" realities. but how could one traverse these dimensions, can one even travel between them, do you agree with my ideas. ideas are welcome

I don't know that I buy into every situation you ever face eventually causing a divergent path. For instance...say you go out on a date and it goes really well, so you keep dating and eventually, you marry the person. Now, there should be a divergent path for every single date you ever had, every passing second you spent with the person because at any given moment, you can say something wrong and get in a fight, thus edning the realtionship. That being said, the number of divergent dimensions would be too many. It just seems too far fetched.

However, I think there is some merit to your idea. I sort of think we've all been here before, on the same path and, through each life, can possibly choose one of the divergent paths that we did not take in our previous lives. I have actually wondered if this is where deja vu comes from. I dunno...far fetched, but something to think about.

Originally posted by Sandcastles on Cydonia
That being said, the number of divergent dimensions would be too many. It just seems too far fetched.

Well we don't know the limits... We can't even determine how many alternate realities can exist. Perhaps there is a limit, perhaps there is none.
It could be up into the quadrillions or quintillions. Nobody knows.

Why would a mere "decision" have anything to do with space time and alternate realities? We make a decision but it doesn't change the universe we're in? I'm probaly wrong, however I believe that divergent universes exist along the lines of other "big bangs" having occured elsewhere in the universe.



peace

I shal post my understandings on the subject, if you agree or disagree, thats fine, these are theoretical.

1.
I shal explain what my understanding of a multi-dimensional universe is.

All dimensions are infinite. X, Y, Z, and Time are infinite. All of them act in what can only be described as perpendicular to the latter dimension.
The idea that there is another dimension beyond time, would indicate that the dimension (we shal call it the 5th.) contains every possible variation of existance at that point in time.
I shal leave out the X,Y,Z dimensions for now, everyone knows what that is.

First, I shal draw a timeline... (the | being the present)
----------------------------------|----------------
now lets add a possible diversion from that timeline... a 'what if' timeline.


----/=============|=======
Okay so now we have 2 possible timelines. In fact there are an infinite number of variations of each timeline.
I shal show you 5.
--------------------|------
--------------------|------
--------------------|------
--------------------|------
--------------------|------
remember that vertial line | being the present, now it represents the 5th dimension. It, like all dimensions, is an infinite line intersecting another dimension, and only on intersection can it contain anything.

That 5th dimension is the one we are talking about, it is the Multiple Universes.
The question being wether we can travel along it, and visit all the possible realities along it.
The question isnt can we do it? The question is, is it suicidal?

2.
The creation and allowance for existance of a universe.

It is said you cannot get something from nothing... that is sort of true, however, there is a way around it.

When our universe began, it is safe to say we had nothing.

0
There it is, a zero, nothing... now how do we turn that into a universe?

Well zero also equals a number, added to its equal opposite.
0 = (x) + (-x)

Great, so now we have a positive amount of matter existing in the same place as negative matter??? That wouldnt work, the universe would immediately fold in on itself and return to 0 again, right? Not if we simply place the negative side back on the other side of the equals sign.

Now we have.
x = x

Thats right, two ammounts of matter forming two universes existing in what can only be described as two pancakes that cannot touch together... it is my theory that black holes are the equal signs between the universes. Anything that enters, also enters from the other side, adding together to equal zero again.

Now for the explanation. Hope you're thinking...

If you take an amount of matter from this universe and place it into another universe, what happens to that equation???
It creates an imbalance. The excess matter on one side of the equation creates an offset attractive force that would inevitably lead to the universe collapsing in on itself.
Whatever universe you travel to will also experience an imbalance.

However, remember how I said that the two sides to a universe are equal to each other?
What if each side reacted the exact same way, at the exact same time, like a mirror? Meaning that if you travel to another Universe, does the mirror (negative) you travel there too?
If it does, then there is no imbalance of the Universes equation, and therefore, yes, you can simply jump realities.

It's pretty complex, if you understand what I'm saying, I'm proud of you, if not, it's no biggie. It usually takes weeks of explaining for most people to start understanding.

Anyhow, thats my understanding of both, a multidimensional universe, and how it's possible to have something from nothing, all wrapped up in one post.

i dunno but i think it is fair to say that height, depth, and width, are merly realms of perception and technically cannot be classified as "dimensions"

Um, they are the 3 dimensions that we use scientifically... whatever you want to call them, they are dimensions.

You know, 2 dimensional space, 3 dimensional space... it's not called 3D for no aparrent reason.

[edit on 7-2-2007 by johnsky]

bingo "scientifically" i beleive they are used as a form of measure ment not a basis for an alternate dimension. that is like saying that in other dimensions there could be a world where everything is one foot long... it just doesnt make sense, in context with the 10 dimensional theory the thought being thta some dimensions do not have all the same amount of pysical structure, i.e. some dimensions only have the perception of width and height but no depth etc.

One theory of the big bang states that there was more matter particles then anti-matter particles at the time of the big bang and as a result all the anti-matter disappeared leaving only matter. I have a theory that the number of matter/anti-matter particles around at the big bang determines the future of that universe, ie one that results in me making this post.

This would mean that the fate of the universe was set at the very beginning, ie you have no free will only the perception of free will. It would also mean that there may be alternate universes where a different combination of matter/anti-matter exists.

For example, if our universe started out with 10 matter and 9 anti-matter, this may result in you going out with and marrying a girl. If an alternate universe had 10 matter and 8 anti-matter you may go out with her but end up getting in a fight. Obviously, it's a lot more complicated then that but you get the idea.

If every different combination of matter/anti-matter was released into alternate universes this would allow for an infinite number of possibilities/parralel universes. Imagine a cosmic nexus that links each one of these universes which is constantly releasing matter/anti-matter and creating new universes, kind of like an inverse black hole.

Originally posted by Mysteri
bingo "scientifically" i beleive they are used as a form of measure ment not a basis for an alternate dimension. that is like saying that in other dimensions there could be a world where everything is one foot long... it just doesnt make sense, in context with the 10 dimensional theory the thought being thta some dimensions do not have all the same amount of pysical structure, i.e. some dimensions only have the perception of width and height but no depth etc.

You seem to have completley missed the point, but thats ok, people misunderstand what a dimension is all the time.

The x,y,z, dimensions are dimensions, there is no question about that, and that topic ends there.
When someone speaks of alternate dimensions, what they are referring to is travel along the 5th dimension... which all the variants of what could happen along the first 4 dimensions exist. NOT what could happen TO the first 4 dimensions.

What you are thinking of would be considered jumping from one dimension to another... not alternate dimensions.

I'm sorry my friend, but you have completley misunderstood what alternate dimensions are.

It's not jumping from one dimension to another, its jumping variants of existance within those dimensions.

The reason so many people get it wrong, is the public is so used to the word 'dimension' bieng used in science fiction, that when they use it in science, they think people must be referring to two completley different things. No, when you refer to alternate dimensions, you're referring to traversing the 5th dimension.

If you want to talk about changing the dimensions we have... well, ok, if you want, but thats a rather obscure topic of which nobody could really have answers... but would be fun to talk about.

i was thinking we think of the 4th dimension as time, but time does not exist does it, we humans thought up time as a measurement so how can it be a 4th dimension, now i think the 4th dimension could be Existence?

Essentially if you want to talk about existance as something you can touch, feel etc... then no dimension actually 'exists'.

If we had to say what a dimension is, it would be like an invisible playing field. Of which everything can exist and interact within it.
Time is just like that. You exist and interact along that timeline.
Multiple varying timelines exist along the 5th dimension...
the further you go out from the first 3 dimensions, the more obscure and harder to understand the dimensions become. Mostly because we havent the sensory perception to see these other dimensions. All we have are these eyes, they can detect the first 3... thats about it.

i just thought about what schizioflux said has a good point. there must be some sort of... i want to say ruberic that causes divergences in realities, mere decisions seem far too... simple, and as we all know nature is rarely simple, and also black holes don't lead into other universes-yet again a illogical discrepancy between us johnsky, but i have brushed past the idea that it may not even be possible to enter another universe...but than again we could be wrong. i think we should find a logical reasoning for dimensions that has a little multiverse theory in it, some string, with a little bit of m-thoery on the side... but still i beleive that time cannot exist, it is merely a perception that may have various outcomes in the "future" and none any more predictable than the last. perhaps that is the nature of dimensionality...infinity.

heres a crazy idea...

anyone who uses adobe photoshop will be familiar with layers.
What if every decision made by any person creates a new dimensional layer? we all live in this single photo but we all have our own layers. we can see the effects of them and they all appear to be a part of the same picture. when the dimensional layer becomes no longer relevant, the dimension closes and disappears.

So... trillions of dimensional layers constantly changing without a constant number? Anyone gettin my drift?

One theory I've had for years about multiple dimensions is simple, but, to the point. Let's say a black hole, which most people have a general knowlwdge of, i hope, sucks in all this information and some is expelled back into space via a "jet". Some information, according to Hawking, is then "lost". Considering that energy cannot be created nor destroyed, this "lost" information may be mearly compacted to a sigularity untill one day no more information can be jammed in, then, "BANG". A big bang, the birth of a universe, on a different plane of existance with close to the same rules and content of the birthing universe, certain things being different because of basic quantum events. I will get into it alot more later. I understand the implications of this theory, I just don't have time to eleborate right now. I just became a member of this site, and im sitting at work. Just wanted to spit this idea out, tell me what ya think.

Yeah sounds like the black-hole/white-hole theory, the only problem is that there wouldn't be much energy in a black-hole compared to the universe, so it would only create a mini universe. Maybe if over time more and more black holes are created, bunch together and suck in the whole universe.



[edit on 9-2-2007 by Cthulwho]

When you describe the dimensional idea back a few posts there i get a certain idea.

Visually i saw the X,Y, and Z but at the same time thought about the big bang idea. If all space time and matter came from one singularity and exploded, well wouldn't it explode along all axis and you would have the radiating lines as dimensions.

Thus in the identical but different universe you mention time might move backwards. Like the X,Y,Z things aren't just a location but applicable to all physics paremeters and thus define a characteristic for a given universe.????????????????????????????????????????????????????

On the contrary my friend, how does one judge the size of the universe, unless you are an outside observer? could the universe as we know it be the size of, say, a marble ( yeah i know, the end of Men in Black ) ?? Can there indeed be a "size" when speaking of something like the universe, considering we know of nothing else but this universe. Also, consider this, Universe A, and, Universe B, quite literally being oppisite poles of known existance, correlating to each other, through other dimensions. This could possibly explain why mass "creates" gravity, although we have no damn clue what gravity is. Perhaps the matter is "pulling" on the fabric of the other dimension or dimensions that this universe is rubbing shoulders with and/or interwoven with. Just some thoughts, sometimes they come out so fast I can hardly make sense of em....lol. Anyones input is most certainly welcome and desired.