U.S. miltary confirms that 4 American troops were captured and executed.

Originally posted by semperfoo

Our soldiers are such beasts arent they?
.

Some are, YEP!
But im glad you can find 2x photo's reports that show them being angels.
Im sure theres a lot of them that care for human life, and hate this war as much as I.
But, you also have to be careful.
Look at the jessica lynch reports,
It goes to show how easily 'good' propoganda can be made up and delivered for people to have that mentality in there mind.
Im not saying your wrong, but the shoe fits on both feet here.
You tell me to take a step back and stop reading the news.. well i like to think I do.
So Ill tell you to not take everything you here about the 'goodness' in our troops either.
I support the troops, the good ones.
I do not support this war.
I do not have to support the war, to support the troops.

That'll be what you say. As will the rest of you tree hugging lovin hippies!

Well, unfortunately, had we not of been in Iraq, none of this collosal mess would be occuring.
hundereds wouldnt be dying daily.
We had no reason to be in Iraq, everyone is dying in vein.. EVERYONE.

But your saying I have to be a hippi to understand ?

How about a human f'n being.. are you one of those?
Or cant you see the suffering we are causing this nation?

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
Some are, YEP!
But im glad you can find 2x photo's reports that show them being angels.
Im sure theres a lot of them that care for human life, and hate this war as much as I.
But, you also have to be careful.
Look at the jessica lynch reports,
It goes to show how easily 'good' propoganda can be made up and delivered for people to have that mentality in there mind.
Im not saying your wrong, but the shoe fits on both feet here.
You tell me to take a step back and stop reading the news.. well i like to think I do.
So Ill tell you to not take everything you here about the 'goodness' in our troops either.
I support the troops, the good ones.
I do not support this war.
I do not have to support the war, to support the troops.

Well thats your opinion. Nothing wrong there.

That'll be what you say. As will the rest of you tree hugging lovin hippies!

Well, unfortunately, had we not of been in Iraq, none of this collosal mess would be occuring.
hundereds wouldnt be dying daily.
We had no reason to be in Iraq, everyone is dying in vein.. EVERYONE.

But your saying I have to be a hippi to understand ?

How about a human f'n being.. are you one of those?
Or cant you see the suffering we are causing this nation?

Yes, but im talking about the very nature of the atrocities that are being committed by the insurgents. You cannot blame the US for the brutal mentality that the insurgents have. That rests on the insurgents who are sick enough in the head to carry out such acts that show such lack of remorse for human life. Im not disagreeing that the war was a sham. Saddam should have been taken out in the first gulf war. The job should have been done right the first time around so we didnt have to do it all over again. Bush is finishing what daddy started. Im on that bandwagon.


Edited just to ask, in a theoretical sense. What if Iraq had WMD's. Would you still oppose the war Agit?
[edit on 033131p://5501am by semperfoo]

[edit on 043131p://0801am by semperfoo]

Saddam should of just been left alone.
He would of been dealt his cards, in the way he deserved in time.

Bush snr didnt go in, because he knew what would happen.
Bush Jnr went in, because his VP and co convinced him it would be a cake walk, and a profitable one at that.

thats why bush has no answer to the strife,
because Iraq wasnt his idea, it was his running mates.
and now when its getting bad, everyones looking at him..

The insurgents are committing crimes, I do agree.
But there is the aspect that America is aiding the insurgency in some respects to keep the violence going.
I for one have not seen EVIDENCE of this,
but I surely havent seen EVIDENCE that everything being done against the Iraqi people, are Iraqi insurgents.

The longer this war goes on, the richer certain people get.
That means something,
when the VP is making millions of this war, and so is Bush Snr.

Iraq is going to get worse before it gets better.
If we stay, it will continue at the same pace until something MAJOR happens at home or in the region.

Im not saying pull out, im not saying stay.
Unfortunately, we have been led to a position where we are royally SCREWED. We have NO ANSWER to achieve a GOAL we cant even define.
Its ok for people like you and me to critisice each other over our opinions, or the government over this war.
But the Iraqi people, who arent given that opportuniyt are dying by the hundereds... and suffering a horrible turn of events every day.

Yet bush still leads, he still sleeps, and he still smirks to the camera.

It makes you sick.

Well I agree that Bush thought this was going to be a nice sunday stroll through the park. It was a poorly planned scheme all across the board. And huge profits are being made. Now the question is will the profits made from this war be greater then the sacrifices made to achieve those profits? Sad times we are living in indeed. And like you said, its at the expense of the Iraqi ppl.

Originally posted by marg6043

US is training mostly the police and military and they are mostly Shiites but US can not tell who is who and which side they are on.

The British and at times the Americans have suspicions that the people are training will probably be one of those who later that day or more into the future will be planting a bullet in their heads.

The British admit it openly, but say they have to make do with what they have, that of volunteers.

The Americans would admit it, but are more censored by their superiors.

Originally posted by marg6043
From the beginning when the comments about how the Iraqis join the police and military and then disappear and how the US soldiers were getting shot at at night, it was an indication that some of this Iraqis are only joining the police and military to get the training they need to fight better back against our troops.

But that is how they play their game and after all this Iraqis are in their nation that they better than anybody else foreign knows best.

Agreed.

Originally posted by XphilesPhan

Exactly, I have tried to tell her this but what I say falls on deaf ears. I do tend to pick on margy but that is just because she is such an easy target

. It is certainly nothing personal, I just think her biasedness was pretty much exposed in this thread.

Hum mm, I think I have been targeted here, and this post very much shows that fact.

You think I am easy don't you

But I see that so far this a direct attack on me and nothing to add to the thread in particular, something that I find very interesting and should consider for now on. . . and perhaps complain should be in order.

One thing is to go alone with some personal crash of interest and another just doing it because is nothing better to do.

Kind of shows the true intentions of the attacker.

Very sad actually I though you were better than this.

At least I do not attack members personally, just the views and ideas . . . and that is just universally.

Sad.

Originally posted by Regensturm

The British admit it openly, but say they have to make do with what they have, that of volunteers.

The Americans would admit it, but are more censored by their superior.

I agree, how can a war be won with this type of restrictions, censorship of superious against any ill comments about this war.

Also we can not forget that Rumsfeld made sure that only yes men were around him, he didn't like the military either at least the raking hierarchy.

Still is not winning and everybody are all losers, I also can no see our own government looking for a middle ground to solve the violence in Iraq.

Just more wood to the fire and more death.



[edit on 28-1-2007 by marg6043]

Originally posted by XphilesPhan
Exactly, I have tried to tell her this but what I say falls on deaf ears. I do tend to pick on margy but that is just becasue she is such an easy target

. It is certainly nothing personal, I just think her biasedness was pretty much exposed in this thread.

Why not pick on the topic, and discuss/debate the issues?

Picking on someone because of the way they write, spell etc. has nothing to do with this or any discussion. Everyone here has the ability to post their thoughts and opinions within any open discussion thread, if you want to challenge a person based on the issues that if fine, but attacking or insulting a person rather than discussing things with them in a civil manner only makes anything you say irrelevant, and does little to advance any argument or discussion.

Please stick to the topic, avoid insults and unnecessary "picking" on your fellow members.

UM_Gazz
Why not pick on the topic, and discuss/debate the issues?

Yes, about that.

U.S. miltary confirms that 4 American troops were captured and executed.

There are new reports are coming out that the early reports were wrong. They were not "executed". They were shot after death. If true, this is called desecration, not execution.

Autopsy Confirms Downed Blackwater Helicopter Crews In Iraq Were Not Killed By 'Shot To The Head'

Autopsy showed that they had been shot in the head AFTER death.

Originally posted by makeitso

Autopsy showed that they had been shot in the head AFTER death.

But, what will be the purpose of shooting them after death. Is anything in the muslin views and believes that doing something like that has some religious meaning?

I don't get it.

Thats a different case you are refering to.
More evidence that this is psy/intelligence ops.

Negative 11Bravo. It's the same.

The 1920 Revolutionary Brigades posted a video. It's still out there, but I won't link it. You'll have to find it on your own.

Originally posted by makeitso
Negative 11Bravo. It's the same.

The 1920 Revolutionary Brigades posted a video. It's still out there, but I won't link it. You'll have to find it on your own.

I beg to differ.
The OP is about a well coordinated sneak attack.
You are refering to the downed blackwater chopper.
Two separate incidents that are being confused and intermingled.

Unless I am wrong, which I have been from time to time.

[edit on 28-1-2007 by 11Bravo]

11B is correct- it's 2 different incidents. The Blackwater folks in the helicopter were the ones supposedly shot after they were already dead. The Army folks were executed. I don't really get the PSYOP/Intel link here though, with the 2 stories though.

Originally posted by marg6043


I agree, how can a war be won with this type of restrictions, censorship of superious against any ill comments about this war.

It can't be won anyway, but you're right.

Originally posted by marg6043
Also we can not forget that Rumsfeld made sure that only yes men were around him, he didn't like the military either at least the raking hierarchy.

Yep.

Originally posted by marg6043
Still is not winning and everybody are all losers, I also can no see our own government looking for a middle ground to solve the violence in Iraq.

Just more wood to the fire and more death.

The last throw of the Necon dice.

Originally posted by marg6043


But, what will be the purpose of shooting them after death. Is anything in the muslin views and believes that doing something like that has some religious meaning?

I don't get it.

Most likely to make sure they were dead, to make sure the people would not fight another day.

A sort of final certainty expressed by the insurgents, an expression of anger at these people they are fighting against, dead or alive.

Perhaps even to 'humanely' end their lives, if the insurgents thought the people were still alive, and needed to be put out of suffering.

What I personaly find peculiar is that up to now US military deaths have been treated as statistics (all you heard was "oh, theres only 3000 deaths" and as much as possible kept out of the mass media.

I don't think anyone in the US Public is truely aware of how many casualties (which means wounded+dead) soldiers there are and most likely you'll have a hard time finding a correct number on that.

Now that the US Govt is strugling with Congress to send more troops and get more money, these kinds of stories are not only reported widely, but also verified by the military.

Its bad that soldiers died this way, for every soldier would rather die guns blazing then in a helpless way like this. But its disgusting and disrespectfull that their deaths are only worth mentioning and milking when its convenient for the goverment.

They aren't statistics and they aren't tools, they are human beings dying for a cause that isn't even closely related to protecting the homeland against threats domestic and abroad.

Any thoughts and ideas !??! We are spending resources on Bombs and Raids and Intell ... Why not just Raid this whole country put numbers and chips on them ... and track everyone of thier movements ... This doesn't have to be even spoken of .... Put free clinics up over there with "GOVERNMENT SUPPLIED SHOTS" that are alittle bit of everything ... as well as an implanted device that shows us where they are as well as keeping them from getting sick all the time we could track thier movements therefore knowing who is meeting with the enemy and doing whatever it is that they are going to do .... Or maybe we should all just go over there .../>!!!??!??