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To John Lear-Existence of the Dulce Facility

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posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 07:34 AM
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This is great, 12 pages I've read for nothing. The only thing I saw was a big John Lear-show...


Staafke




posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 07:38 AM
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Originally posted by Staafke
The only thing I saw was a big John Lear-show...

Staafke


Don't feel bad, you're not alone!

Tim



posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 09:57 AM
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Originally posted by Ghost01

Originally posted by Staafke
The only thing I saw was a big John Lear-show...

Staafke


Don't feel bad, you're not alone!

Tim




Thanks you for your comment Tim. I will keep this in mind when you ask another question or want some additional information. Respectfully.



posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 04:17 PM
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john, why not share alanP's story with those who are interested? seems to me that there isn't really a story.. why are you holding out on us john? i'm sure youre used to the ridicule dished out on ATS by now so why are you holding out on the select few that wish to here the story?



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 04:51 AM
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Originally posted by Ghost01

Originally posted by Staafke
The only thing I saw was a big John Lear-show...

Staafke


Don't feel bad, you're not alone!

Tim


well actually, pretty much 75% of JL's posts were replies to your endless "but but but" questions.

why dont you start a thread for the sole purpose of you debunking John and keep it to that thread. your fascination with trying to prove him wrong is almost scary dude, lighten up.



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 12:39 PM
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Originally posted by biotic
john, why not share alanP's story with those who are interested? seems to me that there isn't really a story.. why are you holding out on us john? i'm sure youre used to the ridicule dished out on ATS by now so why are you holding out on the select few that wish to here the story?


Because there are no Alanp stories to tell. Alanp was a fraud which is why he disappeared when he was called out. I honestly don't know why this thread has lasted as long as it has....



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 01:21 PM
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Originally posted by tke1046

Because there are no Alanp stories to tell. Alanp was a fraud which is why he disappeared when he was called out. I honestly don't know why this thread has lasted as long as it has....



Thank you for your post tke1046. I would respectfully caution you to use less offensive language than you have in your post. I assume that AlanP left because he was not used to getting the kind of tough questions we pose here at ATS.

AlnP is not a fraud, he is a successful busniessman here in Las Vegas and I would respectfully request that you apologize to AlanP and the rest of us here at ATS for your libelous outburst. Thanks.



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 01:27 PM
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Originally posted by johnlear

Originally posted by tke1046

Because there are no Alanp stories to tell. Alanp was a fraud which is why he disappeared when he was called out. I honestly don't know why this thread has lasted as long as it has....



Thank you for your post tke1046. I would respectfully caution you to use less offensive language than you have in your post. I assume that AlanP left because he was not used to getting the kind of tough questions we pose here at ATS.

AlnP is not a fraud, he is a successful busniessman here in Las Vegas and I would respectfully request that you apologize to AlanP and the rest of us here at ATS for your libelous outburst. Thanks.


Thanks for your post John


However, I don't feel as if I need to apologize for anything. Frankly, I can't help but get annoyed when people post claims such as Alanp did and don't stick around to elaborate on them - bad form in my opinion.

Unfortunately, nothing has been stated in this thread that would make me believe that he was legit..that is, except for you posts. And everytime someone has asked you to post information that Alanp has passed onto you John, you have ignored them. So please excuse me for not taking your word for it.

But anyway, thanks for your input



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 03:31 PM
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Thank you for your post tke1046. I would respectfully caution you to use less offensive language than you have in your post. I assume that AlanP left because he was not used to getting the kind of tough questions we pose here at ATS.

AlnP is not a fraud, he is a successful busniessman here in Las Vegas and I would respectfully request that you apologize to AlanP and the rest of us here at ATS for your libelous outburst. Thanks.


You "assume" he left for those reasons? I thought you and Alan were lunch buddies? And you didn't discuss ATS at all, and his reason for leaving? Despite members asking you to pass on their interest in what he has to say? Seems a tad strange to me, if not totally unlikely.

There is apparently a base at Dulce where humans are processed in a lab, and AlanP is worried that a member on ATS called him a fraud? Boy have I got MY priorities arse about.

Oh, and as for libel, I don't see anything in the post that maliciously or misrepresentingly damages AlanP (the person as represented by yourself John). Considering no-one here (other than you apparently) could possibly know who it is, there is no way his character can be defamed. The comment was passed about an ATS member, who came on the site, spewed out some random hooks, and disappeared. Screams fraud to me. So, maybe it is you who should apologise John. For treating the members of this site like idiots.

And to the member who feels that Ghost had no right to question in this thread, if you want to live in ignorance, hit ignore (include me while you're at it) and you can just hear the sugar coated rubbish about Dulce that permeates this thread. Just don't be disappointed when you get nothing more than the "I've seen/got/heard vents/diagrams/photos/from a friend, but lost it/misplaced it/forget where it was/don't want to risk their lives/you've offended me with your questions and I'm not posting here anymore boo-hoo" excuses that the last ten odd pages of this thread has produced.



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 04:47 PM
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Originally posted by Willard856

And to the member who feels that Ghost had no right to question in this thread, if you want to live in ignorance, hit ignore (include me while you're at it) and you can just hear the sugar coated rubbish about Dulce that permeates this thread. Just don't be disappointed when you get nothing more than the "I've seen/got/heard vents/diagrams/photos/from a friend, but lost it/misplaced it/forget where it was/don't want to risk their lives/you've offended me with your questions and I'm not posting here anymore boo-hoo" excuses that the last ten odd pages of this thread has produced.


Willard,

Perhaps i should address this in a PM/U2U but quite frankly, i dont care.
i suspect blighty ol you might be pointing the finger at me in your last paragraph?

Please elaborate on your point? Did i say Tim/Ghost01 has no right to asking questions? i dont think so. "Boo-hoo"? Do I live in ignorance because i fail to enjoy reading 10 pages of you and Tim nagging at JL to please admit to inconsistencies so you can get the feeling that you've uncovered some great mystery? Nope. I merely tried to point out that there is a subject to this thread, and the inquisition was leading away from it. More importantly, it was turning the thread into another one of those yes-no arguments. Please take the time to judge me with an open mind before you tell me whether or not im ignorant or should be. I personally enjoy doing that and highly recommend it.


I'm not particularly sad that AlanP moved on, nor am I distraught by the fact that he didn't feel the need to back his claims up. It doesn't destroy my world to see that someone might know a little more about a cetain subject than me and it certainly doesn't motivate me to get all high and mighty, subsequently informing that person of what he/she is or isn't. Does this then make me ignorant? In this boards quest for truth I must say that there are very few 'contributors' that are receptive to the basic freedom to shut up whenever one feels like it. There is a flipside to everything, right? Including talking.

What i'm trying/was initially trying to say is: instead of continuously pointing out inconsistencies between opinions and/or a multitude of facts, perhaps it would be a nice change to accept someones truth and derive your own truth from that. feed your knowledge with the variables in these viewpoints, sources and (sometimes outright unbelievable) claims that are made on this forum. You seek the world beyond ignorance? Then go find that. Don't spend/waste your time trying to prove someone wrong, it's a waste of time and debits your quest towards your goal.

have a lovely weekend, im going to the park to hang out with the birds.



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by shadow fax

Originally posted by Ghost01

Originally posted by Staafke
The only thing I saw was a big John Lear-show...

Staafke


Don't feel bad, you're not alone!

Tim


well actually, pretty much 75% of JL's posts were replies to your endless "but but but" questions.

why dont you start a thread for the sole purpose of you debunking John and keep it to that thread. your fascination with trying to prove him wrong is almost scary dude, lighten up.


iAGREE. very annoying behaviour imho, hope you're not offended by that Tim.



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 07:44 PM
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john may i ask you to direct your attention to a post i made previosly on this page



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 09:05 PM
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Shadow fax,



Perhaps i should address this in a PM/U2U but quite frankly, i dont care.


Nice attitude. If you don't care, why should I?


Please elaborate on your point? Did i say Tim/Ghost01 has no right to asking questions? i dont think so. "Boo-hoo"? Do I live in ignorance because i fail to enjoy reading 10 pages of you and Tim nagging at JL to please admit to inconsistencies so you can get the feeling that you've uncovered some great mystery? Nope. I merely tried to point out that there is a subject to this thread, and the inquisition was leading away from it. More importantly, it was turning the thread into another one of those yes-no arguments. Please take the time to judge me with an open mind before you tell me whether or not im ignorant or should be. I personally enjoy doing that and highly recommend it.


Just a reminder on what you initially wrote:



well actually, pretty much 75% of JL's posts were replies to your endless "but but but" questions.

why dont you start a thread for the sole purpose of you debunking John and keep it to that thread. your fascination with trying to prove him wrong is almost scary dude, lighten up.


So yeah, you did say he had no right asking questions in this thread. And the questions that have been asked of John have all been valid questions regarding Dulce. Not debunking John Lear. We haven't asked anything about Soul Collectors, or Moon photos, or his SF experience, or his aviation background. All questions have been about the topic of this thread, and the majority of questions have been fobbed off. I have as much right to question as you have to make your own decision on the content of the thread. But without people asking questions, pointing out inconsistincies, bringing up questions of fact, then there is zero confidence that what you are reading is anything other than BS.


I'm not particularly sad that AlanP moved on, nor am I distraught by the fact that he didn't feel the need to back his claims up. It doesn't destroy my world to see that someone might know a little more about a cetain subject than me and it certainly doesn't motivate me to get all high and mighty, subsequently informing that person of what he/she is or isn't. Does this then make me ignorant? In this boards quest for truth I must say that there are very few 'contributors' that are receptive to the basic freedom to shut up whenever one feels like it. There is a flipside to everything, right? Including talking.


Considering you've been registered for all of two weeks, I'm interested to see you speaking so passionately about what this boards quest is. How does my questioning (and others) hinder the pursuit of truth? Surely the flipside to not talking is ignorance. Because then you get one point of view, one perspective, one idea. And unfortunately there are those who are all too ready to swallow whatever crap some people spew forth. I'm not. And I'll continue to press those that treat members here like fools when they offer an alternative point of view, and those who evade simple questions while claiming to have answers. If I represent the flipside of not talking, then I'm pleased to bear that flame. To add another perspective, what if this thread was indeed about the non-existence of the Dulce Facility. Would you be happy that those who potentially have evidence that it does exist not address these issues in the thread? Would you be happy if I ignored questions, gave ridiculous answers when asked legitimate questions. Turned my back on those who were genuinely interested? Wouldn't this lead to ignorance?


What i'm trying/was initially trying to say is: instead of continuously pointing out inconsistencies between opinions and/or a multitude of facts, perhaps it would be a nice change to accept someones truth and derive your own truth from that. feed your knowledge with the variables in these viewpoints, sources and (sometimes outright unbelievable) claims that are made on this forum. You seek the world beyond ignorance? Then go find that. Don't spend/waste your time trying to prove someone wrong, it's a waste of time and debits your quest towards your goal.


I don't derive truth from anything other than facts, evidence, and plausibility. Everything that has been said in this thread points not to the existence of a facility at Dulce, but it's non-existence. THAT is what I was saying about not being disappointed when the touted evidence is again misplaced, lost, or a mysterious first time poster disappears after throwing out some new "evidence". And as for finding a world beyond ignorance, it is hard to find when we have people who perpetuate ignorance by leading the gullible by the nose into their own fantasy world. I don't consider it what I do on this board a waste of time at all. I'm sorry to hear you do. But then, that's the flip-side huh?




have a lovely weekend, im going to the park to hang out with the birds.


You have a lovely weekend too. Just be careful of those hybrid aliens from Dulce. Apparently they ain't that nice...



posted on Mar, 9 2007 @ 10:32 PM
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Originally posted by biotic
john, why not share alanP's story with those who are interested? seems to me that there isn't really a story.. why are you holding out on us john? i'm sure youre used to the ridicule dished out on ATS by now so why are you holding out on the select few that wish to here the story?



As I mentioned before biotic AlanP had a few stories that I found interesting. Nothing spectacular you know, people seeing lights, people with missing time, black helicopters... nothing that would prove anything to anybody who didn't know that Dulce really does exist.

BUT, it would provide lots of cannon fodder for those who don't believe it exists and want, name rank and serial number, 2 sets of photo ID, last 5 years of tax returns backed up by the President of the United States, his Joint Chiefs of Staff on national TV to announce, "Yes, Dulce is real. It is a joint US/alien base that performs hideous experiments on humans and animals."



posted on Mar, 10 2007 @ 02:37 AM
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I am sorry that i have not returned to this post for sometime ...I just wanted to tell the unbelievers that maybe you need to take a trip to New Mexico and find out for yourself if the Dulce Underground base really exists...I have nothing to prove to anyone on this site, The only person I respect is John Lear who I met recently in Vegas....so if you want to check out my credentials maybe you can call my former employer in Farmington New Mexico and find out what I did for the Jicarilla Apache Tribe....My question to any of you out there is how many of you critics have lived on a reservation? And lived in Northern New Mexico? You see I dont need to spend my time collaborating on a web sight to prove myself.
I am sure one of these days the truth will be known...just as I and John Lear have experienced.



posted on Mar, 10 2007 @ 02:49 AM
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Originally posted by Willard856
Shadow fax,

Nice attitude. If you don't care, why should I?




haha.
its going to be an endless discussion, again. itd be fun, but off-topic and yes, since ive only been actively seeking the truth (on the internet no less) for a mere 2 weeks, ill just quit it for now.

see you



posted on Mar, 10 2007 @ 03:02 AM
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haha.
its going to be an endless discussion, again. itd be fun, but off-topic and yes, since ive only been actively seeking the truth (on the internet no less) for a mere 2 weeks, ill just quit it for now.

see you


Catch you around shadow. Check out some of the other threads on this site - not all are as contentious as this one!

AlanP,

Welcome back, as you can see you stirred up a hornet's nest. We look forward to hearing more about the




As I mentioned before biotic AlanP had a few stories that I found interesting. Nothing spectacular you know, people seeing lights, people with missing time, black helicopters


Now, just out of interest, why would John Lear know the truth?




I am sure one of these days the truth will be known...just as I and John Lear have experienced.


Considering John said back on Page 3 that he only "thinks" it exists.

Anyways, as you said, you've got nothing to prove, so telling your stories shouldn't be a problem. If you say you experienced time going backwards, I can do little to prove otherwise, and won't attempt to. My issue is with those who deliberately mislead the members here, and treat them with contempt. So as I said, welcome back, and I look forward to reading more.



posted on Mar, 10 2007 @ 03:23 AM
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ALANP : one question - " where is the vent cluster ? "



posted on Mar, 10 2007 @ 03:49 PM
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i appreciate the responce john, thank you

seems like a valid responce to me but i guess thats just because i know dulce exists



posted on Mar, 10 2007 @ 07:02 PM
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I've been in fits of laughter from the banter between Willard, Shadowfax et al.

Slightly off-topic. With presumably quantities of information gathered on the alien species such as the 'Greys' (there's various kinds?) relating to their physiology. Would it be safe to assume that they used advanced technology (much like we do against dangerous predators) in order to circumvent 'physical' confrontations? I.e if a Grey grabbed 'an average man', would the man be siginificantly stronger than the Grey for him to be able to easily immobilise/incapacitate it? Physical strength does not always guarantee success in a physical encounter. However is it a factor, coupled with our potential ferocity in hand-to-hand combat that would require the Greys & other to use 'paralysing' weapons in order to deal with us? Could this also explain certain abduction cases where alleged victims feel paralysed. If indeed these experiences are genuine phenomenon.

These questions are primarily directed towards John Lear and other reputed individuals who've encountered the Dulce Base or know significant enough information on the facility and it's supposed occupants to answer my queries.

Cheers!



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