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To John Lear-Existence of the Dulce Facility

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posted on Feb, 23 2007 @ 06:34 PM
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Ok let me get this straight ... Someone has pictures of a secret base with UFO's and bigfoot and everybody wants to see them. Has anybody ever seen a bigfoot or ufo picture that wasn't blurry and unrecognisble!!! I wouldn't hold out too much hope for those pictures on a secure site or any site for that matter. Just my.02

mikell




posted on Feb, 23 2007 @ 11:43 PM
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Originally posted by mikellmikell
Ok let me get this straight ... Someone has pictures of a secret base with UFO's and bigfoot and everybody wants to see them.


I'm not exactly sure what the question is here but I will give it a go. Yes someone has a picture of Groom Lake, in fact there are many pictures. In fact you can even get a good view with GoogleEarth. Does Groom Lake have UFO's? Well, probably not at this time. They used to be there but were moved to the Papoose Lake facility sometime in the late 70's or early 80's. Is there a bigfoot at Groom Lake? I would say yes based on a report that I got a few weeks ago from someone who works at Groom Lake and saw, what appeared to be a bigfoot, through a window, in a buiilding at Groom Lake.


Has anybody ever seen a bigfoot or ufo picture that wasn't blurry and unrecognisble!!!


I don't know of a real good photo of a bigfoot. As to UFO's photo's that weren't blurry and unrecognizeable I know that the Billy Meiers photos of UFO's are excellent but are considered by many to be fraudulent. I am not one of the 'many'. I believe that most if not all of the Billy Meiers photos were real UFO's. I admit that I am in the minority in this belief that the Bill Meiers photos are real but that is my opinion.


I wouldn't hold out too much hope for those pictures on a secure site or any site for that matter. Just my.02


I would have to agree with you there. Its is unlikely that any photos of say, for instance, Groom Lake will contain, at the same time, UFO's and bigfoot.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 08:29 AM
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I'm honestly not sure why more people aren't aware of the situation at Denver International. While I generally ascribe to the philosophy that every myth begins with at least a sliver of truth, and I do believe you can apply this particular quote to the legend that is Dulce, there is ample proof right out in the open that something subversive is happening at DIA. You want anomalous air shafts/vents? They're there in the fields surrounding DIA. You want cages designed to hold mass amounts of human beings? They line a lesser used side of the facility. You want cryptic "NWO" type propaganda? There is literally tons of it inside of this place. As a whole, in my opinion, the conspiracy community would do well to expose the more obvious ones to the public before diving into the deep end with subjects that require more of an open mind/imagination than john doe really posesses.



[edit on 27-2-2007 by PartChimp]



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 09:42 AM
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Originally posted by c3hamby
Yes, why indeed? You might want to look at that a little bit more....

Let's do more than put up restricted signs. Let's put up yellow 'do not cross' tape around the perimeter, and put big ol signs that say 'restricted-this place does not exist' and have a parade of Wackenhut henchmen marching around the place 24/7 along with loud low flying helicopter cover.



So in your oppinion the Signs and security at Area 51 are there to draw attention?


Sorry, but that is rediculas.

How did this become a topic that boils down to: I WANT it to be True, so that Proves it's True!

I'm not upset, Just severly dissapointed. I never though people at ATS could be so Gulible.


B.T.W. I'm selling houses in Atlanis for $1 pre square foot, who's intrested?


Tim



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 11:51 AM
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Originally posted by Ghost01
So in your oppinion the Signs and security at Area 51 are there to draw attention?
Sorry, but that is rediculas.


Thanks for you opinions Tim, they are greatly appreciated.

I believe however that the signs and security at Area 51 are there just for that reason: to draw attention. They would like all attention focused on Groom Lake while the real work is going on at Sandia.


Thanks again for your participation, it is greatly appreciated.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 11:58 AM
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Originally posted by johnlear
I believe however that the signs and security at Area 51 are there just for that reason: to draw attention. They would like all attention focused on Groom Lake while the real work is going on at Sandia.



In your thread on Sandia you say that you believe its not being kept a secret from other nations, just from the American people. Surely this would mean that the base at Groom Lake has a different purpose to your supposed one called Sandia.

Area 51 is a base for developing military aircraft and related components. For this reason measures are taken to hide the work done their from other nations. If these measures are not neccesary at Sandia then surely they are doing different work and the bases aren't mutually exclusive as you seem to imply.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by gfad

In your thread on Sandia you say that you believe its not being kept a secret from other nations, just from the American people. Surely this would mean that the base at Groom Lake has a different purpose to your supposed one called Sandia.

Area 51 is a base for developing military aircraft and related components. For this reason measures are taken to hide the work done their from other nations. If these measures are not neccesary at Sandia then surely they are doing different work and the bases aren't mutually exclusive as you seem to imply.




This is off topic to the Dulce thread gfad, might I suggest you move your comments to the Sandia thread?
Thanks.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 12:50 PM
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Hey John,
I've continued to follow this thread, even though it is now all over the place. If you have an answer, what happened to AlanP? If he's not willing to come back, can you share some of what told you? I was really excited about this thread when it first started, but it seems like it has gone the way of so many other interesting threads around ATS.
Oh well.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 01:07 PM
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Originally posted by metalmom
Hey John,
I've continued to follow this thread, even though it is now all over the place. If you have an answer, what happened to AlanP? If he's not willing to come back, can you share some of what told you? I was really excited about this thread when it first started, but it seems like it has gone the way of so many other interesting threads around ATS.
Oh well.





AlanP is still around. He and his wife came over the other night. He has some great stories about the area around Dulce but nothing that would cut it with this group.

AlanP is a very successful business man and enjoys his work. I thinks he regrets having started this thread but he has never said that to me.

I would share some of his stories but they are stories that would only be interesting to those who already know that Dulce exits. Not to those who are looking for proof.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 01:32 PM
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Sorry for getting off track with the DIA rant... John, do you think the facilities on Big Sheep/Little Sheep mountain are connected to Dulce? I went on a trek to the mystic valley (San Luis) a couple years ago, and the only place i visited that i saw anything resembling a possible military presence was here. I wasn't aware CO2 facilities are guarded by armed guards on a regular basis...


-partchimp

(edited for geographical accuracy)

[edit on 27-2-2007 by PartChimp]



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 02:14 PM
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Originally posted by PartChimp
Sorry for getting off track with the DIA rant... John, do you think the facilities on Big Sheep/Little Sheep mountain are connected to Dulce?


I don't know, what makes you think that? The San Luis Valley has had strange lights for years.


I went on a trek to the mystic valley (San Luis) a couple years ago, and the only place i visited that i saw anything resembling a possible military presence was here. I wasn't aware CO2 facilities are guarded by armed guards on a regular basis...


Gas injection for oil flow and delivery would seem to me to require at least some kind of assurance that it would not be interrupted.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 02:36 PM
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As I understand it the origin of the Dulce story is the Krill, or O H Krill papers allegedly written by John Grace and John Lear. Later they were expanded into the Matrix documents by a pseudonymous Val Valerian. To find the location of the base use these directions taken from the Krill document and get on Google earth.

" During the occupation of the Greys, they have established
quite a number of underground bases all over the world, especially
in the United States. One such base (among others in the same
state) is under Archuleta Mesa, which is about 2.5 miles northwest
of Dulce, New Mexico...
...The base is 2.5 miles northwest of Dulce, and almost
overlooks the town. There is a level highway 36 feet wide going
into the area. It is a government road. One can see telemetry
trailers and buildings that are five-sided with a dome. Net to the
domes, a black limousine was noted -- a CIA vehicle. These limos
will run you off the road if you try to get into the area. To the
north there is a launch site. There are two wrecked ships there;
they are 36 feet long with wings, and one can see oxygen and
hydrogen tanks. The ships that we got out of the trade are atomic-
powered with plutonium pellets. Refueling of the plutonium is
accomplished at Los Alamos. The base has been there since 1948."


But remember, this was written before the days of Google Earth when readers of the document couldn't check the 'facts' as easily as one can do today. So don't be suprised if you find nothing at all...

I can't help but wonder if this 'AlanP' who started this thread is just another actor introduced into the show to keep it rolling along. After all, it has turned into a 'John Lear' thread and we a clearly getting no new information on Dulce. Just more broken promises of revelations and evidence just out of reach. Even John claims to have documents concerning the contractors who worked on the base but he 'just can't lay his hands on them'.

Damn, how inconvenient, or should that be ... how convenient!



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 02:48 PM
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Well, namely because of the interaction between c130's and the facility that numerous Malachite residents have witnessed; the actual plant is tucked in the valley of Big/Little Sheep. It's only roughly 80 miles away from Dulce at a straight shot, and Fort Garland falls almost in the middle of a linear path, which would allow for security or an additional port for loading/service. This place seems like perfect cover to me; it's out of the way, employees funneling in and out would draw practically no speculative attention, and most of us are aware of the fact that our government is a fan of saying a facility is being used for one purpose, and using it for something entirely different. Just a theory.



-partchimp



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 02:52 PM
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Interesting thread here, i was wondering John if you are still in contact with Bob Lazar and if he was willing to participate here on ATS regarding Dulce.

Cheers

Graham



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 03:19 PM
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Originally posted by torsion
As I understand it the origin of the Dulce story is the Krill, or O H Krill papers allegedly written by John Grace and John Lear. Later they were expanded into the Matrix documents by a pseudonymous Val Valerian.


This is incorrect. You have not read this thread in its entirety.


I can't help but wonder if this 'AlanP' who started this thread is just another actor introduced into the show to keep it rolling along. After all, it has turned into a 'John Lear' thread and we a clearly getting no new information on Dulce. Just more broken promises of revelations and evidence just out of reach.




Even John claims to have documents concerning the contractors who worked on the base but he 'just can't lay his hands on them'.


I have to agree that this sounds very conspiratorial to me.



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 04:02 PM
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John, is there any published documentation in existence that pre-dates Krill and mentions Dulce as an underground alien base?



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 04:20 PM
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I would share some of his stories but they are stories that would only be interesting to those who already know that Dulce exits. Not to those who are looking for proof.


Wow. It must be so cool to know that Dulce exists. I can understand why you wouldn't want to tell the stories to us losers who are looking for proof. I'm glad you and AlanP have struck up such a wonderful relationship, a guy who claimed to the community here that they had info, then (surprise surprise) failed to produce. But then, you have to be in the know to understand, so thanks for looking after him for us.

Seriously though, is this what it takes to be given the title of Conspiracy Master? If so, I might have to start a few threads where I tell people about these secret bases that I know all about (but don't know about, I'll be all mysterious and coy), then I'll have coffee with a few random posters who claim to also know stuff about these bases(well, I'll tell everyone I had coffee with them anyway), oh, and when people ask legitimate questions, I'll respond in a condescending manner that is contrary to the T&Cs of the website I post on. So, will this get me Conspiracy Master status?



posted on Feb, 27 2007 @ 07:33 PM
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Originally posted by torsion
John, is there any published documentation in existence that pre-dates Krill and mentions Dulce as an underground alien base?



I attended a UFO conference in Crestone Colorado with about 7 other people in 1987. Someone handed me a piece of paper with some notes on Dulce and a phone number in Las Vegas. I had never heard of Dulce but when I returned to Las Vegas I called that number and first talked to Mr. X. Over the next year or so I spent many hours with Mr. X learning about his knowledge of Dulce. He showed me some pencil drawings of the inside of the lab and notes on what they did there. Mr. X allowed me to copy the pencil drawings in ink and to retype the notes which I did on my IBM Executive typewritter. Those notes that I typed and the ink drawings I made became the infamous "Dulce Papers". I mailed copies of them to many of my friends.

One of my friends was John Grace, an airman who worked at Nellis AFB and was interested in all of this information also. I had a lot of UFO and other information including the Dulce information and John decided to self publish a book called The Matrix. I provided most of the information, John provided the text. He published the book under the pen name Valdamar Valerian.

I don't remember the dates of the Krill Papers but I learned of Dulce sometime before John wrote the Matrix and the Krill Papers.



posted on Feb, 28 2007 @ 05:43 AM
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Originally posted by johnlear
I believe however that the signs and security at Area 51 are there just for that reason: to draw attention. They would like all attention focused on Groom Lake while the real work is going on at Sandia.



Thanks John,

With all do respect, I'll think we will have to Agree to Disagree on this topic. You have a lot of very good ideas and valuble insights, but I DON'T think this is one of them!

Sorry John, but frankly this is Obsurde!


B.T.W. Sandia is in a MARKED, RESTRICTED AREA! Like Groom Lake, there are signs on the border that say Restricted Area. Your contradicting yourself. Area 19/R-4806 is mark as restricted. Please get an Up-To-Date Flight chart!
(don't take my word for it, go out to the border of Nellis and look for yourself!)

It's your "Dulce" facility, that isn't marked, and probably non-existant! It's intresting that you seem to have stirred this discussing back to Sandia, since you Know I'll back you up on that.

Tim



posted on Feb, 28 2007 @ 06:01 AM
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John,

Now that you've once again side stepped to topic, let's try round two!

My origional Post about the "Missing Restricted Area" was in refrence to Dulce NM. Humor me, and stick to the question this time.

How can they enforce security at a base in New Mexico, that isn't even marked as military property. Anyone could litterly walk up to the door and knock. In Theory, Dulce is no more secure than my house. You are claiming the US Defense Department has a Top Secret research facility, with NO external security at all?


John, that is unrealistic! I would expct you of all People to know better. I come from a military family, I'm one of the only people in my family that has never served in uniform (I'm disabled). I been around the DOD long enough to know how things work. I respect you, John, but please, don't sell me for a fool!

Tim



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