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81 yr old is visited by the Secret Service, after claiming "wrong person hung in Saddam's trial."

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posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 02:57 AM
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I think it's insane how much money we spend protecting current and past presidents. Additional irony is the fact that time and time again, this particular president has proven that he's the single greatest threat to himself.


In any case, with the amount of money we spend protecting these chumps/chimps we could instead be building schools, upgrading our decidedly vintage electrical grid, revitalizing the agriculture and industry this country used to be famous for, etc..

There are so many other ways to spend exhorbitant sums of money that might actually benefit the American people, instead of just insulate their corrupt and dangerous leaders from the consequences of their arrogance, stupidity, and criminal behavior.

IMO, protection for past presidents has to go, and protection for current presidents needs to be reduced to a third of current levels, or less. We spend over a billion dollars a year protecting our single greatest national disgrace. It's like enshrining a particularly pungent bathroom leaving in Fort Knox for no apparent reason.

:shk:

What an absurd waste of time and money!




posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 03:08 AM
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Anyone here can make the same kind of comment in a public arena or venue and watch how fast the secret service will pay you a visit, I for one am not surprised at all that this happend...

[edit on 23-1-2007 by the_sentinal]

[edit on 23-1-2007 by the_sentinal]



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 06:23 AM
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Originally posted by WyrdeOne
I think it's insane how much money we spend protecting current and past presidents. Additional irony is the fact that time and time again, this particular president has proven that he's the single greatest threat to himself.


...

What an absurd waste of time and money!

I fully agree, but isn't there a legislation to lock people up when they're a threat to themselves?

The threat this no 43 represents can best be illustrated by comparing the visits of two recent US presidents to Copenhagen.

The first one, Clinton stayed for three days and enjoyed more or less in public a popularity no US head ever had in Denmark (JFK never visited).

Clinton held a public speach in one of the old narrow squares of the city where any amateur sniper could have taken him out. Of course no one dreamt about such. Not sure about no 43. His visit was less than 24 hours and the SS run the whole town during his stay. He was never in a public place except when going around in his highspeed motorcade - which always ran double along different routes.

Not to get off a topic, which I find very interesting, I will withhold my comparision of the case of the thread to others in history, but only like to point out:
What about other less fortunate who get the x-men visit and are taken away? Who don't have any to talk for them, who might not even have anyone to miss them. How can we learn about them?

Don't you think it happens in America of today?



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 07:13 AM
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Originally posted by WyrdeOne
IMO, protection for past presidents has to go, and protection for current presidents needs to be reduced to a third of current levels, or less.


Life protection for past Presidents is no longer in play. Silk Willy was the last POTUS to have life protection. Every President from 43 onward will only get 10 years protection after they leave office, good move, I think. These people can afford private security and no longer need or should have a government agency look after them until they go six feet under.

Link

However I cannot agree with your second point, just because you do not agree with the policies and views of a certain President does not men he deserves to be assassinated, what kind of nonsense is that!? He is an elected official and the US head of state, like him or not you have to respect the office. If you want to preach about wasted tax money write to you newly elected congress and tell them to stop earmark spending, but don't complain that the President stays alive while in office.


[edit on 23-1-2007 by WestPoint23]



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 07:31 AM
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Originally posted by MrMedic

I can't believe you people are saying things like this. You have know idea what a monster Saddam Hussein was. To even make the comparison to Bush is off the chart of extremism. You should not debase the office of the Presidency with such rhetoric no matter your political belief.


You mean like refusing to sign up to treaties on international law?
Holding people without charge indefinitely in a detention centre that is set up on occupied land in a foreign country that does not want it there?
Torturing prisoners taken from the battlefield?
Taking photos of prisoners who are having their human rights violated?
Removing people from their country of origion in secret flights passing illegally without clearance through other nations?

Yes, the US Presidential Administration and military covers itself in glory by doing all those things, doesn't it?



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 08:00 AM
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It doesn't matter nefermore,

The Office needs to be respected no matter what. It is how our founding father's made it to be- and it's how it's going to be.

No matter what the crime of our current President, you- and anyone else- have no right to make death threats and make subtle threats.

If you have a problem, write your congressman. If you don't think that will work, organize an anti-Bush protest. If you don't think that will work, complain on the internet.

Freedom of speech on this topic allows one to say Bush should be impeached. It does not allow someone to say he should be harmed physically.

But whatever you do, don't support, or actively do- threaten the Office of the Presidency. Because i'll tell you what pal, that is one road you do not want to walk down.



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 10:53 AM
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I am telling you, it is not as if every head of state in the world has a government agency protecting them.....is there?.....

Who would have thought any government would try to provide security to their head of state....

c'mon people grow up and smell the roses, it is obvious most of you make these claims because of "your" political beliefs...nothing more and nothing less....



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 11:13 AM
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Sorry if anyone has already mentioned this as I have read many of the post but not all of them but has anyone considered the fact that by targeting this old man who did not even make a full descriptive threat the FBI is trying to stop dissent of any kind against Bush.

Serioulsy how many people are now going to think about how they phrase what they write or say to keep from receiving such a visit. And of course such a visit means you are being investigated and probably will always be investigated, who wants to live under that kind of scrutiny?

And though there are many who will say, "well if you have nothing to hide why worry if you are being investigated?" The truth is knowing you are under scrutiny does make one think about what they say or write even when one has no ill intentions or anything to hide.

I honestly think this is a clear move to squelch dissent as much as possible.



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 11:21 AM
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Actually they did hang the wrong guy, look at his hair line...



Hey, i wonder who those guys outside are? they've been parked right over there for a month now,

hmmmmmm... interesting, they all have something stuck in their ears, i wonder what that is, have a look at tha....

BRB someone is at my door!!




posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 11:46 AM
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Originally posted by IamnomanasIamallman
It doesn't matter nefermore,

The Office needs to be respected no matter what. It is how our founding father's made it to be- and it's how it's going to be.

No matter what the crime of our current President, you- and anyone else- have no right to make death threats and make subtle threats.

If you have a problem, write your congressman. If you don't think that will work, organize an anti-Bush protest. If you don't think that will work, complain on the internet.

Freedom of speech on this topic allows one to say Bush should be impeached. It does not allow someone to say he should be harmed physically.

But whatever you do, don't support, or actively do- threaten the Office of the Presidency. Because i'll tell you what pal, that is one road you do not want to walk down.


Well firstly, your post seems to insinuate that I've made some kind of threat against the President of the USA (well actually it refers to someone called "nefermore", but I assujme you meant me). I suggest you re-read what I wrote, in the context of the quote provided, because I did no such thing.

Secondly, the person referred to in the Original post did not make a threat against the President of the USA. He simply said "they hung the wrong man."

Thirdly, you can respect the "office" of the Presidency all you want, but if the person in that office is a lying thieving scumbag do you have to respect them? If so why did Nixon resign before he was pushed, and Clinton get impeached?

As for your last paragraph, I take that as an implied threat, which is a violation of ATS's T&C.

Not that it means much to me to be honest - as I pointed out I did no such thing. I do think that Bush should be impeached, because what he has committed the US to on the basis of the lies his administration put out is far worse than getting a blow job in the Whitehouse from Monica Lewinski.

The Irony of you rpost is that you advise me to express an opinion, which is what the 81 year old man referred to in the original post did. He got a visit from the Secret Service for it. Is that really the kind of country you want to live in?



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 12:44 PM
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WestPoint


However I cannot agree with your second point, just because you do not agree with the policies and views of a certain President does not men he deserves to be assassinated, what kind of nonsense is that!? He is an elected official and the US head of state, like him or not you have to respect the office. If you want to preach about wasted tax money write to you newly elected congress and tell them to stop earmark spending, but don't complain that the President stays alive while in office.


I didn't say he deserved to be assassinated, I said we don't need to spend more than a billion dollars annually to insure against that possibility. Big difference.

It's not just a case of inflation either; the budget of the SS has increased by 100% (in real terms) since 1981, which is obscene.

Link

BTW, thanks for pointing out the fact that former presidents no longer get life protection. Now if only we could stop paying their salaries once they've retired, and protecting them for any period of time, we'd save even more money.






[edit on 23-1-2007 by WyrdeOne]



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 05:23 PM
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Here at ATS, as in the USA, legitimate criticisms are re-interpreted as threats.

When WyrdeOne said past Presidents should not qualify for lifelong protection at tax payers expense - it was not a threat. Obviously.

When I agree that 'they hung the wrong guy,' I am not even remotely implying that I want to hang Bush. I am criticizing his political priorities.


But criticisms are interpreted as threats in the NWO-USA, and threats invite visits from the Gestapo. It's fascism.

The SS mandate notwithstanding, it's all getting waaayyy out of hand.




posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 09:30 PM
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When Neformore points out the administration's contempt for international law, holding people without charge in secret detentions, approving torture, showing disdain to the very same principles of humam right they uphold as the beacon for their "struggle", he's immidiately labeled as a threat to the office of the President. I don't see why.

Sofi is right ATS is a mirror of US, I would say it's predominantly American, if not all. Topics on the illegal warfare - unless it's about some shaky GI's who can't get mats to sleep on - don't get much attention. That the educational elite of Iraq systematically get extincted isn't worth reflections. More than 12.000 Iraqi police killed enforcing law cannot overshade the grief of the American loses climbing. Understandable.

But let me just point out those boys went there by their own free will. The draft is the difference between this war and Vietnam. One thing in common though, not much compassion is showed for the horrific number of civilian casualties. Colleteral damage.

Before we get too far into navel contemplation keep in mind the US is not the whole world (though it would like to be). Altruism is its veil to disclose greed, innocence its cover for evil.

This is NOT US bashing, but merely an objective observation on sanity. By the way, you contradictors of US bashing, why don't you come up with some (intelligent) EU bashing, so things can get more even, eh? Because you don't know much about and don't care the least about what's going on outside your own pond.

Sorry for getting slightly off topic, but for the sake of balance it had to be said.

One more word: Impeachment!

It is beyond me and most concerning Euros - and a lot of Americans too I'm sure - that this president, who like a thief in the night stole your highest office, haven't faced justice yet.

Whenever the issue is brought up, Clinton has to be mentioned. To my knowledge he never threatened worldpeace by illegal actions, in fact in Europe it was the joke of the year he got impeached at all. Well, worse things than blow-jobs have taken place in the oval office. Fact is, it was beyond the comprehension of most people in Europe.

Hypocrisy, a straitlaced prudish action it was to us, what happened that year in the worlds number one porn producing country. In no way we approved it, but to some degree to some of us it was understandable, cause as it goes, the bigger the front, the bigger the back.

Let me finish with some enlightment, cause I'm not the one to threaten anybody.
The first condition for fascism is patriotism.



posted on Jan, 23 2007 @ 10:03 PM
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Great post kuhman!

The point here is we as Americans can't compromise our Constitutional values no matter what.

Instead of ranting and raving in a harmful way, one should use that energy in a positive way to stress impeachment.

The Secret Service isn't knocking, or even kicking down doors- for groups that want impeachment as that is illegal.

However, the Secret Service did absolutely nothing wrong with investigating a potential threat, and later the Secret Service left once they realized the author of the article was not a threat.

The key is understanding the difference. In my opinion, democracy is a continual struggle pushing away fascism. We as Americans have forgotten what Fascism means, as most who were exposed to it are dying or old. Which is why this thread was created in the first place; no proper definiton- out of context. It's time for all Americans to understand the proper definitions of Fascism.

And just so we're all on the same page, yes the NWO is a real group and yes they want to start a police state in America. But we as Americans, can never sink to a low level- follow the steps of the founding father's, not of rebels, terrorists, and guerrueals (spelling). Learn how to effectively speak the word "No", don't pull a trigger or write violent words.

Thanks kuhnman for that great post!

[edit on 23-1-2007 by IamnomanasIamallman]



posted on Jan, 24 2007 @ 04:02 AM
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It might serve the whole of ATS to take into consideration that accusing Bush of war crimes can (and probably will eventually) be construed as a threat upon his life because the highest punishment possible for war crimes is death, so to accuse him of such is to allude to him possibly being put to death. And perhaps that would be for the best really, because its not until people are getting locked up for such things on a routine basis will people really wake up and realize how the world actually works...



posted on Jan, 24 2007 @ 04:14 AM
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They only still have capital punishment in barbaric backward countries anyways ...

Oops


My grandfather got a visit like this once too, its kinda of incredible that he lived to tell about it considering the reputation of the Secret Service of his time.

Guess its Sieg Heil, Sieg Heil, Heil die Fuhrer, Heil Bush from here on for you poor saps still living in the US.

And then people in the US were whining about Germany trying to push heavy legislation about Holocaust deniers in Europe.



posted on Jan, 24 2007 @ 12:34 PM
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[quote
The Secret Service investigates threats to the presidents and they have "visited people for years who have written letters, or written blogs which are direct threats to the president, whatever president was in office"...



I agree with your view on the purpose of the Secret Service, however this man in NO way inferred ANY threat to the president. There are over 5 billion people on this rock, and he could have been referring to ANYONE other than Saddam. Why would it automatically be assumed that he was speaking of Bush. Do that many people want him taken out? That in and of itself could speak mountains.



posted on Jan, 24 2007 @ 12:43 PM
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Pathetic. The Secret Service wasting taxpayer's dollars.There should be an oversight committee for such activities. Hasseling old people for writing an opinon. Very 1984ish. Ugh.



posted on Jan, 24 2007 @ 01:49 PM
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Originally posted by soficrow
..........
And Bush would be impeached if half the citizens of this country had half the cajones of this one 81 year-old guy.




Well i guess that would leave out any U.S. citizen that went scurrying away into Canada, or any other country and are now bashing away and using anything and everything as a political tool to spread their agenda.

Don't you mean to say "if citizens only saw your point of view"?....

Despite your claims and the claims of some others around here, this does not show the U.S. is a dictatorship...

The Secret Service protected presidents of the U.S. since 1894, started part time, then after the assassination of President William McKinley, Congress requested presidential protection and in 1902 the Secret Service had as it's first duty the protection of the President.

www.secretservice.gov...

This man had written a letter before about inciting a civil war....then he writes another piece, which even some members in here say it clearly is talking about the Preisident, yet some want to use this as a "political tool"?....


[edit on 24-1-2007 by Muaddib]



posted on Jan, 24 2007 @ 01:53 PM
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Originally posted by LogansRun

I agree with your view on the purpose of the Secret Service, however this man in NO way inferred ANY threat to the president. There are over 5 billion people on this rock, and he could have been referring to ANYONE other than Saddam. Why would it automatically be assumed that he was speaking of Bush. Do that many people want him taken out? That in and of itself could speak mountains.


I guess the fact that this same old man wrote another piece in the past about inciting civil war in the U.S..... during the current administration wouldn't raise any questions as to who he was referring to in his latest writting?...

[edit on 24-1-2007 by Muaddib]



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