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And It Begins...Iran !!!!!!

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posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 12:46 PM
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So Bush stirs up more military forces.

More defense spending, more money for the "Boys in defense."

Never the truth from this man, even admitting he messed up, he still proclaims he has the plan now.

THis is crap. If we want to win, then take off the gloves, accept heavy collateral damage, and defeat the enemy.

Not this drag out half way crap. These are Americans he is gambling with, not inantimate objects. He says to expect heavy casualties.

Why the hell do we have to accept heavy casualties? Air power the damn enemy into submission. And damn any one of them that hids the enemy.

He aint going to fight to win, he is fighting to keep the money flowing.

And another point, Condalizza unrice says that we need to secure Iraq borders. WHAT THE HELL ABOUT THE AMERICAN BORDERS?


This is a totally unacceptable administration. I hope they go straight to hell.




posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 12:46 PM
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It's not an act of war because a consulate is not the territory of another state. They do not enjoy the protections that embassies do under international law.

If they had did this to the Iranian embassy and the Iranian ambassador then it would be an act of war.



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 12:48 PM
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beacuse the government tells me that we need war to have peace does not make it so...

Peace can't be acheived throught war.....

How on earth can you turn out a fire with fire??????

Don't believe the government, believe in your self and peace.


df1

posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 12:54 PM
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Originally posted by JSR
what would you say we replace democracy with?

The plan is to restore the Iranian monarchy under Reza Pahlavi, the shah's son. He has been living in exile in the US since 1984. He opposes military strikes on Iran, but concedes that the current Iranian government is a threat to world peace. (03-28-06 Interview)

Speaking to US congressmen Pahlavi offered a 3 point plan for dealing with Iran.(09-15-06 Article)
  1. "Where ever the regime is up to mischief, it needs to be confronted."
  2. "a progressive set of smart and vigorous sanctions targeted at the economic, political and personal interests of the regime's inner circle and power base."
  3. "free world to provide unapologetic and robust support for the democratic aspirations of the Iranian people."



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 01:48 PM
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Originally posted by selfless
beacuse the government tells me that we need war to have peace does not make it so...

Peace can't be acheived throught war.....

How on earth can you turn out a fire with fire??????

Don't believe the government, believe in your self and peace.


yeah i made the orwellian joke eariler "war is peace". it's just a means to control. we just move the target here and there and keep the fear and make people obey. this war has been out of control from the beginning and we've all just gone along with it cause we are afraid and because we don't want to lose our comfort zone.


Tea

posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 01:52 PM
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Impeach Bush. The man is murdering our country. I'm not interested in pissing off the entire planet and I know a lot of Americans agree with me.



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 01:59 PM
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Originally posted by reaganero
in daniel it mentions eagles wings on a lion but later in revelations the wings are gone. most/some people interpret this as meaning the united states power gets removed/destroyed. much like the fall of rome (face it, america is the second "rome")


no doubt of that. I've often said that I felt Babylon in Revelations was akin to America now. We've come that far from where we began. Honestly, I wish they'd bring our boys home. Realistically, I know that they won't and so I can only hope that they let them kick some ass.

I've often thought that the lion was a symbol on great britain...and the wings were symbolic of us. However, thinking of all that in world events...if a 100,000,000 man army is going to march to the Megiddo valley, they have to come through America first at this point in time. Moreover, I'm increasingly concerned about the Syrian-Iranian-Russian Alliance that has been a silent fixture in our struggles in the middle east. Is there any doubt about the kingdom of the north?

Mod Edit: Big Quote – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 11/1/2007 by Mirthful Me]



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 02:14 PM
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The hibernating bear.



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 02:56 PM
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"No shots were fired. No altercation ensued," the U.S. official. "It was a knock on the door and 'Please come out.' "


www.cnn.com...



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 04:30 PM
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Originally posted by Mdv2
They have gone crazy. You can't start a war on each and every front you like. That's the mistake Hitler made as well. One of the major reason for losing the war.
[edit on 11-1-2007 by Mdv2]


The difference is that Hitler was gambling his own country away.

The worst that could happen to USA in this escapade is that they lose thousands of soldiers and look humiliated. The US mainland isn't going to be invaded because even if Iran (or whoever dares to step up) were to attack the USA or even Israel they risk having a good few nukes falling on them.



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 06:25 PM
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I say GOOD, it's about time we address the insurgent sources. Beleive me nobody has seen the ability or strength of the US force in this little "pee pee" fest. Syria and Iran need to learn the lesson that they ARE responable for their actions.
I don't like war, but all you cry babies should have spoken up 3 years ago. It is too late for a pull-out now. The damage would be 10 times the cost of staying, as it is now, regardless as to if we were lied too or not about WMD.
War sucks, but war is were we're at. Iraq was one of three "Axis of Evil" and Syria was added later.



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 06:28 PM
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Originally posted by TrueAmerican
lol, 20,000 more troops is supposed to be enough to take on Iran and Syria? What I wonder is when are Iran and Syria going to say "enough?". If they decided to turn things on the offensive, and Syria attacked from the west and Iran attacked from the east, I'd be curious as to what the American military would do then. Start dropping nuclear weapons, realizing they are surrounded?



Oh please neither syria or iran pose a threat by "conventional" means. As terrorists yes, and they are already doing that. Syria and Iran are on the offensive, new opporations are meant to put them on the defensive.
Tanks and troop formations are easy.

And if what is being reported is true about the "new" strategy in iraq then the gloves are comming off. Apparently the Iraqi government wanted to negotiate a peace. Talk seems to have been thrown aside in 2007 in Iraq. We'll see the results in the comming months.


Ex

posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 09:14 AM
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There is no way in hell, Bush has 20,000 troops to send in
He does however have soldiers doing their 4th and 5th tour of duty!

I also loved his comments about unprecedented Mass Killings
Are we really responsible for the acts of a people,
that do not only NOT want democracy,
I don't even think the regular Iraqis citizen
understands the concept!.

Civil war is going to come to Iraq.....now or later

There is no way 20,00 troops are going to change the direction
of this affair. Maybe 2 years ago..but not now.

Tell me ,How do you identify an insurgent,
when the people you are trying to help, will not for fear of retribution
and the underlying problem of WHO WILL come into power there.
give us aid in this area?

It is a mess..and I will not back Bush's proposal

BRING THEM HOME NOW!!!

ps..what is winning , what have we achieved.
I am still not dissuaded that going in wasn't
a historical mistake of unprecedented proportions!


JSR

posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 09:29 AM
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Originally posted by Ex

I am still not dissuaded that going in wasn't
a historical mistake of unprecedented proportions!


i would say you are correct.
but, you cant just say, "oops, sorry" and everything go back normal.



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 10:12 AM
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It looks like the detention of the 2 Iranian diplomats and the subsequient raids provided the hard intel to go after the Iranians and Syrians in Iraq. Up to this time the hard intel was lacking, and the Iranian/Syrian involvement in the insurgency was only speculation.

Now however, the Iraqi government now has the hard data to go after these people and locations.

2 Iraqi Bloggers report that the heat is on now, without waiting for 20,000 U.S. troops, and the intel seems to be paying big dividends in terms of insurgents killed and or Iranian/Syrian/Sudanees operatives capured and killed.

In addition, Maliki has given a strong shot accross the bow to the "militias" in a speach he made, making it clear that now he was not going to be playing pussyfoot anymore. Also the Iraq military leaders have been given their own lead, instead of being micro managed by the central government, and they have strongly and clearly announced their intentions to succeed.


Any civilians carrying arms faced automatic detention, he said, and would be shot if they resisted, the general said

Iraq launches drive to subdue Baghdad


Indeed, they appear quite serious at this time.


Iraqi Army Goes On The Offensive

Over 20,000 Iraqi Army soldiers are said to be participating in the operation.

The Iraqi Army then immediately launched a major operation in the Sunni-dominated Haifa neighborhood, where Sunni insurgents have a safe haven. Thirty insurgents were killed in the operation, including five Sudanese.


Later:


Fifty insurgents were killed in the fighting and 21 captured, Those captured included 7 foreigners, including three Syrians — and one Sudanese.


Shortly afterward, Bush gave a serious shot accross the bow to Iran, Syria, etc.


In his speech on Iraq last night, President Bush describing Iran as providing "material support for attacks on U.S. troops," and identified Syria and Iran as providing terrorists with staging areas. The phrase "material support" is an interesting one, as the "material support" language comes straight from legislation pertaining to terrorism that makes it a federal crime to provide "material support" to terrorists.

The "Material Support" Test for Terrorism


Next thing you know, more Iranians in Iraq are detained, and more hard intel is gathered from them.


Iranians captured inside Iraq

U.S. troops launched two raids on Iranian targets in Iraq yesterday, following through on President Bush's vow to confront and break up Tehran's networks inside Iraq. Five Iranians were detained, and vast amounts of documents and computer data were confiscated, according to U.S., Iraqi and Iranian officials.

Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Gen. Peter Pace charged yesterday that Iran was "complicit" in providing weapons designed to kill American troops. "We will do all we need to do to defend our troops in Iraq by going after the entire network, regardless of where those people come from," he said at a press conference with Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Defense Secretary Robert Gates.


This new hard intel will lead to further actions against the Iranian/Syrian/Sudanees backed insurgency, which will yeild even more hard intel. This will continue for a short time until enough evidence can be presented to the world to confirm without question that Iran is intentionally causing a great deal of the unrest in Iraq.

At that point unbearable pressure will be brought against Iran/Syria to cease the activity, and the end of the insurgency war will be close at hand.

So perhaps a winning formula has been found, and the suggestion of 20,000 more U.S. troops was just the incentive that the Iraqi government needed to kick it into high gear themselves.

Of course nobody will ever overtly see the Russian hand in the proxy war is my guess. Not with any hard data anyway.

[edit on 1/12/07 by makeitso]



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 10:32 AM
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Originally posted by makeitso
This will continue for a short time until enough evidence can be presented to the world to confirm without question that Iran is intentionally causing a great deal of the unrest in Iraq.


There are now some reports coming from the Iranian Press and some Iranian bloggers that Hassan Abbasi was among the arrested in Erbil, Iraq.


Iran Press News: Based on unconfirmed received reports from reliable sources in Iraq, Hassan Abbassi was among those who was arrested in the Thursday, January 11th early-morning raid in what was reported to be the consulate general of the Islamic republic of Iran in the Iraqi town of Erbil.

---[snip]---

Among others, Abbassi works very closely with Muqtada Al-Sadr in running the Mahdi army and other insurgency groups; it is entirely possible that Abbassi would have been in Erbil.
Jan-12-2007; IPN (English)


If true, then evidence of direct Iranian involvement in Iraq’s unrest would almost surely become fact.


mg



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 10:56 AM
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they want to see UN troops marching down our streets and then taking away more of our liberties, and then they'll blame it on "terrorists". the NWO can only come to fruition if the u s falls.


Ok..... Mildly Paranoid there.

And where are the "UN" going to get their troops from?

Also considering most of the UN Peacekeepers around the world are African or SE Asian in origin, I would not fear too much...



in daniel it mentions eagles wings on a lion but later in revelations the wings are gone. most/some people interpret this as meaning the united states power gets removed/destroyed. much like the fall of rome (face it, america is the second "rome")


Why is the USA the Second Rome? Do tell.....

On topic...

Why, when it looked as if we might actually start to make progress with the Iranians and Syrians in Iraq and on other aspects, do they need to go and stir the pot? And what Shrub said in the speech yesterday is more or less saying to Iran "Fudge You"...

Idiot...

The guy has an IQ of a Womble on a bad Acid trip....



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 11:04 AM
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Hey !! At least Wombles are environmentally aware...

I tend to think the ''extra'' troop deployment is somewhat mis-leading.It would be useful to have a few extras for any Iranian backlash.
100,000 extra would be required for a reasonable chance of controlling the area though in Iraq alone.



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 11:04 AM
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Originally posted by missed_gear

There are now some reports coming from the Iranian Press and some Iranian bloggers that Hassan Abbasi was among the arrested in Erbil, Iraq.

If true, then evidence of direct Iranian involvement in Iraq’s unrest would almost surely become fact.

mg


Wowzers! What a catch MG. I wonder if this is the same Hassan Abbasi?


Hassan Abbasi Bio

Hassan Abbasi is an Iranian political analyst, the head of the Center for Doctrinal Strategic Studies in the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps, an intelligence officer, top official, and former commander for the Corps. In public speeches, he takes credit for establishing and training anti-Israel guerilla organizations such as Hezbollah.

He is also a highly educated and respected theoretician in the office of Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei, and an advisor to President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.



Ex

posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 01:12 PM
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Strategy PLEASEEEEEEEEEEE...........

What is the Strategy??
Force them into submission?
Iran & Syria also?
Isn't it time to lift sanctions and make friends?
Let them use whatever influence to make some kind
of truce with the insurgents!
We will never get out of this affair looking purty!

Overwhelming force ( which I am not against at this point)
Then make it overwhelming, not just a surge,
that will most definitely fail
for lack of coordination....

All of this make me think......

THERE NEVER WAS A PLAN!!

GW has been riding the seat of his pants this whole time
and now that no plan was in effect.
The emperor has no clothes!



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