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oh common, are you serious

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posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 06:29 PM
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if we have lost faith in the system, then there is no hope for our country. why do people have faith in god? same thing with voting.

let us remember we are one nation under god. and as said by ronald regan "if we ever forget that we are one nation under god, then we will be a nation gone under"

mabee i am a fed but i'm probably a really smart person that thinks bush is behind the cApitalIzaTion Of my leTterS. its a conspiracy theory.

-ajp

[edit on 10-1-2007 by ajpsk8]




posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 06:34 PM
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Originally posted by ajpsk8
why do people have faith in god? same thing with voting.

[edit on 10-1-2007 by ajpsk8]



No it's not! One is a belief in the supernatural and one is a belief in man and that he will represent the people that voted.

You just lost all credibility with that one!


Ram

posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 06:34 PM
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It's now a global thing - I feel it in my country too...
It's not just Bush - it's all over the place..Somthing is comming..
they preparing for it..

For melt down i think...

There is no turning back anymore...

All this confusion - is just a sign of the comming of somthing so big we can't have it in our minds - so they need to control us before it happends.

thats the feeling of this time.
I never felt this before. It's all happending at the same time globally.

They are in a hurry. In some way or in both ways - i feel they are protecting us in a hurry.

There is no way humans can live like this for many more generations - we would work ourself to death...

[edit on 10-1-2007 by Ram]



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 06:35 PM
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Okay Fed guy. Here is something into your D.C. report. Don't compare the Faith in God with the Faith in the Country. Not God screwed the U.S. The president did. And the President is not God, he is not following God's will, nothing. Don't compare the two. God is maybe able to save the country, but the system is wrong, the President is wrong and so on.

You may also add into you daily report: By Dark Crystalline


P.S.: Dark Crystalline with a big "D" and "C", like your D.C. and with double "l". Don't forget. Thanks.


[edit on 10-1-2007 by Dark Crystalline]



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 06:52 PM
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Originally posted by ajpsk8
second what tare you thinking. bush is going to slaughter 20,000 troops(its 30,000 by the way)? you have to understand this is a war my friend, not a holocaust. People die in a war. even if you think we shouldnt be there, we're engaged in a war. and if we pull out, our nation will, ultimately, fall. so remember, people die in a war. it is not bush killing people, it isw terrorists and insurgents in iraq. bush is not dirrectly or indirectly killing soldiers.


I haven't read the whole post (because anyone defending Bush is obviously one of those vehemently blind people who build up walls of fantasy in their minds and reside in them.
However this post caught my attention...

You will notice I bolded a line...



you have to understand this is a war


You have to understand.... this is anything but a war. Granted, originally it was, but now its not. The coalition of the UK and US went to war against Saddam's regime.... and did we not see Saddam hang over Christmas? And he was caught a LONG time before that.
The war was over when the government was toppled and democracy restored. What is happening now, my friend, is an ocupation. Under the pretenses of 'maintaining order', the US and UK have sent thousands of troops, armoured vehicles, and aerial vehicles into a defeated country and are refusing to leave.

The war was over along time ago... so why are they still there? And before you say something about "The War on Terrorism", since when did the Middle East become the sole origin of terrorists?
Holding one country (which is conveniently very rich in oil) to prevent terrorism is absolutely ridiculous.

Can I ask you, if you woke up daily and saw armed forces from another country constantly patrolling your streets, armed soldiers posted outside schools and places of worship, you'd feel pretty terrified right? Well think how the Iraqi's feel. Bush is a very prominent terrorist leader, no less than bin Laden - except he claims to be doing what he's doing for good (and so does OBL).

In waging this war, Bush defied the UN and his little brown nose Blair (who thankfully will be out of office soon) tagged along with him. Their actions have caused the deaths of many brave men and women who fought for their country (and we Brits have not forgotten that the first 20 of our deaths in the war were caused by American 'misfire').

Again, you can't maintain a military presence in a coutnry because it breeds terrorists. Every country has terrorists, and most countries have their own equivalent of Al Qaeda.
So I suggest that you carefully rethink your views on the situation, which sound extremely infantile, naive, and based solely on what the media tells you.

edit: one more thing... (and this will sound extremely wrong but anyway...)

Before the invasion of Iraq, the country was stable. It was ruled by a tyrant who demanded blood.... but it had stability. Everyone knew where they stood. Then in comes Corporal Bush, with his grinning pet poodle, and topples everything.
I agree that Saddam was a threat, but he's dead..... so in the words of internet addicts everywhere



[edit on 10/1/07 by JackofBlades]



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 06:53 PM
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i think the GOVERNMENT did have something to do with the 9-11 event. its a cover up on 2 sides 1 there were alot more deaths than what was reported and 2 it was a pearl harbor like event to start an enevitable war that was necessary. I think the president is a smuck that is going on with what everybody else is telling him. the president is not smart enough to plan all the events out as well as they went....the GOVERNMENT is.



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 06:57 PM
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JackofBlades....


Excellent post



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 07:02 PM
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Dear, Mr. aspj8-
You need to spent more time reading, and less time sniffing paint fumes. Sorry, but you have been lost to the propaganda that is being spewed by Israel.



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 07:17 PM
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Dude what's your tax ID so I can report you for being a terrible disinfo agent.

Educate yourself fully or leave please.



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 07:19 PM
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not everyone 9/11 conspiracy theory is true....but most are as true as the bs the official 9/11 commission tells the public. Before you pass judgements about the plausibility of allegations regarding the motivation for the war on terror and 9/11...take the time to study past actions of our government (similar black flag ops), take the time to study for yourself the science behind the towers falling, take into consideration all the reports from firefighters, police and WTC employess not to mention the live news crews from that day who reported internal explosions in the towers...



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 08:18 PM
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No, I repeat NO 9/11 conspiracy theory, or war for oil theory, or Bush is a Reptilian theory is true. NONE.
Theory. Say it slowly...theory....get my point ?
Proof, PLEASE ???
I'm getting so sick of people throwing their TRUTH on this site, that noone seems to get the point behind reality.
Nothing, not one damn iota of proof is behind these wild, outlandish theories.

Do I have a problem with speculation ? Not at all. Theory on the other hand, is different. Need to have at least some reason behind it.
But, to claim said theory as FACT ??? I call BS. I do.

That is my 2 cent,
Lex



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 08:33 PM
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[edit on 10-1-2007 by Seedless]



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 08:39 PM
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Originally posted by ajpsk8
no, no no dont get me wrong.

i start our by stating my opinion and then we work it down to one thing. if you notice i'm agreeing with a lot of things people say. and i really do not like it when you take my quote and exaggerate it. its called a debate, i'm out here to debate, not to pick a fight.




Would I be incorrect to state that the US constitution allows one to exercise a choice whether or not they wish to vote ? Can someone set me straight on this please ?


dont get me wrong, it people dont like the cantidates, then you dont have to vote, but its people who dont like the government and dont beleive in it who dont vote simply because they dont want to and will never vote who i have a problem with. we are in a world where people in other countries would be willing to be tourtured to death after they cast a vote simply to cast a vote and some people say "nahh i dont like the government so i'm not gonna vote" i'm just saying its a privlege to vote and morally, not constitutionally, but morally, it is right to vote.


So,
Are you pandering for voters to choose a side...Republican..or Democrat..??? For what reason should one be shamed to make a choice? For the sake of lesser of two evils? You say people who don't vote shouldn't bitch correct? When was the last time you really took a look at your W2's..When was the last time the government by that term I mean Republicans & Democrats working together stood up and said "Were making the federal government smaller"? Humm? The small truth is that the system is broke! And those who choose not to cast a vote are those who have opened their eye's to the truth. They choose not to take a side of lesser of two evils' but rather not add fuel to a outta control fire. So before pissing your vote away maybe next time do some research on the person your voting for find out how many times he/she has switched sides or added write on's to bills so they can ensure a platform to be re-elected on the next term. Some day maybe they will have a 3rd or 4th party to make a choice and vote for...Oh..I forgot the Republican and Democatic parties have managed to fix the system where it is almost impossible to run under a third party. Choose with caution next time. Cause you may be voting your own children if you have them in to a police state?



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 09:16 PM
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Now seriously this thread needs closing down, if you have a problem with a theory/opinion state that, don't open up a can of worms where this will end up as a 100 page thread with nothing but arguing and trolling. You said you wanted to debate and you have bought nothing to the table apart from rambling on about "were all stupid for questioning what were told and your right because they say there right". You even bring religion into the equation to open up more worms and set more people off, you know saying that your nation is under god is going to provoke more reaction and fuel to the fire.

Atleast read some of the threads fully, do your own research and come back with a valid point. By the looks of it you ain't nothing but a troll, using your own opinion that you know will get a reaction on here, I say to fellow members don't take the bait.



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 09:24 PM
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Originally posted by tsloan The small truth is that the system is broke! And those who choose not to cast a vote are those who have opened their eye's to the truth.


Yep the system is broke, but it is a system. Make the most of what you got. What are the alternatives, disparate groups of people roaming the land, trying to enforce their point of view and values on others? No consensus at all just small groups of like minded individuals living in a dream like perfect world.

The Iraqis had a system it was not ideal but it beats what they got now I reckon. Fact is when you get a society as large as the US how do you steer a course? You got to ask who would give up their time to Govern etc if their were not some sort of power trip or ego boost? Fact is to achieve what the US has done in Space for example does need a large, organised body. Organisation, opportunities and power.

I would ask myself what sort of person really goes for that sort of job? I don't agree with a lot f what does on and democracy sucks but I am a realist. Someone has to be up there "looking after things" because it certainly wouldn't be me, I got too much integrity and value my spiritual good to much.

I find the whole 911 "W" done it gig a laugh. You give the administration or whatever too much organisational ability imho. The complexities are to great. The scale of the science has not been repeated. You would really have to construct similar towers of similar ages and test out the scenarios.
No-one can say for sure what happened I reckon but after reading lots of "research" (well really loads of internet aquired photos with neat labels attached) I got bored. The fact as I see it is that there is almost as many variations of the theory as there are people believing it. I like the simple life. Some guys got lucky and fulfilled their dream and humbled the mighty US.

If I were on an aircraft in that film scenario where someone says "You gotta fly the plane the pilots dead." The one thing I can guarantee would happen it would crash. Those four aircraft in the hands of guys who never learned to land were only going to meet ground one way...crash.

As for using them as cover for the real event and the complexities involved I say Ha ha ha. If there were deliberate detonations, why the hell go to the complexities of crashing aircraft into them? Blow the buildings and say the terrorists did it seems simpler to me.

Yes perhaps some strange things did happen that day. Is "W" evil and should be stopped I can probably see and agree. But he did not blow those buildings that I can see and believe.

I think that there is more chance of Godzilla and The Smog Monster being guilty of that.

I have read nothing that will change my mind. Right or wrong the story ain't going nowhere for me. I now await loads of long posts with pretty diagrams that I will probably ignore...I seen it all before. Yawn time for bed.............................



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 09:59 PM
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Well, here's some real truths for you...

The U.S invaded Iraq. There's no liberation, just an occupying force and a rebellion against it. Did the Iraqi people ask to be "liberated"? Did they ask for the U.S army to come humiliate, torture and murder them?
Iraq was never a real military threat to America. There was no real political justification for the U.S to invade. Yes, Saddam was a tyrant, but he always had been. He did have WMD, and had previously used them against the Kurds in Northern Iraq. The U.S knew this long before 9/11, partly because they had a hand in selling him the stuff in the first place!
If Saddam was so terrible and such a threat to "U.S interests" (for "U.S interests" read "U.S businesses" or "Israel's money") why did the U.S wait until after 9/11 and the Afghan conflict to go in and depose this monster? Why wasn't it the first thing Bush did after being elected (lol elected, yeah right) for his first term? If Saddam was so evil, why did the U.S government let him continue to persecute his own people for so long after G.W took office? How many Iraqis died at Saddam's hand before the U.S decided to do something about it? Was it morally right for Bush's administration (and Clinton's too, but we're not talking about him right now) to allow this continued persecution? No. After finding no WMD the U.S claimed getting rid of big bad Saddam had helped free the Iraqi's from his oppression. Well, why did they wait so longto do that? Because they really didn't give a toss about the Iraqi people, just the natural resources of their lands. Is it morally correct to bomb the place then contract the rebuilding work to U.S/Allied companies? Why not pay the Iraqis to do it? It's their country after all. Who gets control of the Iraqi oil? U.S\Allied approved companies, who will no doubt be paying the U.S handsomely for the privilege.
My point is, these are hardly the acts of a morally principled leader. The only real benefactors in this are U.S\Allied businesses. Given the ties that George W. Bush and the various members of his administration have with large oil/arms companies, and the vast sums of money involved in this war, is it completely outwith the realms of possibility that Bush may have had a hand in 9/11 or at the very least allowed it to happen? You must admit there are several things about the whole incident that don't seem right. I know you are a Republican, but surely you don't believe everything you are fed by the mainstream media? Within every person on this planet there is the capability to lie and deceive. Just because someone is elected (ahem) doesn't mean that they are beyond reproach. Look at Richard Nixon!!!

Personally, I do think G.W perhaps knew about and allowed the WTC to happen. After learning of the imminent attack, he may have fabricated the attack on the Pentagon to help facilitate the eventual Iraq war, purely for oil money. I think some of the theories regarding holographic planes/subterranean nuclear detonations are well, frankly, a bit nuts, but entertaining nonetheless.

P.S - I'm from the U.K and to me Tony Blair is just as guilty over the whole Iraq mess, and should also be brought to account.

P.P.S - Sorry for the long post.



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 10:35 PM
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Whether or not we should be in Iraq does not matter any more. We are at war right now and the question should be what are we going to do about it? The way I see it we have two options:

-Count our losses and pull out now.
or
-Stay until our objectives are completed.

If we stay, there will undoubtedly be many hundreds more dead servicemen and women. There will also be billions of more dollars spent supporting this war.

If we decided to pull out and leave things as they lay, everything would be fine for a few months or maybe even longer. The thing that I don't think people understand is that eventually the war would come to us here in the US. The things that would happen would make 9/11 look like good times.

Can you imagine the following?

-Your child and their whole class being blown up in school by a suicide bomber? Just think of getting that phone call and having to identify their body in the morgue.
-Your Mom and Dad being blown up by an IED on the way to get groceries at the store?
-Receiving small arms fire walking down the street just minding your own business...

If these scenarios actually played out, you know martial law would be declared. Everyone is complaining about your mail being opened or your phone calls recorded. Stop and think for a minute what it would be like to have soldiers constantly patrolling your streets and inspecting everything. You would virtually no privacy or rights.

Just watch the news for one night and see how many Iraqi civilians are killed or found beheaded and tortured to death somewhere. That could very well be happening here in America!

One way or another, we are going to have to prepare for more death and destruction...the question is how do we want it served?



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 10:50 PM
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Sorry, although it might sound strange, I actually wasn't trying to say anything about the war itself (as PrepareForThe Worst says, what's done is done, and we'll just have to figure out the best way to deal with it - voting out Republicans and Labour would be a start!) I was just using the moral justification aspect to illustrate to the OP that perhaps they shouldn't be quite so naive about the true intentions of G.W Bush, or any other politician for that matter. After all, there's that old joke...

"How do you know a politician is lying? - Their mouth is open!"

I'm not saying Bush DID have a hand in 9/11, just that it is a plausible theory, that shouldn't be dismissed on the basis of partisan b.s!



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 10:57 PM
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Seeing as voting was bought up let me add my 2c, maybe it will make you think? Probably not.

When you vote you give up your own power. When you elect a leader you give away your own liberty. Whoever you vote for is your master; if you're religious you shouldn't worship two masters, right?
You put these people above the law, because you are giving them the right to make the law, and we know what Bush has done with the law now don't we?

You vote to allow someone you really have NO clue as to their real motivations to be your master. To vote is to give up your freedom!

People need to realise that nothing will change by voting, cause the system is rigged. You never get to vote on war, only who you want to be your master.
Whoever you vote for the wars go on, the starving are not fed, the homeless are not housed, the poor are not lifted from their misery. But the elite keep getting wealthier, and the laws keep getting more restrictive, and the poor, of course, keep getting poorer.

Whoever you vote for government wins. We need to organise from the bottom up instead of the top down, stop elites ever forming and taking control again.



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 11:51 PM
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Originally posted by ANOK
Whoever you vote for government wins. We need to organise from the bottom up instead of the top down, stop elites ever forming and taking control again.


I think the best thing to do would be to eliminate all parties and affiliations. Having different parties only splits countries up. As for America, we are all Americans and we should all vote as Americans. I get so sick of hearing people say they voted for someone just because they were Democrat or Republican or whatever! The good majority of people are too lazy to research the candidates for what they believe in.

I definitely agree with you in that America needs to get the social elite out of office. Very few people can relate to these Ivy League leaders with millions of dollars to their name..I know I can't!

I fear that there is nothing that we can do about it now though as these people are so engrained into this country...not to mention voting fraud, but that is a whole other bucket of apples!



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