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Katadyn water filter questions

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posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 03:47 AM
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I have read in this section about these water filters, If its mentioned here i would assume theyre the best for most situtaions you could find yoursef in.

Living out of the city there are a few camping shops this way but i would imagine the prices are nearest the RRP due to them not buying many as demand will be low.

I would say the net will be the cheapest place to buy, With the £ to $ rates the way they are buying from the US seems a good way to save money (as long as they send it as a gift and not a bought item to save import duty).

I have a few Questions about them.

Can they be used and left for months and then used again when need be? Or do they need to be cleaned out in clean water before storage?

The blurb on some sites say they can filter up to a certain amount of water, If they quote 'up to' how much can each model be expected to filter before filter replacement. What causes the 'up to' bit? would a very fine gauze on the pipe that sucks water in help with not clogging the filter.

Would the drinking bottles be a good accessory to the filter by maybe catching what the filter didnt? If having to be mobile and illness free was of the most priority.

We have Old wells round this way, a freshwater spring about 1 mile away what very few people know about and never has in the 20 years i have known it to be there never to be less than half full, so if for some reason we have a water shortage i can always get water and not do a panic buy like everyone else stripping the shops on Evian and Buxton water.

Any more info on the filters greatfully recieved as some shop sites seem to gloss over what i really want to know and i know if i need to ask questions about this sort of gear, Heres the place for questions




posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 05:38 AM
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Hi , i own a " katydyn pocket " filtration system -

filter life and preformance is awesome .

i have had mine over 15 years .

you clean it with a wire brish - and litterally abrade thge exhaused ceramic matrix away - to expose new element - its colour changes .

filter life is checked with a go / no go guage - if the diameter of the filter element gets below the guage sixe - it requires replacement

mine is no where near exhausted - though i have only used it for about [ guesstimate ] 5000 litres - i have abused it with some crappy intake water

according to friends that abuse thiers far more than i , silt and algea in water are killers .

they reccomend pre filrering with a fine cloth

but here is the user manual

its a PDF .

finally , yes you need clean water [ supplied by the filter
] to clean and rinse it before storage - but it comes with a took kit in the pouch

its very fast and easy to service it .

yes they are expensive - but they are so dammed good and easy to use - they are worth it

i have literally pumped water from a stream - with the out flow pipe in my teeth - hydration on the go



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 08:25 AM
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I have used a Katadyn filter for many many years and have never had a problem. The company that makes them is Swiss so if you live in the UK you may have a better place to get them than ordering from the US over the internet. Here is a quote of mine from another thread here on ATS:

"Katadyn water filters are issued to NATO troops( or they used to be anyway, not sure if they still are). They filter out known pathogens and there is no need to pre-boil the water. No filter will get out radioactive material nor chemical wastes. They use a ceramic filter element with a pore size of only 0.2 micron (0.0002mm or 0.000008"). This ensures 100% removal of bacteria, protozoa, and cysts, including giardia, cryptosporidium, cholera, shigella, salmonella, E.coli, etc. Because of the extremely long life of the ceramic element, Katadyn filters produce safe drinking water at a tiny fraction of the cost per gallon of most other filters. They are very long lasting ceramic filters and even after thousands of gallons, they will still do the job. Their Pocket Filter model is good for 13,000 gallons. "


If the water you are filtering is full of silt, mud or algae, it is recommended that you cover the intake hose with a cloth to help pre filter out anything that would tend to clog the filter. The filter is made from ceramic with fine pores, but it can easily be scrubbed clean. You can store one on the shelf forever with no problem ss it is not a carbon activated filter.

It is the only filter I would consider buying.



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 09:33 AM
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I've got the Katadyn Hiker. I love it! Small and light weight. Costs about $60. In between my backpacking trips I do clean for storage using cl2 and rinsing. I trust it 100% and the filters last a long time before needing replacement.



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 09:44 AM
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Not to get too far off topic here but, has anyone here used one of those new UV light filters? They are very small and lightweight and supposedly they do a very good job at killing all microbes within a container of water. Anyone have any first hand knowledge of these kinds of filtration? I've been thinking about picking up the SteriPen to add to my backpacking gear.

[edit on 6-1-2007 by Creedo]



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 09:46 AM
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One thing I should add. The ceramic filters are silver impregnated which helps to kill bacteria.



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 09:56 AM
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Regarding the Steripen. Note that it is not a filter, but a sterilizer so you have to filter your water first. It also requires a specific water bottle type so it cant be used in all situations to sterilize water. Good that it also destroys Viruses. Bad that it needs batteries.

I tend to rely on things that are simple as tech tends to break just when you need it. In this case I'd be worried about batterys and a breakable lightbulb. Still, it is a good tool for certain situations. Here is a good review on the product:
Steripen review



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 10:05 AM
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Originally posted by Creedo

has anyone here used one of those new UV light filters? They are very small and lightweight and supposedly they do a very good job at killing all microbes within a container of water.


yup they do work , and do the job they are designed to

but in my experience - they are only really good for sterilizing " clean water "

if the water looks clean , but you are suspicios that it may be untreated [ a 3rd world water " supply " etc ] then they are great - fast effective and effortless

but if you are dealing with cloudy water - forget it - even though it is sterile - and the presence of suspended solids degrades UV sterilization

so its going to take longer , or still be at risk

you are still going to have to injest whatever crap is floating in the water - it may be sterile , but that does not always mean safe - and it certainly does not mean palatable


Anyone have any first hand knowledge of these kinds of filtration?


what filtration ?????????? all the UV sterilizers do is kill organic athogens and parasites

katadyn filter will not take out hemicals - but it does make a big difference to taste

brakish waster is still repulsive - but katadyn filtered brakish water is a thousand fold more platable than brakish water that has been sinply sterilized to kill pathogens and parasites



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 06:05 PM
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I guess I should have stated my area of use... I do alot of backpaking into Yosemite National Park and for the most part you can chug water right from the creeks up there. The water is VERY pure and giardia is about the only risk you would be taking by drinking unfilterd creek water up there. The SteriPen would be ideal... for me... because the water needs almost no filtration because it is sooo crystal clear. However.... I would like to eliminate microbes should they be present. We usually take a Katadyn filter along with us but it is a chore to pump all the water needed for camp and a bit dificult to do after the 1st bottle of Jamesons.. =P



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 06:51 PM
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For Yosemite, the Steripen would be a good choice provided you also use the appropriate bottle. Giardia has been a problem there in the past but the Steripen would take care of that. It is much better than utilizing Iodine tablets which make the water taste terrible and in the long run, are not healthy for you. At $140 it isnt cheap, but it is far better than getting sick.



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 07:48 PM
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Thanks for all the answers


I think i will take a drive tomorow and find a camping shop, Just to see which models they stock and have a good look at them. I wont buy one from there as my Khyam tent was very expensive compared to online deals i saw after purchase.(look before you leap!)

Cheapest Uk price i found so far on the web is £170
Best US price so far is £87 not sure of shipping though.











[edit on 6-1-2007 by trueskeptic]



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 08:30 PM
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If you plan on doing long backpacking trips then I suggest you factor weight in. Sometimes even the smallest weight can put a burden on you physically and mentaly. Depending on how much water you need to cook with and filling bladder or canteen should be considered. I love my katadyn hiker, it's small and lightweight but pumping large amounts takes a bit. It;s great for week trips when you can leave the tent or lean-to to hit some summits and return to camp. I primarily hit the Adirondacks because it's close. If you get a chance you must hit some peaks in the Adirondacks. It's beautiful there.

[edit on 6-1-2007 by I See You]



posted on Jan, 7 2007 @ 06:54 AM
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Originally posted by I See You
If you plan on doing long backpacking trips then I suggest you factor weight in. Sometimes even the smallest weight can put a burden on you physically and mentaly. Depending on how much water you need to cook with and filling bladder or canteen should be considered. I love my katadyn hiker, it's small and lightweight but pumping large amounts takes a bit. It;s great for week trips when you can leave the tent or lean-to to hit some summits and return to camp. I primarily hit the Adirondacks because it's close. If you get a chance you must hit some peaks in the Adirondacks. It's beautiful there.

[edit on 6-1-2007 by I See You]


HELLO

just to advise the readers here that a simple and cheap way to eliminate bacteria/fungi is to use a 3 or 6 volt battery and pass a CURRENT THRU the WATER using stanless steel electrodes for example stainless steel spoons etc...

this turns it into "electrolysed water"....type this into a search engine...

(LOOK IN GOOGLE FOR LOADS OF RESEARCH ON ITS ANTI BACTERIAL PROPERTIES.)



posted on Jan, 7 2007 @ 07:31 AM
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Sure, passing an electric current through water will indeed kill off bacteria etc., But, how long will that battery last? I have spent months at a time in the wild with my Katadyn filter. A battery would have been long dead. Good for short term use perhaps, but not something I would recomend for more than a weekend. Katadyn filters are issued to many NGOs and Aid organisations due to their rugged nature and proven long term effectiveness. My single Katadyn filter will get me 13,000 gallons of filtered water, how much will a single battery give me?



posted on Jan, 7 2007 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by Terapin
Sure, passing an electric current through water will indeed kill off bacteria etc., But, how long will that battery last? I have spent months at a time in the wild with my Katadyn filter. A battery would have been long dead. Good for short term use perhaps, but not something I would recomend for more than a weekend. Katadyn filters are issued to many NGOs and Aid organisations due to their rugged nature and proven long term effectiveness. My single Katadyn filter will get me 13,000 gallons of filtered water, how much will a single battery give me?



you can use a hand powered dynamo to re-charge the cells...

u r correct and no doubt a solarcell can be used or a mains adapter or a car battery which will last a very long time indeed...

does the katadyn filter kill bacteria/viruses??


in any case here are the many studies on electrolysed water showing its anti bacterial properties...

surprisingly most people are ignorant of this...



www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...



posted on Jan, 7 2007 @ 03:55 PM
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As I indicated, passing an electric current through water works fine. I simply don't want to lug around a battery and generator, or solar recharger. It is too much equipment for me.
Katadyn does eliminate bacteria, but not viruses. Cholera, botulism, typhoid, dysentery, giardia, cryptosporadiosis, and many others are effectively filtered out with the Katadyn filter.

Water based viruses have not been an issue with me as of yet. The SteriPen would take care of that and with a much more effective current use than passing a current through water. Hepatitis A and Polio, two viruses that can be water born, are not something that I worry about too much as my exposure to them is nil. I am also immunized against them.



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 09:14 PM
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As an avid outdoor enthusiast, life-long Alaskan and Eagle Scout...I highly recomend the "First Need" brand of water purifiers.

I have used the MSR-brand, Sweetwater, PUR...and countless others via boys that were in my troop and the "First Need" was the only one that:

1. Didn't clog easily
2. Didn't break
3. Fit the threads on a standard nalgene
4. Filtered water faster than others
5. Filtered out even virii

My dad and I were turned on to the General Ecology "First Need" line after another dad in my troop showed us/let us use one. He was a retired Coast Guard Captian and did contract work in remote areas of Russia for oil companies. He swore by the reliability and effectiveness of his First Need...After seeing how the other widely available filters preformed in comparison my father and I were sold.

I have yet to get my hands on one of these katadyn products, but if the filter can be reused over and over...I might just have to change my mind about the First Need!



posted on Jan, 10 2007 @ 09:18 PM
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Oh, for quick reference...(i didnt know so many ppl also liked these First Need systems) here's a link to the user reviews, many by reputable people in very exotic and remote locals! Hahah and here I am thinking Alaska is all "exotic and remote" *pft*!

First Need User Reviews



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 09:37 AM
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I had a quick read through all the information, so i may have missed this but can these babys be used to filter seawater? would the salt clog it or anything?



posted on Jan, 11 2007 @ 10:10 AM
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Water that is saturated with anything wears a water filter out very quickly. I believe that the ceramic water filters such as the Katadyn Pocket Filter can remove most of the minerals out of sea water, however; the trade off is going to be much shorter filter lifespan. Besides this the acidic nature of seawater is probably going to be hard on the O-Rings that seal the system up.

At the moment I am using an MSR Miniworks, which has the same basic ceramic filter type as the Katadyn, but with only a 2000-5000 gallon lifespan on the filter. This is the filter that is used by the US Marine Amphibious Units. It generally functions the same exact way though, you scrub the filter with an abrasive to clean it, and you check filter life with a ring.

Since the MSR does not have the silver infused into the filter element I boil water or treat it with a cap of bleach per gallon to ensure that any virus’s or bacteria are killed before using. As soon as I have an extra $200 lying around though the MSR is going into storage, and I am going to pick up a KPF. You just cannot beat the longevity of a KPF.

The MSR’s good qualities though are that it is made of nylon, which makes it very light, it uses the same basic type of filter element as the KPF, even if not quite as high quality, and its less then half the price. You can find a MiniWorks on line for about $60. Even though I plan on getting a KPF, I really cannot gripe about the MSR, it’s a good filter, it just does not last as long. I plan to put a fresh filter on it and keep it as a back-up to the KPF.

The biggest thing to remember with any water filter though is that you have to keep the filtered water separate from the intake water, if even one drop of the intake water gets into the filtered water, then you might as well not have even bothered with the filter to begin with. So no matter the filter, its good to have your water capture device be something that can thread tightly onto the bottom of the filter pump. Be very careful when you remove the filtered water capture bottle that water from the intake hose, or the top end of the filter does not drip into the filtered water.

Edit to add one more thing:

Though these ceramic filters remove almost everything from the water, they don’t necessarily treat poor taste. To take care of foul taste in water you really need to use a charcoal filter. The problem with charcoal is that it has absolutely the worst lifespan of almost any filter. 80 gallons is about the limit on most charcoal filters I have seen on the market, and that plain stinks. You can learn to make a charcoal filter in the field, then treat your water with that first then run it through your ceramic filter as a second stage. This would also increase the lifespan of the ceramic filter as the charcoal filter will remove the larger particles before they go through the ceramic filter element.

Also I cannot attest for the truth of this, but I came across this gentleman that claims you can reactivate a used charcoal filter by back flushing and boiling it.


Water Purifaction
The units already have a carbon (activated charcoal) unit that comes with the water pitcher units. The thing is: You have to keep buying the carbon filters. What you're not told, as you can surmise from the above, is that you can boil or steam them for 5 minutes or so and reactivate the carbon elements---some more expensive units allow you to do this. If not, replace with virgin carbon.
However, there is some concern here. Because the temperatures for this second reactivation do not reach the 500 to 900 degrees C that some technical material calls for. But, High Capacity Water Filter (see below) with a carbon filter says its filters can be recharged by this method---boiling them for 5 minutes in water to evaporate chlorine used in chlorine treated water. We suggest the water be filtered.
Nevertheless, if you (a) boil out your filters, then you could try backflushing first. But, since the incoming port to the filter screen is so small, compared to the outport screen, you may not be able to backflush the refuse (contaminates) out sufficiently, by forcing clean water from the outport screen through the import screen. Then, pour (b) hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) through the outport screen until the filter is saturated. Let rest for 15 to 20 minutes to kill microorganisms; then boil for 10 minutes. We did our Brita® as such and it did not melt, and it works beautifully. If this does not work for you, after testing your spent filter, then replace the filtering unit(s) if you stored enough; or, make your own (see below) using Activated Carbon (charcoal).

Again also remember that purification is not the same thing as filtering.



[edit on 1/11/2007 by defcon5]



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