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Man faces life imprisonment for chanting slogans at rally

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posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 02:43 PM
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news.bbc.co.uk...


Umran Javed 27, of Birmingham, was also convicted of stirring up racial hatred by a jury at the Old Bailey.

Javed told a crowd of hundreds at the February 2006 protest: "Bomb, bomb Denmark, bomb, bomb USA."

He had claimed the chants against the two countries were "just slogans" and that he regretted saying them.


I'll admit that the extent of his comments were pretty extreme, and are not the safest of slogans, as some may take it seriously. However, the possability of life imprisonment for them is pretty extreme as well, if you ask me.

The sentance won't be passed until April, but what do you think would be appropriate for his actions?




posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 02:54 PM
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Thats the World we live in Guys. I live in UK & respect all creeds, colours & cultures but when you see all these ubermuslim dudes on TV spouting threats & hatred, what else are you going to do ?
If I did it I would be locked up, so what's the difference ?



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 03:12 PM
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I think that an arrest would have been appropriate. I believe the cahrge could have been something less though. Something that didn't hold the possability of life imprisonment maybe.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 03:43 PM
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Well, if he was calling for people to bomb others, it's not the same as just shouting death to America. If he is an influential person and is calling for direct action, perhaps it can be viewed as an actual attempt at that action....



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 03:54 PM
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He forgot to mention 'Bomb Norway' as the cartoons were also published in some norwegian papers


Now on a more serious note. If this guy is some sort of religious leader or otherwise person of authority in the muslim community I could understand the reactions, but this is just an ordinary guy. I'm sure many protesters have called for the death of Bush, Blair and many similar things without being arrested and facing possibility of life in prison. It seems the british government is locked in an impossible situation where they must clamp down on 'extreme muslims' while at the same time not offend the muslims as that may get them ever more angry. Life in prison is extreme to say the least...



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 04:17 PM
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You bring up a good point DrLeary, if someone was chanting "Bomb Bush" or "Kill Bush", would they deserve to face life imprisonment? Keep in mind, this dude is only 27, and not likely a leader of any church.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 04:27 PM
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What happens to people who shout,

"Bomb Iran!" or...

"Bomb Iraq!"

or

"Bomb North Korea!"

What happens to people who print these slogans on the Net?


Where do we start? ...And where do we stop?

Do we only charge people who say it outright? Only ordinary folks, but not politicians?






posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 05:11 PM
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*sigh*

damn you war on terror

honestly, stories like these are what make me sad

to think that there's a possiblity for L I F E in prison
sure, those are considered inflammetory
but still, just fine the guy or give him community service
maybe a week in jail

hell, i'm surprised he hasn't been shipped to gitmo



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 07:08 PM
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Originally posted by soficrow
What happens to people who shout,

"Bomb Iran!" or...

"Bomb Iraq!"

or

"Bomb North Korea!"



Exactly! If this was the case it wouldn't even be a story. Life imprisonment is overly excessive considering the fact that what he said, is no different to a politician or some church leaders saying that we need to bomb a country such as Iran.

These double standards are going to make free speach a tricky game to play in the real world or on the internet......if it isn't already.

I'm not saying I agree with what he said, but there's no way in hell that he should lose his life over it when we have the same messages being repeated by our "esteemed" leaders.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 10:09 PM
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what if someone ended up actually bombing denmark, or the usa? do you think he should be held responsible after that?



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 10:23 PM
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As Bush would say,either you are with us or you are with the terrorists.So much for freedom of speech.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 10:49 PM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
what if someone ended up actually bombing denmark, or the usa? do you think he should be held responsible after that?


I've been thinking about what you've asked and its a hard question to answer, when it really shouldn't be.

There's so many double standards these days that freedom of speach/accountability has been tipped on its head.

First off, yes if this guy had direct involvement in killing innocent people then of course he should be charged.

However, do we charge people who are vocal about illegally invading foreign countries, which results in thousands of innocent deaths?

Do we investigate people that have "bomb iran" bumperstickers, because they are expressing their point of view?

Double standards are so common now that I refuse to choose a side, because its idiotic to blame one "team" when the other is playing by the same rules.

"Don't hate the player, hate the game" haha sounds corny buts that's exactly how I see this.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 11:30 PM
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that's not peaceful protest, that's enciting violence....although i agree that life imprisonment is a bit extreme. make him pick up dog crap on the side of the road for a few weekends, and put him on probation.



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 02:10 AM
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What he did was a crime and rightfully so, but not one deserving of life imprisonment. At best he could be charged with DTP or inciting a riot.

30 days in county, a fine, and a record that will call him into question if there should be violence are sufficient.

Do you have any idea how many people on ATS would be in jail for the rest of their lives if that was standard fare for advocating a bombing? Bye bye America if that law ever spreads, I tell ya.



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 03:13 AM
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This is tricky. Part of me says, "he is actively trying to incite terrorism, kill him!" and the other part of me says, "what's next, saying 'Don't eat genetically modified food, the FDA is wrong!!" could be the next hypothetical life-imprisonment scenario.

It all boils down to the motives of not the speaker, but the motives of the one passing the law and the one carring out the law. If it's two steps forwards, one step back- then I think THAT is punishable by life-imprisonment. If the law is actually sincere, then maybe it's ok.

It's a close call- and very very tricky.



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 04:25 AM
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Wow

Just wow

So now spoken words at a demonstration are a crime? A crime punishable by life in prison?

So when christians or jews or buddists fall out of favor with the powers that be; would they be prosecuted accordingly?

Guess the steps from speech to actions are not that far these days.

How long till just thinking these things is a crime?

[edit on 6/1/2007 by shooterbrody]



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 05:22 AM
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if they let rapists and murders out of prison early
anyone really think he will serve life? no chance the british legal system is the most F****ked and is most faver of criminals



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 09:59 AM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
I think that an arrest would have been appropriate. I believe the cahrge could have been something less though. Something that didn't hold the possability of life imprisonment maybe.


In the UK life imprisonment isn't for life. The average "life" sentence is actually 10 years. A prisoner sentenced to life can be out within 5 and 7 years. Upon sentence a third of the alloted time is knocked off.

If you'd seen the context in which the idiot under discussion made his comments, you'd probably see that 5 years inside would not only teach him a worthwhile lesson, but more importantly set an example to others. On the day in question hundreds of militant Muslims took the streets waving placards and calling for non-believers to be beheaded and killed, praising 9/11 and the London tube bombers, calling for Denmark to be bombed, and ironicially, demanding free speech be banned as free speech allows people to insult Islam!

These people were on the street spouting hate and making death threats, which breaches the law. Not one arrest was made at the time. This caused a public outcry, because as we all know, if a bunch of non-Muslims people had protested in the same manner calling for all Muslims to be exectued and their countries destroyed, the Government's response would have been somewhat less timid. Infact, on the day in question the only threat of arrest made was toward a white non-Muslim lorry driver who dared to stop his vehicle to argue with the Muslims and complain to the Police about the nature of the protest.

Someone asked would the same happen with Jews and Christians if they"fell out of favour"? I'm sure it would...if Jews and Christians took to the streets in their hundreds to praise terrorists and scream for the public execution of all those who don't follow their beliefs...

Infact, if anything, the situation was allowed to occur because our Government is so afraid of offending Muslims, because Muslims are so "in favour". When the IRA were regularly bombing England, killing both adults and children indiscriminately, it would have been unthinkable for members of the Irish community to take to London's streets on the anniversary of a large attack, cover Catholic churches in posters gloryfing the event, and march around with placards calling for more terrorism. But here we are, at the height of a "war on terror", and Muslims do just that in praise of Muslim terrorism on British streets, and it's completely tolerated by the authorities.

People now are starting to get seriously sick and tired of witnessing such Governmental double-standards in favour of militant Muslims, and the sentence hanging over the individual in question probably (and quite rightly) reflects that.


[edit on 6-1-2007 by spqr1]



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 10:00 AM
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It's called responsible for you actions. "I thought I would make a speech and say what I needed to say" well,now you answer for your actions. Now he's crying like a little girl



posted on Jan, 6 2007 @ 10:29 AM
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Funny how things works in our world and specially in our nation that is becoming oppressive on freedom of speech as long as is not directed to our own nation and allies.

But is OK to want the death of muslin and countries that our nation claims are the enemy of us.

I call it forced patriotism.



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