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Royal Navy to cut fleet by half?

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posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 06:06 AM
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After a cool assessment of the threats the Royal Navy is likely to face in the medium term, the question that needs to answered is "What is the Navy For". I don't go along with the Max Hastings line that, the future of the RN is as a Taxi service for the Army (he also said something similar about the RAF) but it is clear that everyone from The Admiralty and MOD down is having trouble defining The Navy's future role. Whilst there is a shift in equipment terms to meeting the expeditionary needs of the armed forces (the new carriers, The Helicopter Carrier HMS Ocean, The two Bulwark Class Landing Platforms and Auxiliaries etc.) The Navy still seems to configured, both mentally and operationally to meet Cold-War Challenges. It's most numerous Class, The type 23, whilst being referred to as a General Purpose Frigate is principally an ASW asset. What do we need for the future?

Although written in 2004 The Article "HMS Useless" written by the former RN Officer Lewis Page still raises many valid points. It's a good read too. (I hope the link still works).
www.prospect-magazine.co.uk...




posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 06:20 AM
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Problem with Politicians is they might not have a "need" for ASW assets now, but who's to know in 10-15 years time?

Before the FW in '82, there wasn't a "need" on our primarily ASW fleet for CIWS..

How wrong we were....



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 06:33 AM
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Perhaps, but lets be honest, are we ever likely to be threatened by a massive submarine threat in the future? Sure there might be the need to deal with limited threats but they are unlikely to be as significant as the Soviet Navy in terms of size and sophistication?



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 06:44 AM
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Originally posted by Fang
Perhaps, but lets be honest, are we ever likely to be threatened by a massive submarine threat in the future? Sure there might be the need to deal with limited threats but they are unlikely to be as significant as the Soviet Navy in terms of size and sophistication?


China? Russia is flexing again, give them 10 years and they'll be back to their old selves.

thing is, you never know. We could design and build a limited number of Type-23 replacements. At least then, we could churn out more if the Sub threat increases. having no replacement on the cards is leaving a big hole that could not be filled in an emergency.

Then again, British forces are world famous for making do with what they have, but we shouldn't have too. We're the 4th richest nation on the planet, for crying out loud!

If we didn't spend £300 Billion on Social Security and forced the scroungers to work, there would be enough money for the MoD, the NHS and Education combined, with enough left over to cover another Bank Holiday for St Georges Day


EDIT: I would have no problem with the people getting the dole if they actually did something to earn it.. Make them all do community service or something.. Clean up the streets or work on the railways or something.. Not money for free, Jeeebus....

[edit on 12/1/07 by stumason]



posted on Jan, 12 2007 @ 07:13 AM
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I think you will see a fair amount of strutting about from the Russians but I'm not sure you will see them trying to cut off trying Europe or take on NATO and as for the Chinese I don't think they are likely to be a direct threat to us for some time. I'm more concerned about our ability to take on a crude but better armed Russian/Chinese built Destroyer operated by a developing nation, our ability to provide support for a landing in an African state, and anti-terrorist operations. I know ball gazing is a tricky business and the lead times on new ships is bonkers but I can't help get the impression that The Navy is thrashing around trying to find a role for itself.

More public holidays, oh yes!



posted on Jan, 13 2007 @ 08:11 AM
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Linked with the future of the United Kingdom's defence, Blair gave a rather interesting speech on it yesterday. The transcript can be found here, and if you dig around the BBC News site you can find a video of the first half.

Seems UK defence spending overall is on the increase... and rightly so, in my opinion.



posted on Jan, 13 2007 @ 08:40 AM
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See if any want to join RAN. Aus gov should give free citizenship if u
sign up for service in the RAN. RAN is so short staffed.



posted on Jan, 13 2007 @ 06:09 PM
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Originally posted by Jezza
See if any want to join RAN. Aus gov should give free citizenship if u
sign up for service in the RAN. RAN is so short staffed.


Only drawback is that we'd have to live in Australia....





posted on Jan, 13 2007 @ 07:17 PM
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Originally posted by stumason

Only drawback is that we'd have to live in Australia....




it's a better country than ours and not just at cricket.

[edit on 13-1-2007 by st3ve_o]



posted on Jan, 14 2007 @ 01:09 AM
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It isn't difficult to find stories about either UK social decay or military nightmares these days, and without wishing to "dogpile", this story is far from unusual:



Army supply problems revealed
IAN BRUCE and LUCY BANNERMAN
The Herald, January 20 2004

SCORES of soldiers have contacted The Herald with a litany of complaints
about combat equipment in the wake of the controversy over Sergeant Steven Roberts, the British soldier killed in Iraq.

Angry servicemen claimed many of them were sent into Iraq without essentials such as body armour, morphine, radios, combats or desert boots . and even ammunition.

One soldier wrote how his unit put empty magazines on their weapons for the sake of appearance.

Sergeant Roberts's widow, Samantha, emerged from a meeting with Geoff Hoon yesterday to say she would give the defence secretary "one last chance" to tell the truth about how her husband died.

However, she said Mr Hoon "should seriously consider his position", claiming that he had still failed to accept personal responsibility for her husband's death 10 months ago or identify who was to blame.

Sergeant Roberts, 33, was shot dead by friendly fire in Zubayr, near Basra, just days after being ordered to give up his enhanced combat body armour because there was not enough to go round. An MoD report later said he would have survived the shooting if he had been wearing tough ceramic plates in his flak jacket.

The dead soldier's widow said: "It's a big issue. There are many, many, many soldiers that do not have basic equipment. Time and time again we are hearing from soldiers, brave men who are prepared to put their lives on the line, and they are not getting any support from the government."

The men who contacted The Herald asked not to be identified in case they
faced disciplinary action. One, a battle group officer, said: "When my unit
went over the start line (in Iraq), upwards of one in three were still
without desert combats and more than half didn't have desert boots. We were also unable to deploy to the border until the last minute because we had no ammunition until then."



posted on Jan, 14 2007 @ 04:40 AM
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These shortages are inexcusable and are down to (in the case of Body Armour) Government subterfuge) and more commonly, the MOD employing a supply criteria which is better suited to Tescos than the armed forces. Why weren't there sufficient body armour kits stored for every combat unit in the Army? Because the MOD has cut back on storage capacity and has 'ready in time' contracts with suppliers.

And to those who think this is a new problem and that the country is going to the dogs, read some Rudyard Kipling and see what he had to say about the 'War Office'.



posted on Jan, 14 2007 @ 05:42 AM
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Originally posted by stumason

Originally posted by Jezza
See if any want to join RAN. Aus gov should give free citizenship if u
sign up for service in the RAN. RAN is so short staffed.


Only drawback is that we'd have to live in Australia....




Its better than being unemployed and the exchange rate is great compared
to aus dollar...



posted on Jan, 14 2007 @ 05:09 PM
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Just in case the humour was lost, I was only joking


I actually wouldn't mind living in Oz, but family commitments etc prevent me from doing so.



posted on Jan, 16 2007 @ 05:59 AM
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Originally posted by stumason
Just in case the humour was lost, I was only joking


I actually wouldn't mind living in Oz, but family commitments etc prevent me from doing so.



I know mate everything cool.
just a shame that aus screaming for workers and cant fill jobs



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