Murdered Black Entertainers: No Justice

Originally posted by HarlemHottie

Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
If someone did know who shot Biggie, do you think the odds are more in favor that those who know the truth are black, or white?

Did you read the whole thread???

We don't have to hypothesize. We already know. They're blue.

So, for the THIRD time in this thread, I will post an excerpt from, and a link to, an ATS thread about the murders of Tupac and Biggie. Please, educate yourselves.

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
On Biggie
According to Russell Poole, the former LAPD detective investigating Biggie's death, all roads lead to Suge Knight or, more accurately, a sect of Bloods associated with Knight.

After months of investigating and substantial amounts of evidence, Poole accused an LAPD officer, David Mack, along with his friend Amir Muhammad, of being complicit in the murder. Poole had proof that Mack had ties with the CEO of Death Row Records, Suge Knight....Poole sent this information to the chief of the Los Angeles Police Department, Benard Parks, who ordered Poole to stop all investigation on Mack as Mack had been arrested for bank robbery in December 1997 and was on his way to prison.

So, Suge Knight appears again, this time with a connection to the LAPD, David Mack. Mack, obviously corrupt, also seems to have friends in high places. Look at how the police chief protects him from being implicated in Biggie's murder.

If you wanna see the Documentary about Tupac and Biggies investagation its here.Watch and be educated

Originally posted by MasterJedi
I only read the first 3 pages of this thread so if someone has covered this already I apologize in advance.

Spawwn, while you have a point about perhaps noone caring to look into their murders, I don't think you are looking at this properly.

If they had a huge crackdown on the drug trafficking and gangbanging and rounded all the people up, then you'd be hollering racism, because they were born into that culture... But its that very lifestyle that led to their murders, so to prevent further murders shouldn't they crack down on gangbangers? Shouldn't everyone stop buying the stuff that promotes violence and drug dealing? Of course not, casue I'm sure the whole war on drugs and such wouldn't actually help huh? Its a tool to further the racist agenda no?

The fact is black culture needs to look to people that break out of the drug dealing and gangbanging as their heroes... Tupac was a thug and doesn't deserve to be idolized. In fact its truly sad that anyone would aspire to be a former drugdealer, turned rapper. For God's sake these are your children... make them look up to Edward Temple of TSU fame...A wonderful man and close friend of my family. Make the rappers look like exactly what they are...a rolemodel of how NOT to be.

I may be a little racist, but with reason. Its a fact that crime is higher in the poor black communities, that drugs are more prevailant and that violence has become a way of life to many of the black youth today. Its up to the black fathers to change the way their children are growing up. Because ultimately that is who every child no matter their color should look up to, their mother and father...Stop blaming and start leading.

Just 2 cents... and I might feel different tomorrow =)

Tupac was a thug, but he wasnt a horrible person. You know he was one of the best poet ever to live. Tupac was a drug dealer when he was child because he grew up as a child with his mother a crackhead, dirt poor. Had no father soo he had to find a way to feed himself. You need to research on Tupac and educate your self before you try to talk some sh!t about him.

Originally posted by ResinLA

I said 50 was garbage, I just didn't feel like writing an essay on the topic.

Tupac is garbage too. As are almost every rapper out there. I only give credit to E-40 and that's about it. I hope more and more rappers get killed off as time goes by.

When you want a real debate on race, minus the name-calling and games, let me know. I'll be here.

*SNIP*

Mod Edit: Terms & Conditions Of Use – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 10/1/2007 by Mirthful Me]

Text
Your a classless piece of Sh!t you wish death on people.Wow If you liek E-40 dont you know he made a song with Pac calle d aint hard to find and he wa talking bout thugging. So shouldn't that make you not like him.
Early life

Tupac Amaru Shakur was born in the East Harlem section of Manhattan in New York City.[5] He was named after Túpac Amaru II, an Incan revolutionary who led a Peruvian uprising against Spain and was subsequently sentenced to death. "Shakur" comes from the Arabic word thankful (to God). His mother, Afeni Shakur, was an active member of the Black Panther Party in New York in the late 1960s and early 1970s; Shakur was born just one month after her acquittal on more than 100 charges of "Conspiracy against the United States government and New York landmarks" in the New York Panther 21 court case.[6] Fearing someone might hurt her son, Afeni put the name Parish Lesane Crooks on his birth certificate but changed it a year later.[7]

Violence and criminality surrounded Tupac from an early age. Shakur's godfather, Elmer "Geronimo" Pratt, was convicted of murdering a school teacher during a 1968 robbery. His stepfather, Mutulu Shakur, spent four years at large on the FBI's Ten Most Wanted Fugitives list beginning in 1982, when Tupac was a pre-teen. Mutulu was wanted in part for having helped his sister Assata Shakur, Tupac's godmother, to escape from prison in New Jersey, where she had been incarcerated for shooting two state troopers to death in 1973. Mutulu was caught in 1986 and imprisoned for an attempted robbery of a Brinks armored car in which two police officers and a guard were killed.[8] Tupac had a half-sister, Sekyiwa, two years his junior, and an older step-brother, Mopreme "Komani" Shakur, who appeared on many of his recordings.

At age 12, Shakur enrolled in Harlem's famous "127th Street Ensemble." His first major role with this acting troupe was as Travis in A Raisin in the Sun. In 1984, his family relocated to Baltimore, [9] After completing his sophomore year at Paul Lawrence Dunbar High School he transferred to the Baltimore School for the Arts, where he studied acting, poetry, and jazz. He performed in Shakespeare plays and in the role of the Mouse King in The Nutcracker.[10] Tupac, accompanied by one of his friends, Dana "Mouse" Smith, as his beatbox, won most of the many rap competitions that he participated in and was considered to be the best rapper in his school.[11] Although he lacked trendy clothing, he was one of the most popular kids in his school because of his sense of humor, superior rapping skills, and ability to mix in with all crowds.[12] He developed a close friendship with a young Jada Pinkett (later Jada Pinkett Smith) that lasted until Shakur's death. In the documentary Tupac: Resurrection, Shakur says, "Jada is my heart. She will be my friend for my whole life," and Smith calls Shakur "one of my best friends. He was like a brother. It was beyond friendship for us. The type of relationship we had, you only get that once in a lifetime." A poem written by Shakur titled "Jada" appears in his book, The Rose That Grew From Concrete, which also includes a poem dedicated to Smith called "The Tears in Cupid's Eyes".

In June 1988, Shakur and his family moved once again, this time to Marin City, California, where he attended Tamalpais High School. He joined the Ensembl

Originally posted by HarlemHottie

Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
If someone did know who shot Biggie, do you think the odds are more in favor that those who know the truth are black, or white?

Did you read the whole thread???

Nope, i didn't. I got as far as the first generalization concerning all cops being mud dwelling pigs, and i felt obligated to comment upon what i had already read.

We don't have to hypothesize. We already know. They're blue.

Ah, i see. It is the blue people who are totally responsible then.

my bad for not seeing it sooner.


[edit on 16-1-2007 by Esoteric Teacher]

Marvin, I see you're need to educate people, but where did you get that copy and paste job?(I just found it ironic how you tell people to educate themselves when you copy and pasted from wikipedia.)

Anyways, this entire thread is a general racist piece of garbage, so far I have seen no one enlightened and I have only seen racial mud slung back and forth about who was guilty or innocent and how unsolved murders have gone unsolved because of racism.

Tupac was a very good poet, I enjoy some of his work; granted some of his work I don't enjoy. No one on this planet deserves to die because of something they said, but I do believe chastisement should be handed down for certain things said; just not death. There is always more to what we read on the internet. Keep that in mind before we all start preaching wikipedia as the ultimate wealth of information.

I don't believe Tupac and all those other black entertainers should have died for their music because it's music; actions are. I don't think some of the cases went unsolved due to racial profiling and reasons alone, there is always more to that and I doubt every cop in this country is white and racist. Some are, but most aren't. I don't think all the detectives and investigators handling these cases were all white and racists unless someone can find all of those involved and prove otherwise.

Shattered OUT...

Originally posted by WolfofWar

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by elevatedone
funny you don't mention...
MLK, Rosa Parks, Harriet Tubman, Will Smith

AND - Fredrick Douglas, Dr. Condi Rice, Colin Powell, Harold Ford Junior,
Black American War Heroes , Jackie Robinson, Mae Jemison (my daughter loves her) and other black astronauts , Hank Aaron, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Muhammad Ali, Arthur Ashe, Josephine Baker, Count Basie, Edward C. Brooke, Gwendolyn Brooks, James Brown, Ron Brown, Eldridge Cleaver, Johnnie Cochren, Nat “king” Cole, Bill Cosby, Sammy Davis Junior, W.E.B. DuBois, Duke Ellington, Ella Fitzerald, Aretha Franklin, Marcus Garvey, Woopie Goldberg, Bryant C. Gumbel, Alex Haley, Jimi Hendrix, Lena Horne. “Magic” Johnson., BB King, Thurgood Marshall, Jesse Owens, Betty Shabazz, Denzel Washington, Oprah Winfrey, Tiger Woods
Andrew Young, etc etc etc

Plenty of non gansta heroes out there. Plenty who don't pound rhythmic anger into kids all day long.

But all of those people are "oreos" as was put earlier in the post. Black on the outside, white on the inside. Its obvious the culture in black america today has pushed these role models away because of some racism against the "white man." If a person becomes successful, and does not show the "thug life" they are considered faux black.

[edit on 1-5-2007 by WolfofWar]

NO, these people are all BLACK, bottom line. The difference is... they chose to make a difference in thier lives by doing something good.

They worked hard and made something of themselves. You classify them as oreos, becuase as a racist society, because they "made it" you think they're like white people. Well, there are a lot of white people who are, poor, uneducated etc, and they don't get called..... well you know.

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
this entire thread is a general racist piece of garbage, so far I have seen no one enlightened

You're not very enlightened there yourself. "Glass houses" and all...

I have only seen racial mud slung back and forth about who was guilty or innocent and how unsolved murders have gone unsolved because of racism.

That would be because, that's the point of this thread. That's how it works here, you know. Someone starts a thread about a topic that interests them and others add their own 'messages.' That's what makes this a 'message' board.

Novel, huh?

Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
Ah, i see. It is the blue people who are totally responsible then.

No, clearly, you don't see. Let's review.

You asked: "If someone did know who shot Biggie, do you think the odds are more in favor that those who know the truth are black, or white?"

I responded: "We don't have to hypothesize. We already know. They're blue."

I pointed you in the direction of people who do know. We were not talking about responsibility, we were talking about knowledge of a murder. At the least, the police chief is guilty of withholding evidence in a murder case, or 'obstruction of justice'; at the worst, he could be charged with complicity.

And I bet he hasn't been charged with anything, although this information is on the internet.

The point is, of course the actual murderer is guilty. No one is arguing that s/he wouldn't be. However, the police, whose express purpose is to protect citizens and investigate crimes, HAVE THE EVIDENCE, but refuse to prosecute. If you can't understand why people would be upset about that, maybe it's better that you leave the conversation to the people who, um, want crimes solved.

Thanks.

The point is, of course the actual murderer is guilty. No one is arguing that s/he wouldn't be. However, the police, whose express purpose is to protect citizens and investigate crimes, HAVE THE EVIDENCE, but refuse to prosecute. If you can't understand why people would be upset about that, maybe it's better that you leave the conversation to the people who, um, want crimes solved.

Lots of people know who killed, say, Nicole Brown Simpson...but unless the prosecution has reliable, consistent, willing witnesses and hard evidence, a prosecution can go sideways pretty damned quickly.

Let me ask you this.

If there is only chance at a successful prosecution, and there wasn't enough evidence to convict, would you rather a person be tried and not convicted than wait a bit, see if evidence developes, and then take that risk?

That's how double jeopardy works, and the reason we can't try Simpson again.

The Blue Boys may indeed have an idea, but if they can't bring enough evidence to the DA for the DA to think they can win in a jury trial, well, the DA will choose to not present charges. They won't take that bite of the apple until they know they can have a reasonable chance at conviction.

I'd rather wait and have more evidence than run off and arrest, charge, and try someone before the evidence appears - evidence including witnesses (very important), hard evidence (i.e. ballistics and other forensics), and a winnable game plan based on the above.

But then again, I think OJ did it, too...

Regards~
Aimless

Originally posted by Aimless Searcher
The Blue Boys may indeed have an idea, but if they can't bring enough evidence to the DA for the DA to think they can win in a jury trial, well, the DA will choose to not present charges.

The thing is, they haven't even gotten that far. You're talking about a DA, but a case will never get to the DA if the police chief refuses to investigate because one of his (former) officers might be implicated.

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
On Biggie
According to Russell Poole, the former LAPD detective investigating Biggie's death...

After months of investigating and substantial amounts of evidence, Poole accused an LAPD officer, David Mack, along with his friend Amir Muhammad, of being complicit in the murder. Poole had proof that Mack had ties with the CEO of Death Row Records, Suge Knight....Poole sent this information to the chief of the Los Angeles Police Department, Benard Parks, who ordered Poole to stop all investigation on Mack as Mack had been arrested for bank robbery in December 1997 and was on his way to prison.

btw, This is the fourth time I've posted this quote in this thread and, apparently, no one has read it.

Deny ignorance, people.

[Aimless, the preceding was not directed solely at you. The last time I posted it, I decided to start keeping count of how many times I have to re-post the same thing.]

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
.......but a case will never get to the DA if the police chief refuses to investigate because one of his (former) officers might be implicated.

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
........as Mack had been arrested for bank robbery in December 1997 and was on his way to prison.

Implicated? The guys been shipped off to prison for robbery.
He's in prison. What more do you want?
I mean that is where you'd want to see him go anyway, right?
The guy's in the slammer. Sounds like "ironic justice" if you ask me.
Wonder how many years he got for robbery?
If it's enough to keep him away til he's an old man or dead, then what's the problem?
He's behind bars!
LOL!

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
This is the fourth time I've posted this quote in this thread and, apparently, no one has read it.

Okay. It took me a while but I went and read your information AND I looked up some more on these people.

The people involved in the decision to not go after the alleged perp may, or may not, have been crooked. (probably were IMHO). However, the point the author of this thread was making was that it was due to their RACE that these murdered people didn't get justice.

I have not seen anything in the reading that I did that says the allegedly crooked people in charge of the investigation let the investigation slide due to racism. In fact, from what I have read, he enjoyed a very good relationship with the minority community.

At least that's what I have read. Latimes on Parks

If those facts are true then the murder went unsolved, not due to racism, but due to old fashioned corruption. I already listed plenty of non-black famous people who were killed and who have not received justice. There is plenty of corruption to go around and there are plenty of cases that simply can't be solved due to the crime itself, lack of witness', and plain old human error in the investigating.



[edit on 1/17/2007 by FlyersFan]

Originally posted by rocknroll
If it's enough to keep him away til he's an old man or dead, then what's the problem?

First of all, being in jail already does not exonerate him from being an accomplice, or whatever. That just proves that he engages in criminal acts on a regular basis. He should still be charged, under our laws.

Second of all, he is just one person. There were many others involved, like his friend Amir Muhammad, for example.

So, no, that's not 'ironic justice'. A conspiracy requires more than one person, and all of them belong in jail... for Biggie's murder, not for other crimes.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
It took me a while but I went and read your information...

Thank you, FF. I was starting to think I was on global ignore.

If those facts are true then the murder went unsolved, not due to racism, but due to old fashioned corruption.

Yes and no. Yes, its corruption that keep the murder unsolved, but its my personal belief that certain elements in the police dept. were involved in the actual murder. That, I believe, can be linked to racism.

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
Thank you, FF. I was starting to think I was on global ignore.

NAAAAAAAAAAH. You definately are NOT on global ignore. It just took me a while to not only read what you posted, but also go reading up on these people. I had never heard of any of them before. Also - I'm in school again so I'm busy with schoolwork and volunteering and being a stay at home mom as well.

its my personal belief that certain elements in the police dept. were involved in the actual murder. That, I believe, can be linked to racism.

The one fellow that we have been discussing seems to have a very good relationship with the minority community out there. They seem to like him a whole lot. As for your personal belief that they were involved in the murder and it was a race murder ... I have absolutely no idea if that's true or not, but you are definatley entitled to your opinion on it. I just don't see it.

I guess I have nothing further to add. If something else comes up that I can contribute with .. I'll be back.

Now let me get this straight. You want us to feel bad about the deaths of various individuals who recorded violent music, which advocated the murder of police, et al, and the rape of women.

Frankly, me not care. Me consider the world a safer place without these types of people stirring the pot.

Color? Irrelevant. They reaped what they'd sown.

A human life is a human life- no matter the color.

Many Whites have been murdered also. I dont get your point here that somehow coloreds have lost more.

Dont get me wrong, an injustice is an injustice no matter what color, but the same can be said for every color and nationality.

Originally posted by Aimless Searcher

The point is, of course the actual murderer is guilty. No one is arguing that s/he wouldn't be. However, the police, whose express purpose is to protect citizens and investigate crimes, HAVE THE EVIDENCE, but refuse to prosecute. If you can't understand why people would be upset about that, maybe it's better that you leave the conversation to the people who, um, want crimes solved.

Lots of people know who killed, say, Nicole Brown Simpson...but unless the prosecution has reliable, consistent, willing witnesses and hard evidence, a prosecution can go sideways pretty damned quickly.

Let me ask you this.

If there is only chance at a successful prosecution, and there wasn't enough evidence to convict, would you rather a person be tried and not convicted than wait a bit, see if evidence developes, and then take that risk?

That's how double jeopardy works, and the reason we can't try Simpson again.

The Blue Boys may indeed have an idea, but if they can't bring enough evidence to the DA for the DA to think they can win in a jury trial, well, the DA will choose to not present charges. They won't take that bite of the apple until they know they can have a reasonable chance at conviction.

I'd rather wait and have more evidence than run off and arrest, charge, and try someone before the evidence appears - evidence including witnesses (very important), hard evidence (i.e. ballistics and other forensics), and a winnable game plan based on the above.

But then again, I think OJ did it, too...

Regards~
Aimless

OJ did it!!!

Originally posted by dgtempe
I dont get your point here that somehow coloreds have lost more.

Nobody is saying that "coloreds" have lost more...

and, we're not "coloreds" anymore, btw.

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
and, we're not "coloreds" anymore, btw.

Why is it that "colored people" is considered to not be PC, perhaps even bordering on racist, while "people of color" is an über-PC term?

I was always wondering about that...

BTW, NAACP still has colored people in its name.

Originally posted by HarlemHottie
and, we're not "coloreds" anymore, btw.

Oh brother! Anymore? What is it now? Why is "colored" an insult? There is absolutely nothing negative in that term. So why is it taken negatively? Every time you turn around the latest name is called "disrespectful". It went from negro, to black, to African, to colored, to Afro American, to African American. To be honest, I'm waiting for the term "N-word" to soon be deemed disrespectful. LOL! If you were born in Africa and moved to America, I could see how you'd want to be called African American. But if you were born in America, that makes you an American, plain and simple. Why the need to set yourself apart? You are no different or special than any other American here. But if you seek special treatment, then prepare to be treated differently.

Maybe I should start calling myself an Irish/German/English/Hungarian American and settle for being called nothing less. And if you call me an American I should be insulted and make a stink about it...........

Whoopi Goldberg said it best:
"so no i'm not an african american. im not from africa. i'm from new
york. my roots run a lot deeper than a lot of people who don't have
anything in front of the word american. i can trace my family tree back
to the mayflower. we may not have been on it, but we were under it, and
that counts too. we're out of florida, for the most part. we're seminole
indians. we're a couple jews from russia. we're black and white .
there's even some chinese running through my blood. they were here to
build a railroad and they stopped to add to my strange mix.

i'm a mutt. theres a whol lot of historical adventure that belongs to
me, and i refuse to let our cultural demagogues rob me of what's mine.
george washington belongs to me. lou gherig belongs to me. jackie
robinson belongs to me. nathans hot dogs belongs to me, you know. the
lower east side is mine. the amber waves of #ing grain? mine. im as
american as chevrolet."

An actually HH, my relatives came over in the immigration wave of the early 1900's. Yours came over here earlier than that....so I guess this makes you more qualified to be called "American" than I myself. Something to think about...

....and just remember, I'm an Irish/German/English/Hungarian American and from now on I'd prefer to be addressed that way.....anything less would be an insult. Don't ever call me white!



[edit on 19-1-2007 by rocknroll]

Tupac was not killed by gangsters. His killing was made to look like that. The Black Panthers are still an active group and the government often tries to cause problems within their group. There were lots of witnesses who say they saw nothing. Maybe they didn't. If someone were to come up and start shooting would you be trying to see who was shooting or try to get out of the way? I have witnessed a drive-by before and mostly what I saw was the floorboards of my car.

The football player's death is still being investigated. The last I heard about the case though was that they found the SUV which had been involved in the killing and it had been wiped clean and had been stolen. Hopefully, his murder will be solved though.

Unfortunately, a lot of the so called black culture is against narcs. You don't talk to police. I used to be married into a black family and saw a lot of stuff. I don't regret choosing to raise my daughter outside of such an environment.