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Murdered Black Entertainers: No Justice

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posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 04:06 PM
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To those saying that you need to get rid of "rap" or "hip hop" and that its a repungnant form of music, you need to educate yourself. Itssimply a style of music, a rhythmic form of poetry. Its just a shame that a large portion of the artists are told by record producers to make theyre music "ghetto."

Theres plenty of rappers who dont preach such things. Look at Black Eyed Peas




posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 04:29 PM
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Guys, trust me I work in the music industry with the labels and exacutives and I do know whats going on. Rap is dying and fast and it's mainly from lack of showmanship, talent, and a message that the public can actually identify with.

It looked cool on paper, but in reality the public couldn't identify with gangster rap, maybe 100 kids fown in south central but thats it. The demographics were really smaller than anyone thought. The media blitzed us with coverage of the issue cause they were paid off to, and things looked bigger than they really were, but in reality it didn't make that much money....

so the rap producers decided they were going to write "rich rapper fantasy" music.
For two reasons, they needed to desperatly get out from under the gangster rap motif so that they could bring in fresh prospects to the record store to buy thier albums, hopefully influence a new generation into enjoying rap. The second reason is becuase they needed to persuade the public that rap is this big powerful industry and established and so are the rappers. But guess what, it didn't work, and they weren't. If anything it is subtly pushing away most of the public. What do the public have to relate to when a rapper is singing about his 5 bedroom mansion 5 cars, gold and diamonds, how many bitches and hoes they got, and how much of a playboy their lifestyle is- none of us can identify with it in reality, and so it's loosing any of it's intrinsic value to society.

Time is the test with most things in life and rap didn't pass the test in the long run. it contributed to music and will always in some degree but it won't be prevelent.

Notice most of the population prefers hip hop over rap becuase at least people can identify with what they are singing about. But hip hop is getting infused and diluted into other forms, rap is too, but hip hop has much more value to the population, so it will predominate over rap. Hip hop won't go away fully just infused to create new fresh music. rap will contribute a little, but if you want to become a rich rapper than give up now, those days are long gone. Don't believe that rap is dying than check it's sales. these rappers are living a lie big time and the public is begining to figure it out. Rap is it's own worst enemy and it pretty much discredited it's self.

Crunk was a response to people needing something to identify with, no violence, no I'm rich nahnah, just I don't give a rat's behind and I want to party just like the public. But it's not too deep and people don't get too connected to any of it and so it gets old hat real fast.Crunk was a last ditch effort that has for the most part failed. Why do you think there are pictures of little john wearing a chain that says, Crunks not dead? Cause thats what his sales are telling him and it's what all his business partners and label executives are trying to tell him. He knows-he just doesn't want to accept it yet, that crunk is dead.

Jay-Z-public don't care his last album tanked, same with eminem, dr.dre. the game. 50 cent, snoop dog, and unfortunantly Ice Cube. Check the soundscans nobody is interested in their albums whether they are good or not in any long term money generating way. A few years back but not now.

So rap as we know it is dead, most of the executives are sick of the players in the rap field, and now that they can't make a quick buck on em and are dropping them back off wherever they found them to fend for themselves. Most rappers end up where they started poor.

Mod Note: Do Not Evade the Automatic Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 7-1-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 04:39 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan

Malcolm X said that the streets of America should turn red with the blood of white people. I really don't care who killed him.


He later reformed his views after his Hajj to Mecca, seeing men of all colors being dignified and responsible Muslims.

Sorry for the off-topic comment, just defending the Brother Minister.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 04:42 PM
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You know what this thread is turning into absoloute hogwash. It’s sickening to see the amount of racism and hatred towards blacks that many of you have shown. You should be [B]ashamed[/B] of yourselves.

This is for flyers fan. = You may not view rap as healthy beacuse you don’t understand the meaning behind it...but I know it’s healthy to a point. It’s healthy because those people are venting their frustratioin in a POSITIVE way. Statements like “slavery ended get over it” is exactly why they write songs like they do. Everyone feels we should just up and drop any and all emotions, when it’s a FACT that blacks are targeted by racist white cops EVERY DAY. That’s still a form of oppression. Look at the number of minorities in prison. Better yet, go to court on any given day and look at the number of blacks in the court, compared to any other race. If you don’t see a disturbing trend that there seems to be an abundant amount of minorities in court (keep in mind I live in a VERY diverse city) then you must be out of your mind.

Furthermore a problem I see with you is that you don’t even want to give certain aspects of black culture a chance. That’s like me saying “I hate all stupid cowboy hat wearing rednecks that listen to country music. All they do is sing songs about rustling cattle and being white”. Can’t you see how some of the views you are expressing are a direct parrell to that racist view? I’ve never shuned white culture. I’ve had white friends that have asked me to go to rock concerts with them, and I’ve gone and had a good time because it was something I wasn’t used to. Could you say that you would go to a rap concert? listen to a rap cd? give the product a chance? I even seen Kenny Rogers in concert cause a white friend of mine had an extra ticket and he wanted me to tag along. I don’t even like country music, but I went..was one of the only black people there..but I still had a good time because I OPEN MYSELF UP TO NEW THINGS.

So until you maybe stop spouting this racist crap and saying how we can’t have a respect for someone who is telling it like it is when it comes to certain areas of society...then who are you to really challenge my views? You saying that you don’t care to my comment about how blacks don’t feel whites care about them even in 2007, is blatently showing why there is so much animosity left in inner city blacks. You still haven’t answered my question..if I showed your comments to a young black individual, what do you think he would say?

@hottie = after thinkin about the class separation thing..I think it’s very valid and can be used to explain things better. Take Jam Master Jay..he wasn’t your averege thug rapper, so maybe lack of effort by the authorities might have been some what racially motivated. However people like biggie’s murder could have been class related. They associated with a lower class of people so therefore the police want to do less to solve the crimes. Great point here I’d like to explore the class factor in the lack of productivity in these crimes.

Strangerous = WTF are you talking about? Like seriously....I gave some examples of famous black entertainers that have been murdered and their crimes go unresolved, both because of racist reasons, and “class separation” distinctions. So if you want to make the point that white rappers get shot to...that’s on YOU. I made my point in my original post. Like I said you want to rebutt it, then you find 6 white rappers that have been gunned down in the past 10 years and their murders go unsolved. Like is said, that’s not my job..it’s yours. Reason I had to use Mel Gibson as an example is because I can’t honestly think of 6 white musicians that have been killed and their murders go unsolved. Dimebag Darrell from Pantera, the gunman was killed at the scene. Jon Lennons murder was solved I believe. I’m not as versed in white culture as you may be...so that’s your job to find me something to compare it to if you want to refute my statements.

@ everyone else...with the whole thing of “they were gangstas they were bad heroes you shouldn’t like them these black people are better”...that is so shallow and narrow minded. Yes we do respect people like Dr King..and Dave Chappelle...but they speak on one aspect of black culture..there are many aspects of the culture, not just a few. The culture is more broad than just a few people. There is a wide range of culture, and yes some of these rappers are heros because they are speaking about THINGS THAT HAPPEN TO CERTAIN BLACK INDIVIDUALS EVERY DAY. Better yet, what about what some of these white musicians are saying? What about marylin manson? What about eminem? It’s funny how you don’t cite their music as damaging..and believe me their music has A LOT sense substance and realism to it then most rap music does. People like that are worse because they prey on rebellions outcast white teens for a profit. At least a lot of the black musicians are speaking truley about things they see every day.

You know..some of these views in this thread are pathetic. Many people seriously make excuses as to why blacks shouldn't feel some of the emotions they do. All i want is for one person to be like "wow, well i dont' agree with their actions..but i can see how their words would mean a lot to people who see racism on a day to day basis".

But no..people seriously want to say everything that is wrong with the black man..and if you even read my 2 posts i never attacked white culture. I never attack your value system, your heroes..and i never dismissed your opinion.

But time and time again all you have done is dismiss the REASONS behind WHY these black individuals WOULD HAVE SUCH ANGER. You've blamed everyone else except yourself. After 3 pages i've only gotten a few decent replies form people that actually seemed to have read up on the subject.

To reiterate = [B]We are trying to figure out if race and class distinction played any part in these crimes going unsolved.[/B] we're trying to see if there is a real conspirocy or possibly just lack of evidence. however it is VERY funny that nobody can come to me (yet) with more examples of whites entertainers THAT HAVE BEEN KILLED THE WAY THE BLACK ENTERTAINERS WERE who's crimes go unsolved. Someone mentioned jon benet...good, give me some more examples so we can see if there really is a trend.

if you all can't still see that's the reason of this thread, then i sugjest a darker pair of sunglasses



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 05:09 PM
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Whats sad is you think blacks are the only ones that feel racism in todays world. Have you watched TV? actually gone out and seen how much racism is not aimed at blacks but at most races by everybody in general. Think of how many racist comments you hear every day about white people? A boat load, so much that we barely even notice it cause it's so ubiquetus and it is very tolerated.

The jews didn't have it hard? They were practicaly exterminated wholesale. Are the ones who moved to america and faced extream racism and predjudice still living in ghettos, and whinning about racism and how they can't make a peaceful living. NO they got organized and encouraged decent roll models, they saw way more pain and strife than most people during those times and they discussed it, but they didn't glamorize it and make it something to perpetuate and strive after. Thats the problem, stop giving your youth false goals to run after.

Tell your kids that acting like a gangster rapper is a jackass thing to do. Tell them that it's more important to actually assimilate what you learn while in the classroom and that falling back on crime is not acceptable but a respectable job is. Tell them that it's a stupid idea to put big faux shinny rims on your car when the rims are worth more than your car, tell them that education is more important than sports. Only 3 percent of all athleats that even make it to college sports teams actually get a viable carrier out of it. Not a good gamble, learn to be a morgage broker instead. Stop putting on fake diamond earing that are actually glass in your ear, nobody thinks your rich, your not fooling anyone and actually embarrasing yourself inadvertantly. Chains not a good way to invest your money. All these things lower ones opinion of someone, and is part of the reason the population looks down on it. Stop playing the fool and people won't treat you as one.

Mod Note: Do Not Evade the Automatic Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 7-1-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 05:14 PM
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You know what, another big problem is the idea of being mainstream. Real music should be about expression. So what if only the urban population can relate? They are a huge portion of america that pays taxes and should have music to reflect some of the daily struggles they see in their life. There’s a lot of rap that ISN’T about violence and killing...so these attitudes that say “it’s all about violence” is just pure wrong. That’s seriously like me saying all rock music is about cutting yourself.

So what if they weren’t mainstream britney spears status...they had a huge audience, that reached millions of people and they made millions of dollars doing it. Who cares if your album doesn’t go gold..not every album will. And most albums that DO go gold are trash...because they were put together by some 40 year old men in a studio, and they gave the songs to a pretty pop star to sing. Look at some of the trash that goes gold...nsync..back street boys...pussycat dolls..all manufactured record label trash. That’s not real music. Those people didn’t sit in their house and write songs and spend hour after hour, year after year crafting their art. So to say that rap is dying just because they don’t sell as much as mainstream pop artists is not even valid. Rap is huge, especially in the underground.

There are people that DO care. Jay-Z’s album might have floped by big money executives..but guess what..every time his “show me what you got” song from his new album plays on that budweiser commercial, his bank goes CHA-CHING. Music revenue is NOT just about record sales. You can create revenue from ringtones, movie apperences, commercials (such as COMMON’S GAP COMMERCIAL), tv shows, video games..and countless other avenues. So if you sell a half a million albums..that might only be a small portion of your revenue. Think about it, every time one of their videos gets played on MTV they make money. So maybe you only see rap videos on mtv2 on sunday...but guess what, every week you are getting big fat check from ASACP for that 4 minutes of airtime.

Weather hip hop is “mainstream” or not is irrelevent. The fact it got as big as it did, is proof that there is a market for it. But what you are seeing is not a decline of public interest, you are seeing the record labels not being able to manufacture rap stars the same way they can manufacture pop stars. A rapper has to be real about what he or she is saying...so just remixing crazing train and putting Lil Jon on the track does nothing, because you are loosing the essence of what real rap is..and that is, well, realism.

Gosh so many views...about the Malcom X thing..Nihlist Fiend was right, he did change his views. But lets examine WHY he said what he said. In Malcom X’s time, it is a FACT that, blacks were beaten, tared, feathered, lynched, segregated..and treated like utter DOGS by all whites. The REASON he said the streets should be red with the blood of whites..is because he was TIRED of seeing his FRIENDS KILLED BY WHITES. There was a spesific reason that he hated whites up until the time he went to mecca. You being offended that he said blacks should kill whites...is almost wrong on your part, because your people weren’t the ones getting killed every day.

Your people were not the ones who had to sit at separate tables, and drink from separate fountains. Your people were not the ones who had to wake up at 2 am to see some hooded KKK members burning crosses on your lawn. Honestly you have no right to be mad at what he said. If you want to be mad at anyone, BE MAD AT THE RACIST WHITES WHO WERE OPPRESSING BLACKS. Heck I would have said the same thing if I was alive in his time. You can’t blame militant black groups for lashing out against the whites of that day, because they HAD to lash out to survive. The HAD to unite because they were being beaten in the middle of the street, and having dogs sicked on them by the police for NO REASON OTHER THAN THEY WERE BLACK.

Just like they were lashing out, the rappers of today lash out at the ideas of racism, and the shadow racism they see. They lash out not because they are being lynched, but because so many of their friends are racially profiled or treated unfairly by the law.

I can’t even understand how whites can be mad that some of these ideas exist. You just want to give a “oh...sorry.” and expect everyone to be friends. I don’t’ know what to say there are so many holes in peoples logic that it’s almost hard to comprehend.

It's not aobut being racist..blacks just want to get to a point where the law does not breathe down their neck. What we are saying is that there are a few aspects of society that need looking into. Belive me the blacks want the hardcore drugs out of their community in the ghetto. But you know what..the white cops don't. It's easy revenue. Tell me why the POLICE are not able to stop the drug selling and crime. Oh thats right...because they can have an unending pool of money to line their swine pockets.

If the cops wanted the drugs out the communitys..they'd take them out. They'd spend the man power and money neccecary to bring more wealth into the ghetto..instead of just raiding crack houses, and LEAVING THEM STANDING. They would build more activities, they would look at their laws and how mandatory penalties are just creating a circle of desperation. A desperate kid hustles a little pot and gets busted, but spends a mandatory 6 months in jail and has a record. When he gets out, he's still desperate and does the same thing again.

If they wanted to help the kid they would order him to recive counceling or order him into some kind of job program. The police don't want to fix the ghetto. If they fix the drugs and crime in the inner city then they will take to big a paycut. So don't tell the blacks to fix their cities, tell the cops to stop standing by and letting this violence happen. When the gov wants something changed..it changes. This has been proven time and time again. However i truley belive they dont' want to fix the inner city problem becasue then how would they make a huge portion of their money. This world is really sick i'll tell you...

sorry for the double post but there are many attitudes that simply need to be addressed..



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 05:44 PM
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Man you are barking up the wrong tree when you discuss the record industry with me.

Like I said I work very closely with these people and talk to them everyday at work. I've hung out with Ice T, Ice Cube, and handled deals with Andre Young in person when he needed to contact my boss to get permision to sample songs we own for his tracks he was producing. Trust me i know EVERY single way to make money in the industry, even ways the industry will generate money in the future that nobody who isn't real deep in the industry would know, it's my job. True it's not about album sales, but soundscan tells you so much more, it shows downloads, synching, public opinion etc. They do accuratly reflect to a great deal where you stand in the publics eye.

But I am currently working real closely with people who's job it is to work out the synching deals for music on TV, Videogames, Movies. trust me the artists don't make as much as you think on ringtones, and all the above. it's not cha-ching, it's all a bunch of self premoting hype. Trust me I know what these artists are making on all of the monies cause I collect commisions directly off their paychecks, I see evey friggen royalty they see, from every type of source and from every country in the world. Believe me when I say that rap is dead in the water. Underground maybe..but like everything else there is always an underground. The demographics aren't as big as you assume.

The Brittney Spears trend, was a few executive using a scorched earth policy to make a few real quick bucks, brittney is about to be broke because she also acted like a fool.
Same with the Black Eyes Peas, and I can't even tell you how close Wil.I.Am is to getting tossed out onto the street cause the people he works with think he's really annoying.

Rap just isn't relevent to people anymore even in the ghettos. people still listen to it but the winds are blowing a different way, and it's not in the direction of rap sorry.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 05:46 PM
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Unfortunately, everything that does go mainstream goes mainstream for a reason, because it's "cool".

Read up on the "Merchants of Cool" and research them. You will discover that everything that you see on MTV, FUSE, BET; all those stations and flash a mainstream record label has been designed and created to attract a certain audience.

That audience is teenagers. Teenagers in this generation are the single most influential group of any other generation, why? Because they have what's called a lot of disposable income. The record labels and corporations aim at getting that disposable income by any means necessary. Those means even resort to "infiltrating" the teen population and learning what "cool" is. Unfortunately, the industry has learned a very valuable lesson; it is IMPOSSIBLE to create cool or be cool, cool comes and goes and when you try to hold on to something and sell it as "cool", it will no longer be cool and the mainstream audience will lose interest. All that can be done is follow cool and as soon as something becomes cool, it's no longer cool. It's an ever changing industry and will forever have it's obstacles.

People like Jay-Z however, have learned to take what they have recieved and run with it. Look at Jay-Z, the man is worth over 350,000,000 dollars. He was once poor, living in the ghettos and now he is a business Mogul.

Jay-Z is a true image to model yourself after in business, that man was smart.

Shattered OUT...



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 05:48 PM
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also the drug war is a seperate issue. Most of the hard core drugs in LA aren't distributed by the blacks, but by whites and other contingents. The police can't stop the white drug houses either so your point is not valid concerning the drug epidemic as a racist thing.

You just seem really angry and lashing out. Slow down and work stuff out for yourself, it's a journey all adults have to do to be able to make it in the world financially and socially. It'll be worth the effort when you are far behind all of these problems and issues and are content living a peaceful happy life.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by Spawwwn
This is for flyers fan. = You may not view rap as healthy beacuse you don’t understand the meaning behind it...but I know it’s healthy to a point. It’s healthy because those people are venting their frustratioin in a POSITIVE way.


Here are a few 'lyrics' from the rap scene:

“Kill the white people; we gonna make them hurt; kill the white people; but buy my record first; ha, ha, ha” -Kill d’White People; Apache, Apache Ain’t #, 1993, Tommy Boy Music, Time Warner, USA.

“Niggas in the church say: kill whitey all night long. . . . the white man is the devil. . . . the CRIPS and Bloods are soldiers I’m recruiting with no dispute; drive-by shooting on this white genetic mutant. . . . let’s go and kill some rednecks. . . . Menace Clan ain’t afraid. . . . I got the .380; the homies think I’m crazy because I shot a white baby; I said; I said; I said: kill whitey all night long. . . . a nigga dumping on your white ass; # this rap #, nigga, I’m gonna blast. . . . I beat a white boy to the mother#ing ground”; -Kill Whitey; Menace Clan, Da Hood, 1995, Rap-A-Lot Records, Noo Trybe Records

“Bust a Glock; devils get shot. . . . when God give the word me herd like the buffalo through the neighborhood; watch me blast. . . . I’m killing more crackers than Bosnia-Herzegovina, each and everyday. . . . don’t bust until you see the whites of his eyes, the whites of his skin. . . . Louis Farrakhan . . . Bloods and CRIPS, and little old me, and we all getting ready for the enemy” -Enemy; Ice Cube, Lethal Injection, 1993, Priority Records, Thorn EMI

"Buck the devil; boom. . . . shoot you with my .22; I got plenty of crew; I take out white boys. . . . we got big toys with the one-mile scope, taking whitey's throat" -Buck tha Devil; Da Lench Mob, Guerrillas in tha Mist, 1992, Eastwest Records America


Now please tell me where the positive is in this crap? What possible good can come from these type of messages. For you to even attempt to admit there is merit in this garbage only further reveals your utter ignornance.


Originally posted by Spawwwn
Look at the number of minorities in prison. Better yet, go to court on any given day and look at the number of blacks in the court, compared to any other race.


Police do conduct investigations into all crimes but as others have clearly stated not all crimes can be solved. What is so difficult to understand about this? What you should be asking is why so many crimes are being attributed to minorities and what are the minority communities doing about it, next to nothing it would seem. You bet there's a problem but blaming 'the man' isnt the answer. Deal with the issues head on starting with community involvement and education. Stop kids from trying to live a fantasy lifestyle that praises guns, drug abuse & killing then maybe people will take notice and start to give a damn. The death of a gangsta style rapper (who advocates what I previously stated) is a positive & rewarding step forward for society.


Originally posted by Spawwwn
Furthermore a problem I see with you is that you don’t even want to give certain aspects of black culture a chance.


We all have our stories to tell so here is mine. About 3 years ago I attended with a friend a community led Carribbean Day. Being the only non blacks in attendance I didn't give it any thought as I was more interested in enjoying the music and great food. For no apparent reason we were confronted on 2 separate occasions to leave as 'crackers' were not welcome. You'd expect this to come from brat teenagers with a chip on their shoulder, not the case. Not only that but we were actually refused food at one spot and outright ignored. Now I realize this is an isolated case but when you start spewing garbage like "if I showed your comments to a young black individual, what do you think he would say?" my response is the problem is perpetuated from BOTH sides. Not everyone is anti-minority and some people ARE trying to do their little part.


Originally posted by Spawwwn
You know..some of these views in this thread are pathetic. Many people seriously make excuses as to why blacks shouldn't feel some of the emotions they do. All i want is for one person to be like "wow, well i dont' agree with their actions..but i can see how their words would mean a lot to people who see racism on a day to day basis".


What a steaming heap that last sentence is. It sounds more like you need a shoulder to cry on rather than hear what is more likely the truth and something you simply cannot accept nor comprehend. Just keeping blaming 'whitey' I'm sure someone will listen.


brill



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 06:20 PM
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It seems to me that Spawn has proven the basic point. He seems to be the most racist person on this thread, making more excuses then beaches have butt cracks. He seems to produce a climate for his radical views, just so he can feel better about having them. Let me clue you in, there is little chance you have anything in common with the earliest civil rights fighters but probably more with what they were fighting…

“Your people were not the ones who had to sit at separate tables, and drink from separate fountains. Your people were not the ones who had to wake up at 2 am to see some hooded KKK members burning crosses on your lawn. Honestly you have no right to be mad at what he said. If you want to be mad at anyone, BE MAD AT THE RACIST WHITES WHO WERE OPPRESSING BLACKS. Heck I would have said the same thing if I was alive in his time. You can’t blame militant black groups for lashing out against the whites of that day, because they HAD to lash out to survive. The HAD to unite because they were being beaten in the middle of the street, and having dogs sicked on them by the police for NO REASON OTHER THAN THEY WERE BLACK”

Please study some history. History. That means in the past. These claims may have been valid or suited to people who lived 50, 100, 150 years ago. Why don’t other groups who were discriminated (Irish, Japanese, etc) still use indecencies against them as excuses to ? You only know of these behaviors against “Your people” from history, highly doubtful from experience. More likely, if it was experienced, it is more your behavior then how you look.

“Belive me the blacks want the hardcore drugs out of their community in the ghetto. But you know what..the white cops don't. It's easy revenue. Tell me why the POLICE are not able to stop the drug selling and crime. Oh thats right...because they can have an unending pool of money to line their swine pockets.”

After you study history, read some current statistics. More people considered “white” live in “ghettos” then black. Corruption, and the cops involved, have no more whites then blacks. In your eyes though, the black cops are justified. I hope you have no influence with children or youth.

These thug deaths have nothing to do with music, drugs or race… it is because they lived as they died… THUGS. Any music that encourages hate is at fault. Any person that glorifies the use of illegal drugs is to blame. Any race can hate.

You sound as though you have a huge axe to grind & looking for someone’s head to bury it in.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 06:57 PM
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Some thoughts on Jay Z. First off i like most of Jay Z's stuff. However his total assests are worth 350,000,000 dollars, parts of it are his various business outside of the music industry. He doesn't have control or access to alot of that figure. It's money on paper not real life. Geez my dad using the same method of accounting would be worth over 3 million dollars even though he barely puts out 200,000 a year. See how easy it is to misunderstand what we read.

Also, Jay Z is a smart man with very good councel. He got lucky with rap, used the money he made initially and reinvested in himself. One of the best things anybody could do for themselves, how do you think rich people generaly get rich and actually keep their money. Now why do you think that most rappers go dirt broke and fall off the face of the earth after a few years. Bad roll models, councel, and poor upbringing that taught them NOTHING about money except how to make a quick buck.

So Jay Z took that money and created a few business' used the leverage of his then rap carrier and name in the right ways and built up those business. Some are still around and doing OK. some have failed in the end. All of Jay Z's money from all of his sources are based off his name and popularity.

But, Jay Z's not selling anymore across the board. His name is diminishing in worth. He had a good run and will die rich if he doesn't waste his money, but the cash flow is like a drying up river, and he knows it. why do you think he's trying to take a back seat in everything he does right now...to consolidate.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 07:19 PM
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Originally posted by WolfofWar
To those saying that you need to get rid of "rap" or "hip hop" and that its a repungnant form of music, you need to educate yourself. Itssimply a style of music, a rhythmic form of poetry. Its just a shame that a large portion of the artists are told by record producers to make theyre music "ghetto."

Theres plenty of rappers who dont preach such things. Look at Black Eyed Peas


Okay, in my personal opinion it's highly repugnant. How's that?
The definition of music is:
Music: an art of sound in time that expresses ideas and emotions in significant forms through the elements of rhythm, melody, harmony, and color.

Rap rarely contains melody and harmony, so as far as I'm concerned this completely discounts it from beng music. I'm sure you could find some that has instances of the aforementioned, but I'm sure I'd still find it repugnant. Rap music repulses me.

Long live rock'n'roll!!!!!!!!!!



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 07:36 PM
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I've got to say though that good rap isn't so repulsive. but damn is there a lot of bad rap, poorly produced rap, talentles rap etc...

I've got some advice, stop putting everyone of your posse on your albums and pretending they are rappers. It'll destroy your cred just like yoko ono "contributing" to the beattles eventualy brought them down too. Your body gaurd is just that a body gaurd leave his talentless ass off your album. Also, if you are little bow wow or some other poindexter who came from a rich family and had your job handed to you through nepotisim then stop pretending to be 'hardcore' you eventually discredit yourself and ruin the industry you think you are contributing too. Also stop placing yourself above your audience, babbeling about how you in the VIP, and nobody is as fresh as you is. It alienates your fans and eventtually even you can't be in the VIP either.

Also, VIP what's the big deal anybody can get into a VIP line or section if they try. SMoking trees in da back of da club, again so the F*** what, yeah you and everybody else in that club. I gots Kush and I blow it in your face cause I'm so cool. Again don't brag about something that you didn't even know about that other contingents have been on top of since the early 90's. Yes the "Kush" has been around for 15 years and everybody but the rappers knew about it, especially white people from low income areas, so how can you act cool and brag about indulging in something that has been old hat to everybody else for 15 years. Get with it rappers.

Nothing was as funny as old dirty bastards conversation that was recorded and then played on yes MTV with fellow members of the Wutang Clan when he got out of jail and wanted to collect his money. He thought he had all this money his band mates had to expalin to him that not only is he completly broke but that he owed them money. When he wanted to know where all his money went they litteraly explained to him that he spent it all on his "grill" ( gold and platinum plated with diamond studds fake teeth) I bet he felt stupid after he hung up the phone. Great roll model, someone to look for for guidance. ANd they wonder why the black community "can't get of the ground"



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 08:07 PM
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Brill chew on these:

screwdriver = white power music

prussian blue

white peoples music, white peoples religion

ethnic clensing: the game.

Yeah so i think those rap lyrics are fine considering that trash like this and worse comes out every day.

bassplyr.....obviously your one of those "you can't tell me ****" people. I'm telling you for a fact i know plenty of people who still listen to rap and hip hop. Maybe not that commercially produced puff daddy crap, but REAL rap. It's not a dying art form as you so love to call it. Just because people stopped being able to exploit it the way they once could, doesn't mean it's dead and doesn't mean it doesn't have a fanbase.

@ jake the dog man = so i'm the biggest racist now right? because i support rap music and the message they send? Or because i blame the police for racially profile minorities. The problem with people like you is you don't think any blacks should have a gripe anymore. We're not in chains or being hung so shut up and stop doing drugs, right? It's ironic that you call me a racist when you have implied some of the most racist things i have heard yet.

@ everyone..i suppose the real message here as we can see from these posts..is that whites simply don't care about blacks gripes anymore. They feel the police are justified in doing whatever they please, and blacks should "stop being so violent" and "fix their community themselves". White folks feel they've given them enough land..and enough freedom..so time to tell the ******* to shut up and move on. great, that's exactly why if another rapper gets shot tommorow..his murder will NOT be solved.

and that's also why nobody is going to be changing their mentality in the ghetto anytime soon.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 08:21 PM
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Originally posted by Spawwwn
Brill chew on these:

screwdriver = white power music

prussian blue

white peoples music, white peoples religion

ethnic clensing: the game.

Yeah so i think those rap lyrics are fine considering that trash like this and worse comes out every day.


Yes those are garbage lyrics as well, anyone with a shred of common sense & decency would agree. However by your reply you still seem to support the lyrics I've presented so what does that say about you. You didn't answer my question about what good could come out of the lyrics I posted, of which you seem to fully advocate. Your good at dodging the issue but you don't seem to provide any logical reasoning.

brill



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 08:28 PM
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I'd like to have you point out anything I have ever stated as racist. Where as, basically all of your posts in this thread have been racist. I was almost giving your slanted views a chance, with this being a conspiracy site & all. Your last post just exposes your agenda.

The terms thug & punk hitting a little too close to home?



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 09:50 PM
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Comrades, Comrades. Lend me your ears. Why must we fight? Why must we bicker back and forth between what race has the worst lyrics? What good does this do anyone!?!

I can see why blacks of the past have said the violent things they did. If it were my people being oppressed as such I would say and do the same things. But that was then and this is now. Now there is no room for violence. Violence only begets violence. You should not support unfounded hatred, no matter the cause.

The only way that you and I can make life better is to stop associating with people based on trivial things as race, religion, politics and so on. I judge all men by their actions, one of the few things they have control of. Of course there are mitigating circumstances to each case that need to be look at but we need to stop the insanity! A lot of people have fallen on hard times, and whatever their color they should be helped. This being said I will not help those who wish to bring harm to innocent people for a reason, such as race, which a man has no control over.

The problem is there are still some people who allow themselves to be manipulated into race warfare. Just as a black man should not say "kill whitey", A white man should not say "kill blacky". Why is this concept so hard to understand? Yes slavery was terrible, there have been a lot of terrible things in history, but what good does it do us to fight amongst ourselves now?

I am white. If I said I hate all black people then I would be dismissing all those black people in life who would have helped me. In the same way I want to help the poor, but when black kids are saying to kill whitey, I think to myself "What have I done? I truly want to help people but it is hard to do when they are actively calling for my death." Not all rap is hateful. It is not the genre, it is the specific suggestions of the specific band. You can't judge all music based on one bands point of view, black or white or whatever.

In closing I have but few words. There is hateful music all around, don't listen to it. There is good constructive music in both the "black" and "white" fields (though I find it strange that music can have a race, being a inanimate concept and all). There are leaders who preach unfounded hatred, don't listen to them either. We must all say "I renounce those who do bad and harm, no matter who they are. I stand with all my comrade brothers and sisters who do good, no matter who they are."

Long Live those of Love!



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 10:46 PM
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This thread has made me very sad. Many from my generation worked hard and some gave their lives to promote the ideal that we are ONE race. We lost members of our own communities because our relationship with the Afro-American community. We wanted people to look beyond color and see the person.

One of the most powerful songs I have ever heard was “The Message.” I am saddened that this genre was rejected but the gansta rap was promoted. I do not know any young people who live the gansta life because they listen to the music. Adults understand the emotion of the music. Kids identify with the music. Unfortunately, this music promotes an adolescent’s frustration rather than alleviates it. The music’s focus is on the problem and not the solution.

It is a return to selfishness that has prematurely ended the work that my generation fought so hard to promote. Society has become so focused on itself as individuals that it lost track of how to work together. By embracing our own cultural differences, we have grown further apart rather than closer together.

The stereotypes are still alive and thriving. Gansta rap only promotes the stereotypes. The conspiracy is not that this country is still torn by racial strife. The conspiracy is that the big powers behind the scenes promote racial inequality and strife. They want the disadvantaged to stay that way to preserve their own power and wealth. When you buy into their game, you hand your strings over to the fat cats that want to keep you down.



posted on Jan, 5 2007 @ 10:52 PM
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Originally posted by Spawwwn
Yeah so i think those rap lyrics are fine considering that trash like this and worse comes out every day.


So... you advocate everything that the Rap lyrics are sending across to the public on the basis that pro-white music sends similar messages? By no stretch of the imagination do two wrongs make a right, this isn't math.


bassplyr.....obviously your one of those "you can't tell me ****" people. I'm telling you for a fact i know plenty of people who still listen to rap and hip hop. Maybe not that commercially produced puff daddy crap, but REAL rap. It's not a dying art form as you so love to call it. Just because people stopped being able to exploit it the way they once could, doesn't mean it's dead and doesn't mean it doesn't have a fanbase.


In Bassplyr's defense, you completely dodged the point he was making and attacked a literal meaning. I too know plenty of people who enjoy listening to rap and hip hop and there genuinely is good rap and hip hop music. However, as a whole and according to mainstream society; rap and hip hop are in fact dieing in the eyes of the mainstream public and that is where it matters to the industry. I've made mention of how the industry follows the "cool" around. Rap and Hip Hop isn't a dieing art form, but that's what it is, art, not music necessarily. I see rap and hip hop more as poetry than it is music, whatever music it was; it is dieing, but not as an art form, there are still plenty of people who practice it and will continue to practice it for the love of it and the passion that they hold. Not to say of course there aren't those that will not abuse it for their own personal agenda. There are people out there like that.


@ jake the dog man = so i'm the biggest racist now right? because i support rap music and the message they send? Or because i blame the police for racially profile minorities. The problem with people like you is you don't think any blacks should have a gripe anymore. We're not in chains or being hung so shut up and stop doing drugs, right? It's ironic that you call me a racist when you have implied some of the most racist things i have heard yet.


You're not a racist because you support rap and the messages it is sending, you are a racist and ignorant because you refuse to acknowledge what we are actually trying to tell you. Now it's fair for you to have your own opinion; but please don't take something that we say for wrong and then run with it because it will only look bad on you. You are a racist because you bad mouth Caucasians for something they don't even have control over. Unsolved murders? Not all crimes are solvable, there will be crimes that will never be solved and that's a truth; nay, the ultimate truth. Be them black or white, there will always be crimes that will go without justice and unsolved providing no closure for those involved, it just so happened that the famous black entertainers that go through unsolved crimes have their stories spammed through out the networks and channels by the media trying to get a certain point across... the wrong point. Another thing you should not take and run with. You are a racist for your words against those of another color and you're constant rant that the black community is constantly being put down, I'm trying to open my mind to your point and understand where you are coming from, don't get me wrong. But you're not opening your mind to what we are saying. Respect those and they will respect you.


@ everyone..i suppose the real message here as we can see from these posts..is that whites simply don't care about blacks gripes anymore. They feel the police are justified in doing whatever they please, and blacks should "stop being so violent" and "fix their community themselves". White folks feel they've given them enough land..and enough freedom..so time to tell the ******* to shut up and move on. great, that's exactly why if another rapper gets shot tommorow..his murder will NOT be solved.

and that's also why nobody is going to be changing their mentality in the ghetto anytime soon.


That's not the real message, that's the message you so desperately want to get across and press into the minds of those that are impressionable. That message is what makes YOU racist. As a matter of fact, more southern poor whites live in ghettos than do blacks, why? Well, whites make up a hefty 60 percent of the American population, so there's bound to be more poor white people than black, since black people only make up roughly 12-20 percent of the population. The group of people that are actually in trouble in the United States of America is in fact southern, single white mothers who live in trailer parks and are on welfare for the better part of their lifetime. But of course you weren't thinking about them, nor were we. To say that whites don't pay care specifically about blacks if wrong, because whites don't care about anyone and nor does anyone care about whites. So... who cares for whom? I'll tell you, people; people care for people. It's not whites, it's not blacks, it's not Asians or Hispanics, it's people.

"All that is required for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing."

I hope you will allow for an open mind and as such I will try to open my mind. I do know what it is like to be put down because you're not of the same race/nationality/religion. For me it's the nationality. I didn't grow up as an American, but let me tell you that I became one; I became more American than most Americans themselves. I believe in what the founders fought for; what the civil rights movements were for, and what all those wars that we fought were for. Not all were correct, but some of them tried to make a difference and for me, that's what it means to be American. To make a difference; to advocate change. And no, I'm not liberal, I'm conservative.

Shattered OUT...



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