Researchers Say They Can Prevent Homosexuality in Sheep - Are Humans Next?

rocknroll
If you believe homosexuality is a defect in the soul, how do you explain homosexual animals? How can the researchers cure homosexuality in sheep using hormone therapy, if it is indeed a defect in the soul?

I mean, there are hundreds of species of animals that exhibit homosexual behavior, are they all posessed of souls, and making a choice?

I realize that you've said acting on your urges is the choice, not the orientation, and that's an interesting twist - but I guess I don't see how you can think of it in strict terms of choice. What's wrong with an animal acting in accordance with its nature?

I know, I know, you don't think we're animals. Well, I do. I think we're animals, and I think gay folks ought to have gay sex - that doesn't mean they have to be promiscuous and lascivious and irresponsible about it. THAT'S a choice.

So, I'm interested in your opinion on this specific research pertaining to hormone therapy for homosexuality.

Also, a minor point, I've never known a promiscuous gay person. My experience is limited to less than ten folks (eight that I can think of off the top of my head), but NONE of them slept around and put themselves (and others) at risk with irresponsible sex.

So, how does my experience jive with yours?

you know, this experiment is like hormone level a is straight and level b is gay. so to make you straight, they just change the hormone levels from b to a. so it should also be possible to turn a straight animal/person into a gay one by changing the hormone levels from a to b. a cure for straightness!

Originally posted by Ford Farmer
Why are you stating that homosexual acts are wrong? I am not angry that you "turned on us"

, just curious. Do you still find men attractive? or do you just supress all sexual urges.

I'm not your judge. I use to play the game, but now I sit on the sidelines and observe. You know it's a tough question? It's one I often ask God.......the big "WHY?" Why do want me to experience my life alone with no one to snuggle up to and love? How can you take my happiness from me? How can you condemn me for what made me feel fulfilled?

I had an 8 year relationship (the last serious one). We loved eachother dearly. I felt he was my soulmate. We had the most quenching, deliriously delicious sex life. I can honestly say it couldn't have gotten any better. It was GREEEEEEAAAATTTTTTT!!!!!!!
But as time went by the lust we cherished started to wane, not because we did anything to make it happen, it just occurs...........what I learned is that lust is earthly, and all earthly things must eventually come to an end..... when our lusts died (which was the glue) the relationship weakened. My partner went outside for sexual satisfaction, hurting me very deeply......and in the end it occurred to me that sexuality became more important then the love and history we built together. This told me something was wrong......

A truly successful relationship requires a few things that gay relationships lack:
To obtain maximum satisfaction, one must build an exclusive relationship with one other person that excludes all others. There is no other way to do it. Affection spread among many people may give short-term pleasure, but such relationships necessarily will be superficial and not satisfying in the long run. A relationship must be exclusive, that is, with just one other person. There is nothing arbitrary about this need for exclusivity: Our nature as human persons requires it. Each partner has to be sure that the other is totally committed. Commitment has two features: intensity and permanence. A halfhearted commitment will not do. Neither will a temporary one. Unless each spouse is confident that the other is committed unconditionally and for life, neither will trust enough to risk self-revelation. But without that, a couple will never achieve mature unity. To be successful, relationships need to be exclusive, unconditional, and permanent. Without these qualities, it will not thrive. People know that love must be exclusive, unconditional, and permanent in order to trust enough. Psychologists never tire of telling us that marriages die for lack of exclusiveness, unconditional mutual acceptance, or commitment to permanence. Couples who fail to develop these features often fail at marriage.

There is also a fourth quality needed for long-term relationship success which gay relationships lack. It is dictated by the nature of the human person. That feature is sexual complementarity. For the deepest unity, you need one man and one woman. These differences matter both spiritually and physically, for without the complementarity between a man and a woman on all these levels, the deepest forms of union are not possible. The unity possible to two men or two women will be necessarily lopsided, both spiritually and anatomically, and therefore ultimately unsatisfying. Two men together cannot capture the fullness of human personhood, and neither can two women; for that, you need one man and one woman. However exclusive, unconditional and permanent same-sex relationships may aspire to be, they lack the complementarity that the deepest fulfillment requires. This fact may explain some of the amazing sexual behavior in the homosexual subculture.

I could go on and on. If you don't believe me ask the Holy Spirit to enlighten you and I'm sure He will (no joke). I don't subscribe to any particular faith right now. I just have my relationship with God and that's it.......

I find this whole idea repugnent. Variety is the spice of life! Applying this procedure to humans is nothing to do with breeding, its about whoever is in charge acheiving their own aims and ideals. Preventing homosexuality is just the first step on a slippery slope to total selective gene manipulation in my opinion. I don't think its much different to the blond haired, blue eyed Ayrian race plan Hitler was trying to achieve. How far could this go? Although I can see the positive aspects/advantages of gender selection and screening for inhereted diseases in embryos I cant shake the uneasiness I feel when man plays God. Who are we to make these kind of choices?
Just because we have the technology and scientific know-how to do these things, it doesnt mean we should.

Originally posted by rocknroll

Originally posted by Ford Farmer
Why are you stating that homosexual acts are wrong? I am not angry that you "turned on us"

, just curious. Do you still find men attractive? or do you just supress all sexual urges.

I'm not your judge. I use to play the game, but now I sit on the sidelines and observe. You know it's a tough question? It's one I often ask God.......the big "WHY?" Why do want me to experience my life alone with no one to snuggle up to and love? How can you take my happiness from me? How can you condemn me for what made me feel fulfilled?

I had an 8 year relationship (the last serious one). We loved eachother dearly. I felt he was my soulmate. We had the most quenching, deliriously delicious sex life. I can honestly say it couldn't have gotten any better. It was GREEEEEEAAAATTTTTTT!!!!!!!
But as time went by the lust we cherished started to wane, not because we did anything to make it happen, it just occurs...........what I learned is that lust is earthly, and all earthly things must eventually come to an end..... when our lusts died (which was the glue) the relationship weakened. My partner went outside for sexual satisfaction, hurting me very deeply......and in the end it occurred to me that sexuality became more important then the love and history we built together. This told me something was wrong......

A truly successful relationship requires a few things that gay relationships lack:
To obtain maximum satisfaction, one must build an exclusive relationship with one other person that excludes all others. There is no other way to do it. Affection spread among many people may give short-term pleasure, but such relationships necessarily will be superficial and not satisfying in the long run. A relationship must be exclusive, that is, with just one other person. There is nothing arbitrary about this need for exclusivity: Our nature as human persons requires it. Each partner has to be sure that the other is totally committed. Commitment has two features: intensity and permanence. A halfhearted commitment will not do. Neither will a temporary one. Unless each spouse is confident that the other is committed unconditionally and for life, neither will trust enough to risk self-revelation. But without that, a couple will never achieve mature unity. To be successful, relationships need to be exclusive, unconditional, and permanent. Without these qualities, it will not thrive. People know that love must be exclusive, unconditional, and permanent in order to trust enough. Psychologists never tire of telling us that marriages die for lack of exclusiveness, unconditional mutual acceptance, or commitment to permanence. Couples who fail to develop these features often fail at marriage.

There is also a fourth quality needed for long-term relationship success which gay relationships lack. It is dictated by the nature of the human person. That feature is sexual complementarity. For the deepest unity, you need one man and one woman. These differences matter both spiritually and physically, for without the complementarity between a man and a woman on all these levels, the deepest forms of union are not possible. The unity possible to two men or two women will be necessarily lopsided, both spiritually and anatomically, and therefore ultimately unsatisfying. Two men together cannot capture the fullness of human personhood, and neither can two women; for that, you need one man and one woman. However exclusive, unconditional and permanent same-sex relationships may aspire to be, they lack the complementarity that the deepest fulfillment requires. This fact may explain some of the amazing sexual behavior in the homosexual subculture.

I could go on and on. If you don't believe me ask the Holy Spirit to enlighten you and I'm sure He will (no joke). I don't subscribe to any particular faith right now. I just have my relationship with God and that's it.......

Please show some scientific studies to backup everything you just said.

"I'm not saying homosexuals are violent, or anything of the sort, but clearly there is a link between hormones and homosexuality, and hormones and violent tendencies - or am I wrong about that?)

As a species, it might benefit us to eliminate homosexuality"

HOW WOULD IT BENEFIT US AS A SPECIES????

First of all: over-population is one of THE most tremendous problems facing this species- how would eliminating homosexuality cure this?

SECOND OF ALL: Do you even know any homosexuals personally? Do you think they would appreciate being "eliminated?"

And THIRD of all- there are many kinds of hormones, testosterone-something which STRAIGHT males have in far more abundance than gay males, is one of the primary hormones linked with violent tendencies. to imply there is any connection between homosexuality and violence is preposterous and rude. Last I checked it was far more common for straight men to beat gay men to death- not vice versa. you are uninformed and latently prejudiced.

Red Dragon, my beliefs are enlightenments from the Holy Spirit.
All the scientific journals in the world can't hold a candle to His knowledge.
You want understanding of life's deepest mysteries....pray to the Holy Spirit, otherwise you're on your own.

Originally posted by WyrdeOne
I know, I know, you don't think we're animals.

I suppose animals engage in homosexual activity for the same reason my dog decides to hump someone's leg occasionally. Is my dog trying to tell me he wants a human/animal bestiality relationship? I think not. I can't hold animals accountable for there actions. They are after all animals. They don't really know any better. They don't have morals. People do.........

i think this is a good thing. as long as this doesn't become a mandatory shot for humans..then i support this reasearch. i know a lot of people will cry and say this is messed up, especially the gay community, but i think this will only benefit those parents who do not want their children living that lifestyle.

while i have nothing against the gays, if there was a shot or a patch like they say, that would prevent my kid from being gay (or retarted, disabled, deformed, or sickly) then i would ask my wife to take the medication. plus if it works after birth, then maybe some people who don't want to be gay could take this and be normal. believe it or not there are some people who do not like being gay, but they can't help it.

i've always stated that i thought homosexuality was a genetic dysfunction of some kind. I mean it's common science. Man + Woman = Life. That's the way it works in human nature, and in 95% of animal nature. it's just the way things were ment to be. religion and politics aside, lets be real there would be no living things on earth if male and female species did not procreate. So homosexuality is like getting your wires crossed genetically. It's not a choice or a sin really, just a simple geneitic flaw much like many other geneitc flaws.

I say go for it and push this science further. I think it's our duties as humans to cull out as many genetic weaknesses as we can. There are so many babies that are born that are essitially just draining society. babies with brain defects or babies that are not born with all their limbs or something..are just brining regular able bodied people in society. It's harsh but i honestly feel that we would benefit from ridding our society of these problems.

I don't think people should use this for vanity. Like i don't think that you should just be able to "create-a-baby" like it was a video game..and be able to choose eye color and height or whatever. But If there was some kind of medicine you could take while pregnent to ensure that your baby would not come out brain dead, or deformed, or gay..then i think it's our duties as humans to research that science.

Immagine if you could take something during pregnency that would make your kid immune to AIDS or cancer. what if you could prevent him from getting genetic deasieses later in life like parkisans, or alzheimers? shouldn't we do everythign in our power to make true? that's why stem cells, and studies like this one are vital to more forward as a species.

Cloning even partially has some potential, as long as it's used in the right way. Think about this..what about all these people who get burned beyond recognition. ever since i was a kid i've probly felt more emotion towards those people than any other people who haev had some kind of tragic event to them. burned people are just turned into monsters.

So what if we could take away their pain and essentially clone them a new body? or real replacement skin? Even with grafts burn victims are deformed for life...there's nothing anyone can do to help them. But what if they could go back to looking EXACTLY the way they did before they were burned? It's our duty, to find new ways of science to help these people..and studies like this are the path to that type of world.

so while i have mixed feelings about this study..i support it full heartedly. We need to think ahead to figure out how we can twist and malnipulate our genetics a bit. I'm not saying lets play god, but lets help these poor souls who can't function as regular people have a normal life..even if it is just a simple thing as malnipulating sexual preference for right now.

Originally posted by rocknroll
Red Dragon, my beliefs are enlightenments from the Holy Spirit.
All the scientific journals in the world can't hold a candle to His knowledge.
You want understanding of life's deepest mysteries....pray to the Holy Spirit, otherwise you're on your own.

Great, then I can totally disregard everything you just said since it's completely irrational.

Jeez, this thread is funny, in a very sad way.

Until you can judge yourself with openess and truth you are neither qualified to pass judgement or categorise.

So, 1 in 10 Rams are gay, buy 11, I find it hard to believe that the reason for this research is the one that is given.

Originally posted by RedDragon
Great, then I can totally disregard everything you just said since it's completely irrational.

Ahhh, another God-hater on the ATS forum
That's cool, as I myself will totally disregard anything you have to say based on the fact you believe the Holy Spirit to be irrational.

I think we are making quite a stretch here. The article states the drug simply makes a gay Ram "more inclined" to have sex with a Ewe. Hell, I know people that after a few drinks are "more inclined" to have sex with anything!

At best the drug is a "mood" modifier.

The idea we could genetically alter a persons sexuality in the womb assumes we know what causes it in the first place. WE DON'T. After many years of study we have no evidence homosexuality is genetic. Sure there is a different balance of hormones but we don't know the cause.

LOL @ Spawwwn by the way.

while i have nothing against the gays, if there was a shot or a patch like they say, that would prevent my kid from being gay (or retarted, disabled, deformed, or sickly) then i would ask my wife to take the medication. plus if it works after birth, then maybe some people who don't want to be gay could take this and be normal.

Originally posted by Spawwwn
but i think this will only benefit those parents who do not want their children living that lifestyle.

Huh? What in the hell right do you think you have to dictate your child's entire future, even when outside of your home and an adult? Yeah, your child will relish that when it is time for the rebellion stage in the teens.

You know what would be unnatural about all of this? Taking a child, and turning him into something else completely by probing and poking it while in the fetal stage to manipulate the outcome as an adult. Designer babies... That is highly unnatural to me. Much more unnatural than two men getting it on in bed.

And for just once, I would like to know where in the world all of this bull comes from about gay people getting sex all the time?

By the way, FlyersFan, regarding your earlier post, please don't develop a "straight cure" and send a bunch of loony homo's to my side!

[edit on 1/2/07 by niteboy82]

Yes, back to subject. Although I feel the way I feel regarding being gay.
I have to kinda agree and say leave the embryo alone. Don't play Creator.
Let the chips fall where they may, and let God sort it out in the end.

Originally posted by niteboy82
And for just once, I would like to know where in the world all of this bull comes from about gay people getting sex all the time?

Youth and beauty are prized in gay culture. It helps to be good looking (which alot of gay men are - take any straight girl into a gay bar and she'll cry at all the doll baby boys who won't look at her). Check out any gay personals site on the net. If you're young, gay and beautiful you can get sex as often as possible. All you have to do is make yourself available. I had friends that had steady lovers (never monogamous though), but were with 4-5 different men every week. I had other friends that had been with thousands of different men. Live in a big city, go to the bars, festivals, fundraisers, circuit parties, private parties...........eventually you gather a very big circle of friends.........all gay.....it's like being a kid in a candy shop.......depends on how much self-control you have.

I remember when I came out in the mid 1980's the bars were chock full of beautiful middle-aged gay men. But this was the generation that got staggeringlly hit by AIDS (1985-1990). At that time gay men were just dropping right and left. You have no idea how terrifying it was to see all these deaths around you stemming from the same cause. For me it was especially troubling because I didn't want to catch HIV and I was just getting to know gay life as an "out" man. By 1988, a huge proportion of the middle-aged gay community was dead. As a 20-something, I liked middle-aged guys so I was not happy that many of the pickings were dead and gone. All the "hotties" who were middle-aged and getting laid were dead or dying or infected..........

[edit on 2-1-2007 by rocknroll]

[edit on 2-1-2007 by rocknroll]

Originally posted by rocknroll
Youth and beauty are prized in gay culture. It helps to be good looking (which alot of gay men are - take any straight girl into a gay bar and she'll cry at all the doll baby boys who won't look at her). Check out any gay personals site on the net. If you're young, gay and beautiful you can get sex as often as possible. All you have to do is make yourself available. I had friends that had steady lovers (never monogamous though), but were with 4-5 different men every week. I had other friends that had been with thousands of different men. Live in a big city, go to the bars, festivals, fundraisers, circuit parties, private parties...........eventually you gather a very big circle of friends.........all gay.....it's like being a kid in a candy shop.......depends on how much self-control you have.

I live in New Orleans, I work during Mardi Gras/Southern Decadence at the #1 Gay Bar/Dance Club in the city (so I'm in the middle of everything), go out to clubs, parties, festivals, fundraisers, I am young *glares around*, and I am pretty. *glares around again, only glares longer*

I still find you to be stereotyping heavily. I was sitting with my hair stylist today discussing this very stereotype, and concluded it was waaaay overexaggerated.

Not to mention what you say at the end of this quote, "depends on how much self-control you have."

Bingo! That's what it comes down to! Not whether you're gay or you're straight, but what self-control you have.

*glares around one more time, walks away*

Originally posted by niteboy82
I still find you to be stereotyping heavily. I was sitting with my hair stylist today.......

ROTFLMAO! I'm sorry............heheheheheheheee. It's cool.

Originally posted by niteboy82
Not to mention what you say at the end of this quote, "depends on how much self-control you have." Bingo! That's what it comes down to! Not whether you're gay or you're straight, but what self-control you have.

What I am saying is there is a lack of sexual self-control, proportionately, in the gay community, with having more than just one partner to satisfy (compared to the straight world we live in). In the straight world this leads to divorce (a big clue that open relationships don't work right there). Yes, it is about self-control, which is free will. In the gay community, I saw more open relationships in my 15 years than I ever did monogamous. I know truly mongamous gay couples are rare. Me and my ex use to be made fun of all the time cause we were mongamous (or so I thought. ). I rarely saw true monogamy, ever. You know this is true in the gay world if you work in a gay club. Based upon where you work and what you do you have seen the "wildness" of the gay world.....believe me, I've been to Fire Island, Rehobeth, tons of gay raves, I lived it all buddy, but I stayed unpromiscuous through it all......was out for 2 years with my first lover, lived with my second for 8 years, and spent the final 5 years single dating only 2 guys before I bailed out of that lifestyle. It doesn't fulfill my needs anymore. I thought it would, but not anymore. I'm convinced it's not meant to work. I saw something in it that has kept me from wanting to go back. It's not my road to peace....unless someone could prove otherwise, but I cannot ever envision that happening.

I'm still gay though, just celibate (4 years now), and I'm not ashamed of who I am. I just think I'm better off where I'm at. I truly don't believe you can change someone's sexuality. I'll always be gay. Always attracted to men, but that doesn't mean I have to sleep with them. I was a virgin til I was 23 and it didn't hurt me back then, so...........it's kinda like being a kid again. A nice sense of innocence un-lost. It's a good feeling!
Peace.


[edit on 2-1-2007 by rocknroll]

I tried finding on the web once about how many gays said that they were born gay. so far I haven't found any sites. There seems to be NO GENE in the human body that says you will be gay. They had done survies years ago and everyone either was raised around gays, or had been sexually molested as a child or young adult..so unless someone finds a gene there's nothing a mother should take during her 9 months.. enough said= study it and try to find all you can before they make it a damn law so your not wasting your money or making your child an a experiment

Originally posted by schallb
I tried finding on the web once about how many gays said that they were born gay. so far I haven't found any sites. There seems to be NO GENE in the human body that says you will be gay. They had done survies years ago and everyone either was raised around gays, or had been sexually molested as a child or young adult..so unless someone finds a gene there's nothing a mother should take during her 9 months.. enough said= study it and try to find all you can before they make it a damn law so your not wasting your money or making your child an a experiment

Sorry but you don't know what you're talking about and I'd be interested to see your stats that prove this, obviously if they exist they'll be from some neo nazi /fundie website. I wasn't raised around gays or sexually molested as a child, I had absolutely every opportuniity to grow up straight handed to me on a playtter but I grew up to be, and remain gay and there are many more like me, sorry to shoot down your sacred cows but they're based on ignorance and supposition.