What Special Operations training is the toughest?

Most everyone says U.S. Navy SEALs BUD/S training is the worst, but I've heard U.S. Air Force PJ training is even worse. And what about U.S. Marine Corps Force Recon training? I heard that's tough too.

Any thoughts?

What Special Operations training is the toughest?

Are you talking about the USA only Special Forces?

If not then I think Spetsnaz is the toughest training.

They get #ed up in the training.

They are thought how to be very brutile.

SpetNaz is brutal lol..

I have seen stories of them literally beating the # outta terrorists to take em out

(Russian probably knew this already )

Anyways, SEAL Bud/S is tough, if not the toughest, hell week is insane. I don't know too much about the SpetNaz training, but I would have to say SEAL training.

-wD

Originally posted by WeBDeviL
SpetNaz is brutal lol..

I have seen stories of them literally beating the # outta terrorists to take em out

(Russian probably knew this already

)

Anyways, SEAL Bud/S is tough, if not the toughest, hell week is insane. I don't know too much about the SpetNaz training, but I would have to say SEAL training.

-wD

when you terrorize terrorists then they dont want to mess with you again.:up"

Thats what I think US troops should do.

That way the terrorists would be scare to fall into the hands of the US troops.

But right now they are babysitted when cought.

Originally posted by Russian

What Special Operations training is the toughest?

Are you talking about the USA only Special Forces?

If not then I think Spetsnaz is the toughest training.

They get #ed up in the training.

They are thought how to be very brutile.

Since most of us don't know much about foreign special operations, let's keep it limited to U.S. for now.

What do you think?

If in US troops I would think Recon.

And it is because Marines are the hardests troops and the special forces are even harder.

Originally posted by Russian
If in US troops I would think Recon.

And it is because Marines are the hardests troops and the special forces are even harder.

What exactly about their training makes it that difficult?

I heard it's a waste too. Force Recon Marines stay in their units for only three months!

Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo


What exactly about their training makes it that difficult?

I heard it's a waste too. Force Recon Marines stay in their units for only three months!

Force Recon training falls into two categories: Deep Reconnaissance and Direct Action (DA) missions. Each platoon goes through a two year work-up cycle to include: 6 months Individual Training Phase, 6 months Unit Training Phase (Deep Reconnaissance), 6 months MEU (SOC - Special Operations Capable) (Direct Action) Training Phase, and the 6 month MEU (SOC) Deployment. Upon return the platoon has a Post Deployment Phase where they prepare for the next work-up cycle. Post deployment can last three to six months.
The Individual Training Phase is where the Marines go to their specialized reconnaissance schools. Prior to deployment, each Marine in the platoon will go to the Basic Reconnaissance Course, Airborne School, the Marine Combatant Diver School, and SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape) School. Upon completion of their first float Marines can be selected to go to the advanced reconnaissance schools to include but not limited to: Ranger, Pathfinder, EMT, Military Freefall, Jumpmaster, Applied Explosives, and the Mountain Leaders Course (Winter and Summer).
The typical Unit Training Phase consists of the following training packages: Long Range Communications, Advanced Parachute/HAHO, Amphibious Recon, Combat Dive, Weapons and Tactics, Combat Trauma, Desert Patrolling, Mountain Patrolling, and Long Range Patrols.
The MEU (SOC) Training Phase consists of the Explosive Breaching Course, Close Quarter Battle Course, GOPLAT training, VBSS (Shipboard Visit Board Search and Seizures). During the TrUE (Training in an Urban Environment) training packages, the platoons can train in a variety of missions to support the MEU (SOC). The MEU (SOC) Missions include:
Amphibious Raids

Non-Combatant Evacuation Operations (NEO)

Reinforcement Operations

Security Operations

Humanitarian Operations

Seize Airfields and Ports

Conduct Counter Intel Operations

Signal Intelligence / Electronic Warfare

Direct Action Raids Maritime Interdiction Operations

Gas and Oil Platforms

Recovery Operations

Clandestine Recon and Surveillance

Specialized Demo

TRAP (Tactical Recovery of Aircraft and Personnel)


The east and west coast deployments are typically six months long, and the 31st MEU usually lasts about three months. Some deployments can last up to a year if the MEU is involved in any major operation.




I wish that answers all you questions.

either

spetsnatz

GROM or SAS

or maybe LRP

Originally posted by Russian

Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo


What exactly about their training makes it that difficult?

I heard it's a waste too. Force Recon Marines stay in their units for only three months!

Force Recon training falls into two categories: Deep Reconnaissance and Direct Action (DA) missions. Each platoon goes through a two year work-up cycle to include: 6 months Individual Training Phase, 6 months Unit Training Phase (Deep Reconnaissance), 6 months MEU (SOC - Special Operations Capable) (Direct Action) Training Phase, and the 6 month MEU (SOC) Deployment. Upon return the platoon has a Post Deployment Phase where they prepare for the next work-up cycle. Post deployment can last three to six months.
The Individual Training Phase is where the Marines go to their specialized reconnaissance schools. Prior to deployment, each Marine in the platoon will go to the Basic Reconnaissance Course, Airborne School, the Marine Combatant Diver School, and SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape) School. Upon completion of their first float Marines can be selected to go to the advanced reconnaissance schools to include but not limited to: Ranger, Pathfinder, EMT, Military Freefall, Jumpmaster, Applied Explosives, and the Mountain Leaders Course (Winter and Summer).
The typical Unit Training Phase consists of the following training packages: Long Range Communications, Advanced Parachute/HAHO, Amphibious Recon, Combat Dive, Weapons and Tactics, Combat Trauma, Desert Patrolling, Mountain Patrolling, and Long Range Patrols.
The MEU (SOC) Training Phase consists of the Explosive Breaching Course, Close Quarter Battle Course, GOPLAT training, VBSS (Shipboard Visit Board Search and Seizures). During the TrUE (Training in an Urban Environment) training packages, the platoons can train in a variety of missions to support the MEU (SOC). The MEU (SOC) Missions include:
Amphibious Raids

Non-Combatant Evacuation Operations (NEO)

Reinforcement Operations

Security Operations

Humanitarian Operations

Seize Airfields and Ports

Conduct Counter Intel Operations

Signal Intelligence / Electronic Warfare

Direct Action Raids Maritime Interdiction Operations

Gas and Oil Platforms

Recovery Operations

Clandestine Recon and Surveillance

Specialized Demo

TRAP (Tactical Recovery of Aircraft and Personnel)


The east and west coast deployments are typically six months long, and the 31st MEU usually lasts about three months. Some deployments can last up to a year if the MEU is involved in any major operation.




I wish that answers all you questions.

Russian, that is an awesome clarification of what Marine Recon is and does. As a former Marine I want to say that there is not much different in training from Force Recon and Navy Seals because they both tend to train together. Also it is not who is the toughest. We don't go out there and "whale" on each other. Each service has their elite and their elite are trained to do specific missions.

Semper Fi!
TejanoRey

PS: sweatmonicaIdo

Nothing more to it..



(Thigs are done to them in training that would get US/UK.. etc instructors into jail for 25 to life..)

I have to agree with Fulcrum


and second in my book is GROM

What i am talking about..

Link!

Not about the 'militia/police units',

But those are also very good..
(SOBR, OMON.. etc..)



In the late sixties, four-man SPETSNAZ teams were clandestinely inserted into Vietnam to test the then-new SVD sniper rifle in combat. In May 1968, a reconnaissance-sabotage group attached to the 103d Guards Airborne Division seized Prague Airport to enable the division to land. Prior to the operation, the officers and men were familiarized with the airport and its defenses. They embarked on a plane that received permission to land at Prague based on a fictitious claim of engine trouble. As the aircraft touched down and slowed, they jumped out, seized guard posts, and helped to set up a control team to bring in the division.

In December 1979, SPETSNAZ, in company with the Committee for State Security (KGB), surrounded President Hafizullah Amin's palace in Kabul, Afghanistan, and proceeded to execute Amin and virtually everyone in the palace. In the words of an Afghan survivor, "the SPETSNAZ used weapons equipped with silencers and shot down their adversaries like professional killers." After this, the SPETSNAZ secured Kabul Airport in preparation for the mass airlanding of airborne troops. Subsequent operations in Afghanistan have included attempts to ambush the rebel leader Ahmed Shah Massoud, infiltration of rebel-held territory, and heliborne ambushes of rebel units.

good link fulcrum

i agree with you

Originally posted by FULCRUM
What i am talking about..

Link!

Not about the 'militia/police units',

But those are also very good..
(SOBR, OMON.. etc..)

In the late sixties, four-man SPETSNAZ teams were clandestinely inserted into Vietnam to test the then-new SVD sniper rifle in combat. In May 1968, a reconnaissance-sabotage group attached to the 103d Guards Airborne Division seized Prague Airport to enable the division to land. Prior to the operation, the officers and men were familiarized with the airport and its defenses. They embarked on a plane that received permission to land at Prague based on a fictitious claim of engine trouble. As the aircraft touched down and slowed, they jumped out, seized guard posts, and helped to set up a control team to bring in the division.

In December 1979, SPETSNAZ, in company with the Committee for State Security (KGB), surrounded President Hafizullah Amin's palace in Kabul, Afghanistan, and proceeded to execute Amin and virtually everyone in the palace. In the words of an Afghan survivor, "the SPETSNAZ used weapons equipped with silencers and shot down their adversaries like professional killers." After this, the SPETSNAZ secured Kabul Airport in preparation for the mass airlanding of airborne troops. Subsequent operations in Afghanistan have included attempts to ambush the rebel leader Ahmed Shah Massoud, infiltration of rebel-held territory, and heliborne ambushes of rebel units.

Fulcrum you and I know Spetsnaz are the best.

But the guy just wanted to find out which is the best Special Forces in USA.

I too support Spetsnaz!

Look at my avator!

Called as Special Jaegers..

Their only mission is to hunt and kill Spetsnaz..

To counter so called strategic strike..



Unit has been visited by US Delta Force that took some lessons from them back to the states..



[Edited on 8-12-2003 by FULCRUM]

hmm i agree the top three special ops teams would be

Spetsnaz ( RUSSIA)

GROM ( POLAND)

Isayeret( Isreal)

going back to GROM there operations are so secretive that when bushed thanked the polish president when the GROM unit sezied an offshore oil drilling the Polish president was angry at bush saying that by divuldzing info on the actions and location of the unit he is putting them in danger.

Originally posted by Kriskaos
hmm i agree the top three special ops teams would be

Spetsnaz ( RUSSIA)

GROM ( POLAND)

Isayeret( Isreal)

going back to GROM there operations are so secretive that when bushed thanked the polish president when the GROM unit sezied an offshore oil drilling the Polish president was angry at bush saying that by divuldzing info on the actions and location of the unit he is putting them in danger.

I agree with my whole heart.
Aspecially about GROM- patriotism...
The eastern CT units are much tougher than the eastern. SAS is nothing compared to Spetsnaz or Isayeret.
And it is said that GROM guys are learning from Delta and SAS... Desinformation

Troszke czekalem a� ktos wspomni o Grupie Reagowania Operacyjno-Manewrowego.

Too bad PolskieWojsko isn't here, he would be proud of the conclusion...

Sweat,

Unless you've gone through all of them, how're are you going to really know?

I have friends who have done 2 (seals/force recon, seals, french foreign legion) and I I respect their opinions, but I really doubt that there are many who have done, Spetznatz and Seal for example..

With that said, I asked my friends this question, and both said that the Spetznatz is probably the most physically arduous, but the seal training is probably the most mentally arduous. Both said its about the intent of the training....

hrxll

btw of the Seal-buds washouts it's the mental mistakes that kill people, not the physical ones...

Did anyone mention the French Foriegn Legion?

Tough, because:

a. 6 year minimum enlistment
b. they take you for any crime, aside from murder
c. can change your name when you are accepted
d. can retire after 12 years, and get French citizenship if you request it.
e. there are NO Frenchmen in the Foreign Legion,hehe
f. You get to kick as much azz as you want, because you are totally expendable.
g. you get to endure 16 weeks of brutal training.

Way back when, when the Legionaires were still in Algeria, they were battling the Algerians at the time, because France did not wwant to lose control of this strategic colony. Well, as time went on, France decided to give Algeria independence, leaving the Legionaires to fend for themselves.
Well, a very po'd company of Legionaires decided to stage a coup d' etat, by assassainating DeGaulle in Paris. The plans went according to schedule, the sniper was in place, and setting up to fire as Degaulle rounded a corner during a parade. A last minute rat exposed the whole scheme, and the Legionaires were summarily executed.

Legionaires are the shiznit!