crappie (pronounced: cropee) is just a pond fish that's in abundance here. fairly easy to catch. tasty. yes, zephyr is a type of rod.

Maslow's hierarchical system of needs, while generally true, overlooks an amazing historical fact: people of limited or no means have been known to skip immediately over all the other steps in the hierarchy to selflessly give even their lives for others, sometimes total strangers. I think that on any given day (or moment) we may find ourselves on a different step in Maslow's hierarchy and that the steps are not necessarily progressive. In situation x when everyone is scrambling for survival of self/loved ones we will see the best and the worst of the human condition. As a woman, this prospect is frightening to me.

Men and women will never be equal but one is not better than the other by virtue of gender. Our souls do not have genitals or X or Y chromosones. Even in these (relative) peace times, I find it impossible to treat my fellow man the same as females. Example: yesterday, at work (predominantly female profession) I had to get up and leave my work area from embarassment. Normally when women get together and chat about deeply personal things, I just shake my head and chuckle to myself but yesterday it was 2 men (i was the only female in the group). They started talking about sex and how women were illogical and men were rational, etc. I continued to work, trying not to overhear their conversation but when it got graphic, i fairly ran out of the room. Call it a double standard if you like but I just don't think mixed company is the place for locker-room tittle-tattle. I also don't think one's place of employment is the right environment to discuss sex stories. (I'm an old fogey, I know).

Now when shtf, will men behave like gentlemen? I understand that women are capable of atrocities and bad behavior as well but I'm talking in general terms. Generally speaking, women, throughout history and throughout the world, have been subjected to the will of men. Even during peace times subjugated women have had their feet crippled (China-foot binding), burned on their husband's funeral pyres (India), female infants left to float away in monsoons (Japan), been made to cover their entire bodies, including their faces so as to not "tempt" men (moslem countries), burned at the stake for their audacity in having an independent or contrary thought (Europe-dark ages), been denied property or their own children (America-settlement days to present times), etc. It was mentioned earlier that most of the violence toward men is from men. I find this telling. Not all men are violent, of course, but generally speaking, men TEND toward violence more so than women. Violence is usually born of a lack of self-control (at least in that moment) and/or a need to control a situation or person. Who is the more easily controlled (physically)? Men or women?

Despite all the inequalities in our culture, society, legal system, etc. between men and women, I still see men as being the biggest threat to a woman's survival. Hopefully, one day we will all learn to appreciate one another's virtues and the strong will not dominate or oppress the weak (male or female) but I strongly suspect that blessed, enlightened day will not come during situation x.

Dark_Elf,

Good judgment comes with experience, experience comes from poor judgment.

That, my dear, is beautiful and true. (Makes all the poor judgement worth while.)


GPS,

If then in a bug out situation what do you plan on being your main source of food?

Frankly, I'm hoping it waits a year or so, so that I can get out to a farm. However, in the event that it doesn't, we've got food stocked up in the pantry. Won't last forever, but it'll last at least a week or two, depending on portions.

And really, it all circles back around to Whitewave's question: What if there is no definintive 'now is the moment to bug out'? As she aptly pointed out, these things are not likely to be sudden, but rather stretched out.

Honestly, I'm not so much worried about bugging out, but rather another Depression. There are numerous signs that point to this being a very real possibility in the near future... And while there was a definite 'Yup, this is rock bottom' period, I don't think it suddenly *snaps* happened. It's a downward slope, not the floor dropping out.

Which still begs the question: Do I work to pay off my student loans or not?


OT,

I must ponder your words some more. I *think* I understand, but because I cannot put it into words right now, I must continue thinking.



[edit on 3-2-2007 by Diseria]

This is a photo of a home made fishing pole I have often used to catch fish around here.

Croakers, Bluefish, Striped Bass, Trout.

It consists of a old piece of bamboo pole cut off and attached to it is a yard sale reel..attached with two hose clamps from Auto Zone. THe eye on the end is an olde eye from a worn out fishing pole. I attached it carefully winding it to the pole with 25 lb fishing line then when finished I super glued the windings...finally some tape over the windings...duct tape.

I have used this olde rig for years and caught many a fish off it making for some fine meals.

As a sidelight on the Survival thread " IF no ATS meeting place An intel NET Maybe"....I have posted a photo of my emergency antenna along with this fishing rig used to reel it up a tree limb for some altitude.

This is the type of antenna which after I used after Hurricane Isabel to monitor conditions around town along with my police scanner. I was able to locate available gas stations through other hams without having to spend hours waiting in line or searching as were so many. The few days after the hurricane were critical for many who made no preparations in advance. Mind you now this was not a bad hurricane on the scale as was Katrina down south but it was amazing for how many people were totally unprepared for even this.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Nicely done, OT. Ever use waders? Know of any homespun methods for checking whether a fish is contaminated or not? I don't want to carry a science lab with me when I fish in waters I'm not familiar with. Any quick checks that can be done by just "eyeballing" it to see if it's safe to eat?

An intel net is a fine idea but isn't that what ATS is? What did you have in mind?

Originally posted by whitewave
Nicely done, OT. Ever use waders? Know of any homespun methods for checking whether a fish is contaminated or not? I don't want to carry a science lab with me when I fish in waters I'm not familiar with. Any quick checks that can be done by just "eyeballing" it to see if it's safe to eat?

An intel net is a fine idea but isn't that what ATS is? What did you have in mind?

You are up like me...standing the night watch??

Ive been out in my garage knocking around with reloading some ammunition I used at the range some two weeks ago and enjoying some light jazz and coffee. No chocolate eclairs this time.

I dont know many ways for contaminated fish. If I see alot of dead carcases floating on the water ..I suspect that there are ten times more which have not floated as of yet to the surface. It was so with the Kepone poisioning here years back. I saw that one with my own eyes..and knew that there were far more dead fish which had not floated yet to the surface.

If I see abnormal growth on fish ..I dont eat them..internal as well as external. Cysts and so on. I look carefully for this when cleaning.

As to the net...that site was just a suggestion of what to do to connect with other people or groups. I think as suggested by some others it would be advantageous to stick close to someone with a radio receiver which could pick up not only regular AM/FM but also the shortwave bands. Better if it were a person who knew how to use a transmitter. ATS members are so spread out across the country and the globe.

Angry American had asked me several inquiries when he found out that I was a Ham. Come to find out there are quite a number of hams on here.

What is great about this site is the ability to spread information and thinking outside of the normal routes...on a multitude of topics. I think it is great. I used to look for informed people in chat rooms but it just got to be so much disorganized wildlife in them. The informed were few and far between in chats. Here you can meet people with similar intrests and thinking and discourse on selected topics.

Are you keeping warm out there? Cold has finally set in here. Only light snow to date but winter yet young here.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Nice day today. Sunny with a little bite in the air. Sweater weather. It amazes me that people are so surprised by the cold. If I'm feeling particularly uncharitable, I'll say, "you know, I've noticed a pattern. Every year about this time, it gets cold." (I'm going to hell, I know.)

Recently got my book (Now you're talking! All you need for your first amateur radio license) to get my license. There's a group that meets out here once a month. Friendly bunch. The equipment looks expensive. I asked questions about the best type of equipment to get and that turned out to be a BIG mistake. My head was swimming with information overload, a notepad full of numbers and letters that looked like algebra problems and a riot nearly broke out as everyone had their personal favorite to promote.

Don't know why I'm still up. Gotta go to work in about 3.5 hours. Had a lot of weighty matters to consider lately.

I checked out the other thread about ham operators and about 3 posts in I felt like I had entered a foreign speaking chat room. You guys really do have your own language. I trust I can learn it though.

Well, I'm really useless on less than 3 hours sleep so I'll see ya on the threads tomorrow.

Been watching a number of movies this weekends begining with this recent release called "Flyboys" about World War 1 American pilots in France. I love those period movies where they dress up all the actors in the fashion of the days. Someone must have all that stuff catalogued somewhere to make the wardrobes for these movies. It must cost a fortune. Same with all these olde cars and trucks.

Yes the ham operators do seem to have their language peculearitys. Similar to any other hobby or even trade..the language and its usefulness follows.

Dont let all that stuff intimidate you about language or what rig or rigs to buy. I would suggest you begin with a two meter rig or a dual bander which consists of two meters and what is also called the Four Forty meter band ..and also sometimes called the 70 centemeter band. This is basically VHF and UHF tansmission. If you want to use the really long range bands the rigs are a bit more expensive and not always portable.

It is up to you if you want to get used or new equipment. I have done both. My base station.. a Yaesu FT 890 is used.

The radio in my truck has the HF ..long wave bands...the VHF and UHF bands built into it. I can also take it out of the truck and use it on my base station. This one I bought new. It is a Yaesu FT 100 D.

As I understand it, if not already, they are getting ready to delete the requirement for morse code altogether. Just the written tests. I never expected that when I got my ticket years ago.

I am planning down the road to get another walkie talkie with both the VHFand UHF bands. They are really making them small now days and with more features too.

Good luck on your tests...dont let anyone rush you on either the tests or the purchase of a rig. Do your homework here on both.

There are sites on line which sell new rigs and accessorys

Ham Radio Outlet is one

Amateur Electronic Supply is another. I buy some accessorys from a company called MFJ enterprises.

Just some resources for you to research if you are so inclined.

Gotta get some shut eye here too.
Thanks,
Orangetom

Wow whitewave, you are seriously one cool woman

I'm a tomboy by nature, always have been, probably will always be, so I find your posts fascinating. I'm also a nineteen year old girl, so I thought I should chime in on this topic.

I agree with you, whitewave, about most of what you said throughout this entire thread. I have no intention of ever marrying or having kids myself, simply because I don't want any, and its often hard for me to relate to either gender, because on many womens issues I just don't have any interest in going through [like motherhood] and thus have nothing to say about, and I'm frankly not allowed to say anything about mens issues because no matter how neutral I am inside spiritually, as a genderless 'soul', I will always be labeled a woman and lumped together as if every woman is the same while I'm in this body.

But thats besides the point--- if the shtf any time soon I want to be ready to take care of myself, take care of other people if I have too, and survive.

I believe, like you, that in this situation, men will be the biggest threat. Thats not to say men are inherantly bad or that all men are dangerous, but even today, statistically, the most dangerous animal on earth is a male human. This is the biggest threat to other men as well, and to children.

Woman are naturally smaller and weaker than men, but sometimes I think people make that into an extreme statement, as if women are totally weak and incapable, and men are totally strong and capable, and thus one should do no physical work and the other should do it all. But thats not how life really works; things are usually not totalities.

Its like saying that if one horse is faster than the other one by even a slim margin, the slower horse shouldn't be allowed to run at all. That would be like having only the strongest men fighting and working, and all persons less than the strongest doing all of the 'feminine' duties in a group, including the weaker men. Life just 'aint that black and white, there is a lot of gray area, and a lot of colorful areas as well. Individualism plays a big role; sickness, fitness, genetics, mind set, personality, intelligence, etc, all play roles. It more of a continuum than a yin and yang scenario, but humans like to simplify things.

When it comes to menstruation, I think something women should think about doing is getting fitter; not skinnier, but stronger, because that will lessen the severity of the menstrual cycle and obviously help in a physical situation. Female animals in the wild cannot afford to be as weak and frail as the female human strives to be in our strange little society, because realistically, the male is probably no where to be found, and the group of females has to deal with the problem and defend the young. Female mammals are survivalists by nature, and tend to be more social and cunning. We have to use those broad strengths along with individual strengths.

In a manner of speaking, we have to be like the wolf. Use our numbers and our teamwork, our intelligence and our combined abilities to get the job done. We can't cut each others throats like we do so much nowadays, and that goes for men as well. A pack of wolves can take down the biggest and strongest adversary when they work together.

Speaking of which, having canines would be a big bonus if the shtf. They help to guard, to sentinal, to hunt, to assist, and to raise morale. If you could in the aftertime of some world-destroying event, try to get a dog or puppy, or steal a wolf or coyote puppy for your group [if you have one], or get a mixture of canines, they would be an asset, as they instinctively know how to hunt and take care of themselves, are omnivorous, and they instinctively work for the good of the pack. They are also highly intelligent.

I'm dying to head out to Montana for another woodsy vacation and do a bit of fishing and camping now. The sooner the better. Really enjoyed this thread

Aw shucks. *blushes*

I find your perspicacious acumen to be refreshing. Most women your age are just too fascinated with themselves and their assumed sexual power to be of much interest to anyone but hormonally deranged men. Gives me hope for my own (too cute for their own good) daughters.

As a woman who has worked 60 hours a week, homeschooled 3 different grade levels of kids, lived for the past 30 years off no more than 4 hours sleep a night, etc. ad nauseum....I'm here to tell ya: Womens' lib sucks! Man! We bought into that self-destructive fad hook, line and sinker, didn't we? I think we're coming full circle, though. Women I know seem to be learning to appreciate their men a little more. There are stereotypical behaviors in both genders that give plenty of fodder for jokes and cruel witticisms; generalized truths to which we can all relate. It's when we forget that the stereotype is not always true that we degrade into discriminatory prejudices. The stereotype does not allow room for spiritual growth or cultural change of individuals within the stereotyped group and that sort of stunted mindset limits us all.

It has been my observation and experience that most self-proclaimed survivalists are male (usually "ISO like-minded female...). I've also noticed that most Darwin Award recipients are male. And while I laugh and shake my head at the unbelievably stupid ways in which men remove themselves from the gene pool trying to do things that most women would not even consider trying; I also have to admire the courage and adventurous pioneering spirit exemplified by such dangerously risky behavior. Again, most women would not even consider such behavior and without a burning curiosity devoid of consideration for potential consequences would we not still be in the stone age? The same flagrant disregard for consequences of behavior, while admirable in noble men, will be (is) a nightmare when exhibited by the amoral beast.

Sun Tzu said: Know yourself. Know your enemy.
Occasionally they are the same person. I think much of a survivalists attitude is in not defeating yourself. Knowing that all human life has value (some more than others-imo) and that your own is no less worthy of all the consideration and care you can put into it. Learning, improving, growing are all necessary to survive. You never know what bit of knowledge or skill will be called upon to survive a particular situation. Like the army recruiting poster says: Be all you can be.
It doesn't say to be all that someone bigger and stronger than you can be; just be all that you CAN be. Just because I'm not Colin Powell doesn't mean I can't come up with a useful military strategy. Just because I'm not Whitney Houston doesn't mean I can't sing my kids to sleep. Just because I'm female doesn't mean I can't survive a tough situation. Women are just strong in different ways than men. And men are tender in different ways than women. We have equal value in life and even our different functions have equal value.
Hopefully, when sit. x is OVER, we'll all be a little more appreciative of what we have and are.

Orangetom tips his hat to Whitewave...

I needed and very much appreciate your last post.

Well ..well done!!

Thanks,
Orangetom

Check this out folks.


Something of which you need to be aware for your general and daily survival.

This information was sent to me by another Ham Radio operator.

It is on a topic called


"Lock Bumping"


I had never heard of this since I carry a set of lock picks with me daily so it caught me by surprise. Now ....lock picks require some degree of skill to use them consistently.

Not so much with lock bumping per se.


You will find the videos disturbing. As if we didnt have enough to worry about daily in our lives...but you need to be aware of this information.

It seems the local constabulary are aware of this trend but are not wont to inform the general public for fear of panic. Much better the public be dumbed down and secure in thier faith in the system.

Anyway..plug in " Lock Bumping" into your search engine and watch the various videos available on it. The video/videos I watched were on a site called U Tube.

For your general information.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Originally posted by WyrdeOne

On the other hand, I've heard of women who gave birth in a few minutes, in bathroom stalls and department stores - even heard of women who didn't know they were pregnant (sounds unbelievable to me too, but who knows). So maybe you could keep moving if you absolutely had to.

Still, I would think it would be better if you could find a safe place for a while.

When your ass is big enough, you won't know either...

Originally posted by RedStar11
I rarely ever see this addressed anywhere on all the message boards I lurk, so I will ask it myself.

This is mainly a question for the girls out there.

If/when the time comes when America is under attack/martial law/whatever, and you're in full-blown survival mode, there is only so much preparation you can do right? So how do you deal with menstruation? I'm ready to deal with whatever comes my way but I am still trying to figure out exactly how I'm going to prepare for those "special" (specially annoying) times of the month that could either be a major hinderance (ie. no "supplies" and it's soaking your pants) or just an annoyance.

I mean, other than totally stocking up on feminine products, what is there to do? And that's assuming you will be bunkered down somewhere. What about when you're backpacking out in the middle of nowhere? I'm especially worried about that situation because I have no idea what I would do. Find a stream and sit in it all day? Are you supposed to use leaves or something? Please help me out and give me some tips.

And I left the title open to other tips and worries that could pertain to females only.
If anyone has anything else on their mind, feel free to post it here.
Maybe dealing with pregnancy?
Or newborn babies?

One thing is for sure, I definitely wouldn't want to be pregnant when s**t hits the fan.

I have a question when supplies run LOW and medicine RUNs LOW and it's that time of the month what do you suppose ones does...?