Swearing in...

As far as I know when swearing into a Congressional office, all you have to do is raise your right hand. I don't believe there is a book involved in the process...

If this is the case then the guy wanting to swear in on the Quran is only putting it forth as a means to further his own agenda and draw attention to himself.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Noone know for sure?


Really curious...

Would you much rather have a public official take a solemn vow of office on a book that is sacred to him, or to take the vow on a book that means nothing to him?

Having a muslim take a solid vow on a Christian Bible, as opposed to a Koran, is like asking a Christian to swear on a copy of Dr. Phil's new book instead of the bible. The Muslim Congressman should be applauded for taking his vows of office seriously by insisting they be made on a book that means something to him.

My point is that I don't believe that in a Congressional swearing in ceremony there is a book used at all.. Only asked to raise your right hand and swear the oath.

Originally posted by MasterJedi
My point is that I don't believe that in a Congressional swearing in ceremony there is a book used at all.. Only asked to raise your right hand and swear the oath.

Ah but therein lies the problem. Oath in this context has 2 meanings.

Onelook: Oath:

# noun: a commitment to tell the truth (especially in a court of law); to lie under oath is to become subject to prosecution for perjury
# noun: a solemn promise, usually invoking a divine witness, regarding your future acts or behavior

So which is it? Just saying the words or "invoking a divine witness"?

congressional ceremonies DO have a book present
so far they've all used a bible

this isn't an issue of someone trying to further their agenda, it's about someone excersing religious freedom

That is why I started this thread so that I could ascertain whether or not a holy book was even used. I had heard on talk radio that there wasn't one used during Cogressional swearing in and that didn't sound right to me.

Thank you for clearing that up. And personally I could care less what book he uses, because as its been pointed out, its his integrity that is being weighed and the book is merely a symbol of beliefs. If he preferred to swear on a copy of Gone with the Wind I wouldn't care. Because he is only held to whatever standard by his own integrity.

NO, a book is not used in the official ceremony. It's held with ALL members being sworn in at the same time.

Later on for photo's it is acted out with the congressmans people around and all the camera's present.

The official ceremony is just one big group of congressman in chambers all saying yes.

So that would mean that if I were to ever hold congresional office I could use my BOS to swear my oath to? As a pagan wouldent it be my right to swear by a book that I hold sacred? Hmmm Wonder how that would go down?

Hmmm, so he is just wanting to use the Quran for the photo op?

Sounds to me that he knew this would gain himself attention and is using it for political gain, perhaps in the Muslim community.

I f the case is that he wants to use it in the group and noone else is actually swearing on a bible then it does sound like an agenda.

In the official swearing in there are no books, just everyone in chambers and I believe it's the speaker that reads the oath and they agree.

If he placed his hand on the Quran that would be in the later photo op, which is not the actual swearing in ceremony. ALL member do this so they can autograph the pics and hand them out for more money from their constituants.

Congress and the Senate are sworn in officially as a group.

How they stage the photo ops later is up to them.

I know this because I read a fascinating article on it earlier this week (which i'm trying to locate.)

Many Congressman and senators have chosen not to take an oath on the Bible.

This is the first though that has chosen to use the Quran.

Edit to add:

According to the Library of Congress, Theodore Roosevelt became the first and only president to take an oath without a Bible in 1901. In 1961, John F. Kennedy took his oath on a Catholic (Douay) version of the Bible. Several Jewish members of Congress have taken their oath on the Torah. Article VI of the Constitution specifies that "... no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."

Here is a pretty good story on it. link

[edit on 21-12-2006 by mrwupy]

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
Would you much rather have a public official take a solemn vow of office on a book that is sacred to him, or to take the vow on a book that means nothing to him?

Ok, of all the arguments I have heard to support this point of view, yours is the best.

I think he should have the decency to swear on the book that most Americans hold sacred.

Originally posted by XphilesPhan
I think he should have the decency to swear on the book that most Americans hold sacred.

He's not swearing an oath from the American people, he's swearing an oath from HIM to the American people....so he should be able to use a book that means something to him.

If I were to swear an oath on the Koran it would mean NOTHING to me, might as well us a comic book. However, me being Christian, using a bible would hold some serious weight.

I would rather him be sincere and swear on a book that holds weight with him.



[edit on 22/12/2006 by SportyMB]

Church and State is seperate in the United States and you do not have a "Church of America" or an official religion so in theory there is not an arguement here.

Christian groups who are demanding he should be swearing in on a bible are breaking the constitution by forcing Church and State into one unit and trying to create an official religion.

The United Kingdom has altered The Oath of Allegiance & Pledge to all major religions, including Atheist and Church and State are one in the UK (The Church has members in the House of Lords and can make laws). MPs have options when taking the Oath to enter Parliament and others do when joining the Army, police, etc.

So if we can change to support others, why can't America?