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Goode Not So Good For Muslims

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posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 06:29 AM
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Originally posted by supercheetah

Are all Muslims Islamofascists/evil?

This thread will go no where until you answer that question.



Ofcoarse i dont think all Muslims are evil Islamofascists, i have stated that many times.

But i certainly dont see Islam broadly as the religion of peace as its leaders so wish us to beleive.

I stick by my statement, Most Muslims are NOT Terrorists, Most Terrorists ARE Muslims.


Peace.




posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 06:40 AM
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Originally posted by NumberCruncher

Originally posted by supercheetah

Are all Muslims Islamofascists/evil?

This thread will go no where until you answer that question.



Ofcoarse i dont think all Muslims are evil Islamofascists, i have stated that many times.

But i certainly dont see Islam broadly as the religion of peace as its leaders so wish us to beleive.

I stick by my statement, Most Muslims are NOT Terrorists, Most Terrorists ARE Muslims.


Peace.


Again, you need to examine if and why most "terrorists" are Muslim.

Are the Irish more likely to be terrorists than the English? Does the existence of the IRA and the Real IRA prove anything?

Powerful states do not have terrosrists. They have soldiers, armies, navies, mercanaries,pilots, technology and "gunboat diplomacy" to fight their causes and achieve their goals.

The French resistance were classed as terrorists...but they only existed because of German occupation. They didn't exist simply because "most Europeans - and particularly the French - are a bit violent"

[edit on 22-12-2006 by daviduk2006]



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 06:48 AM
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With the number of civillians killed in the Middle East and the Third World due to the policies and strategic games of the West running into the many millions, it is rather saddening to see so many people fall into the "We must watch those dangerous Muslims...our Empire is good and needs defending" type reasoning.

It's as if we belong to the Stormtroopers with Darth and the Death Star on our side, using our force to achieve "our" goals, and are worried that pathetic C3PO and R2D2 are going to come and get us all!

I don't really know or understand why so many Americans seem totally oblivious to their country's role in fermenting war and terror.



[edit on 22-12-2006 by daviduk2006]



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 07:16 AM
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Originally posted by daviduk2006
With the number of civillians killed in the Middle East and the Third World due to the policies and strategic games of the West running into the many millions.




You got some proof on this outragous claim David ?

As long as there is nut jobs running around the joint threatning our sovereignty we will be hunting them down.

It seems your prepared to submit to the Doctrine of Fighting is Evil, Where as we learned a long time ago that we must fight evil!

What do you propose David, all things said and done ? Lets forget Iraq for now ..... What should we do, sit here on our laurels apologoze and pretend to ourselfs everthing is ok and it wont happen again ??



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 07:21 AM
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Originally posted by NumberCruncher

Originally posted by daviduk2006
With the number of civillians killed in the Middle East and the Third World due to the policies and strategic games of the West running into the many millions.




You got some proof on this outragous claim David ?

As long as there is nut jobs running around the joint threatning our sovereignty we will be hunting them down.

It seems your prepared to submit to the Doctrine of Fighting is Evil, Where as we learned a long time ago that we must fight evil!

What do you propose David, all things said and done ? Lets forget Iraq for now ..... What should we do, sit here on our laurels apologoze and pretend to ourselfs everthing is ok and it wont happen again ??


Outrageous claim? I'm guessing you didn't Major in History, then?

You have internet access, right? Google for crimes and atrocities and political games carried out by the "Allies" over the past 50 years. There's only about 100,000 books on the subjects (war, terror,politics,oil, arms,death squads,torture etc etc) at Amazon.com so, of course, I wouldn't expect you to read everything at once!

As I said, I don't really "get" why so many Americans are unaware of this stuff.



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 11:00 AM
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Originally posted by daviduk2006

As I said, I don't really "get" why so many Americans are unaware of this stuff.


Most educated Americans are not.



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 12:05 PM
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Can you stupid people stop relying on the "internet" for reference, dont you people know that internet can be altered, changed and BIASED to the webmasters character. The best place to get your information from is PAPER-BASED Books.. and another thing islam promotes peace believe it or not, your opinion is one in a million so it will help if try to believe that Islam does not promote Violence, Jihad doesnt mean "holy war" and other things that you hear in the media portraying islam in a negative perspective... but if you wish to be against, like i said your opinion is one in a million (your "mate" might agree with ya! but he/she probably agrees with you in everything!"



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 01:30 PM
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Originally posted by NumberCruncher
So it really is quite irrelevant what teh constitution says....


:bnghd:

Oh, for the love of Santa Claus! :shk: If this isn't indicative of ignorance in this country today... I just can't believe it! They're swearing to uphold the Constitution, for Christ's sake! (or for Santa's sake)

Congressmen DON'T swear on a book, they sometimes carry one. And not always the bible.

Educate yourself. Please...



In Congress, newly elected representatives do not put their left hands on any book. They raise their right hands, and are sworn in together as the speaker of the House administers the oath of office. Some do carry a book, according to House historians, and some choose to photograph a private swearing-in afterward with their hand on the Bible. One senator is known to have carried an expanded Bible that included the Book of Mormon.


And regardless what NumberCruncher thinks about the Constitution and it's relevance...



The Constitution says: "The senators and representatives ... shall be bound by oath or affirmation to support this Constitution; but no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States."

Some confusion may come from the long-standing tradition of presidents taking the oath with a hand on the Bible. But this is a choice and matter of custom, as is the phrase, "so help me God." President John Quincy Adams took the oath on a law book including the Constitution. President Theodore Roosevelt didn't use a book.
Source


Emphasis mine.

This is yet another sensaitional story made specifically to get the blood of the fear-mongerers boiling. Congratulations.

[edit on 22-12-2006 by Benevolent Heretic]



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 01:53 PM
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I have an idea.
In the spirit of equal representation of all religions.
Lets not allow ANY book to be used during the swearing in ceremony.
Even carried on person, whether it be sworn upon, or not. no books, no religious symbols.

Or, the person being sworn in could be required to carry ALL religious books.
Even if he needs to have his or her assistants standing nearby with a full shopping cart from the local bookstore chain.



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by spacedoubt
I have an idea.
In the spirit of equal representation of all religions.
Lets not allow ANY book to be used during the swearing in ceremony.


That's the lame way schools are halfway trying to handle it. How about let it be an option to carry something and let the one who's swearing decide which book or other meaningful (to him/her) object to carry.

Oh, never mind. That's the way it is now.

What exactly is wrong with the way it is now, again???



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 02:39 PM
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By golly thats right!
IT's ridiculous, isn't it?

We'd probably be better off worrying about Ellisons past record.
It bugs me that he was a supporter of Nation of Islam back in the 90's.



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 04:16 PM
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When the official swearing in ceremony is held, each new senator or congressman can supply whatever book they want to be sworn in with....If I were elected I could use the Joy of Cooking or a porno novel if I wanted to....there are no laws other than those of good taste that would prevent me.

These people who profess to be such good Christians on here are often the ones who spout such hatred (towards Muslims, or, for that matter anyone who disagrees with them) seem blind to the irony of it all. Hatred is hatred, no matter the source and no matter who it is directed towards and is the antithesis of their master's teachings be it Muhammad or Jesus or Moses or Buddha etc.

If you do not believe me look at the travesty of the teachings of Jesus that are represented by the slaughter that is encouraged by the so called "Christian" video game based on the Left Behind series. Like them, it is obscene and its relishing of violence borders on pornography.

The poison you spew gives lie to your professions of faith and charity. In its zenophobic manifestation it is a perversion of the principles that have made America great.

IF it seems that the majority of "terrorist" attacks happen in Africa, Asia and the Middle East it is perhaps because it is those very regions that have been meddled in most often by the west and that people there feel that they have lost control of their destinies.

[edit on 22-12-2006 by grover]



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by NumberCruncher

Originally posted by forestlady

This is not true at all. The Quran in its original state does NOT enocurage that at all.



LOLLercoaster, all i can say is whatever, after all im only a proud Infidel !!


Do your OWN research people .......

Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true.

Kitman - Lying by omission.


Sura (2:225) - "Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts"

.www.usc.edu...




Islam and Politics are inseperatable, the likes of Keith Ellison in politics will be a disaster in secular western countrys as he has already proven.





Originally posted by NumberCruncher

Originally posted by forestlady

This is not true at all. The Quran in its original state does NOT enocurage that at all.



LOLLercoaster, all i can say is whatever, after all im only a proud Infidel !!


Do your OWN research people .......

Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true.

Kitman - Lying by omission.


Sura (2:225) - "Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts"

.www.usc.edu...




Islam and Politics are inseperatable, the likes of Keith Ellison in politics will be a disaster in secular western countrys as he has already proven.




WOW, that statement is a long way from "Islam encourages lying". If you take any sentence in the Bible out of its context, it can sound just as bad, especially if its in the Old Testament, which in some ways actually encourages the practice of slavery, the subjugation of women, and incest with ones' daughter, etc.

This is just more disinformation.

Signed,
A Proud goody-2-shoes Western apologist treehugger



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 05:08 PM
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The Mighty Roman Empire came to a pathetic end, because of corruption, and also the influx of paid mercenaries HIRED BY THE LAZY SENATE TO "PROTECT" THE EMPIRE. What a joke, we are heading down the same path, ie allowing Muslims to be in our senate, allowing millions of people to pour over our borders, all in the name of big money, & special interest groups. Heck, we arrest & jail our own border patrol guards for trying to stop a drug smuggler breaking our laws, & he gets off scott free. Our system is broken, & it will NOT be fixed.

Manifest destiny is playing out, and we really are pawns moved by the supreme creator to bring about His final plan. Checkmate....



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 05:11 PM
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Originally posted by forestlady

WOW, that statement is a long way from "Islam encourages lying".


I guess that particular isnt quite encouraging Lieing ( But you think and read as a Westerner), i chose that one as i quite liked it, if youd followed the link you would of found plenty.

such as ....



Qur’an 9:3 “Allah and His Messenger dissolve obligations.”

ur’an 66:1 “Allah has already sanctioned for you the dissolution of your vows.”

Ishaq:519 “Hajjaj said to the Apostle, ‘...I must tell lies.’ The Apostle said, ‘Tell them.’”

Qur’an 8:58 “If you apprehend treachery from a people with whom you have a treaty, retaliate by breaking off relations with them.”

Qur’an 8:30 “Allah is the best schemer.”

Ishaq:323 “I am the best of plotters. I deceived them with My guile so that I delivered you from them.”

Ishaq:365/Tabari VII:94 “Muhammad bin Maslamah said, ‘O Messenger, we shall have to tell lies.’ ‘Say what you like,’ Muhammad replied. ‘You are absolved, free to say whatever you must.’”

Qur’an 13:27 “Say, ‘God leads whosoever He w
ills astray.’

Bukhari:V7B67N427 “The Prophet said, ‘If I take an oath and later find something else better than that, then I do what is better and expiate my oath.’







If you take any sentence in the Bible out of its context, it can sound just as bad, especially if its in the Old Testament, which in some ways actually encourages the practice of slavery, the subjugation of women, and incest with ones' daughter, etc.



Well perhaps you should also provide proof just as youve asked of me ?
Or maybe theres double standards here ?, if someone speaks out agaisnt Islamic teachings they must provide proof, but you speak out against Christian teachings with no proof ?

Perhaps also the biggest difference is that i dont see and have never heard of Preists teaching that sort of Rubbish in Moderns times, but we could quote hundreds of Imams preaching hate and all over the Globe !

Thats before we even start on Islamic teachings that are at Odds with Western normalitys !



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 05:20 PM
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Ok. I'll admit that I am a pretty big critic of both the Christian and the Islamic faiths. However, my question is rather simple,albeit not as simple to answer directly.

Why such religious hatred? Why is it, other than history,
that Jews,Christians,Muslims and Hindus hate one another? With Jews,Christians and Islam it really makes no sense because christianity and Islam are just sister religions emerged from there parent religion Judaism. Hinduism predates,at least Christianity and Islam, so I really see why there should be conflict there, other than a difference in belief. Yet, the Muslims and Hindus fight over Kashmir like a bunch of children.

Really. Other than history, why do these religions have such conflict. While with Christianity and Islam, I think it's due to arrogance of thinking that they have "the answers." I don't understand why some of this hatred is filtering down into religions such as Hinduism.

Now, this sectarian hatred, for the lack of a better word, is even filtering down into American politics. Hell, why not turn this country into a theocracy. Then will be no better than the countries we claim to be fighting against!! Folks, we are edging towards that now.

It's all rather childish from where I stand.

[edit on 22-12-2006 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 05:24 PM
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Originally posted by OTE TruthSpeaker
allowing millions of people to pour over our borders, all in the name of big money, & special interest groups. Heck, we arrest & jail our own border patrol guards for trying to stop a drug smuggler breaking our laws, & he gets off scott free. Our system is broken, & it will NOT be fixed.

Manifest destiny is playing out, and we really are pawns moved by the supreme creator to bring about His final plan. Checkmate....


I do agree with this. If it is true we are engaged in a "war on terrorism," which I sincerely question, then why on God's green earth do our borders remain wide open? Like you, I see no one willing to try and fix it either. The Demofreaks and Republipukes certainly never will.

[edit on 22-12-2006 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 05:25 PM
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I've said it before and I'll say it again why can't we find a nice big Island for the nuts on the Muslim side and the nuts on the Jewish side, and the nuts on the Christian side and ship them all there and let them just battle it out between the Jacks, The Mohammed and the Moishes of the world and let the rest of us live in peace, instead of putting all the rest of our lives at risk for their skewed beliefs.


Numbercruncher if you are such a good Christian who's worried about being converted to Islam then you know very well what parts of the bible contain calls for slavery, incest, sacrifice of ones own children. Im Catholic and even I know about passgaes like that , where I don't need someone to quote proof of it existing.



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 05:56 PM
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The Island of Mixed nuts.
I like that Idea.

How many Square miles would it take?
I'm thinking Something a little smaller than Austrailia..
That is if we want to be all inclusive.



posted on Dec, 22 2006 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by ThePieMaN
I've said it before and I'll say it again why can't we find a nice big Island for the nuts on the Muslim side and the nuts on the Jewish side, and the nuts on the Christian side and ship them all there and let them just battle it out.........


Thats one of the few things youve written that I 100% agree with

Staged Warfare, Isnt something similar already happening ?



Numbercruncher if you are such a good Christian who's worried about being converted to Islam then you know very well what parts of the bible contain calls for slavery, incest, sacrifice of ones own children. Im Catholic and even I know about passgaes like that , where I don't need someone to quote proof of it existing.


Who said I was a Christian ? You like the previous poster have said some pretty nasty things about your own religion and still havnt proved it ! Please prove to us that your religion teaches Slavery and sacrifice of your children !

I see religion as a matter of the Heart, i dont have the need to share my beleifs with you or anybody, i know my roots and my Heritage, i wasnt Christened, I was born free of any religious deposition, I was granted the right of Choice, My passage was my choice using my own free will, unlike the Sheep of this World !

Sheep of the World i specifically mean Muslims, who are forced to beleive or be an Aposate ...... we all know where there leads within many Islamic countrys and communitys !




F is for Freedom !

Freedom of Mind
Freedom of Heart
Freedom of Choice



[edit on 22-12-2006 by NumberCruncher]




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