McVeigh's impossible change of eye color

I looked at a lot of McVeigh photos recently, comparing them to the one from the new video from prisonplanet, and noticed that in his photos from before he was arrested show his eyes as being very dark and almost black, but his photos after from Time and such show his eyes as bright blue. Eyes can lighten or darken a shade or two in rare cases, but brown/black eyes cannot change to blue eyes EVER.
The left photo is him in the military, the second is from the video, and the third is as a teenager.

Heres him as a boy.

And once again, him in prison.

I dont know about timothys eyesight but have you ever heard of contact lenses?

The problem is that you are comparing three low quality amateur photographs of goodness knows what generation and what looks like a TV screen capture to a professionally lit high quality image.

Frankly he could probably have been albino in the older images and it wouldn't have been apparent.

Babys tend to have there eye colour changing through the years of growth...

7A

posted by timeless test
Frankly he could probably have been albino in the older images and it wouldn't have been apparent.

That is a ridiculous statement and an obvious exaggeration. The photos of him as a boy and teenager are school photos, which means they're fully lit from the front which would show ANY hint of blue in his eyes. Even in the later photos where his eyes are hard to see, you can still make out the blue! And once again, eyes can change a shade or two, but black/brown eyes NEVER change to blue. And while it's certainly a possibility, why would McVeigh get blue contact lenses in jail?

Originally posted by 7Ayreon
Babys tend to have there eye colour changing through the years of growth...
7A

True. But baby's eyes tend to go from blue to brown. The melanin in the iris (particularly in children with parents of differing eye color) often takes some time to develop. Both my cildren were blue-eyed when born but gradually went to hazel and then brown.

I've never heard of a case of brown going to blue. Once the melanin is there it's there.

That is a ridiculous statement and an obvious exaggeration.

Yep, you got me there.

But now look at the last photograph you just posted which is not lit as carefully as the posed portrait although it is much better quality than the old ones - can you honestly see blue eyes in that one without blowing it up?

Originally posted by timeless test
can you honestly see blue eyes in that one without blowing it up?

I can see the blue from the little pic posted. Can't you? This is interesting. Does anyone have more photos of Timmy pre OKB?

[edit on 12/21/2006 by Griff]

Yes I can see blue eyes in it without blowing it up that's why I chose that picture, and it wouldn't matter if I had to blow it up or not because the blue is still there. In his early dark-eyed photos (especially the boy and teen ones), you can sometimes see the light reflecting off the surface of his eye which shows without a doubt that his eyes had enough lighting to show any traces of the blue if it were there.

what exactly are you trying to prove by his eye color changing?!? My dad was born with brown eyes and now his eyes are green... maybe hes a terrorist too

posted by hikix
what exactly are you trying to prove by his eye color changing?!? My dad was born with brown eyes and now his eyes are green... maybe hes a terrorist too

That comment was not well thought out. Read the whole discussion, all 1 page of it, and you will see that brown eyes cannot change to blue. I don't care about your personal experience with your dad's green/brown eyes, which is a common change. NOT BROWN TO BLUE WHICH NEVER HAPPENS. I'm trying to say that the McVeigh from before being arrested could possibly be a different person.

I looked at these pictures, and looked... and looked... This is what I'm seeing, and someone already posted it here.

Low Quality vs. High Quality.

The pictures you show of his "black eyes" are low quality. They are, look at the rest of his face, the coloration is not nearly as detailed as his "glamour shot."

First picture of him in the military, you can't even see a color difference from where his lower lip becomes his chin. It's not doing a good job on color, and if it was a quality frontal shot with good lighting, you should be able to see that, imo.

Second picture, the color isn't correct anywhere, it looks like a crappy webcam picture. Can't guage any colors from that, though in my opinion, his eyes don't look so "black," but I don't think it's a good picture anyway.

Third picture on far right, look at his cheeks and his nose, the quality is poor. It looks like a scanner took it in at a low resolution.

Him as a boy, from a picture taken on what looks to be a CRT screen, lines going across everything, not buying it.

"Glamour shot photo" he looks perfect. Excellent lighting, professionally done, bad positioning of his face, his head looks messed up, yet this isn't the point. This is an excellent high quality photo. In the highest quality photo, his eyes are blue.

So which picture would I believe, amateur photos, or a well done high quality one? Would I believe Mama Rosa in her Manhattan apartment with a fly on her lens for a 9/11 photo, or a picture taken by an AP photographer with the right equipment and knowledge to get things done? The answer seems pretty simple. You also make it sound rare that eye pigmentation changes, your "rare" is about 15% from what I recall from high school. That isn't necessarily from "black" to blue, but I don't think these pictures prove they were black in the first place.




BTW, no where did you pull any scientific proof that brown can't go blue, so I don't think you should be knocking anyone else that is bringing in their personal experiences to share in this thread. The fact that you say you don't even care about the other member's personal experience gives me the idea that you are so glued to your theory that you would argue this even if I brought down hours of research to prove you incorrect.

and considering that in the boyhood pic, there are parts wehre the blue part of the flag dont even look blue...may be kind of telling

Originally posted by Trauma

I'm trying to say that the McVeigh from before being arrested could possibly be a different person.

Okay, but why? And where is the real Timothy McVeigh? And better still, who is this guy then (The one in prison)?

I do see the differences you are talking about, btw. But I also see where the other posters are saying that it could be due to quality differences in the different pictures.

I think the photos are very clear on brown eyes in two of the younger pics, and clearly light blue in the jail pic.

At the very least it would be worth further investigation, like what his original drivers license issued as eye color and maybe old health records or something that would identify the color of his eyes as a child.

Good find

So I was eating an awesome pizza, and I thought of something...

Kid Rock when young, and under arrest:



Hmm... "black" eyes.

Now lets look at him as an adult:



Now his eyes are blue, in a visible, high-quality photo.

This does not prove that there is another "Kid Rock" doing rock concerts. This does not prove that there never was a "Kid Rock" in the first place. It proves nothing except that Alex Jones was making an issue of the colorations of someone's eyes based upon two different "eras" of photography, and comparing them as though they were the same.

True point made by showing the kid rock photos, only thing I would say in response is that in Kid Rock's police photo there is a white light in the pupil area which is comman with blue eyes to reflect back the flash as white or even red color in the picture. I didn't notice the light pupil reflection in the childhood photos of MeVeigh.

Originally posted by interestedalways
I didn't notice the light pupil reflection in the childhood photos of MeVeigh.

Ah good point, I will look for some others to see if I find the same thing. This just hit me off the top of my head, I am sure there are many others with "embarassing" high school photos that are now stars, that we can use for a reference.

Originally posted by niteboy82


I am sure there are many others with "embarassing" high school photos that are now stars, that we can use for a reference.

We could have some fun with this one!

Originally posted by Mechanic 32
Okay, but why? And where is the real Timothy McVeigh? And better still, who is this guy then (The one in prison)?

McVeigh is dead:

McVeigh's death sentence was delayed pending an appeal. One of his appeals was taken to the Supreme Court of the United States, which denied certiorari on March 8, 1999. He was ultimately executed by lethal injection at 7:14 a.m. on June 11, 2001, at the U.S. Federal Penitentiary in Terre Haute, Indiana. He had dropped all of his existing appeals, while presenting no reason for doing so. He was 33 years old.

McVeigh invited California conductor/composer David Woodard to perform a 'prequiem' (a Mass for those who are about to die) on the eve of his execution, and he had also requested a Catholic chaplain. Ave Atque Vale was performed under Woodard's baton by a local brass choir at St. Margaret Mary Church, located near the Terre Haute penitentiary, at 7:00 p.m. on June 10, to an audience that included the entirety of the next morning's witnesses. McVeigh chose William Ernest Henley's poem "Invictus" as his final statement. His final meal consisted of two pints of Ben and Jerry's mint chocolate chip ice cream. McVeigh's execution was the first of a convicted criminal by the U.S. federal government since the execution of Victor Feguer in Iowa on March 15, 1963.

His body was disposed of by cremation in the retort at Mattox Ryan Funeral home in Terre Haute under the direction of funeral director Kevin Nickles. The cremated remains were then given to his lawyer for disposition. McVeigh's remains were scattered in an undisclosed location.

en.wikipedia.org...

[edit on 2006/12/21 by GradyPhilpott]