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Project Bluebeam and What ATS Cannot Become

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posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 11:24 AM
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Information can come through a variety of avenues. The easiest ones are documented and auditable. But those, then, are largely public record and Wikipedia is your new ATS. We discuss some pretty outlandish things here and the vast majority is going to end-up being bad speculation, egregious misinterpretation or outright hoaxes. It’s extremely easy to jump on the OP-bashing bandwagon --- odds will always be in your favor. Every March up here in the Northeast hope would spring eternal as the Red Sox started Spring Training. Before their cleats were even laced a chorus of bombastic ‘experts’ would start saying they don’t have a shot at the Series. Come September these same experts --- irrespective of what the Sox’ record and performance was at the time --- would be yelling the same things, “They’ll blow it”, “They’ll come un-glued… it’s September”. And they were always right and would feel quite smug because their perennial prognostications were always dead-on... Until 2004.

For the kinds of conspiracies and issues on which we focus here at ATS it is highly unlikely that someone is going to get access to a secret file cabinet or vault and be able to upload color-glossy 8x10’s with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back explaining what each one was. I’m in my mid-50’s and have been trained in the sciences. I make my living doing statistical analytics. In the course of my lifetime, well-placed individuals with unimpeachable credibility have told me things that completely contradict ‘official’ information. My father was attached to military communications and intelligence operations during WWII and after. He was a stable, sane, sober man of the highest ethical caliber right up to his death. Had he told me something along the lines of what D4rkKn1ght was discussing I would have believed him. Now it would be entirely possible that he had heard/seen/read something that he had misinterpreted but knowing him I would have a strong sense of how much weight to give the information. Proof? None needed.

My point is this: ATS is an intelligence-gathering community and clearinghouse of sorts. While I agree with crijack that posters who knowingly post false information or initiate hoaxes should be burned at the stake, it’s important that we do not discourage people from posting information they receive that has potential significance. If the information is legitimate, corroborating pieces will no doubt surface in time. If not, it will die. I did not and am not taking a position either way regarding the D4rkKn1ght thread. However, his information was not unprecedented. Much of what he provided correlates closely with the stories about Project Blue Beam and the well publicized warnings of Wernher Von Braun going as far back as the 1970’s. If ATS becomes a place where people are afraid to post information because they fear being ridiculed if they cannot offer concrete ‘proof’ then our mission has failed. I for one would rather encourage ATSers to post information they learn if they believe it could be important. So often, tiny bits of information seem meaningless on their own but take on significant stature when combined with other apparently meaningless bits. The ATS community is widespread and collectively has millions of outside connections. If something BIG of any kind is in-the-works at any time we have an opportunity to expose it. But only if people feel free to share what they know.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Removed username from title
and removed personal comments




[edit on 11/12/06 by masqua]

[edit on 11/12/06 by masqua]




posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 11:44 AM
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Well put...what more can be said.

Thanks for the time and effort you put into posting this, again your points are pretty well laid out.

Peace

Dalen



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 11:47 AM
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Caveat emptor

Nice post jtma508,

I think all members of ATS would do well to remember the time honored saying of Caveat emptor (Buyer Beware) because we are all to a certain degree asked to buy into certain theories or ideas without any evidence what so ever. But that is precisely what makes ATS such a great place. No one has to believe anything that is posted on this site and certainly some people do deliberately post false information.

Responding to information you do not agree with, with ad hominem attacks is just as bad in my opinion as knowingly posting false information. I find it disturbing that certain members feel the need to attack the messenger and not the message when they don't happen agree with or believe in what is being discussed.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 12:04 PM
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You have voted jtma508 for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.


D4rk KN1GHT had started another thread (since trashed) that I had commented on. In addressing DK, my point was that you can't get too tweaked about being slammed in a thread. If you're sincere and honest, what does it matter what other people think? And when you're posting anonymously, how do you take anything "personally" from people who don't know you personally? So you have this Earth-shaking life changing revelation but you're going to take your ball and go home if everyone doesn't roll over for you? What about the ones who are being respectful and attentive? You blow them off because someone else isn't being nice-nice?

I absolutely agree we shouldn't be too quick to jump on a contributor, but if you're going to post things of that nature and magnitude, you have to be extremely naive to think you're not going to catch some flak. And how do you expect to fight the power if you can't take a little forum grief?



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 01:08 PM
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Thanks for the WATS yeahright. My OP was significantly edited by the mods. It was originally intended to address the DK post and subsequent mayhem as well as a later post by an ATSer attacking DK. I don't think DK folded his tent because of the attacks as much as because of the utter derailment of the thread. I just don't want to see ATS devolve into that. As i said (and have said before) ATS presents an unprecedented ability to collect and share intelligence information that could someday be vitally important for all of us.

Thanks again.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 03:13 PM
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"I absolutely agree we shouldn't be too quick to jump on a contributor, but if you're going to post things of that nature and magnitude, you have to be extremely naive to think you're not going to catch some flak. And how do you expect to fight the power if you can't take a little forum grief?"


FORUM GRIEF? how about being called a liar / hoaxer / crack head / idoit every time you opend a u2u? how about deleteing most of them but keeping one that calls me both full of # and a coward? for me, the worst of all those that stated that I was a coward - That hurt after having a long hard think about it AND after stating that I was going to step out, contact a moderator of this site, and let them meet me and the wife and hearing it all from start to finish? The mod was also going to get a complete low down on the wifes family back ground, and my own - This was at my time and my expense so they could say wether they thought after a face to face I was genuine or not - No, i can cope with some grief, but not out right nastiness because i moved some thing from the personal areana to the public ie My plans and the time scale involved.


No sorry, i can take it, but having a thread closed because people tried their hardest to derail / detour / flame the thread made me feel very very sad indeed.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght

FORUM GRIEF? how about being called a liar / hoaxer / crack head / idoit every time you opend a u2u? how about deleteing most of them but keeping one that calls me both full of # and a coward? for me, the worst of all those that stated that I was a coward


Well, that certainly is a shame, I agree. But it is what it is and that's what I'd call "Forum Grief". 1- It's directed at a cyber-identity 2- Given the situation, I'd expect some of that 3- You know it to be untrue so blow it off.

I'm glad you're still hanging around, and I'm most interested in seeing whatever you have to write on this topic. And I sincerely hope you won't let the petty insults of a few limit your participation for those of us who seriously want to know what you have to say.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 03:44 PM
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FORUM GRIEF? how about being called a liar / hoaxer / crack head / idoit every time you opend a u2u? how about deleteing most of them but keeping one that calls me both full of # and a coward?


Im going to play armchair psychiatrist here.

I think the one of reason some of the posters reacted in that manor is what you did and said scared them. They know that if there is any truth to what you are saying they themselves might have to do something similar and they cannot deal with that so they lash out at the messenger.

One of the first emotions of anyone when confronted with an uncomfortable idea that could change their world view is denial and anger. So what transpired on the thread should really not be unexpected. I know that does not make it right but its the classic human reaction to the unknown.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 03:56 PM
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Okay! Now I am burning with curiosity! I have no idea what was posted on that thread but I am almost unable to contain my curiosity. Where can I read the thread. I am mainly interested in what Dark Knight has posted. (I know I didn't spell the handle correctly) If the thread can still be read can provide a link please?



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:02 PM
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Here.

www.abovetopsecret.com...'


Its closed now, and those who I got time for can u2u me any questions. I'll answer all polite civil u2u's (even if you don't believe, thats fine, I will still answer POLITE u2u's. All rude / very rude ones go straight to asala to deal with)



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:05 PM
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Seeing as how I was one being accused of derailing the thread, I would also like to comment about this. I have no problem with being open minded and up till then never even paid attention to any prophetic threads. I have been here a while and if you knew me better you would know that I am very open minded, but have begun to see the effects of what I first thought was innocent speculation. After seeing several memebers come and go after making extreme claims it does several things. One it makes those that really believe the story very disgruntled afterward when they are proven false. Two, it causes others to worry needlessly, and three someone might actually believe enough to alter their lives based on this story.

After reading the opening post and seeing similar patterns of withholding more information in the DK thread it was clear to me that it was another one of “those” threads. So I made comments and said what I thought, which I would not consider to be rude or derailing, and for the record I never sent any of those u2u’s. I did no name-calling, and used reason to make my point. I would have only posted one or two comments if it weren’t for others who started accusing me of derailing the thread.

I would recommend that if you want to continue your discussion, you can ask that it be re-opened or start a new one. Also, I recommend sending any nasty u2u’s to a mod or put in a complaint. I think you should keep in mind though that if you truly believed what you are posting, then you should state that it is “your belief”, or “your opinion”. If you are making it all up and continue knowing that what you are saying might cause undue grief to other members, then that is something you will have to live with.

Regards, Hal



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:05 PM
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Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght
Here.

www.abovetopsecret.com...




Removed the ' that's the link



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:09 PM
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Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght
Here.

www.abovetopsecret.com...'


Its closed now, and those who I got time for can u2u me any questions. I'll answer all polite civil u2u's (even if you don't believe, thats fine, I will still answer POLITE u2u's. All rude / very rude ones go straight to asala to deal with)


Thanks! D4rk Kn1ght. I'm going to see if I can access it. I really don't like it when information is forced out of reach by loud mouthed trolls. It becomes a form of censorship when that is allowed to happen.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:11 PM
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Hal9000.

No, I can say 100%, that A) I was prepped for a mod to come to my home town and get the full low down on me and my wife, and B) a strange web page was brought to my attention from 2001. A man, who is a major major player in the satellite communications world both civ and military, is known as dark knight. Now, I would try and find out more, but, at the minute im busy planning an earlier exit, ala 2008.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:31 PM
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Well said jtma508, you've made points that a lot of us think about but never really said as straight up as this. It's a shame what happened to the D4rk Kn1ght thread in question and I can see what you mean about not wanting ATS to go that way.

I'll second you on saying that no one should be discouraged from posting their thoughts, especially not because of small minded flamers



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:40 PM
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We definitely don't need people causing threads to turn out that way just because they either freak out because of the info or just don't agree with it, and start attacking the OP. ATS is in my opinion the best place to learn or discuss just about anything. There are many people here that are very knowledgeable and many who are open minded and willing to help out in any way they can.

As far as project blue beam goes: if there is indeed something like this (which i feel there very well could be) then i believe that millions of people may lose it, but it is up to us that are not afraid to restore their composure, to show them that there is nothing to fear. I know that there are many many people just like me, that in any type of situation like this will remain calm and help the rest of the people. If something like this happened, and the governments tried to take complete control of everything, it wouldn't be allowed, too many of us are not willing to let them have that power.

More and more people everyday are waking up from their propaganda induced coma, and more and more people are seeing just how powerful love is.

D4rk Kn1ght, I know it took a lot for you to come out and say what you said, and I am very appreciative that you did so. There is nothing to worry about though, no matter what anybody does to our bodies, they can not touch our souls. We are here to learn, here to help others learn, this is only a small part of what our existence is. Our bodies are not permanent, and they are more like containers, and at times they are even like prisons. Just remember that fear enslaves, love liberates, and we shall fight with peace and love with light as our guide.

ATS is awesome, and I would really hate to see it become full of attackers. We can be more constructive people, not attacking, but perhaps questioning. We attack things when we are afraid, once we are no longer afraid, then we will all be much happier together.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 04:49 PM
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JT,

I have been reading about blue beam as you asked... and I don't know what to say really.. I'm kind of stumped and speechless.

Whats bothered me really is the sheer manipulation, and the reality that if you was far enough away from major civ centres they wouldn't bother to beam stuff in your direction, and then you could possibly observe the effects being beamed in...i don't know, im not that ckued up about that type of stuff..

Reading more is deffo required.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 05:04 PM
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D4rk Kn1ght,

I sense your concern for people. I did not read the whole thread but I read your earliest posts as I was interested to know what may have upset some people so much that they would attack you, not only on the thread but even through u2us. I can see where some of them must have become frightened by your warning. But that does not justify attacking you maliciously. There really isn't much that can be done when you offer help to people in the form of warnings and they spit at you for doing so. You must keep in mind though that many people read and heed the warnings and those are the ones that justify your post. When you have helpful information to share, even if only ONE person reads and benefits from that info, while everyone else may scoff, that one person is more than enough justification for offering the information you have.

You did your part. You told us what you know. Now, it is up to those who receive your warning to heed them or not. But now your mind can rest easy, because if and when the apocalyptic events that you have warned us about take place, should many people perish, at least you know that it wasn't because you did not warn them. And if people are able to survive by having been forewarned and forearmed, then you have the satisfaction of knowing that you had a part in their survival. Time will tell. I have to admit though, the signs do seem to indicate that many of the calamitous events foretold in the Bible have begun, and your warning resonates perfectly with that.



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 05:07 PM
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Ok, what is Project Blue Beam, and where can I find info on it ?

Lex



posted on Dec, 11 2006 @ 05:09 PM
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I'm reaching here a little bit but in the theme of the original post and a possible Project Blue Beam link here are two sites that are talking about an event in the 1960's when a satellite not launched by the then nascent USSR and US space programs suddenly appeared in Polar orbit. It was named The Black Knight:

Black Knight

Black Knight #2



[edit on 11-12-2006 by jtma508]



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