UK vice murders(5 bodies found)

Ok i really did not think about posting this when it first happened, then they found a 2nd body and i thought eish serial killer, Today they have found a 3rd body!

All the murders have been on vice girls the youngest so far being 19,.

whats worrying is that all these have happened within a month?

Is that not even odd in serial killer terms? don't they normally at least wait a longish time?


All of this has happened in Suffolk here in England,

here is the full story so far

news.sky.com...


Also what jogged my mind a little was there not a similar happening in the US not so long ago?



[edit on 10-12-2006 by asala]

[edit on 12-12-2006 by asala]

Is this what you are refering to asala?

www.amnestyusa.org...

Actually these murders are on the USA/Mexico border.

It seems that Prostitutes are fair game for sick people, regardless of country.

Serial killers don't have to wait a "longish" time - they can be prolific in a short time as well as a longer period. Serial killing is simply a term to describe someone who kills, "cools off" or returns to normal life, kills again, and the sequence of "kill/cool" cycle repeats. Depending upon stressors that trigger a killing, the killings can come more frequently. The key in serial killing investigation is not the frequency, but the "signature" of the killer - the one thing that is intrinsically linked to his fantasies that cannot be changed for "fulfillment" of the fantasy to occur. That's the key - if something is there that indicates a signature, then it is likely that the same person did the crimes. And often, we (the public) will not know the signature, as that is a key piece of evidence that will be withheld so false confessors can be rooted out.

As for the victims being prostitutes, they are indeed more often victimized than other catagories of people. Prostitutes are more easily brought into a situation (it's their livelihood), will enter a car/vehicle more easily; they are not likely to be as quickly missed as someone else; more often they are runaways without lots of familial contact; and other such situations that occur to someone who is a prostitute rather than another catagory of women.

And lastly, I believe the OP was referring to the Atlantic City serial killings, wherein 4 women were found murdered with a particular (unreleased) signature. However, with the understanding that more than 200 serial killers operating in the world at any given time (according to some old statistics from the FBI, iirc) (while others say about 50), and with prostitutes being the "preferred" victim for various reasons, it may be that there are some operating on the Mexican/American border, as well.

Regards-
Aimless

something similar happened in coquitlam. robert pickton picked up hookers from vancouver and ground them up and fed them to his pigs.
www.missingpeople.net...

theres also a similar thing happening on a highway close to my town, highway 16 or the highway of tears. someone picks up aboriginal girls. they've only found a few bodies.
[qoute]
Highway of Tears
As the result of a the effect on the community of a series of murders that have happened in the vicinity of Highway 16, the route has gained an unfortunate nickname as the Highway of Tears.

As the result of a symposium held in Prince George in March 2006, aboriginal Canadians along the route are advocating better rural bus service that would help reduce the number of young native women hitchhiking. In addition, spurred on by native leaders, the RCMP is officially investigating the unsolved murder or disappearance of nine women between the ages of 14 and 25 since 1974, most of whom were hitchhiking along Highway 16
[/qoute]
en.wikipedia.org...

this happens everywhere, no shortage of psychos.

This morning the news are reporting a 4th women is now missing!

Im not sure but it seems the more coverage this man is getting the more he is killing?


This is awfull, and i hope the police do all they can t get this women of the street,

news.sky.com...

There's a fifth woman missing now according to Sky News.

wow this is getting big, and with the holiday season here and many young girls going out *Shivers*

theres a £50.000 reward now,

It's crazy.

I just finished a short introductory course on forensic psychology and offender profiling. I'm trying to find as much info on this case as possible to build up my own profile on the killer from what I've learnt.

oh this is terrible 2 more bodies have been found !

They need to catch this man so quick

news.sky.com...

poor poor women

A woodland area around the village of Levington, near Ipswich, in Suffolk has been sealed off by officers.

Police said it is likely the two bodies are those of two missing women - Paula Clennell and Annette Nicholls.

The area is close to where the body of Anneli Alderton was found on Sunday. The bodies of Gemma Adams, and Tania Nicol, were also found near Ipswich.

From what i have heard these last two where found due to a possible tip off,

I hope they are going to pull in more help now,

news.bbc.co.uk...


All the bodies so far have been found naked, this seems to be the killers stamp,

[edit on 12-12-2006 by asala]

I live in Ipswich & this is crazy....

The 1st 2 went missing around 5 weeks ago, so this has to a degree been on going.

The 3rd victim found at the weekend was not even known to be missing....

Someone in the other thread mentioned that the killer seems to be increasing his kill rate with the media attention, this may be true.

The latest 2 victims were found late this afternoon. If as suspected one of these is Paula Clennel, she was last seen on late Saturda/early sunday morning.

This is well within the time that a major police murder investigation was under way & when a heavy police presence was in & around the red light small red light district of Ipswich.

Seems that he is bold in his ambitions to kill, of course although the number of prostitutes on the streets has reduced, there are still some who continue to work to feed their drug habit, despite the dangers.

Elohim2007

Thanks for your input elohim2007, I hope we can here more of whats going on and i really hope that nop more happen,

most of all stay safe yourself, as nobody knows whenn this killers thoughts will change,


I cant imagin what it must feel like there at the moment, !

FYI - Another thread was started on this topic: Another Jack the Ripper? (now closed).
.

Let's hope he's caught soon. It's not so unusual for serial killers to not sexually assault the victims. Often the brutality and exercising the power over life and death is what arouses them and not the sex act.

I don't see why there's a comparison to Jack the Ripper in this case, since all serial killers tend to prey on prostitutes.

Murders commited by strangers are the hardest ones to solve.

I once watched a talk show that featured women who had survived assaults by serial killers. The FBI had assembled them in order to ascertain what it was they did that allowed them to survive.

One young girl had been picked up as she walked home from her late night job at a convenience store. He had held her for 3 or 4 days before she had the tenacity and psychological insight to barter her own release.

He apparently was sick of his compulsive killing spree and agreed.

The audience accused her of being a whore.

These sick creeps are all over. Here in Washington state we recently had two The Green River Killer (a completely evil person), and Yates. Both targeted hookers because they like killing because of the power it gives them or at least the sense of power. That seems to be the motive behind many serial killers. Serial killers usually target victims who are vulnerable; such as hookers or young girls who are alone.

There are ways that ladies can help themselves. First of all safety in numbers and walk tall and confident. I don't know the laws in England but capstun is a good means of self defense. This may sound strange but lemon juice also is a good thing to use. Here in the US you can buy lemon juice in lemon shaped plastic containers which you can squeeze and squirt it out. Lemon juice in the eyes will cause intense pain and watering giving you time to get away. Worst case drive the heel of your palm into the tip of the nose as hard as you can. You will cause damage and intense pain once again giving you time to get away.

Just some ideas. If you live in the area please be safe and careful.

All the bodies so far have been found naked, this seems to be the killers stamp,

Might be, but then again, it might not be. Naked victims are not uncommon; the forensic evidence which can cling to clothing is immense, and thus we've had serial killers who strip their victims to remove evidence. Also consider the mentality of a naked person. People who are stripped bare have been done so usually to prevent an escape attempt; furthermore, it's a degradation technique used by people in power to break down a victim (Abu Garhib prison scandal comes to mind).

Because there are other reasons to strip someone, I'd venture to say this might not be his signature; rather, it's a bit of evidence and definitely links the murders, but isn't the immutable part of the fantasy (in other words, it could change should the need arise and not affect the satisfaction the killer receives from the abduction/murder).

Someone (either on this thread or the other one now closed) mentioned that he had to be reaching the end of his ability to function because the murders are coming close together. I don't know that this is a good assumption. While I most certainly do hope he is becoming disorganized and sloppy as that will allow the police to catch him that much quicker, I would also consider the possibility that he is in fact playing with the police - "see, I can kill two even while your eyes and ears are peeled for me. I'm better than you, smarter than you, and I can do this right under your nose!" sort of thing. That is something other serial killers have done - John Wayne Gacy, Andrew Cunanan (although I put him into the spree killing catagory; others disagree), Wayne Williams, the Hillside Stranglers (Buono and Bianchi) to name just a few.

There seems to be interplay between the police and the killer, inasmuch as the more they hunt, the more he hunts. I'd also be willing to bet they have either already spoken with him, or someone has tipped them to his name but he's managed to not become a suspect. This happens with relative frequency, Ted Bundy being one who was on 4 lists of possible suspects in Washington before he was arrested in a different state (Utah).

And lastly (at least for now...) there is the possibility that he is imitating Jack The Ripper, up to and including the names of his victims (there are some significant similarities between Nichols, a Ripper victim, and the names of two of this guy's victims - I believe "Polly" and "Nichol" were the connections I read). While the locations are different, the similarities might amount to something (prostitutes, narrow location of body recoveries, et cetera). Not sure what, exactly, but something. Then again, maybe it is just co-incidence. If not, it speaks to a prior knowledge of these women inasmuch as names were known...and that speaks to less "stranger" murder than acquaintance murder. And that might be an important lead to follow.

I am positive that the Ipswich police are doing everything in their power to apprehend this evil scum...and in the meantime, my prayers are with all who this has affected, townspeople and family alike. It's a horrible thing to have to live through.

Regards-
Aimless

They are now warning other nearby towns to be on their guard, the heavy police presence in Ipswich may make the killer go further afield on the hunt for victims. Then again when you think this is the UK and most places are only a few hours drive from each other, maybe every town should be on guard. This is a terrible and tragic series of events.

Originally posted by clearwater
I once watched a talk show that featured women who had survived assaults by serial killers. The FBI had assembled them in order to ascertain what it was they did that allowed them to survive.

One young girl had been picked up as she walked home from her late night job at a convenience store. He had held her for 3 or 4 days before she had the tenacity and psychological insight to barter her own release.

He apparently was sick of his compulsive killing spree and agreed.

The audience accused her of being a whore.

This sickening example of mob psychology is, to me, almost more distressing than the appalling acts of a lone serial killer. Yes, no-one died, but the girl in the programme should have been congratulated for her intelligence and persistence.

I hope they get the Ipswich guy soon, and put him away forever.

it was me on the other post saying the escalation suggests he may be out of control. The speed and frequency of the killings is pretty unprecedented, I think even the nightstalker ramirez cooled off for longer periods. Plus this really is a tiny area of about 10 mile square. The fact he took one of the latest vics at the weekend only a few days after she was interviewed on TV - that's a close call, recklessness driven by compulsion or super-arrogance. I think it's highly likely he will be caught imminently or rather the police will know who they are after. CCTV alone should provide a workable shortlist as there are really only one or two main roads that could have been used to dump the bodies and these are CCTV'd up.

And it's not just Ipswich one of the 5 was a working girl from Colchester which is a town with a vast army background and a lot more working girls than Ipswich. If this nut is going to keep on going then it will be next to impossible to operate within ipswich environs.

The Juarez mexico border killings are thought to be an organised ring I believe. A kind of torture, rape, murder club rather than a serial killer per se.

Originally posted by asala


From what i have heard these last two where found due to a possible tip off,

Thats what I heard too..Well the first body anyway. The second was spotted by police helicopter combing the area.
On a news bulletin either SKY, BBC or ITV a local was questioned by a reporter. He claimed that the police had still been in the area where the bodies were found. Because of the body of Anneli Alderton being found close by.
The area where these 2 bodies had been found had already been searched/combed by police following the discovery of Anneli's body.
This guy is very brave and I think this is a middle finger to the police.
I think eyewitness accounts are very important because the police are not going to disclose anything..Very little anyway!
Certainly not anything like this that makes them look inadequate or incompetent..I am not saying they are because serial killers are shrewd and calculated and have evaded the best in the past but a panicked general public will think so.
It shows his confidence and egotism though. To abduct in a highly policed area and then dump in a highly policed area.

it could simply be he only has local knowledge of such a small area.

The first two bodies were dumped in water, making them less easy to lift evidence from. These latest ones were not and also left close to the road. Clearly he wants them to be found.

A member of public saw the body from the roadside and when the chopper went up to film it they saw the other body from the air.

Killers do return to the sites of the murder or to the bodies. That Australian backpacker killer (or it was two brothers I think) they did that kind of thing repeatedly.

I saw a newspaper headline late last night saying he stored the bodies before dumping them but didn't catch the name of the newspaper. I've not seen anything about that elsewhere... ?? Oh it was the Sun, and it doesn't say much

[edit on 13-12-2006 by kickoutthejams]