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Daniel 12: are we near the end?

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posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 01:23 PM
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I have always found the whole verse of Daniel 12: to be interesting, especially the part where the angel said that at the time of the end knowledge shall be greatly increased and men shall run to and fro.

Never in human history has there been a kowledge explosion like there was in the 20th century.

We went from not even having cars in the early 1900s, to flying to the moon just a short 60 years later, i could not even imagine the changes the people in that generation lived through.

Life had always pretty much been the same until this knowledge explosion in the 20th century.

Now we have technology, there has never been a time in history like there is now, this brings me back to the verse of Daniel:



1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river.

6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?

9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.

10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.


So are we closer to the end than any other generation before us? I believe that answer to be yes.

I want to know what everyones thought are on verse 4, so please share your opinions.






[edit on 4-12-2006 by thehumbleone]




posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 02:17 PM
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Well,it certainly does seem to be somewhat indicative of present days and times. Every decade knowledge increases about ten-fold. The official line is that humanity is smarter now than at any other time in history.. That's a question of debate,but it would seem to me that we are certainly more knowledgeable than what we were 200 or 300 years ago.

I have been saying that we are approaching the "end times" quite aggresively. Man has just about reached its allowed, in my opinion, pinnacle. I mean look!! Science is talking about cloning!! To my mind, without getting into the pros and cons of the whole issue, that's like trying to play God. :shk:

Daniel 12, and the whole book of Daniel for that matter, is quite intriguing because it gives us an idea of what to look for when it comes to the one world dictator. It plainly states that the one world dictator or the anti-Christ will be "a king with a fierce countenance." Now one is persuaded,and some have, to suggest that this very well could have been a prophecy about Hitler. If so, why did he fail?

Many will argue that he failed because that's what the bible says the anti-Christ will ultimately do, fail. Yeah, but shouldn't things be a lot better now than what they are if all of this has already come to pass. Or are our hopes just too high?



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 03:02 PM
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You could also say that during the time of Hitler, the state of Israel did not exist, so it couldn't have been him.

Remember, the antichrist will rebuild the temple and declare himself god in it, this was impossoble for hitler at the time.

I also wanted to add that i find it interesting how he says men will run to and fro, just look at today and how often and far we travel. Nowadays we can travel all over the world with the airplane.

If you lived before there were cars or trains, you more than likely wouldn't travel more than 20 miles from your home.




[edit on 4-12-2006 by thehumbleone]

[edit on 4-12-2006 by thehumbleone]



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 06:52 PM
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i was wondering

how can you reconcile bible prophecy with free will?

if it's a true prophecy that will come to pass, then does that not mean it is an inhibition of our free will?

why can we not stop the end times?



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 06:57 PM
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Madness,I personally think we can. I just don't think that we are very likely to. :shk:

I personally don't think that anything, if free will is indeed true which I am not 100% it is, is cast in stone. However, you have to remember that God already knows what path humanity is going to take. So, there is no real question in God's eyes. Now,the real question that I have about biblical prophecy is the severity of it. I have discussed this many times on other threads so I won't go into it here. All I will say is that I think that most people have wild imaginations when they think about what the "end times" are going to be like.



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 07:02 PM
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speaker, how can you have free will if said omniscient diety already knows what we're going to do, do we actually have a choice?



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 12:39 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
speaker, how can you have free will if said omniscient diety already knows what we're going to do, do we actually have a choice?


Like I said,"free will" is a concept that I do indeed question. There have been times when I have leaned towards there not being a such of thing as "free will."



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 01:38 PM
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here is what i believe, i believe we have free will cause the bible says we do, but God is so smart he already knows what path us humans are gonna choose.

He already warned us a million times that we would destroy ourselves and we still do not learn, if we one day blow ourselves up, it will not be God's fault, we have already been warned by him, looks like God knows us better than we know ourselves.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 01:42 PM
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@ Humble

The bible does not explicitly say that we have "free will." It implies that in some spots,but no where does it explicitly state that. No where.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 03:27 PM
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We do have free will and a choice!

Just because God already knows our destiny it doesn't mean he is laying it out for us. He already knows who will turn away from Him and although He could change that, He doesn't. Don't you think it would be easier to make people follow Him than go thru the sacrifice of His Son?

If there were no free will then there would not be any options in the Bible. One evidence is the fact that people repent throughout the Bible. Another biggie is satan! Think about it.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 04:21 PM
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I feel as if everything I do and everything I say was meant to be done or said after it has been said/done. Immediately afterward, i'll get a feeling when i think about it, that somehow all my actions, words, decisions, my entire life, could be unfolded and presented to someone, even myself, despite the future having-not occured yet.

I guess I am crazy. But that feeling, it feels quite real. Especially if im in a psuedo-concious spiritual state of being..

How could Jesus be God's genetic son if God does not have human dna, a penis, or sperm? Furthermore, does not procreate in a sexual manner?

Right right.. he 'creates'. So he created him right there in the womb of Mary. Okay, fair enough. But does that not make him FROM God, a gift from, a divine prophet of God, but a son of God, in the literal context? That is something that makes no sense and never shall, and so many blindly equate Jesus with God. They are not literally the same being!! Jesus and God are different just as you or I and God are different. Granted Jesus was divine, he was more than you or I, but still not God himself.

[edit on 12/5/2006 by runetang]

[edit on 12/5/2006 by runetang]



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 04:34 PM
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Jesus is God incarnate, God is the Father, Son , and Holy spirit, 3 seperate, yet somehow one, i know it's tough to understand and i will probably never fully understand it myself.

But isn't that the beauty of it? what would God be if he was something we could easily define? he is above us



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 04:39 PM
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thehumbleone, do you believe that we could ever possibly prevent the end of the world?

is it your belief that it must come to pass?



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 04:48 PM
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I believe it is possible, but with the way humans act, it seems very unlikely.

I believe God gave us these prophecies to show us what direction we are headed in, and possibly be able to prevent it, but it seems most of us have taken no heed to do anything about it.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 04:53 PM
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Originally posted by thehumbleone


I believe God gave us these prophecies to show us what direction we are headed in, and possibly be able to prevent it, but it seems most of us have taken no heed to do anything about it.


Humble,
I agree... However, I, like you, am not very optimistic about the path that humanity seems to be taking. Of course, you know the old saying,"It ain't over till the fat lady sings." Well, she isn't singing yet,but she sure does seem to be warming up her vocal chords.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 06:25 PM
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Originally posted by thehumbleone
Jesus is God incarnate, God is the Father, Son , and Holy spirit, 3 seperate, yet somehow one, i know it's tough to understand and i will probably never fully understand it myself.


That is Catholic doctrine and I do not agree with it, nor did my soul or its pre-form from the moment of Catholicism's foundation in Rome in the early centuries after the death of Yeshua.

The trinity idea is just .. bleh. by golly is an abomination of desolation!! or sumthin..

[edit on 12/5/2006 by runetang]



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 06:29 PM
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Runetang,I thought the Catholics idea of the Trinity was that they were all separate? I thought the idea that they were all one and the same was unitarian? Am I wrong?



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 07:47 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Runetang,I thought the Catholics idea of the Trinity was that they were all separate? I thought the idea that they were all one and the same was unitarian? Am I wrong?


the catholic idea is that of classic 3 in 1 in 3 trinitarians
they're just like any other trinitarians
but you are right about the unitarians



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 07:50 PM
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What? you guys don't even know what you are saying, i'm catholic and we believe the same thing as any other christian, the father,son,holy spirit are all the same ONE God.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 08:05 PM
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Originally posted by thehumbleone
What? you guys don't even know what you are saying, i'm catholic and we believe the same thing as any other christian, the father,son,holy spirit are all the same ONE God.


actually, unitarians do not believe there is a father, son, and holy spirit, they just believe in GOD
not in a 3 in 1 beling, a 1 in 1 being
or am i mistaken?
any unitarians here to help me out?




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