Originally posted by chissler
Their vehicle was struck with an egg, firing a weapon in retaliation is unjustified.

No doubt, but the other side of the coin is that life isn't fair. Nobody forced the kid to go out and egg cars. If you decides to egg cars, 999 out of a 1000 times this kind of retaliation won't happen, but if you're unlucky enough to egg the wrong person's car, right or wrong, it could cost you your life.

I'm not saying it was right, but nobody put a gun to the kid's head and forced him to egg cars. Fourteen years old is old enough to know between right and wrong.

Peace

Well most 14 y.o. boys don't have huge amounts of sense. This is very typical of something they would do. Who would have thought that tossing an egg could get you killed? It's appalling that someone would think their SUV's appearance is more important than a kid's life. What was the driver doing with a gun anyway??

You know, I agree, this is tragic. The life of a child is hardly proper punishment for a boyhood prank. I'm very sorry for the boy's family...

AND I totally agree with the Doctor of Love. People (kids included) need to realize that they can't just go attacking other people or their belongings without provocation. You just can't depend on the reaction of other people. This is a crazy world, filled with unstable and unreliable people. The boy assaulted, not just one, but many vehicles. What kind of behavior is that? Odds are that at least one person in one car isn't going to just let it go...

Hopefully the friends of this boy learned that very valuable lesson and will think twice before taking their anger or testosterone out on other random people...

Originally posted by forestlady
Well most 14 y.o. boys don't have huge amounts of sense.

Actually some studies show that they do, but they just don't care about it enough to stop. They feel that the time they'll spend while throwing eggs will be far more fulfulling, than what the end consequence will be. They take the 50-50 chance of being caught, teenagers would be wild gamblers.

This kid did not deserve death over an egg, but still anyone would be aggravated if some little boy was throwing things and their personal belongings. I guess we can just all be thankful that he did have a gun because, god only knows what would've happened if he didn't.

I hope this sets an example to teenagers everywhere.

[edit on 3-12-2006 by 1Crisis]

Like if I were driving my car and someone threw an egg at it, I'd just drive on to the next carwash, why would you bother retaliating? Maybe egging them back, but shooting them? Why would you shoot someone when it would probably cost a similar amount to wash it off (bit of cloth, car wash liquid etc) against shooting them (cost of bullets etc). And thats ignoring the fact that now someone's dead over it. How do the minds of people who do such an act work?

For the people on this thread that even mention the child's fault should check themselves. That is what 14 year olds do. Everyone I know has thrown an egg at a home or car to cure the boredom of childhood, myself included. Now I have grown to be a responsible adult that lives my life altruistically. Mention the parents but leaves the kids out of it. This is a tragedy and cannot be justified by faulting the kids.

AAC

I think we are missing something here. As tough as it is, I do agree with the Doctor of Love as well. Kids need to understand there are ramifications for their behavior. But are we leaving out the shooter here? We will assume his age for the sake of discussion for the time being, but it should be safe to say he is at least in his 20's.

We say that children are not smart enough to understand their actions. Well this man has taken a life and given up his future, all because his vehicle was struck by an egg. Is this a fair trade? Certainly not. The child was wrong to throw the egg, but being the adult, he should of dealt with it in a much better manner.

Assaulting the child would be a horrible crime, but firing several shots at the children is unthinkable.

So before too many of us think the child failed to see the consequences of his actions, we need to look at the shooter here.

He too has given up on his future. And over what?

Be prepared, that's all I'm saying.



I hope the SUV driver at least gets a stern warning from the police not to shoot unarmed civilians again.

I have personally seen grown men get out of cars and beat a kid with a crow-bar for doing such a thing. People are nuts. To take a life over an egg is beyond crazy. The past few halloweens I told my kid, don't even think about egging someones car as you never know who may be behind the wheel or what they might do.

I hope they catch that guy and he goes away for a long time. He will hve many years to think about what he did and more then likely will never want to look at another egg again.

Originally posted by In nothing we trust
I hope the SUV driver at least gets a stern warning from the police not to shoot unarmed civilians again.

Hey, that sounds exactly like the justice system in the UK at the moment. But what this guy deserves is death by stoning. First his car, then him.

Nothing can express the deep grief I feel everytime I read something like this. I also hope they catch the responsible party. My heart goes out to the family. On the holidays too. That hurts to lose someone so close to the holidays. God be with them.

In recent years, discussion around our youth have become rampant. They are worse than ever, behaving in a manner that was never seen before, etc., you name it they are being called on it. But lets take a look at our older generation.

Years ago, if a child misbehaved, what would happen? Odds are they would be brought home and their parents would deal with it.

Nowadays, the public insists on dealing with it themselves.

I've read articles of people killing children for walking on their lawns, now throwing eggs. How about parents attacking children at youth football, hockey, or baseball games?

Kids are a problem, I do not deny this. But in the process of pointing fingers, we need to look at the older crowd. The self-proclaimed role models for the younger generation.

Are they really setting a positive example?

Originally posted by In nothing we trust
Be prepared, that's all I'm saying.

I hope the SUV driver at least gets a stern warning from the police not to shoot unarmed civilians again.

Then I read this post and felt like chuckling again. Responding I posted, "The driver of the SUV should get a $20 mail in fine for firing on unarmed civilians!"

Its hard to grasp wtf is in someones brain that makes them react this way when the logical thing would have been to follow them home, and tell their parents to get the buckets out because they would be washing the entire car for egging it. The punishment should fit the crime, sad to say the punishment in this case was unbalanced in this one costing someone their lives, when it should have been their dignity by washing the car in front of the owner and their parents.

My opinion is the most the guy driving the car is going to get is aggrevated manslaughter. Max 10 years. If he's smart he'll say he wasn't aiming at the kid, just trying to scare him. On top of that he was in a fit of rage.

That is once they find the driver of course.

Peace

I certainly hope they catch the driver and that he gets what he deserves. He shot a child. There's not much one can say to justify that, certainly not for an egging. Surely they know who owns the SUV?

I agree the best punishment would have been for the driver to follow them home and get their parents involved. I wonder, though, if their parents would have seen it the same way as the driver... It seems like only in the 50s would the driver grab the kids, take them home and watch while the kids washed the car and paid for any damage (think Dennis the Menace). These days, I wouldn't trust the parents not to defend the kid and chase the SUV driver away at gunpoint.

Things are screwed up for the most part.

I also wanted to be clear that I'm not blaming or faulting the kid for being shot. I AM however blaming him for egging cars. I'm not saying his life was the proper punishment. I'm saying he shouldn't have been egging cars. I hope the parents of the other kids meet out some punishment as well. This wasn't just one SUV they egged, they were having a heyday egging cars.

Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
For the people on this thread that even mention the child's fault should check themselves. That is what 14 year olds do. Everyone I know has thrown an egg at a home or car to cure the boredom of childhood, myself included. Now I have grown to be a responsible adult that lives my life altruistically. Mention the parents but leaves the kids out of it. This is a tragedy and cannot be justified by faulting the kids.

AAC

Agreed AAC. I have to admit that I never threw an egg at a car, my gig was with snowballs. Yes indeed, as a young stupid kid who was caught in that time when I was too old to do this, but not old enough to do that, I pegged a couple of cars with snowballs. Not ice balls, snowballs. It wasn't anger on our part, it was just something to do, that didn't cost anything. We were occassionaly yelled at, but for the most part we became acclimated to receiving the 1 middle finger salute!
The world has changed so much in the last couple of decades. It is so dangerous now these days.
I think back to my youth. My friends and I used to always play unsupervised. From the age of 7, I would walk to school by myself through a desolate wooded area everyday. When I got into a fight, the only thing I ever worried about was getting beat up. Deadly force was never even contemplated.
Nowadays, I'm scared for my children every day. Kids getting killed for egging a car, or for their sneakers. Recently a child was shot and killed because someone wanted his Allan Iverson jersey.
What's the solution? Is there one? To make the punishment so severe that it might actually disuade these lethal acts? Today "street cred" is so important. You look cool if you kill someone, and like a wimp if you don't.
Without a massive overhaul of the judicial system, I'm afraid that this problem is only going to get worse.

Reminds me of a story I once heard about a car that was parked outside of an apartment complex and someone came along and rammed the parked vehicle and drove off. Well, it just so happens that the vehicle's owner saw it happen and chased the runaway car down. When he caught the person, he pulled the person out of the vehicle and shot him in the head. Killing him instantly.

People are funny about their belongings.

Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
For the people on this thread that even mention the child's fault should check themselves. That is what 14 year olds do.

I have a BIG problem with that. A young adult vandalizes multiple cars. That should ABSOLUTELY NOT be 'what 14 year olds do.' Now please don't misunderstand me, the shooting was unjustified, tragic, and deplorable. It's not the child's fault that he was shot, it's the shooter's fault for pulling the trigger. But what caused the shooter to pull the trigger? There has to be some responsibility and blame placed on the kids for contributing to the cause of the shooting.

Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
This is a tragedy and cannot be justified by faulting the kids.

Again, I'm not justifying or condoning the shooting in any way, but a lot of people are making the kids sound innocent and blameless. There was an obviously small, yet easily avoidable cause that set the events in motion.

Hypothetical situation: kids are hiding in an alley egging cars. They cause an accident that kills an infant passenger. Do you think people would be outraged at the actions of the kids, or would people pass it off as an unfortunate instance of 'kids being kids?'

Yes, times have changed and the use of excessive or deadly force by civilians is depressingly common. However, actions such as these (throwing eggs) are just as wrong now as they have ever been; perhaps this is a sign that these actions were put up with and accepted as typical behavior for too long.

[edit on 4-12-2006 by greatpiino]