It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Decided it was time to buy an AK

page: 5
0
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 10:46 PM
link   

Originally posted by JackJuice
grimreaper797 thanks for the kind words of my favorite state, as I live in PA
. The only state i've found better for getting guns is Florida. I lived their for two years and they have as many gun stores and ranges as they do churches. I'm exagerating of course but they have a lot. Unfortunatly where i live in PA there are no indoor ranges where i can rent various guns to try and test out like they do in Florida.


Yea, NJ is ruff. I am thinking about just looking through different state gun laws to see which are more lax. NJ got an A- while PA got a D lol. That shows you the difference.




posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 10:50 PM
link   
lets say we are both a little right about the surviving thing(lets close that subject cause we could argument a night long...)

But dont you agree that its not helping human society right now...its a negative thing linked to violence and giving bad examples to kids and giving ways to sick people to express their frustrations(im not talking about you guys)

It can be that good, these weapons are used to kill millions of PEOPLE in the world
(not in the states...not yet)
But what would you say having warlords with milicias killing families and religious people all over your country?...

oh yeah i forgot thats why you have a gun...



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 10:57 PM
link   

Originally posted by kraggen
lets say we are both a little right about the surviving thing(lets close that subject cause we could argument a night long...)

But dont you agree that its not helping human society right now...its a negative thing linked to violence and giving bad examples to kids and giving ways to sick people to express their frustrations(im not talking about you guys)

It can be that good, these weapons are used to kill millions of PEOPLE in the world
(not in the states...not yet)
But what would you say having warlords with milicias killing families and religious people all over your country?...

oh yeah i forgot thats why you have a gun...


see the thing is you have this twisted picture of a bunch of people going out and shooting whoever they dont like. People generally dont do that. If a criminal comes along, they either get shot on spot or arrested and they have their due process. What makes us different from other countries is our belief that every person is equal, regardless of beliefs.

Guns and weaponry wont change this nation into iraq and somalia. Ideals will change this country into those places, if it happens. The gun doesn't kill people, people do. Those people in other countries, have the same guns, same weaponry in some senses, but they don't have the same ideals we have.

The reason your starting to see a change is complacency. The people going out shooting people aren't a result of families owning guns and protecting their families if a criminal comes along. They aren't products of a large family that hunts. They are a product of the media fooling them into thinking violence to other people is cool and parents working rather then raising their kids.

The reason ideals change in this nation is because the way this countries government is being handled. It embraces laziness, complacency, and stupidity. That is what is destroying this nation. Not guns, or hunting or anything like that. Its american people being told its ok to be lazy and its ok to let your kids be stupid and uneducated. Its not, and its the reason our country has so many problems.

[edit on 4-12-2006 by grimreaper797]



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 10:58 PM
link   
i just wanna tell you that Doc holidays is hot!
and that tombstone is one of my favorite movie!

i know its off the subject but nice picture greamreaper
i hope you dont deserve your name



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by kraggen
lets say we are both a little right about the surviving thing(lets close that subject cause we could argument a night long...)

But dont you agree that its not helping human society right now...its a negative thing linked to violence and giving bad examples to kids and giving ways to sick people to express their frustrations(im not talking about you guys)

It can be that good, these weapons are used to kill millions of PEOPLE in the world
(not in the states...not yet)
But what would you say having warlords with milicias killing families and religious people all over your country?...

oh yeah i forgot thats why you have a gun...


I don't see how hiding from the fact that Humans are a violent species is helping mankinds or maybe its just hope. The way I see it being willing, ready, and prepared to fight for freedom, justice, and that which is right in this world is a good thing.



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:06 PM
link   
last question....the ultimate one...
Be honest,do you really think that weapons make the world a better place to live in?
Ask the families of fallen soldiers or families of school shootin victims,ask families of street gangs victims...
Will you still think(honestly) that weapons are a good thing?
I mean could you go on a stage in front of million of people(if you could) and says:
GUNS ARE A GOOD THING FOR HUMAN CIVILIZATION



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:10 PM
link   

Originally posted by kraggen
last question....the ultimate one...
Be honest,do you really think that weapons make the world a better place to live in?
Ask the families of fallen soldiers or families of school shootin victims,ask families of street gangs victims...
Will you still think(honestly) that weapons are a good thing?
I mean could you go on a stage in front of million of people(if you could) and says:
GUNS ARE A GOOD THING FOR HUMAN CIVILIZATION



Let me ask you the ultimate question... Do you really think that Guns are what makes these people violent? People have been killing each other since the dawn of man with much cruder weapons Guns don't really make much of a difference. Before the Gun it was the sword and spear and axe or whatever else.

Now to answer your question. I think if everybody gave up guns all at once then world would be better off yes. If you convince the rest of the world to give up theirs then I'd be glad to give up mine. Since that is never going to happen I think that my having a Gun and my fellow Americans having guns is a good thing.



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:17 PM
link   
Thats want i wanted to hear...
you made my night!
So why dont we start giving up guns now!
starting with you guys!
Who will start giving up guns so everybody does the same?!
Im happy to see that you guys are coherent and understand my point
i know that you wont give up guns but i least i see that you guys have a head

(i still hate it when i hear a seventeen years old guy saying that he is waiting for his new AK,sorry!)



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:19 PM
link   
Kraggen, your posts manifest your ignorance very well. Why don't you look at the issue from both sides instead of your own subjective view, hmmm?

I doubt you would be bashing guns if someone broke into in your house, armed with a gun, and you also had a gun and were able to kill that person before they killed yourself and your whole family. Think buddy, think.


[edit on 4-12-2006 by Mindzi]



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:21 PM
link   

Originally posted by kraggen
Thats want i wanted to hear...
you made my night!
So why dont we start giving up guns now!
starting with you guys!
Who will start giving up guns so everybody does the same?!
Im happy to see that you guys are coherent and understand my point
i know that you wont give up guns but i least i see that you guys have a head

(i still hate it when i hear a seventeen years old guy saying that he is waiting for his new AK,sorry!)


lol I hope you don't actually believe that if even All of america gave up guns forever that the rest of the world would. We would be invaded and conquered so quick it'd make your head spin. China would probably take over and then who would protect canada?

But atleast your feeling good about yourself glad i could help
I on the other hand am proud when i hear of a twentyone year old that is ordering his Ak because he wants to be a responcible American.



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:36 PM
link   
Yea if we gave up our guns, we would just be run over by the people that wish to do us harm. If the world were peaceful there would be no need to have guns for protection. Unfortunately, there are people who make guns for people with ill intent because they want money. Those willing to pay get the guns and use them for malicious purposes.

There will be greedy destructive people to make and use these guns so long as people exist. I would rather go to war to fight for this country (not iraq and such because I don't believe in going overseas to fight for a war over money and politics), then sit around and give up my guns while I wait to be killed/enslaved/invaded or otherwise.

Like I said, there will always be people to make and use guns to further their own greed and power trip, so I would rather fight then roll over in the name of peace and die.



posted on Dec, 4 2006 @ 11:45 PM
link   

Originally posted by Iblis

Originally posted by Mcphisto
Wow, you yanks really are trigger happy nutcases!

I wondered why there was so many school shootings. Pretty obvious now though.

Thanks for the heads-up! I will steer clear of the good 'ol USA!


I'm almost tickled that, given your display-picture on the name-tag, you'd dare say anything about America's competency, let alone without actual supportive facts regarding its gun-control laws.


My avatar shows another American idiot whose a trigger happy bastard whos just dropped the whole world in the brown stuff! And if you cant find out the facts everytime you tuned into the news, it must be coz your too busy waving that poxy flag of yours or your own bull**** as risen above your eyes!

Some facts for you.........

Gun deaths per 100,000 population (year indicated).

Homicide Suicide Unintentional

USA 4.08 (1999) 6.08 (1999) 0.42 (1999)

Canada 0.54 (1999) 2.65 (1997) 0.15 (1997)

Switzerland 0.50 (1999) 5.78 (1998) -

Scotland 0.12 (1999) 0.27 (1999) -

England/Wales 0.12 (1999/00) 0.22 (1999) 0.01 (1999)

Japan 0.04* (1998) 0.04 (1995)



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 12:00 AM
link   

Originally posted by Mcphisto


Some facts for you.........

Gun deaths per 100,000 population (year indicated).

Homicide Suicide Unintentional

USA 4.08 (1999) 6.08 (1999) 0.42 (1999)

Canada 0.54 (1999) 2.65 (1997) 0.15 (1997)

Switzerland 0.50 (1999) 5.78 (1998) -

Scotland 0.12 (1999) 0.27 (1999) -

England/Wales 0.12 (1999/00) 0.22 (1999) 0.01 (1999)

Japan 0.04* (1998) 0.04 (1995)



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 12:14 AM
link   
Your statistics are misleading, allow me to show you why.


The U.S. has a high gun murder rate, whereas a country like England with strict gun controls has almost no gun murders and a very low murder rate. Doesn't this show that gun control is effective in reducing murder rates? Not exactly. Prior to having any gun controls, England already had a homicide rate much lower than the United States


Gun availability in the black market has more to do with these stats than gun availability to regular citizens.


There are many, many factors, some much more prominent than gun availability that influence homicide rates and crime in general. (See this excerpt from 1997 FBI Uniform Crime Report and GunCite's "Is Gun Ownership Correlated with Violent Deaths?")

Due to the many confounding factors that arise when attempting international comparisons, this approach would appear to hold little promise for determining the influence of gun levels (or handgun availability) on violence rates.


Source

Here you can compare murder Rates with Gun and Non Gun rates with a lot more countries as well. Plus if you look you will notice that Guns per house hold has little to do with the rates when some countries have as many or as close to as many Guns as America and still have some of the lowest crime rates. There are too many Factors that go into violent crime rates to pin this on guns. Again if violence isnt commited with a gun it will be commited with something else.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 01:29 AM
link   
First off Sigung 86 I want to thank you for your service to our country.

I agree ...I would rather be a citizen than a subject. Though I have a great respect for the history of the UK I have no desire to follow those ways and become a subject. No intrest in it.

Yes the M14/M1A is a fine rifle as is the FN/LAR series both in 7.62x51 Caliber. Both great shooters but a bit pricey. No doubt about the abilities of these rifles.
I own the older brother of this rifle the M1 Garand and it too is a fine rifle though I am actually more partial to a bolt action. I also own a couple of 1903 Springfields in the same 30.06 caliber as the M1 Garand. Both are shooters if you can hold them tightly. I get much pleasure out of my Bolt actions for pure shooting dicipline. The Garand too. I reload for these calibers.

I have a Black Belt in the Martial Art of Ju Jitsu from back in my teen years when I lived in Japan. A Brown Belt in Judo also. This did not prevent me from learning the dicipline of shooting and reloading as well as other life diciplines.
I tend to catalogue these as diciplines...requiring training and consistency...not wildlife or wild behavior. My guns are no different as is reloading. No wildlife allowed here. I dont reload or shoot when I have been drinking. I seldome drink anyway and dont like to be around drunken peoples....especially someone drunk with a gun. Talk about stupid!!
At the gun club I dont like being around people I consider unsafe or showman with a gun. I will report them or leave. NO wildlife tolerated here.

I have taught myself many diciplines from morse code for my amateur license to fishing ...with the viewpoint of rounding myself off in these areas and applying them to my daily life.

I am not here to conduct myself as wildlife. Gun owner or not. This is not my view of life.

It was my pleasure to back up Silverado in another board with his rationale for hunting to put meat on his table and in his freezer...thus saving himself and his family moneys for other uses. While not a hunter per se...I prefer fishing with the same rationale ..meat on my table and in my freezer. Hunting as well as fishing require dicipline ..not wildlife.

Jack Juice...well said on not caring what the rest of the world thinks of us and our guns. THe rest of the world has no reason to like us ..ever. They only historically tolerate us when they are in trouble. I know enough history to understand this having been raised as a military dependent...and been many places in this world.
We are considered Yanks and upstarts by the rest of the "Enlightened " world. I'm not impressed as previously stated.

Someone posted about a Mossberg shotgun. Good affordable choice. My choice is a olde Ithaica 12 gauge pump police special. Loads and ejects from the bottom. Leftys love it. It is my house gun. 20 inch barrel. I hope I never have to use it but it is there on the ready line.

A bit off topic but needed to be said by many of us.

THe AK series is affordable like the SKS series. Personally I have little use for a AK47 type rifle. I already have rifles with high capacity magazines if I want them but hardly use them in favor of bolt actions and single shots. Affordability is the major draw of these rifles both in the rifle and the ammo.

Kraggen...most man made death here in America and I am sure in other countrys occurs on the highways. Much of this is murder too. We just call it manslaughter here. Most legal gun owners are more responsible with their guns than automobile operators. Think before you post such nonsense. It looks good on paper it just does not make good nonsense to those who can think a bigger picture. It is however a easy target for politicians willing to whore out thier publics rights for votes. THe word for this type of selling of rights and souls is whoredom. Very popular among politicians to use on a easily emotional unthinking people brought up on a emotional diet of movies and television.

Kraggen..I handled two nuclear fuel cells this week...are you worried about me with a gun?? Think this through....carefully.

Think about the tractor trailer driver who has the lives of many people in thier hands daily. How about a electrical lineman. A forklift operator, a doctor too has the lives of many in their hands daily. These people are not to be trusted with a gun. What are you and so many possibly thinking?? But we trust them with a automobile and alcohol. Talk about stupid..talk about putting the cart before the horse??
Not all of us out here are so insecure...guns or not. WE dont live for our insecuritys..we learn to master them. Neither are we Yanks intrested in living for someone elses insecuritys. No thanks. IF you or others choose not to own a gun no problem. Same with any American here. That is most certainly a American right too..not to own. I have no problem with this. Bon Appetit.

I am not intrested in anyone telling me to live the way they choose and trying to foist it off on me as moral high ground. I get enough of that from our air headed politicians, news media, and public education trying to foist off their insecuritys on me daily. I will make up my own mind thank you.

To the rest of the posters here ..thanks for your input,
Orangetom



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 03:02 AM
link   
You just can't draw a clear connection between the amount of guns and gun related violence.

Finland has over 2 million legal firearms + 800 000 in the army hands and up to 500 000 illegal "suveniers" from ww2. And yet we have a population of only 5.2 million and gun crime rate is very low, murder rate is high, but most killings occur withing "drinking buddies" and they are done with knives or just about anything one can get a hold of. Less than 3% of murders are done with firearms and most of those are done with illegal guns.



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 06:39 AM
link   
Hello OrangeTom and GrimReaper, and friends... It's oh dark thirty here and I just woke up... Haven't even had coffee yet!


People like Mcphisto, no offense intended little buddy, seem to get their jollies by coming on forums like this and making instigatory statements that they believe will piss folks off and get a flame war started. What he, and others like him don't understand is the American Spirit that is steeped in the history of Davy Crockett, Daniel Boone, Jim Bowie, Jim Bridger, Kit Carson, Sitting Bull, Geronimo, Kwana Parker, and on and on down to people like Wyatt Earp, Doc Holliday, and on and on down to folks like John Wayne.

You can't spit on us, McPhisto, and really think we care much about your keyboard antics. The American Spirit isn't based on what you and your ilk think about us and our ilk. Sure, we make mistakes. Sure, we get the occasional bonehead in the office of the President. Sure, we sometimes bull our way through global issues. But, right or wrong, we are here, and what we do is our take on what needs to be done.

That's been our way since just about day one, when we got off the boats here, either as Mayflower passengers seeking relief from religious oppression, or as the poor Viet Namese family trying to escape to a better life. Right now, down to the Mexican and other, South American Illegals trying to get here to make a better life for themselves.
WE'll get that figured out too... No thanks to folks like you who would rather sit around and criticize.

We're loud. We're brash. We live life the way we think it should be lived. We may have a gun in the closet, but if you came here, destitute, in need of help, in a bad way, and were willing to get at it, we'd help you any way we could. We'd try to provide you an arena to pull yourself up. We'd make sure that no one is able to walk into your house, take your family, declare your private property as property of the state. We are responsible people, like OrangeTom, who does some work in a nuclear facility. We are great-grandfathers, like me, who live in the rural area, live the way we want and don't tolerate a lot of interference and government intervention, yet still find time to love our families, help our fellow man, and care about a great deal, both nationally and internationally.

In order to keep this from being a 12 billion page tome, I'm just touching on some things. But you, young McPHisto, have to realize that your skewed view, obviously based on something that has pissed you off in your living room, in no way, impacts how we live. Your insults really are a waste of time. You don't want to come to Crazy America? Fine... Stay home... That is most certainly your prerogative. It won't make a great deal of difference in the gross national output, nor in the way I park my car tonight. But I think if you were to climb down from your high horse, and come down here and meet some of us loonie gun owners, you might be surprised at just how human and caring we are about us ... AND ... About you.

Last night, I took my wife, oldest daughter, and grandson to one of the local truck stops, called the Flying J, for dinner. Got into a very cool conversation with a trucker down from Ottawa ... Um ... That's in Canada, as I recall. He and I let it get around to firearms ownership. Interestingly, he was banging on the last "French" government, and how, due to their obsession with mandatory firearm registration, and control, he had been a criminal, because he had, at least, one in the closet that he would never register.

Our views were slightly different. He doesn't mind the fact that some registration should be mandatory. I on the other hand believe that any person, at any time, should be able to belly up to the bar and buy the firearm of their choice... No registration, no licensure, until such a time as they use a firearm in the commission of a crime. Then lower the boom. I'm "guilty" of still believing that every human being should be innocent until proven guilty.

We talked about how firearms were stashed and hidden up there until the wind of change blew and now things are a little more relaxed. So... I am afraid I would be a little leery of taking any moral high ground, were I you.

No ... We Americans are not always right ... Yeah ... Sometimes our international policies are similar to the bull in the china shop. So what? Give us a little time ... If it isn't working, we'll change it next election.


And ... I'll keep that little bit of insurance in my closet, in my bedside stand, and in the glove box of my car, just to keep ensuring that I will have the opportunity for a next election ... And probably won't lose too much sleep over what you think about me, or my country.

One final thought. To the kind folks who posted the firearm/mortality rates. Do a comparative study on deaths in hospitals, per country. And consider that, somewhere on this great, diverse, wonderful planet... before the sun sets, wherever you may be, someone has an appointment with the worst doctor in the world.



[edit on 5-12-2006 by sigung86]



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 08:16 AM
link   
And here I was hoping for an interesting discussion on the merits of milled versus stamped receivers and the advantages of 5.45mm over 7.62 short, sigh.

As for these American hating Canadian and British hippies that we appear to have picked up along the way, I just love to see all that jealousy spill out in one place


It's ironic that the reason we have the right to keep and bear arms enshrined in our Constitution is because we needed them to get the British Jackboot from off our necks. Doubly ironic because here in Arizona, and next door in California, you can't turn around without falling over one of those snaggle toothed individuals, the Brits are everywhere and easily recognized as the only form of acceptable national dress appears to be a soccer shirt, and they keep on coming (regrettably). Go to Florida and you can't move for them. The Brits appear to loathe and hate the gun crazy, bigotted, xenophobic USA right up to the point that they can either:

a) Afford a vacation here; or
b) Get a Green Card

So hearing them complain about us just sounds like so much sour grapes.

I'll continue to enjoy my freedoms in the US, in fact I may add a DSA para tactical (FN FAL) to the AK just to balance out the East/West thing, why?, because I can



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 08:30 AM
link   
Most AKs are just remakes and are complete JUNK!!! They're heavy, not built very well and, honestly, just not that accurate! Why not purchase a REAL assult rifle, like this rifle.

Now that is a REAL weapon! I just picked mine up about 3 weeks ago and I can tell you that this piece is accurate, well-blananced, light-weight for an assault rifle, and fires the NATO ascribed 5.56 round!!! This gun ROCKS!!! It is built like a tank but has the heft and feel of a .22. It weighs in at under 9 lbs FULLY LOADED! Has a mag capacity of 30 rounds! Picatinny rail mounts everywhere; 3 different ones to be exact! And measures anywhere from 33.5" to 37" depending on your stock config. In short, this is the ultimate assault style rifle. AKs are pure crap in comparison! Go buy yourself a real rifle!



posted on Dec, 5 2006 @ 09:17 AM
link   

Originally posted by Retseh
And here I was hoping for an interesting discussion on the merits of milled versus stamped receivers and the advantages of 5.45mm over 7.62 short, sigh.

As for these American hating Canadian and British hippies that we appear to have picked up along the way, I just love to see all that jealousy spill out in one place


It's ironic that the reason we have the right to keep and bear arms enshrined in our Constitution is because we needed them to get the British Jackboot from off our necks. Doubly ironic because here in Arizona, and next door in California, you can't turn around without falling over one of those snaggle toothed individuals, the Brits are everywhere and easily recognized as the only form of acceptable national dress appears to be a soccer shirt, and they keep on coming (regrettably). Go to Florida and you can't move for them. The Brits appear to loathe and hate the gun crazy, bigotted, xenophobic USA right up to the point that they can either:

a) Afford a vacation here; or
b) Get a Green Card

So hearing them complain about us just sounds like so much sour grapes.

I'll continue to enjoy my freedoms in the US, in fact I may add a DSA para tactical (FN FAL) to the AK just to balance out the East/West thing, why?, because I can


Hmm

You still haven't acknowledged you're posting #e about UK gun laws, have you?

But reading this post I see that intellect or the actual facts are unlikely to trouble you.

Never let the facts get in the way of your prejudices eh?

BTW I'm a shooter, have been for years, I've never worn a footie shirt and am unlikely to want to trouble your lovely immigration staff ever again.

I'd rather go North and visit some cultured people.



new topics

top topics



 
0
<< 2  3  4    6  7  8 >>

log in

join