Originally posted by Landis
If blacks don't like the use of the "N" word they should stop using it amongst themselves. As long as the word is still in use it's fair game.

Double standards blow.

I've never understood this logic. So, if any black people anywhere use this word, that gives all non-black people everywhere the right to use it to refer to blacks?

It's a hateful word with awful connotations. Using it says a lot more about the user than it does the person it's directed towards.

I'm all for free speech. I'm against communication suppression. Let the idiots say what they want when they want. It only makes it a lot easier for the rest of us to identify them. But I absolutely disagree that anyone using the word shouldn't be called out on it.

Even if that seems contradictory, it makes sense in my head.

A small, meaningless incident and the liberals are blowing it up.

Two hecklers got heckled back and now the gutless wimps of the world are crying.

If Richards was black and the two hecklers were white, would there be such a big deal made about this? No.

Why didn't the Laugh Factory kick the two hecklers out before it escalated? The Improv kicks out hecklers immediately.

Originally posted by yeahright
I've never understood this logic. So, if any black people anywhere use this word, that gives all non-black people everywhere the right to use it to refer to blacks?

It's just a word, and the meanings of words change. Remember gay used to mean happy? Not that Kramer was using it in a nice way, but I've had black friends call me it as a pleasantry on many occasions, where does that fit in? It doesn't just seem to be for blacks to call blacks anymore, they use it for everybody, but if somebody that isn't black uses it, it automatically changes meaning? It just defies all logic.

Let's face it - 'n-word' and nigga are the same damn thing. Anyone who believes there's a difference is an ignoramus.

Frankly, I'm sick to death of black martyrdom. They wear that chip as if they're the only people on the damn planet who've ever been enslaved.

The Indians lost their entire damn country, but you don't see them sitting around and snivelling about it.

Get over it. Move on. You're boring the piss out of the rest of us.

[edit on 11/22/2006 by Landis]

Originally posted by Landis
Let's face it - 'n-word' and nigga are the same f'ing thing. Anyone who believes there's a difference is an ignoramus.

C'mon now, there is a difference depending on how it's said, pretty much like anything. There's a difference between an old redneck saying 'n-word' in a hateful way, and when black people call each other nigga. The difference is in the context it is used.

But I wholly agree that they should not be given a pass because their ancestors were enslaved before any of us were even born. It's ridiculous and they should be held to the same standards everybody else is, imagine if a white comic's whole routine was about black people and making fun of how they talk and such, the career prolly wouldn't go too far, but just about every black comic relies on white people jokes, with the exception of a few....

Originally posted by Rockpuck

Originally posted by subject x
If this is true, then the Masons should definately reconsider using Richardson as a poster boy...

They should NOT use him as a poster boy.

I don't believe he is used as a 'poster boy'. Like a lot of freemasons, I imagine his membership is purely incidental to his life, just like numerous other activities and memberships he undertakes.

This is certainly a black mark against him though, and reminds me a lot of the furor caused by Jim Davidson's membership.

right on I can't understand it neither. You are so right about the double standard in your post earlier. I'am starting to the double standard even more as the thread goes on.

Masonic Light wrote:
I do not think Brother Richards should be expelled from the fraternity, but his behavior merits a Masonic censure at the very least. We are all humans, and all make mistakes. However, as Masons, we are obliged to a higher standard.

What he said is way over the limit. If some pastor at a church went on a rampage about masonry and said real vial things you would want that pastor kicked out of the church. Or have him brought on charges of hate speech. Give me a break this guy should have all his masonic awards and apron burned. I'am starting to find out that masonry isn't all what it's cracked up to be. Yeah we are all human but the stuff he said he should be punished for. If this guy is still a mason in six months then I have learned about what masonry stands for. I do as of right now think the masons are a good group of men. The charity stuff is great. I wish more people were as giving as the masons. But if this clown gets away with it I will lose much respect that I have for the masons.

Originally posted by Andy Warhol

What he said is way over the limit. If some pastor at a church went on a rampage about masonry and said real vial things you would want that pastor kicked out of the church. Or have him brought on charges of hate speech. Give me a break this guy should have all his masonic awards and apron burned.

Maybe it's a subtle difference, but a pastor speaks for his church much more than an individual Mason can ever speak for Masonry. BTW, many pastors do rail on about Masonry in vile terms.

Who more needs church than a sinner? Who could more use an organization whose aims are to "make good men better" than a man who needs obvious improvement? I don't think the Masons lose much face in not tossing him out, nor do I think they should. I do think since Richards has been publicly identified by the Masons as a Mason, they lose some face by not publicly denouncing his tirade. And if they already have, I haven't seen it.

They (masonry), are not going to denounce Richards and here is why:

1. He was wrong to be caught but they believe in what he said.
2. Among their highest loyalties is to each other no matter what a member does especially among 33 degree.
3. They have the power to protect this guy from any harm and even bury this story in time.
4. They are desperate to maintain their 'clean image' which is not earned actually.
5. Secretly many of them may even like what he has done eg. said things in public for which there has been little backlash as a test on the mental condition of the populace.

Originally posted by yeahright
I do think since Richards has been publicly identified by the Masons as a Mason, they lose some face by not publicly denouncing his tirade. And if they already have, I haven't seen it.

What about this thread? There's a public denouncement. several Freemasons have called for censure within this thread, but only his Lodge, Grand Lodge, Valley, and Supreme Council can mete out any sanctions.

Time will tell.

Originally posted by Andy Warhol


Masonic Light wrote:
I do not think Brother Richards should be expelled from the fraternity, but his behavior merits a Masonic censure at the very least. We are all humans, and all make mistakes. However, as Masons, we are obliged to a higher standard.

What he said is way over the limit. If some pastor at a church went on a rampage about masonry and said real vial things you would want that pastor kicked out of the church. Or have him brought on charges of hate speech.

Some ministers go on rampages about Masonry all the time. Idiots shooting off their mouths do not necessarily constitute hate speech. As Freud once said, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

I would agree with you that what he said was over the top. But I don't think we can crucify someone just for saying soething offensive, especially if he is apoletic about his words. Let's face it, all of us have said things before that we didn't really mean, during fits of anger.

This isn't to excuse Richards, but only to point out the fact that probably all of us are guilty of kindred words that lacked charity. Another poster keeps talking about hypocrisy, and us jumping all over Mel Gibson (all the while taking a few cheap shots at the Jews himself in his posts). In reality, I don't remember any Mason here condemning Gibson. He said something stupid, then apologized for it. Life goes on.

Give me a break this guy should have all his masonic awards and apron burned. I'am starting to find out that masonry isn't all what it's cracked up to be. Yeah we are all human but the stuff he said he should be punished for. If this guy is still a mason in six months then I have learned about what masonry stands for. I do as of right now think the masons are a good group of men. The charity stuff is great. I wish more people were as giving as the masons. But if this clown gets away with it I will lose much respect that I have for the masons.

If Richards continued in the same behavior, I would agree with you. But if he offers his apology, I cannot sanction such a thing. That Most Wise Master whose life, death, and resurrection are detailed in Holy Writ, once said to his Father, "Forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us." If we cannot forgive our own brothers and sisters, how may we expect our Father to forgive us?

Richards' words were despicable, but words break no noses nor shoot innocents, and he has apologized for his actions. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

[edit on 22-11-2006 by Masonic Light]

Originally posted by Landis
Let's face it - 'n-word' and nigga are the same damn thing. Anyone who believes there's a difference is an ignoramus.

Frankly, I'm sick to death of black martyrdom. They wear that chip as if they're the only people on the damn planet who've ever been enslaved.

The Indians lost their entire damn country, but you don't see them sitting around and snivelling about it.

Get over it. Move on. You're boring the piss out of the rest of us.

[edit on 11/22/2006 by Landis]

EXACTLY how I feel.. Blacks really are a sensitive bunch huh?

Honestly.. blacks deserve NO special treatment NO special laws protecting them from ANYTHING, they don't deserve and WILL NOT GET my sympathy when someone calls them a N and we as a nation need to stop feeling so damn guilty about our past.

Let me put it this way..

My grandparents where Irish. I would say that Irish people in history where definitely NOT treated.. kindly to say the least. Do I hold any bad feelings about English people because they suppressed my great grandparents or my great great grandparents? Should I hold a grudge against Normans and viking descendants as well? See how absurd that sounds? I will never feel sorry for our past, especially considering my family was not here during slavery but simply because I am white.. I need to feel guilty for my races actions. Maybe in honor of the guy who got called a N we should throw a national pity party for him.

By the way, why has no one mentioned he said CRACKER far more times then Richards said NIGGER??? Yeah, cause no one cares.

The guy has an attorney now, my guess is some NAACP jerk saw it and decided to make a name for him self and offer his service free of charge. Suing because... he got called a name... Makes me sick honestly.

Ok well this is being looked at the wrong way. He was being heckled for like 20 minutes before he lost it. Also, lets say this had been chris rock. Someone heckled chris rock, and if they were white and he called them honkeys and crackers, he would have been a hero.

i think he was tryin to be funny but it didn't work. he was just trying to cover but he screwed up the way that he was doing it.

Originally posted by Spawwwn
Ok well this is being looked at the wrong way. He was being heckled for like 20 minutes before he lost it. Also, lets say this had been chris rock. Someone heckled chris rock, and if they were white and he called them honkeys and crackers, he would have been a hero.

i think he was tryin to be funny but it didn't work. he was just trying to cover but he screwed up the way that he was doing it.

Sorry but the religious cult members supporting Richards isn't impressing me in the least here.

Furthermore, Richards could have walked off stage if the heckling was too much. He had that right and I've seen it done before.

I've been at concerts where the audience lambasted the stage with garbage and the band just walked off.

They didn't go into a tirade against the people or the city or culture etc.

Richards is a RACIST.

Originally posted by denythestatusquo

Richards is a RACIST.

Everybody is racist. Some people have the balls to admit it, some don't.

Originally posted by Mirthful Me

What about this thread? There's a public denouncement.

Definitely a start, I agree. I understand (if I'm correct) that there's no "official" head of Freemasonry so it's not like the CEO or Pope or something of Masons can make an official announcement on behalf of the entire organization. But I give you a big for starting this thread.

Originally posted by Landis

Originally posted by denythestatusquo

Richards is a RACIST.

Everybody is racist. Some people have the balls to admit it, some don't.

While I'm at it.. where is the ACLU on this story? They didn't waste time to attack Gibson when it was convenient for them.

I guess the rumors that the ACLU only works to protect the interests of Richard's people is proving true isn't it?

Today's NY Post had an article about how Richards went nuts at a prior show when a woman knocked something over and he screamed like a maniac at her using the C word. They also interviewed comedians who had performed at the same venues that he was performing in and said he had been acting peculiarly.

I think the guy has a MAJOR rage problem and needs to seek help for it. He needs to apologize, not to David Letterman's audience but to the African American community at large (and to women as well if that Post story is true). TV apologies, genuine or not are not going to solve the problems of a rageaholic.

He needs to get help.