Mystery Plane Identified (theory)!

Are we talking about the Aurora?

Originally posted by undo
Are we talking about the Aurora?

F-19 is what the current discussion is about. This talk is hinged on if the documents from the airforce are correct in saying that the F-19 designation was skipped for the F-20 programe or if Mr Lears contacts are correct in saying that the worked on the F-19 programe. So far we have documents from the Airforce but are just going on Mr Lears words and hopeing we can get more info from his friends and possible contact in sketchs etc.

As it stands though personal opinion from me now Mr Lear has been a bit side tracked (by his own choosing) with other posters in the forums and hasn't been answering key questions asked of him. My self I'm not ruling out the possiblity of the F-19 but its hope is growing dimmer due to documents. Then again the goverment hasn't been knowen to lie either have they? Its all in the perspective I guess at this point till even more info is found or brought forward.


[edit on 22/08/06 by Canada_EH]

Errm, but isn't the F-19 the Stealth Fighter? Or no?

Originally posted by undo
Errm, but isn't the F-19 the Stealth Fighter? Or no?

The F-19 designation has been misused a number of times by a number of high profile companies in referance to the F-117 "NightHawk/Cockroach(new nickname I found today). In the F-117 was never refered to by knowledge in Airforce documents as the F-19 it was the designation that Monogram and number of other companies used (in their best reasoning at the time) to brand their new models of the then rumoured stealth plane. The models ended up looking completely different and I ended up feeling had. Its a nice collectable anyways.

Hubby saw a huge huge "flying" thing in the air over Hill AFB in Utah, back before 1996. It was sailing gracefully over the flight line. He said it was totally silent, moved incredibly slow, almost hovering, was black,
triangular, and smooth, like it was all one piece, no visible seams or wheels or wheel wells. He said, when it took off, it just shot off, like out of cannon, from slow to incredibly fast and zip it was gone, almost straight up, and then it made noise, but when it was just cruising over the base, it was totally silent. He also said it looked like something out of scifi film and looked like it was quite capable of space flight. He said it was much bigger than the F-117 Stealth, which we have both seen at USAF Air Shows. He also commented that it was so big that it was the biggest aircraft or flying thing, he'd ever seen. (career Air Force) So perhaps IT is the F-19.

[edit on 30-3-2007 by undo]

Originally posted by johnlear

Originally posted by Canada_EH

I ask again Mr Lear please respond to the civil questions from Stoo and myself all we ask for is information or some way to move this beyond word vs word and actually say record testimony or get your friends to join here on ATS even if its for just the purpose of the F-19 myth and to provide counter evidence to the Gov papers on this thread.

I responded to the questions from Stoo. As to asking my friends to violate their oath of secrecy for ATS, I don't think I will. They did for me but, well, this group might not be as appreciative.

Well I would be very appreciative if they would but I do understand that doing so would possibly put them or their famlies at harm. But if they were to give you more info it would help further the truth about a project they were involved in that for the most part this world has no idea of its possiblity. You do put us in a hard place John as to what to believe when you only seem to tempt us from in your "shadows". I do think that it would be amazing to try and flush out this possiblity but I guess the question/ my question is are you willing to provide proper discussion about the F-19 or are you just too content to stir the pot

Originally posted by undo
Hubby saw a huge huge "flying" thing in the air over Hill AFB in Utah, back before 1996. It was sailing gracefully over the flight line. He said it was totally silent, moved incredibly slow, almost hovering, was black,
triangular, and smooth, like it was all one piece, no visible seams or wheels or wheel wells.

(career Air Force) So perhaps IT is the F-19.

[edit on 30-3-2007 by undo]

It sounds seperate from what John Lear has been describing but with your husbands career and what he claims to have seen it makes me interested. Would he be willing to sketch out what he saw? If you have trouble posting images etc I'd help out. Its hard to find people that are willing to do sketchs etc so if he would that woudl be great. We have alot of people with many different types of expertise in the aviation forums here, many of which I know that would love to have a look at a sketch of what you just described.

I had him pick out from a group of images on the internet, which aircraft most resembled it. One sec, will link it as soon as i relocate it.

This one, only he said it didn't have the silvery thing on it and didn't have the fins, it was a bit more modular ( a tiny bit more smooth and rounded like it was all one piece, rather than sharp and angular corners). he's sleeping right now, or i would ask him for more details. He also said it was, and he kept impressing this, the biggest thing he'd ever seen in the air. He still says that and we live by Cape Kennedy and have seen space shuttles with fuel tanks still attached, if that gives you any idea of how big it would have to be. This image is someone's idea of the Aurora. I dunno if that's what he saw or not, as I'm not sure how big the Aurora is supposed to be. He was by the flight line at the time and it went over where he was standing, and corner to corner covered the entire landing field. I was thinking, where do they park these things if they're that big?!! It apparently dropped out of higher altitude right over the northern end of the base, sailed over the base, simulated a bombing run, then before it reached the southern end of the base, went straight up again, presumably to keep from freaking out the locals.
www.aerospaceweb.org...

[edit on 30-3-2007 by undo]

Originally posted by undo
I dunno if that's what he saw or not, as I'm not sure how big the Aurora is supposed to be.

Well people claim its large but no one of course can agree on a standard size and some even claim it would piggy back up to it alt on a larger craft.

He was by the flight line at the time and it went over where he was standing, and corner to corner covered the entire landing field.

I'm assuming this would be the apron where the aircraft park or are we talking a taxi way or a runway or the entire base. Basically if he is saying it was big just how big inorder to pull fo the next part you describe.

I was thinking, where do they park these things if they're that big?!! It apparently dropped out of higher altitude right over the northern end of the base, sailed over the base, simulated a bombing run, then before it reached the southern end of the base, went straight up again, presumably to keep from freaking out the locals.

What throws me for a loop is the last part where the plane goes striaght up. Tomorrow if you can or if you know now can u answer if the plane pulled up ie raised its nose veritical and climb (no small feat for the size your describing) or raise vertically as in no nose movement and the plane appears to climb like a chopper. Thanks for all of your answers so far your being a great sport and a greater help.
[edit on 30-3-2007 by undo]

the flight line is where the mechanics fix and maintenance aircraft on the way out or just newly returned, before their stored in the hangars, etc. the landing field is adjacent to that with the runways for the jets to take off and taxi around, etc, it came in along the runways but wasn't actually landing. it was just cruising very slowly over the runways, simulating a bombing run. he knew it was simulating a bombing run because
the loud speakers on the base kicked in and did the little war games thing. i didn't ask him what they said, he just said he knew it was a simulated bombing run. he wasn't even told it was going to happen as he wasn't part of the war game so it was all a surprise to him.

it by no means covered the whole base, as that is one big base at 4000 ft above sea level, it's on the foothills of the wasatch mts. i asked him if it blotted out the sky as far as he could see on all sides, and he said no, but he wasn't directly underneath it.

i recall asking him about the takeoff as well, and he said in nearly went straight up. he got the impression that it wasn't obeying the laws of physics as we know them, not only because of its immense size, moving so slowly almost effortlessly above the landing field, but because the takeoff was incredibly fast, from a near standstill.

if i remember correctly, the harrier can do the same thing, but it has to build up alot of noisy power before it does that. this thing didn't make noise till after it was climbing away.

oh and i should mention, housing for military families is just on the other side of the landing field. that means other people, spouses, their children, probably saw it too. we lived off base, so i didn't get to see it or anything like it. there was nothing barring the view of the landing field from the housing area on that side of the base.

when i saw the phoenix lights thing on video, i asked him if he thought that might be the same vehicle and he said it was possible, as it was certainly big enough. but it was broad daylight when he saw it and there were no amber or white lights that he recalled, anyway.

who knows. they got more contraptions than toys r' us!



[edit on 30-3-2007 by undo]

Originally posted by Canada_EH
Also welcome to ATS SToo I havent seen you on the Aviation forums yet. Good to have another person who at least seems to approach things the way I try too.

Thanks

I've actually been here ages, but not really posted

So John, I'm curious, what do you actually get out of being on ATS, other than a little hero-worship by some, derision by others, and the occasional ego-massage?

Or is it just fun to toy with the plebs?

Aurora has been flying over Canada a lot lately, its length is 35.61 m and wingspan is 30.37 m

Originally posted by firepilot
Aurora has been flying over Canada a lot lately, its length is 35.61 m and wingspan is 30.37 m

AND...........
where's the pics

Yes I am curious about these measurements as well... Were you using a laser range finder and a sextant to calculate the stars it blotted out at some point on it's flight path? OR did you army crawl through a drainage pipe into it's underground hangar with a measuring tape?

Please if nothing else tell us where to acquire such amazingly quick accurate and long range measuring devices....

And Undo the mystery plane sounds alot like a few different descriptions that have been batted about by people in that area... When I lived a bit south of hill we used to camp out by dougway and the bioweapons disposal place and we caught sight of something similar a time or two (unfortunatelly none nearly as close range or in optimal visibillity conditions). If you could also U2U me or respond here if you or your hubby ever saw some smaller smashed ball looking floater type craft that sorta gave the air a very strong heat mirage look....

EDIT: oh yeah and this seems alot like a mufon report that was a thread on here awhile ago (can't find it sorry) but in that case there were typical rescue icons like on fighter jets did your hubby see any on his?

[edit on 31-3-2007 by roguetechie]

Originally posted by roguetechie

If you could also U2U me or respond here if you or your hubby ever saw some smaller smashed ball looking floater type craft that sorta gave the air a very strong heat mirage look....

EDIT: oh yeah and this seems alot like a mufon report that was a thread on here awhile ago (can't find it sorry) but in that case there were typical rescue icons like on fighter jets did your hubby see any on his?

[edit on 31-3-2007 by roguetechie]

He says he didn't see the ball thing.

He says he saw no insignia and no engines. When it finally accelerated, it went so fast it was like it "jumped" ahead. ??

Range is about 5000 NM, has 4 turbine engines.

Thanks for the clarification Undo ... we only ever saw the ball things way away from hill and never very close. It was usually out in the deserts of southern utah and/or around dougway proving ground. And lord knows we tried to get a picture but the buggers just seem to disappear. To this day we can't figure out what they were... at the distance we were seeing them and with the mirage heat wave effect it's hard to even speculate. That is why I am so interested in finding other people that have seen them.

And again fire pilot can you please clue us in on your sources of information? You state these things as hard facts and it'd be nice to know where you came across said specifications etc.

Originally posted by firepilot
Range is about 5000 NM, has 4 turbine engines.

Or what types of turbine engines for that matter. It would really help create some stats to go on other then 2 unsupported statements.